Bidwill pissed

[Crimson Warrior]

Gotta break my self imposed ban for a bit.

@PACardsFan was responding to a guy who said he doesnt watch film. I think PAC also knows the writer said he doesnt watch much film. However, it was not something Kyler exactly said.

I think the context missing is the quote before where he said he wants to play with an uncluttered mind. Basically saying he does, but makes sure he's not suffering paralysis by analysis. I'll say that Lions game and 3rd Rams game he looked paralyzed if anything.

Ignore the film bit. I dont think Burrow said it about film, but did say this about notes.

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Guys try to sound smarter than they are these days I guess.


I think going forward its best to just say we want Kyler to be the SMARTEST WORKER on the team. Thats a safe space for the fanbase and I'd assume the team.

Maybe would have helped Kliff to not look scared you know what on the sidelines in the 1st Qrt of a playoff game.

I do believe film matters. However, for him just not in the way you or others think.



The issue is Kyler doesnt know how to work a bad pocket. He doesnt know how to manipulate a bad pocket to either save a play or make a play. Sometimes a decent pocket he has issues with that as well. His counter moves are simply kill the play/sack or lower his eyes and hope he breaks contain.

The film he needs to watch is Drew Brees and maybe Russell Wilson. Know the play. Know the defense. Know where the pressure is coming from. How can he get the ball out to keep the chains moving. How to avoid a sack and throw the ball away so they are still ahead of the chains. Whether through film of those guys or offseason training he has to figure out to overcome it. Brees had outstanding footwork in a crowd. Russell Wilson had a fearless to him on the interior that Kyler lacks right now. I agree with another post you said where Kliff might to be too BRO COACH for him. And Kyler might not be to self motivated for Kliff. I'd use the words SELF AWARE.

Kyler's approach needs to be better. Stop carrying himself like he's 6'3" in preparation knowing on gameday once he drops his eyes in the pocket he's 5'7".

A noble effort, but in vain my man.

The only way K1 is going to shut up the haters is to prove it some more on the field. To bolster your spirts however, here are his passer ratings from the first seven games this season while DHop was healthy:

Game #1 vs. TEN = 120.9
Game #2 vs. MIN = 117.6
Game #3 vs. JAX = 93.1
Game #4 vs. LA = 120.3
Game #5 vs. SF = 104.1
Game #6 vs. CLE = 129.0
Game #7 vs. HOU = 121.3

A 115.2 average. For context, Rodgers led the league this year with a 111.9 rating.

So take heart. Murray can get it done big time as long as he has a legit number one WR on the field with him.

 

[SoonerLou]

For the record...I can buy the argument that Kliff is a bad fit for Kyler. However, I don't believe it is because of scheme and I can't guarantee that a new coach would be able to get more out of Kyler

Of course not. None of us can guarantee anything. What we can do is recognize that’s something is broken and you have to explore all options. Including whether the pairing is a poor one. Which, I believe to be the case for reasons that completely exclude scheme.

My very first post on this board.

Kyler

His major flaw is physicality. People get so caught up in him being short when thats not the issue. Russell Wilson is only an inch taller, Brees just 2 inches. Those guys would have still been successful in the pros even if they were Kyler's height.

The issue for Kyler is he doesn't know to navigate through contact. Notice I said through and not around. He does a tremendous job of not taking kill shots. Not putting himself in harm's way, etc. etc.

What he doesn't do is take that punch in the mouth from a defender while taking a strike. Oh he's done it before but sometimes it will be reactionary. As if he tried to avoid the hit and still got hit.

The lack of physicality is why the team has started from behind the last two games and why he started so slow against Bama in the playoffs. He usually figures it out and gets comfortable but its something that he needs to be ready for when the game starts.

I've noticed complaints about his lack of running. Well the truth is Lincoln Riley had to really urge Kyler to run the football. I think his lack of scrambling is why they lost to Texas. Again started slow and would not cut up field.

I do think there is hope though. Jared Goff looked uncomfortable his first year and many others. I believe once Kyler truly feels that he has an NFL body he'll be ok. However, he's not the grown man that Russell Wilson (24 at the time) was entering the league. Also Cardinals fans even Kyler said himself that there really is no comparison with Russell Wilson. They have totally different games. Kyler went to A&M to be the next Johnny Manziel. However, the difference that Manziel/Wilson had is that they didn't care about scrambling and being in harm's way to make plays.

How many plays have we seen Kyler try the Russell Wilson scramble drill? Not many right. Kyler will throw it away or kill the play (take the sack). He operates on efficiency not necessarily electricity (like Russ).

I think Kyler can and will be great. However, he's going to have to adjust and that brings me to Keim and Kliff..

Kliff

Kliff's system is really different from Lincoln Riley's system. Oklahoma almost had THREE 1,000 yard rushers last year. Kyler really only targeted two wrs and his other options were TE's. Kliff's lack of balance isn't surprising. Kliff's red zone struggles aren't surprising. He's having to adjust to not having the width he had in college. Riley made sure Murray was a real threat and that the running game was a real threat in the red zone. They became very physical when they needed.

The problem with the air raid is that some coaches answer to answer thing...is more tempo. When in reality you need to adjust tempo situationally. Those last two drives should have been about the running game. Its a tired defense....use Kyler legs. If you do not use Kyler's legs he becomes just like every other Tech QB. Suspect against all out blitzes and basically get the house thrown at them on critical plays.

I like Kliff...and hope he adjusts. However, (back to Manziel) his A&M success (which got him the Tech jo) was primarily just Manziel saving the play or at Tech it was Mahomes saving the play. Right now Kyler isn't saving the play for him. Thats not really Kyler though. You need to design some things to take advantage of his legs or identify to him what plays he needs to use his mobility.
Keim



Really fortunate he got Johnson in the 6th round. I watched two rookie wrs in Hardman and Metfcalfe ball out today. Kliff's lack of NFL experience had him sold that Andy could just seamlessly fit in as well. When in reality he was a project. Those two 4.3 SEC guys would be the speed threats to really make this offense go.



Keim didnt build the Oline or the WR core up with guys that fit the system. Sweezy is a brawler, but athletic enough for the running game. Couldn't find a healthy RT either. The play to Byrd on 4th down against an all out blitz should have been a TD. A wr with speed AND strength breaks that tackle and takes it into the endzone. With the lack of spacing in the red zone this is a team that needs big play strikes.



Look at Kansas City Keim. Their wrs are physical and fast. I'm not sure Crabtree at his age will be a great fit either.

Kyler's physicality, Kliff's philosophy, Keim's...well

Hello all, Finally decided to post my feelings about a few things in regards to the team and come out of lurk mode. A lot of thoughts on Kyler... a couple nuggets on Kliff and Keim. I really do think fans should be proud of how the team has played but the title indicates why the team hasn't...

www.arizonasportsfans.com

Three years later and here we are.



Since this is the Bidwill thread.

Im making Kliff bring in an OC. More focus on being the HC. Kliff can call plays, but looks worn out as well towards the end of the season. Find the guy who is going to challenge Kyler since Kliff just doesnt want to do it. Also maybe that guy will start helping Kliff figure out ways to get him on the move.



If I'm Bidwill Im leaking to Kyler's camp he has to seek out Brees or work with someone who can help him overcome his issues. Kyler as we know can be really great against air. Thats his fastball. Whats he got when things get tough in the pocket? How is he simulating that experience to be prepared for it. I think Kyler thinks Keim needs to just fix the Oline. However, thats not a guarantee so he needs something else in his toolbox. Now in fairness to him we complained about him being a weak runner and he came back faster. We complained about him being an awful thrower on the run and over the middle. He got better there.



Now its about pocket presence. However, that is the most difficult one and something he needs to attack. Not just think he doesnt have a limitation to overcome.

 

[cardncubfan]

It was a quote by kyler murray in an interview. Go look it up. What a stupid argument.

“I think I was blessed with the cognitive skills to just go out there and just see it before it happens,” Murray said. “I’m not one of those guys that’s going to sit there and kill myself watching film. I don’t sit there for 24 hours and break down this team and that team and watch every game because, in my head, I see so much.”
@SoonerLou @PACardsFan

I know it was a quote by Murray. I don't think you understand what I was saying/joking about. If he doesn't watch film what makes you think he reads articles? Also an article can be far from what actually transpired in the interview unless you believe everything you read is the absolute truth. In case you didn't know writers embellish. Hard to believe I know but they do.

It's also not a stupid argument as you put it. If you actually read the article it was in reference to a certain play.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

My very first post on this board.

Kyler's physicality, Kliff's philosophy, Keim's...well

Hello all, Finally decided to post my feelings about a few things in regards to the team and come out of lurk mode. A lot of thoughts on Kyler... a couple nuggets on Kliff and Keim. I really do think fans should be proud of how the team has played but the title indicates why the team hasn't...

www.arizonasportsfans.com

Three years later and here we are.



Since this is the Bidwill thread.

Im making Kliff bring in an OC. More focus on being the HC. Kliff can call plays, but looks worn out as well towards the end of the season. Find the guy who is going to challenge Kyler since Kliff just doesnt want to do it. Also maybe that guy will start helping Kliff figure out ways to get him on the move.



If I'm Bidwill Im leaking to Kyler's camp he has to seek out Brees or work with someone who can help him overcome his issues. Kyler as we know can be really great against air. Thats his fastball. Whats he got when things get tough in the pocket? How is he simulating that experience to be prepared for it. I think Kyler thinks Keim needs to just fix the Oline. However, thats not a guarantee so he needs something else in his toolbox. Now in fairness to him we complained about him being a weak runner and he came back faster. We complained about him being an awful thrower on the run and over the middle. He got better there.



Now its about pocket presence. However, that is the most difficult one and something he needs to attack. Not just think he doesnt have a limitation to overcome.

You know what? I forgot that they could hire an OC while still keeping the band together. That would be a change if it’s a legit OC. And while I don’t think that’s enough, it would be change to what they’re doing now. It’s the only thing that could come out of Mikes comments that might cause me to lower the pitchfork and douse the torch until next season. But if next season is more of the same we storm the castle.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I know it was a quote by Murray. I don't think you understand what I was saying/joking about. If he doesn't watch film what makes you think he reads articles? Also an article can be far from what actually transpired in the interview unless you believe everything you read is the absolute truth. In case you didn't know writers embellish. Hard to believe I know but they do.

It's also not a stupid argument as you put it. If you actually read the article it was in reference to a certain play.

Writers don’t embellish quotes though. That’s how they get sued.

 

[Stout]

KM doesn't know how to work a clean pocket anymore either, it seems. He could do it early in the season, but not late.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Seriously? Holding tightly to that pocketbook. Just like dear old dad. SOC.

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[football karma]

Seriously? Holding tightly to that pocketbook. Just like dear old dad. SOC.

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as an owner: there are productive ways to deal with this, and unproductive ones

this is an unproductive one

these are standard, contractual payments. They will be made, so its not like he can declare "not good enough" and not pay them

 

[PJ1]

Seriously? Holding tightly to that pocketbook. Just like dear old dad. SOC.

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So Billy B. like. Bad move if true.

 

[StreetTruckinTitan]

as an owner: there are productive ways to deal with this, and unproductive ones

this is an unproductive one

these are standard, contractual payments. They will be made, so its not like he can declare "not good enough" and not pay them

Def more to the story as far them getting bonus checks at the moment? Mike might be waiting to see what happens with Vance first before deciding who stays and who gets a big goodbye check?

 

[Arz101]

Seriously? Holding tightly to that pocketbook. Just like dear old dad. SOC.

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I believe LaCanfora Insider information less than I believe in.

1. Keim drafting skills.
2. Gambo insider information.

 

[football karma]

Def more to the story as far them getting bonus checks at the moment? Mike might be waiting to see what happens with Vance first before deciding who stays and who gets a big goodbye check?

my guess --

the source is an assistant coach who doesnt know the pay timing and is guessing. I really doubt the org is intentionally withholding the bonus. Maybe it will be on this paycheck at that end of the month.

Mark Dalton of the Cards will likely clarify soon

 

[Arz101]

LaCanfora is not trustworthy. End.

 

[football karma]

re: bonusgate

Playoff bonus checks for Cardinals coaches are being issued

No, Cardinals owner Michael Bidwill isn't happy with the way his team's season went.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I've always felt that Kyler's ascendence was inevitable, but this last season has definitely shaken my confidence a bit.

Kyler's comments, his body language, his entire attitude seem to signal that he's too good for football.

Look at Burrow taking shot after shot, yet still getting up and making things happen. Look at the duel between Allen and Mahomes, which will likely go down as one of the best in history.

Maybe the last two years have been stepping stones to his ascendance, but I have genuine concerns about his attitude.

A noble effort, but in vain my man.

The only way K1 is going to shut up the haters is to prove it some more on the field. To bolster your spirts however, here are his passer ratings from the first seven games this season while DHop was healthy:

Game #1 vs. TEN = 120.9
Game #2 vs. MIN = 117.6
Game #3 vs. JAX = 93.1
Game #4 vs. LA = 120.3
Game #5 vs. SF = 104.1
Game #6 vs. CLE = 129.0
Game #7 vs. HOU = 121.3

A 115.2 average. For context, Rodgers led the league this year with a 111.9 rating.

So take heart. Murray can get it done big time as long as he has a legit number one WR on the field with him.

Now do the 2nd half!

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Also - Bidwill says he wants to win, but no serious GM would allow his meddling. The best thing he can do is get some real football people in charge and get the hell out of the way.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I've always felt that Kyler's ascendence was inevitable, but this last season has definitely shaken my confidence a bit.

Kyler's comments, his body language, his entire attitude seem to signal that he's too good for football.

Look at Burrow taking shot after shot, yet still getting up and making things happen. Look at the duel between Allen and Mahomes, which will likely go down as one of the best in history.

Maybe the last two years have been stepping stones to his ascendance, but I have genuine concerns about his attitude.

Now do the 2nd half!

Or the Rams game with Hopkins healthy. Or the second half of last season with Hopkins healthy.

 

[kerouac9]

Or the Rams game with Hopkins healthy. Or the second half of last season with Hopkins healthy.

Don't you understand that he was also injured in the second half of last season. That shouldn't impact your evaluation of his long-term viability, but instead excuse his performance in a vacuum.

In. A. Vacuum.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

That Rams game was just a killer. Being down forced Nuk to play more snaps and harder, and against such a physical team, its no surprise that he ended up getting injured.

The ultimate mirage was the first Rams game...after losing what, 7 in a row to the Rams, to go to their house and beat them soundly really felt like a turning point.

Instead, it gave the Cards a false sense of confidence, and now we've lost 9 of 10 to the Rams?

In the end, many predicted the Cards would be the worst team in the division - watching our last regular season game vs. the Seahawks made me think that in the end, they were probably right.

 

[SoonerLou]

Or the Rams game with Hopkins healthy. Or the second half of last season with Hopkins healthy.

Don't you understand that he was also injured in the second half of last season. That shouldn't impact your evaluation of his long-term viability, but instead excuse his performance in a vacuum.

In. A. Vacuum.

Maybe he's just limited to only being really good when healthy and having his #1 wr. You can have questions about how good he is as an individual talent, but still think he works under those circumstances.

That 2nd Rams game was actually one of the better games against the Rams defense lately tbh. Just had two terrible ints. Hopkins drop probably cost us an eventually 7 as well. That version of Kyler/Cardinals and I think we had a shot in the playoffs.

Even the Goat had his issues with them with Evans and Gronk. Rams are on fire.

 

[Arz101]

That Rams game was just a killer. Being down forced Nuk to play more snaps and harder, and against such a physical team, its no surprise that he ended up getting injured.

The ultimate mirage was the first Rams game...after losing what, 7 in a row to the Rams, to go to their house and beat them soundly really felt like a turning point.

Instead, it gave the Cards a false sense of confidence, and now we've lost 9 of 10 to the Rams?

In the end, many predicted the Cards would be the worst team in the division - watching our last regular season game vs. the Seahawks made me think that in the end, they were probably right.

Yup, Cardinals are worst team in 2022 to start the 2022 NFC W season.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

If you aren't firing someone then you need to force Kliff to take an offensive coordinator and remove the playcalling from him. Its crystal clear that he can't manage the flow of the game and call plays at the same time. It's why we are constantly wasting time outs and precious minutes in high pressure situations.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Maybe he's just limited to only being really good when healthy and having his #1 wr. You can have questions about how good he is as an individual talent, but still think he works under those circumstances.

That 2nd Rams game was actually one of the better games against the Rams defense lately tbh. Just had two terrible ints. Hopkins drop probably cost us an eventually 7 as well. That version of Kyler/Cardinals and I think we had a shot in the playoffs.

Even the Goat had his issues with them with Evans and Gronk. Rams are on fire.

The Rams were decidedly NOT on fire at that point. They were coming off losing four straight to anyone with a pulse, getting beat ugly by them and only beat Jax in their previous five games before us AND then had MULTIPLE guys out including Jalen Ramsey for Covid.

Defending that game is ludicrous. Kyler threw too awful interceptions, missed a WIDE OPEN AJ for a TD to start the game and then stat padded with a time draining 16 play drive that only ended with a FG that basically salted the game away despite us getting the onside kick where Kyler proceeded to be awful once he got the ball back.

You can’t hope to be taken seriously when you even try to minimize how bad he was in the biggest game of the year, with all his weapons healthy.

 

[dscher]

So Billy B. like. Bad move if true.

I'm sure the players or coaches don't care. They have a new plane.

 

[Shane]

If you aren't firing someone then you need to force Kliff to take an offensive coordinator and remove the playcalling from him. Its crystal clear that he can't manage the flow of the game and call plays at the same time. It's why we are constantly wasting time outs and precious minutes in high pressure situations.

Someone posted a stat about mid season that says he is about on par with Shanahan In This category. And better then many coaches. Not so sure it’s the problem everyone thinks it is. Also the 3 games that McCoy started it was noticed by @Russ Smith and others that there were far far less issues with this. Suggesting maybe it’s a Murray issue not necessarily the coach maybe?

I don’t have the answer just asking the question considering the above?