Best All Time Cardinals QB?

[BigRedMO]

With all this talk about who should QB the Cardinals it reminded me of a recent magazine the Sporting News published about the all time great QBs. It listed Jim Hart as the best Cardinals QB(somehere in the 40s overall). Lomax was 4th for the team. I believe with QBs from the Chicago days in between. One being Charly Trippi. I wonder how many of you agree with Hart as the best Cardinal QB? I cant comment on the Chicago QBs since I know very little about them. Statistically Lomax ranks much better than Hart. Both of their stats are listed below for comparison. Note the QB rating, PCT completion and TDs to Ints. The Sporting News is published in St. Louis. Does Hart rank better because they won two division titles under him? Do some in St. Louis not like Lomax because he said negative things about the city after the team left. I saw them both play but I think Lomax was the better QB on a team that did not have as much talent as the Hart teams at least during 73-77. There were some bad teams that Hart played on too and there were rules changes to favor the passing game for Lomax. Anyway be curious to hear others opinions.


Hart Lomax
1966-83 1981-88
G 199 108
Att 5,069 3,153
Comp 2,590 1,817
PCT 51.1 57.6
TD 209 136
INT 247 90
Rating 66.6 82.7
Yds 34,639 22,771

 

[conraddobler]

With all this talk about who should QB the Cardinals it reminded me of a recent magazine the Sporting News published about the all time great QBs. It listed Jim Hart as the best Cardinals QB(somehere in the 40s overall). Lomax was 4th for the team. I believe with QBs from the Chicago days in between. One being Charly Trippi. I wonder how many of you agree with Hart as the best Cardinal QB? I cant comment on the Chicago QBs since I know very little about them. Statistically Lomax ranks much better than Hart. Both of their stats are listed below for comparison. Note the QB rating, PCT completion and TDs to Ints. The Sporting News is published in St. Louis. Does Hart rank better because they won two division titles under him? Do some in St. Louis not like Lomax because he said negative things about the city after the team left. I saw them both play but I think Lomax was the better QB on a team that did not have as much talent as the Hart teams at least during 73-77. There were some bad teams that Hart played on too and there were rules changes to favor the passing game for Lomax. Anyway be curious to hear others opinions.


Hart Lomax
1966-83 1981-88
G 199 108
Att 5,069 3,153
Comp 2,590 1,817
PCT 51.1 57.6
TD 209 136
INT 247 90
Rating 66.6 82.7
Yds 34,639 22,771

IMO the best Cardinal QB would be Hart.

The most talented would be Lomax.

Hart's stats are not as good but completion percentages were always a lot lower in that era.

He played on some very bad teams for more years than Lomax did.

 

[Russ Smith]

Mike Buck.

 

[Stronso]

stan gelbaugh or tom tupa

 

[HookemCards]

Steve Pizarkawitz (sp)

 

[Rocco]

Tim Van Gelder or McIvor - that college career backup quarterback from Texas that we drafted in the third round. He was good.

 

[Russ Smith]

Tim Van Gelder or McIvor - that college career backup quarterback from Texas that we drafted in the third round. He was good.

McIvor had a gun though, he had the strongest arm I think I'd ever seen before Elway.

His older brother was a neighbor of my dad's years ago, he said that in all through school every coach Rick had told him you have the strongest arm I've ever seen in my life.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Lomax

Lomax had Loui Sharpe on the line (minus the line of Sharpe's cocaine habit) but if he had the protection Hart had he would have really lighted up the league and might not have left the game as soon due to injury. Lomax to Green...SWEET!!! J.T. Smith and Tilley where great compliments. Pitty Awalt didn't turn out and we let a young Novecik go.

 

[Capt'nCard]

Fumbles Krieg, jay schoerder or dave brown

 

[artp]

Jim Hart

 

[bratwurst]

Will Furrer.

 

[ajcardfan]

It was Preston Parsons or Chris Greisen, but now we'll never know.

 

[Tyrestud]

What about the goal line threat?

Don't forget the Great Permian Panther Stoney Case.

 

[Rocco]

man, some of the names in this thread are bringing back some really ugly, suppressed memories...

 

[BigRedMO]

From some of the responses it appears I offended some people. I did not realize so many people did not care about the team's past history. Noted for future reference though.

 

[Rocco]

From some of the responses it appears I offended some people. I did not realize so many people did not care about the team's past history. Noted for future reference though.

Not at all. Certainly not me. Sorry, we were just poking some fun at some of the former 'quarterbacks' we've had.

There are some long - very long - threads out there on Cards history and I think people enjoy it for the most part. The older guys enjoy remembering past players and the guys who started following the team in AZ seem to like hearing about the St. Louis/Coryell years.

I only go back as far as Charley Johnson (post Army) but there are some guys on this board that go back to Trippi and Matson during the Chicago years. They can tell you much more about those guys.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Definately LOMAX!!

 

[Russ Smith]

From some of the responses it appears I offended some people. I did not realize so many people did not care about the team's past history. Noted for future reference though.

Not at all, but realistically there's only 2 choices in my lifetime, hart or Lomax, so it was more interesting to name one of the worst.

I would go with Lomax, I think Hart had better personnel (the OL) but they played in different eras so it's tough to compare.

 

[TRW]

Jim Hart is my favorite all-time Cards QB. And, I think he was better over all. Lomax was right there though, he was very good. As several have said, different eras, hard to compare.

 

[PJ1]

Saw them both and Hart was better. Hart had some tough times early on but really had some great seasons. No D at all on those teams. Super Bowl caliber offense though.

 

[HookemCards]

From some of the responses it appears I offended some people. I did not realize so many people did not care about the team's past history. Noted for future reference though.

I wasn't offended. As Rocco said, we are simply laughing at some of the pitiful players we've had at QB. I only go back to Hart, and for my money Lomax was the better QB. We had some really good offensive teams in the 70's with Hart: great line (think he was sacked like 7 times one year), Mel Gray, Pat Tilley, Jim Ottis, and Terry Metcalf (he was probably the most exciting player of the 70's, either with spectacular runs, or untimely fumbles, you just never knew what was going to happen when he touched the ball). While Lomax had Green and Anderson, for alot of his career. He never had the OL that Hart did.

I remember vaguely a preseason game against the Bears (think it was 84) that had a huge brawl in it precipitated by Fridgerator Perry picking up Lomax and body slamming him on the ground. I always thought that play had a huge role in Lomax's degenerative hip problem. Later in the game several small brawls broke out in the game, and one of the Bears players got caught on the Card sideline up against a concrete barrier they have up on the sideline at soldier field, and about 4 or 5 Cards players are kicking him. I think thats the game the Stallings pulled the team off the field with like 2 min to play. I hope I'm not getting my games/years mixed up. The old noodle doesn't work like it used to.

 

[gamebird98]

Cliff Stoudt?

 

[MrY]

Kelly Stouffer?

 

[Southpaw]

Jim Hart's numbers were the best, but I personally liked Charley Johnson. 1st QB I ever saw play in the Big Red Uni was Sam Etchevarry, a CFL castoff.

 

[TRW]

Jim Hart's numbers were the best, but I personally liked Charley Johnson. 1st QB I ever saw play in the Big Red Uni was Sam Etchevarry, a CFL castoff.

Charley Johnson was a pretty decent QB! I remember him too