Belkin Sues Other Hawks Owners

[thegrahamcrackr]

The hawks can not offer a 6 year deal. Only a 5. The Suns said they will match an offer but I don't see the Suns giving him this big of an offer just to Atlanta can be happy.

He means offer the 6 year deal in the sign and trade. The Suns can sign him to a contract under their possible terms as the old team then trade him to the hawks.

 

[SweetD]

Is anyone else worried that Sarver is posturing about the matching of the deal. Most of us heard him on Gambo and Ash, and while he said he would match, he seemed VERY leery of commiting that kind of money to a untradable (due to the setup of the contract) potential chemistry problem. ....

Ok one thing that is missing is JJ told Sarver that he would rather play in Atlanta. Sarver will match the offer, but we will not loose JJ for nothing. Here are the options..... JJ take the 6yr/75 from the Suns or get a trade done with Atlanta.

 

[SweetD]

He means offer the 6 year deal in the sign and trade. The Suns can sign him to a contract under their possible terms as the old team then trade him to the hawks.

Again why would the Suns or JJ do this. JJ wants the cash and the deal he was looking for. The Suns will not loose him for nothing. As the Suns said they will match any offer. The only reason the Suns didn't get Joe signed is JJ's Camp wanted a MAX contract from the Suns and nothing else. JJ is not worth a max contract so the Suns said they will match any offer and they will. The issue is why would the Suns invest a large contract on someone that doesn't want to be here. JJ came out and said he would rather be in Atlanta, and he didn't even meet with the Suns to counter offer. I am sure his agent said the Suns will not give you a max offer so lets go find one.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

The Suns would do it because they don't care. Either way they get the same package for Joe. The terms are only relevent for JJ and the Hawks.

JJ would do this because it gets him an additional guaranteed year without changing his average salary. So he give up the 20 million up front, instead getting 12 million for earning and extra 14 million total in the 6th year. Seems pretty clear to me.

 

[SweetD]

The Suns would do it because they don't care. Either way they get the same package for Joe. The terms are only relevent for JJ and the Hawks.

JJ would do this because it gets him an additional guaranteed year without changing his average salary. So he give up the 20 million up front, instead getting 12 million for earning and extra 14 million total in the 6th year. Seems pretty clear to me.

But why would JJ, and more importantly his agent do this deal. They have a very sweet deal what type of agent would say ok lets give you money back. Plus the Suns could come back and say if that is the offer your going to stick around and if you don't like it we can trade you down the road now.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

But why would JJ, and more importantly his agent do this deal. They have a very sweet deal what type of agent would say ok lets give you money back. Plus the Suns could come back and say if that is the offer your going to stick around and if you don't like it we can trade you down the road now.

They don't give any money back though. They get an extra 14 million on another guaranteed year. They get 6 million less in the first deal in exchange for an extra 14 million guaranteed.

The Suns could come back say that, although they won't. They don't reneg on deals, and I just don't see Sarver paying Joe a max contract without him saying he wants to be here unless his hand is forced (if Atlanta tries to do just an offer sheet)

 

[SweetD]

They don't give any money back though. They get an extra 14 million on another guaranteed year. They get 6 million less in the first deal in exchange for an extra 14 million guaranteed.

The Suns could come back say that, although they won't. They don't reneg on deals, and I just don't see Sarver paying Joe a max contract without him saying he wants to be here unless his hand is forced (if Atlanta tries to do just an offer sheet)

But why would the Suns help out Atlanta? Atlanta can only offer a 5 year deal and they have offered the max they can. If you had a deal for x amount upfront why trough it away.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

But why would the Suns help out Atlanta? Atlanta can only offer a 5 year deal and they have offered the max they can. If you had a deal for x amount upfront why trough it away.

The Suns would help Atlanta so that the deal doesn't fall through. I think it is more likely Joe takes the 1 year tender and we lose him for nothing than him signing a big deal with us.

They still get their package, so the Suns are happy with the situation.

If I am Joe I agree to those terms because while I am giving away the upfront payment I am getting something in return for it. The chances of him getting a max contract next summer aren't solid enough for him to throw away the opportunity now.

 

[Chaplin]

Long article with some quotes from Belkin:

http://www.ajc.com/hawks/content/sp...iHD!741727382&UrAuth=`NYNUOcNXUbTTUWUXUTUZTYU

Belkin has declined to be interviewed this week about the situation, but in an e-mail to the Journal-Constitution on Thursday, he said he wants Johnson on the team but is opposed to the proposed deal because he believes the Hawks would be giving up too much in return.

"As NBA governor . . . I have the responsibility to manage the business and affairs of the team and to look out for the best interests of the team," Belkin wrote. "In that capacity, I am charged with authorizing any player signing or trade. Like my fellow co-owners, I have supported signing Joe Johnson for the Hawks under contract terms proposed by general manager Billy Knight.

"However, I cannot support, in my capacity as NBA governor, a sign-and-trade that involves two first-round draft picks and a quality player, which I believe would be giving up too much of our future. I remain hopeful that Joe Johnson will be wearing a Hawks uniform next year, and that a deal can be completed in a manner that allows us to build around Joe in the future."

 

[AsUdUdE]

ATL is in sooo much of a mess, This is how I see it

I agree with everyone, if BC gives in and lets them have a pick back, it better be only under ONE CONDITION!

wE get Josh SMith, AND they lose their protection on next years pick.....PERIOD,

Otherwise We stick with the deal we have, Part of me hopes Belkin sticks to his guns, and tests the suns, by signing JJ outright, Because I truly think Sarver would match JJ, and JJ would come to his senses, and we would be set for the future.....BUT, on the other hand, I am on the "SCREW JJ" bandwagon, after hearing the Sarver interview, and I really don't even want him in a suns uniform.... So Im torn


I laughed when I read that they came back with a counter offer of Diaw and a 2nd rounder, That won't happend.....

This situation is a mess, Lets get it over with already, Bring in Payton/Finley, bring back Hunter, and Hope to God that these picks are top 10....

 

[Joe Mama]

ATL is in sooo much of a mess, This is how I see it

I agree with everyone, if BC gives in and lets them have a pick back, it better be only under ONE CONDITION!

wE get Josh SMith, AND they lose their protection on next years pick.....PERIOD,

Well that's obviously not going to happen. They would rather just give up the pick and go with the original deal.

Joe Mama

 

[elindholm]

Amazingly enough, I'm with Arizona's Finest. My hunch is that the trade will break down, Atlanta will panic and offer their original contract, Johnson will panic and take it, and the Suns, after all of their posturing, will let Johnson go rather than take on a huge immovable contract for an unhappy player. (Can anyone say Penny Hardaway?)

No matter what happens, I sure hope the Suns have some other FA plans lined up.

 

[devilalum]

Amazingly enough, I'm with Arizona's Finest. My hunch is that the trade will break down, Atlanta will panic and offer their original contract, Johnson will panic and take it, and the Suns, after all of their posturing, will let Johnson go rather than take on a huge immovable contract for an unhappy player. (Can anyone say Penny Hardaway?)

No matter what happens, I sure hope the Suns have some other FA plans lined up.

If Sarver gets caught bluffing it will effect his ability to make future deals. Not a good precedent for a first year owner to set.

 

[elindholm]

He's already been caught bluffing. He said any other team that pursued Johnson would be wasting their time. Now it turns out that isn't true. Sarver has a cover, which is that he didn't know that Johnson wanted to leave. But he'd have a cover in this situation too, so it doesn't change things much.

 

[devilalum]

He's already been caught bluffing. He said any other team that pursued Johnson would be wasting their time. Now it turns out that isn't true. Sarver has a cover, which is that he didn't know that Johnson wanted to leave. But he'd have a cover in this situation too, so it doesn't change things much.

He said the only reason he backed off of this statement was that Joe told him he didn't want to play for the Suns anymore. I know its weak but not totally unreasonable.

If he just let Joe walk after saying point blank that there would have to be compensation he'd be totally screwed.

 

[KANIDJA]

He said repeatedly that if Atlanta don't want trade for JJ he would match. He said that on the readio interview so he can't just lie to the public. He will have to match if he doesn't get anything in return.

 

[sunsfn]

If the deal does not get done the way it is now, I can not see JJ signing the one year option and playing for the suns one year.

My gosh, that is a lot of money and then what if he got injured? I do not think his agent would let him do that.

If he signs the deal without the trade I think Sarver has to match at this point. Then JJ has to play for the suns for the 5 years unless the suns decide to trade him later when they can.
The problem with that is, if they sign him he gets that big bonus and you can not trade him for apx. 3-4 years. So, if Atlanta signs him and the suns match, JJ is a sun for a long time.
So I think the deal will get done the way it is, maybe later than sooner, but it will get done.

If the suns give up a pick or the player to get this done I will really be upset with them!!

 

[cly2tw]

He's already been caught bluffing. He said any other team that pursued Johnson would be wasting their time. Now it turns out that isn't true. Sarver has a cover, which is that he didn't know that Johnson wanted to leave. But he'd have a cover in this situation too, so it doesn't change things much.

Not quite true. Business is business. They'd be wasting their time thinking they'd sign Joe away without compensation to the Suns. He didn't say that we never would let Joe go at ANY price. Well, the only guy of that status is Amare anyway.

Also, if Stern allowed Hawks to pull out of a deal negotiated on good faith and cheat on the Suns, this would definitely compromise the integrity of any future negotiation in NBA. It'd open the door for more cheating and dishonesty and lead to demise of the syndicate. I don't think he'd let this happen.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

I believe this move by Belkin can be partially traced to the back down that happened just a few weeks ago during the draft. He has seen that the Suns are an organization that is willing to give in some when pushed. Let's just say the scenario that elindholm has proposed transpires, and the Suns' bluff is called then Colangelo could have serious leverage issues in his future dealings since again another negotiation was won by the opponent because Phoenix did not stand their ground.

The worst case though IMO is if the Suns do reengineer this trade to be even more favorable to Atlanta, thus saying to the NBA, when dealing with Phoenix back out at the last minuet and they will cave.



So I think if Atlanta pulls out of the deal and signs JJ to an offer sheet the Suns are almost forced to match the offer.