Bigger impact in 2021: Isaiah Simmons or Zaven Collins

[QuebecCard]

Is not about just the weight but the agility, the right compromise to be effective with nfl speed
The guy is built like a defensive end, there is a reason the most impactful ILB nowdays are in the range of 230/245
In any cases the answer is the field, at this point obviously the more optimistic here doesn't see it like an issue
Dansby was around 250/255 in college, but I remember him saying he played in the range 235/240
Somebody can say about Devin white or Wagner who are 6'1 and around 240/245 but both are athletic freaks, very explosive

The unicorn is a better athlete than Dansby.

Is he as smart?

Left to be seen.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Most of them aren't 6'5" either. Kuechly for instance is at 240 and is 6'3". That extra 2" can carry an extra 15 pounds or so.

I'd prefer 250ish but year each inch for a bigger guy means he can carry more weight.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I'd prefer 250ish but year each inch for a bigger guy means he can carry more weight.

He also looks to have a big frame on top of being tall. The 255-263 optimal weight number he gave out seems to make sense with that in mind.

 

[CFLredzoned]

I think he defies his weight some due to his gymnastics background.

 

[JeffGollin]

They're the Bobbsey Twins -

How well one does, so will the other.

 

[oaken1]

Collins IMO

he has natural instinct and in our division we face teams with strong running games

we should never see a RB get to the second level

 

[Chopper0080]

Good news is for those who loved the idea of Washington and Dansby, thee two have the ability to be that. Collins may never be the LB Dansby ultimately was, but Simmons can easily be better than DWashington was.

 

[football karma]

i think Simmons makes more plays that fans remember: sacks, interceptions, etc

i think Collins may quietly play effective Mike LB -- tackling the RB in the correct gap for a 2.5 yard gain, taking away a throwing window and making the QB pull the ball down, etc

 

[DVontel]

Really hope Zaven pans out badly cause we already look foolish drafting off-ball Linebackers in the top 16 back-to-back drafts, now imagine if neither pan out to stardom?

Yuck.

 

[QuebecCard]

Really hope Zaven pans out badly cause we already look foolish drafting off-ball Linebackers in the top 16 back-to-back drafts, now imagine if neither pan out to stardom?

Yuck.

Other than you and Chopper, who continually re-visit your preferences, I've read nothing out there suggesting that selecting Simmons and Zaven was or is viewed as 'foolish'.

 

[BritCard]

Really hope Zaven pans out badly cause we already look foolish drafting off-ball Linebackers in the top 16 back-to-back drafts, now imagine if neither pan out to stardom?

Yuck.

Is this "I badly hope he pans out" or "I hope he pans out badly"? I assume the first but it reads like the second.

 

[DVontel]

Is this "I badly hope he pans out" or "I hope he pans out badly"? I assume the first but it reads like the second.

1st.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Calling it now, if they both stay healthy, they’ll be the consensus best ILB duo in the league by season’s end. I’m expecting a massive improvement defensively. If we stay remotely healthy (especially in our paper-thin secondary) and aren’t a top 5-7 defense by season’s end, Vance is more worthless than I ever thought.

 

[ajcardfan]

Why is Leki Fotu not part of this conversation?

 

[juza76]

Good news is for those who loved the idea of Washington and Dansby, thee two have the ability to be that. Collins may never be the LB Dansby ultimately was, but Simmons can easily be better than DWashington was.

I don't get this statement
Washington was damn good, probably the best linebacker I saw in Cardinals jearsey
Was so quick and instinctive playing the position and was a great tackler as well

 

[cardsfanmd]

I don't get this statement
Washington was damn good, probably the best linebacker I saw in Cardinals jearsey
Was so quick and instinctive playing the position and was a great tackler as well

And Simmons is quicker, more instinctive a better tackler and bigger.

 

[juza76]

And Simmons is quicker, more instinctive a better tackler and bigger.

Comparing Daryl Washington first season with Simmons, Washington was better
Quicker? Really?
Instinctive, that's funny..
Forget track numbers, just say what u saw on the field
I didn't see yet a quicker lb then Washington

 

[cardsfanmd]

Comparing Daryl Washington first season with Simmons, Washington was better
Quicker? Really?
Instinctive, that's funny..
Forget track numbers, just say what u saw on the field
I didn't see yet a quicker lb then Washington

Let me preface this by saying I was one of the original backers of Washington’s game (and there weren’t many...K9). The only thing I held against him coming out was that he was dumb and was never a team captain.

The combine numbers tell me and everyone else who can read that Simmons is bigger and quicker. Im not sure why you’re debating that.

Go back and look at the numbers as well as the tape. Washington wasn’t a pro bowler until his 3rd year and he was fast, not instinctive. Simmons made just as many if not more big plays last year in way less snaps than Washington did in his rookie year as a starter because we didn’t have anyone good in front of him on the depth chart.

Simmons was DPOY in all of college football at Clemson his junior year. Washington was a 1 year starter at TCU and not even a team caption.

In short, there’s not a serious talent evaluator in the world who would’ve ranked Washington ahead of Simmons. This isn’t even worth discussing.

 

[SoonerLou]

Really hope Zaven pans out badly cause we already look foolish drafting off-ball Linebackers in the top 16 back-to-back drafts, now imagine if neither pan out to stardom?

Yuck.

Humphries
Pugh?
Hudson
AVT (easy trade-up . Then again Wirfs would have got us in the playoffs so maybe not)
Wirfs

would have been such an elite Oline

If Zaven/Simmons are Lavonte David/Devin White level good then everything worked out for the best.

 

[juza76]

Let me preface this by saying I was one of the original backers of Washington’s game (and there weren’t many...K9). The only thing I held against him coming out was that he was dumb and was never a team captain.

The combine numbers tell me and everyone else who can read that Simmons is bigger and quicker. Im not sure why you’re debating that.

Go back and look at the numbers as well as the tape. Washington wasn’t a pro bowler until his 3rd year and he was fast, not instinctive. Simmons made just as many if not more big plays last year in way less snaps than Washington did in his rookie year as a starter because we didn’t have anyone good in front of him on the depth chart.

Simmons was DPOY in all of college football at Clemson his junior year. Washington was a 1 year starter at TCU and not even a team caption.

In short, there’s not a serious talent evaluator in the world who would’ve ranked Washington ahead of Simmons. This isn’t even worth discussing.

About the talent evaluator I would care less and their respective college snaps either
I just said Washington first year was much better
And moreover he was much faster reacting/reading plays and quicker
Is not even worth debating or maybe u confusing him with Kevin minter

 

[PDXChris]

Is not about just the weight but the agility, the right compromise to be effective with nfl speed
The guy is built like a defensive end, there is a reason the most impactful ILB nowdays are in the range of 230/245
In any cases the answer is the field, at this point obviously the more optimistic here doesn't see it like an issue
Dansby was around 250/255 in college, but I remember him saying he played in the range 235/240
Somebody can say about Devin white or Wagner who are 6'0/6'1 and around 240/245 but both are athletic freaks, very explosive

I don't think you understand how agility works. The Olympian in this video has more agility than most, yet she is probably 100lbs over weight. Weight and agility don't always go hand in hand.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

 

[juza76]

I don't think you understand how agility works. The Olympian in this video has more agility than most, yet she is probably 100lbs over weight. Weight and agility don't always go hand in hand.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

Being agile despite the weight doesn't mean he/she can be more agile with less weight to carry on
About Collins it's about being 10 lb less, not much, being adequate quick in college level is one thing, be as effective in the nfl is another thing

 

[PDXChris]

Being agile despite the weight doesn't mean he/she can be more agile with less weight to carry on
About Collins it's about being 10 lb less, not much, being adequate quick in college level is one thing, be as effective in the nfl is another thing

Again, weight doesn't equal agility. There are several factors that goes into being an optimal athlete and each athlete is different. For example, when I am below 10% body fat, my stamina struggles because I start to lose muscle insy4ad of fat when training and competing. My prime zone is 12% body fat at 180lbs and I am 5'9". Strength coaches work to figure this out for each athlete and put them all on different plans. It's not an exact science, but to say he needs to be in a certain weight range without knowing anything about how is wrong. If he leans out too much, the same could happen to him. He's such a big guy and will play do many snaps, I predict he'll break-down if he is too lean.

 

[BritCard]

Again, weight doesn't equal agility. There are several factors that goes into being an optimal athlete and each athlete is different. For example, when I am below 10% body fat, my stamina struggles because I start to lose muscle insy4ad of fat when training and competing. My prime zone is 12% body fat at 180lbs and I am 5'9". Strength coaches work to figure this out for each athlete and put them all on different plans. It's not an exact science, but to say he needs to be in a certain weight range without knowing anything about how is wrong. If he leans out too much, the same could happen to him. He's such a big guy and will play do many snaps, I predict he'll break-down if he is too lean.

Has nobody seen Aaron Donald?

 

[juza76]

Again, weight doesn't equal agility. There are several factors that goes into being an optimal athlete and each athlete is different. For example, when I am below 10% body fat, my stamina struggles because I start to lose muscle insy4ad of fat when training and competing. My prime zone is 12% body fat at 180lbs and I am 5'9". Strength coaches work to figure this out for each athlete and put them all on different plans. It's not an exact science, but to say he needs to be in a certain weight range without knowing anything about how is wrong. If he leans out too much, the same could happen to him. He's such a big guy and will play do many snaps, I predict he'll break-down if he is too lean.

Are u making an example of u, I'm talking about super competitive NFL
BTW let's see what he will do later, now it's premature talking
As I said even dansby slimmed down a bit to be more effective, when I watch his tape, I see a talented lb but a liitle bit stiff in change of directions, maybe I'm wrong maybe not, nfl is different then college
But even if he claimed his right weigh is 260, without the response of the nfl field, let's see in the future, he will certainly figure out what the best for himself