Beware These Players in the Draft + Reasons NOT to Draft

[Russ Smith]

He needs a bunch of work, but on size and athleticism alone he's worth the #23 if we stay there any other viable options are gone. I'd rather Davis over a CB.

That's my impression he was a basketball player who devoted himself to football full time a bit later than most guys do so he's a bit behind technique wise.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I'd normally agree but that's what Vita Vea was and he went #13? And you would have to say that he was worth it.

Get him in 1 on 1 situations and that's going to be tough to handle for any team.

He needs developing for sure, but if he's there at #23 I don't think you can argue he's not worth the risk with his athletic profile. And he can start right away as a run stuffer worse case.

Depends on who else is there though.

A quality WR? Take the WR.
A quality Edge? Take the Edge.
A quality CB? LT?

I mean I could go on and on. Even as good as Vita Vea is, it's not hard to argue that the there were probably 4-5 more impactful players they could have taken at that spot. And the impact of Vita Vea vs. a solid 3rd round DL run stuffer wouldnt be so large.

In my view, run stuffing DL are only more valuable than run stuffing LBs and blocking TEs. Just never really worth premium picks even if they are good players.

I mean.. the Buccaneers could have drafted Jaire Alexander, Harold Landry, and a few other pretty good players that are more impactful.

The Rams drafted Sebastian Joseph-Day in the sixth round of the same draft as Vita Vea. For the money and draft picks, I'd easily take Jaire Alexander and a later round pick on a guy like Joseph-Day.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Only facts here

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Karlaftis is a guy I'd like. He'll produce way more impact plays than Davis, and be a + run defender.

 

[Stout]

Karlaftis is a guy I'd like. He'll produce way more impact plays than Davis, and be a + run defender.

No thanks. He's all projection, no production. I don't want college edge rushers that don't tally up the sacks. Projection might be okay in other drafts with little top-end edge talent, but this year? Give me a guy who could actually sack the QB a lot in college.

 

[Krangodnzr]

No thanks. He's all projection, no production. I don't want college edge rushers that don't tally up the sacks. Projection might be okay in other drafts with little top-end edge talent, but this year? Give me a guy who could actually sack the QB a lot in college.

Ummm he had TONS of pressures. Tons.

 

[Stout]

Ummm he had TONS of pressures. Tons.

That means little. That tells me he couldn't CLOSE on the QB. In college. If we're talking not as many sacks but TONS of pressures in the pros, okay, I could sign off on that. But, for my money, if he can't get sacks in college I'm not confident he'll do what we need him to do in the pros. I'm betting that's why I read about him slipping, possibly.

 

[Krangodnzr]

No thanks. He's all projection, no production. I don't want college edge rushers that don't tally up the sacks. Projection might be okay in other drafts with little top-end edge talent, but this year? Give me a guy who could actually sack the QB a lot in college.

The majority of top college pass rushers are never any good in the NFL. Overall quality tape matters a lot more, and Karlaftis wouldn't be looked at to be 12 sack per year guy right off the bat.

Even if he isn't a top pass rusher, it's hard to find one outside of the top of the draft. Every pass rusher outside the top 15 picks is going to have warts and I don't mind bringing in a guy who has overall production AND measureables AND intangibles like Karlaftis has.

 

[juza76]

That means little. That tells me he couldn't CLOSE on the QB. In college. If we're talking not as many sacks but TONS of pressures in the pros, okay, I could sign off on that. But, for my money, if he can't get sacks in college I'm not confident he'll do what we need him to do in the pros. I'm betting that's why I read about him slipping, possibly.

Pressures and not as many sacks, means he always a bit late reaching the qb, great effort btw but more of a Markus golden guy
Guys that can put some pressures and getting coverage sacks mostly, but not game changer

 

[Stout]

The majority of top college pass rushers are never any good in the NFL. Overall quality tape matters a lot more, and Karlaftis wouldn't be looked at to be 12 sack per year guy right off the bat.

Even if he isn't a top pass rusher, it's hard to find one outside of the top of the draft. Every pass rusher outside the top 15 picks is going to have warts and I don't mind bringing in a guy who has overall production AND measureables AND intangibles like Karlaftis has.

I can respect that view, though I don't fully buy into it. I hope someone takes him earlier and we aren't tempted, though

 

[Stout]

Pressures and not as many sacks, means he always a bit late reaching the qb, great effort btw but more of a Markus golden guy
Guys that can put some pressures and getting coverage sacks mostly, but not game changer

That's my thought process on it.

 

[DVontel]

No thanks. He's all projection, no production. I don't want college edge rushers that don't tally up the sacks. Projection might be okay in other drafts with little top-end edge talent, but this year? Give me a guy who could actually sack the QB a lot in college.

lol you gonna be hard-pressed to find all that + translatable traits in the 20s

 

[BritCard]

Depends on who else is there though.

A quality WR? Take the WR.
A quality Edge? Take the Edge.
A quality CB? LT?

I mean I could go on and on. Even as good as Vita Vea is, it's not hard to argue that the there were probably 4-5 more impactful players they could have taken at that spot. And the impact of Vita Vea vs. a solid 3rd round DL run stuffer wouldnt be so large.

In my view, run stuffing DL are only more valuable than run stuffing LBs and blocking TEs. Just never really worth premium picks even if they are good players.

I mean.. the Buccaneers could have drafted Jaire Alexander, Harold Landry, and a few other pretty good players that are more impactful.

The Rams drafted Sebastian Joseph-Day in the sixth round of the same draft as Vita Vea. For the money and draft picks, I'd easily take Jaire Alexander and a later round pick on a guy like Joseph-Day.

I agree but Vita Vea and Jordan Davis are more than that. They are O line wreckers. They destroy blocking schemes and you have to game plan for them. They make it easier for everyone else.

I agree that if there is a WR or OLB there then that should be the pick but otherwise Davis is a valid option.

 

[Stout]

lol you gonna be hard-pressed to find all that + translatable traits in the 20s

Agreed, which is why I want to go offense with our first pick.

 

[QuebecCard]

No thanks. He's all projection, no production. I don't want college edge rushers that don't tally up the sacks. Projection might be okay in other drafts with little top-end edge talent, but this year? Give me a guy who could actually sack the QB a lot in college.

Ziggy Ansah - 5th. pick in 2013 played 3 years of College ball and totalled 4.5 sacks, all in his last season.

He had 30 sacks in his first three seasons in the NFL.

 

[Stout]

Ziggy Ansah - 5th. pick in 2013 played 3 years of College ball and totalled 4.5 sacks, all in his last season.

He had 30 sacks in his first three seasons in the NFL.

Great! Now tel me the first 3 years of stats for all NFL players who had low sack totals in college. But nice exception that proves the rule post.

That was a bit harsh. Sorry. I'm sure there are exceptions--there always are--but I'm not wanting us to take the chance here.

 

[QuebecCard]

Great! Now tel me the first 3 years of stats for all NFL players who had low sack totals in college. But nice exception that proves the rule post.

That was a bit harsh. Sorry. I'm sure there are exceptions--there always are--but I'm not wanting us to take the chance here.

There is no rule that definitively establishes low or high sack counts in the NFL based on College output and thus there is no exception to the rule here. Ansah was drafted high because of his elite measurables, Mr. K. has considerably more production than Ansah in College but is not the same quality of athlete. He's a back end of the first round choice IMO and therefore a consideration for the Cards given need.

 

[JeffGollin]

By now, the current Card establishment will have built up a database of Blue Collar vs. Super athlete, analyzed their relative value to the team and understand the odds risks, rewards, floors, ceiling etc.

Problem is - they know what each prospect gives the team most in brains, muscle or filling team ‘s needs.

We don’t.

Would I rather have a grinder LB or a. Simmons?

YGIAGAM*

* Your Guess is as good as mine.

 

[slanidrac16]

The thought of Wr Williams or Wilson or Olave and adding a guy like Breese Hall could/ would strike a little fear into the hearts of defenses. Speed kills and we need speed.
Somewhere in there add a one trick pony edge rusher.

 

[oaken1]

Ummm he had TONS of pressures. Tons.

So...
Do you want to replace old chandler Jones?
Or young chandler Jones?

 

[oaken1]

The thought of Wr Williams or Wilson or Olave and adding a guy like Breese Hall could/ would strike a little fear into the hearts of defenses. Speed kills and we need speed.
Somewhere in there add a one trick pony edge rusher.

That's my thoughts.
That's why I have edge .asked for the 3rd round... get a lanky guy that's long and fast but is very raw....
I liked Logan Hall for that pick but his draft stock has gone up....... not sure who to pick now, unless we go ahead and take Hall in 2, then try for Salyer at guard in 3

 

[SissyBoyFloyd]

I have agreed on your comments regarding Jordan Davis and have reinstated him. Also removed a few more players some of you have concerns about.

Let's keep going. Only 3 more days to narrow our board down.

 

[SissyBoyFloyd]

As far as the QBs go, I see Corral as a huge bust. I do like Howell though. He needs time but I could see his upside as being a Josh Allen-lite. What do you guys think? Agree or Disagree?

 

[Krangodnzr]

That's my thoughts.
That's why I have edge .asked for the 3rd round... get a lanky guy that's long and fast but is very raw....
I liked Logan Hall for that pick but his draft stock has gone up....... not sure who to pick now, unless we go ahead and take Hall in 2, then try for Salyer at guard in 3

I mean Karlaftis is younger than Hall by a year AND was more productive.

Give me Karlaftis and Alex Pierce in round 2.

 

[Krangodnzr]

So...
Do you want to replace old chandler Jones?
Or young chandler Jones?

Honestly Id trade some of Jones' sacks for better play against the run.

 

[Jetstream Green]

As far as the QBs go, I see Corral as a huge bust. I do like Howell though. He needs time but I could see his upside as being a Josh Allen-lite. What do you guys think? Agree or Disagree?

I see Corral as being possibly the most successful out of the bunch. Now I did not say a franchise QB, just better than the other guys riding the bench from this draft class lol