Calling all David Barrett fans

[AZCB34]

OK, now that he has become our #1 corner let me ask:

Do you really think he is a shut down number one corner who can shut off the likes of Moss, Booker, Owens, Holt/Bruce, Robinson etc?

I had trouble buying Barrett as a #2 but a #1 now?

So again the question is, do you think he is good enough to be a shut down corner against the best WRs in the league?

(This is not meant to be a Barrett sucks thread nor do I want to hear the "This is the hand the Cards were dealt" stuff. Just wondering if those who are so high on him think he is truley a shutdown corner.

 

[football karma]

He isnt.

But neither are either of the Bucs starting two corners –

Like the Bucs, the Cardinals have always played, and will continue to play, lots of cover 2 zone. Cover two only works if A) you have linebackers who can run and cover and B) you have a pass rush. Unlike the Bucs, the Cardinals haven’t had either in the past couple years.

In 2003, the Cardinals certainly have A, it remains to be seen if they have B

 

[Wild Card]

Originally posted by AZCB34
... do you think he is good enough to be a shut down corner against the best WRs in the league?... Just wondering if those who are so high on him think he is truley a shutdown corner.

AZCB34:

What, exactly, is a "shutdown corner"? This term get tossed around a lot, but I'm beginning to think that it's almost meaningless.

Name the cornerbacks currently playing in this league who truly take away half the field on an every-down basis, independent of a good/ great front seven. The rap on Duane Starks, for example--before he got hurt, when he suddenly became irreplaceable--was that he'd been a product of the system in Baltimore, and got exposed with the Cards and their poor pass rush.

Increasingly, I think that effective CB play in the NFL is a matter of fitting individual players' skills to a particular scheme and coaching them up. I think there are a handful of DBs, at most, who are so skilled that they can dominate "the best WRs in the league" regardless of who plays around them.

No, I don't think David Barrett is a "shutdown corner." I don't think many other DBs are, either.

WC

 

[RugbyMuffin]

David Barrett

Well, I am a David Barrett fan but I will not say that I haven't yelled at him threw the TV on numerous occasions.

HE IS NOT A SHUTDOWN CORNER. He is a scrapper, he is strong, and does a good job of reading the play, and jamming the WR.

but he is no shutdown corner, and wouldn't start most places.

I am a fan of him, and always root for him to do well, but #1 recievers in our division will be eating him alive!

Peace

 

[cardzfan]

No matter who the corner is, they look better with a good pass rush. A mediocre corner can look decent if the QB is throwing off his back foot all the time.

 

[AZCB34]

Take shut down out of the equation. I put that in there since virtually anytime a #1 CB is mentioned, the term shutdown is attached. So take shutdown out.

Is he a #1 CB in this league by his talent?

 

[Shane]

I am very high on David Barrett and from what I have seen with my own two eyes shows me that he is a quality STARTING CB in this league! He is a good #2 IMO!

Is he a shutdown CB? No! Heck in the NFL today there might be one or two actual shutdown CBs out there. That being Champ Bailey maybe Shawn Springs.

Our problems with our secondary over the last three years have been from lack of pass rush! If our rush in the regular season is as good as it looks so far in the pre-season then even with us starting Hill and Barrett we will be ok! Any DBs would look suspect at times with lack of pass rush this team has had Including the two I named above. So I personally dont think you have given any of them a fair assessment!

Do I wish we had more talent? Of course. But im not gonna sit here and worry about it. What goods it gonna do?

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Shut Down Cornerbacks.

A guy who can jam the reciever, and if the Reciever even gets off him he can't outrun him, can't get to the inside, and pretty much can't do anything.
Now please don't give me to much hoopla back on this. Even shutdown corners get beat, and MOST have low stats cause nobody wants to throw there way.

Shutdown Corners:

1. Rod Woodson - in his prime
2. Charles Woodson - before injuries
3. Champ Bailey - currently, the guy is a stud.
4. Ty Law - yet slow for a CB
5. Todd Lyght - Was on Detriot, and was probably one the best
corner backs I have ever seen, year in year out very solid
6. Terry Allen - My father called him the bane of the Giants, I saw
him play a lot and man he was strong and quick
7. Aneas Williams - in his prime, at one point WAS the Cardinals
secondary
8. Night Train Lane! - fast, and VISCIOUS as hell!

That is the best I can do off the top of my head. Some of the old timers on this board could probably add a few more.

But CB just recently has become SOOO important now with running the ball giving way to short passing, so older teams didn't rely on CB too much. San Fransisco, and I will always hate them for this, KILLED running the ball with there west coast offense dynasty. THE BASTARDS!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Originally posted by Shane H
I am very high on David Barrett and from what I have seen with my own two eyes shows me that he is a quality STARTING CB in this league! He is a good #2 IMO!

Is he a shutdown CB? No! Heck in the NFL today there might be one or two actual shutdown CBs out there. That being Champ Bailey maybe Shawn Springs.

Our problems with our secondary over the last three years have been from lack of pass rush! If our rush in the regular season is as good as it looks so far in the pre-season then even with us starting Hill and Barrett we will be ok! Any DBs would look suspect at times with lack of pass rush this team has had Including the two I named above. So I personally dont think you have given any of them a fair assessment!

Do I wish we had more talent? Of course. But im not gonna sit here and worry about it. What goods it gonna do?

Re-inforcing my post above. I see that Champ Bailey is the only current injury free shutdown corner in the league today.

And yes, I am not saying Barret is not a player. The guy can play but he will NOT have much success against the division reciever, but in that thought who would.
The corner back weakness on our team will be helped by our improved pass rush, and our excellent safties.

Peace

 

[Wild Card]

Originally posted by RugbyMuffin
Re-inforcing my post above. I see that Champ Bailey is the only current injury free shutdown corner in the league today...
The corner back weakness on our team will be helped by our improved pass rush, and our excellent safties.

RM:

Bingo. In the modern era, I think Deion Sanders--for most of his career--defined the term "shutdown corner." Past a point, it didn't matter who the other Dallas DBs were, or who was lined up in the front seven. If Deion played zone, part of the field disappeared. If he played man, his WR might as well have been on the bench. Period. (And yes, Cardinals fans, in his prime Aeneas Williams came close.)

Problem is, there aren't a helluva lot of Deions floating around. Most of the players to whom the term "shutdown corner" get applied cheapen the term, IMO. (Sorta like "franchise QB." Elway, Marino and Montana were franchise QBs. Brett Favre is a franchise QB. Merely very good QBs need not apply.)

WC

 

[kerouac9]

Why has no one mentioned Chris McAllister in this conversation? For as good a D as B-More has had, they've never been dominant pass-rushers. Christ McAllister might be the best corner in the league right now, but is definately the most underrated. He'll get a signing bonus larger than Champ Bailey's, and deservedly so.

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by kerouac9
Why has no one mentioned Chris McAllister in this conversation? For as good a D as B-More has had, they've never been dominant pass-rushers. Christ McAllister might be the best corner in the league right now, but is definately the most underrated. He'll get a signing bonus larger than Champ Bailey's, and deservedly so.

I dont care how he plays on the field a guy that is a prejudice piece of **** like him will never get any mention or respect from me!

 

[BACH]

Originally posted by Shane H
Is he a shutdown CB? No! Heck in the NFL today there might be one or two actual shutdown CBs out there. That being Champ Bailey maybe Shawn Springs.

Add Troy Vincent, Chris McAllister, Sam Madison, Patrich Surtain and an injury-free Woodson.

But you're absolutely right. Very few players can be descibed as shutdown corners.

 

[kerouac9]

Samari Rolle borders on "shutdown", but he's more of a "premire cover corner".

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Shane H
I dont care how he plays on the field a guy that is a prejudice piece of **** like him will never get any mention or respect from me!

What is bringing this on? What did McAllister do?

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by AZCB34
What is bringing this on? What did McAllister do?

All I can say is Ihave delt with him professionally! I have my own opinions of him! You could find a news article on it Im sure if you dug hard enough!

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Shane H
All I can say is Ihave delt with him professionally! I have my own opinions of him! You could find a news article on it Im sure if you dug hard enough!

Hmmm. The plot thickens.

Actually, it doesn't surprise me one bit. I bet you have an interesting story to tell

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by AZCB34
Hmmm. The plot thickens.

Actually, it doesn't surprise me one bit. I bet you have an interesting story to tell

One day if we ever meet I will tell it but not in a public forum! Sorry!

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Shane H
One day if we ever meet I will tell it but not in a public forum! Sorry!

No problem. Wasn't trying to get you to spill anything. I just bet there is an interesting story there.

Shane, slight change of subject. Now that the Cards are marketing Las Vegas, will you be getting more regular season games up there? Is Las Vegas now considered a Cards market so far as programming is concerned?

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by AZCB34
No problem. Wasn't trying to get you to spill anything. I just bet there is an interesting story there.

Shane, slight change of subject. Now that the Cards are marketing Las Vegas, will you be getting more regular season games up there? Is Las Vegas now considered a Cards market so far as programming is concerned?

Just the pre-season games and nothing more! Good thing I get Direct TV! I couldnt live without it!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Originally posted by Wild Card
RM:

Bingo. In the modern era, I think Deion Sanders--for most of his career--defined the term "shutdown corner." Past a point, it didn't matter who the other Dallas DBs were, or who was lined up in the front seven. If Deion played zone, part of the field disappeared. If he played man, his WR might as well have been on the bench. Period. (And yes, Cardinals fans, in his prime Aeneas Williams came close.)

Problem is, there aren't a helluva lot of Deions floating around. Most of the players to whom the term "shutdown corner" get applied cheapen the term, IMO. (Sorta like "franchise QB." Elway, Marino and Montana were franchise QBs. Brett Favre is a franchise QB. Merely very good QBs need not apply.)

WC

I almost put him up there, but his tackling was SOOO bad. But coverage he was a monster. The guy would outrun recievers on an overthrown ball and intercept it!
If Deion ever put all his effort in football he would have been one of the best ever!

To bad he has turned into a clown!

Peace

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Originally posted by kerouac9
Why has no one mentioned Chris McAllister in this conversation? For as good a D as B-More has had, they've never been dominant pass-rushers. Christ McAllister might be the best corner in the league right now, but is definately the most underrated. He'll get a signing bonus larger than Champ Bailey's, and deservedly so.

Another one that I almost added. The only reason I didn't was because he hasn't been playing that long. But he plays solid the next couple year and he will be one of the best.
He has all the potential to be a so called Shut down corner.

Longevity is a hard thing to come by at the Corner Back position.