Calling People Trolls

[Chris_Sanders]

I read the Lakers thread this morning and I saw the repeated attacks on 1Sun by calling him a troll. To his credit, he didn't respond to those attacks. Name calling is against the sites rules but I won't be issuing any warnings or bannings. I just want to address this question before moving on:

It was asked why he is allowed to post here? I can answer that one.

His takes may not be popular but that happens all over the board. I don't believe he says stuff to get a rise out of people, which is the definition of trolling. I believe he is pretty consistent in his opinion, even if you or I don't agree with it.

We have a similar issue on the Cardinals board right now where a small group doesn't like Kyler Murray and everyone else does. I am not going to censor opinions just because I or others don't agree with them.

The one time I tried to cowtow to popular opinion about how "Trollish" someone is and it absolutely blew up in my face and fractured the board. A strong lesson was learned then to not try to over moderate, especially when people's passions run hot.

So please remember to debate the opinion not the person behind it. Absolutely refute things, especially if they are easily proven to be incorrect. If you can't or won't debate them, then put them on ignore. If you can't or won't do that, then that is on you.

If you disagree with this stance, you can absolutely take it up with @Shaggy or myself via PM.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I am tentatively opening this thread but the intent here is not to invite further discussion over if someone is a troll or not.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

It's really a simple solution. If someone feels like another poster is a troll and brings nothing to the board than just put them on ignore and move on.

 

[95pro]

I’m tired of the people posting that he’s a troll.

if you feel like that, then don’t feed it

If you feel like that , then use the ignore option.

but don’t ruin a thread with those kinds of posts.

 

[TJ]

Respectfully disagree, Chris. In general, when you have an individual who's knowingly inciting negative reactions, that's trolling. It's a lot different than the KM subject. Yeah, the name calling and personal attacks in that situation can be better managed by individual posters, but it's gotten to the point in this situation where a large contingent of posters are becoming frustrated with the level of discourse. Yeah, we can use the "ignore" feature, but that doesn't eliminate the posts where others who I'm not going to put on ignore continue to respond to their posts. So, in essence, it doesn't fix the core issue.

I'm not asking for a perma-ban by any stretch, but it warrants some form of action by the moderators, in my opinion. Maybe you've already handled the situation in private, but I hope it's been addressed with the poster in question.

Moreover, I don't recall a situation on this board in which it was fractured because of an action moderators took, but certainly, addressing this situation isn't going to rip the board to shreds.

I'll do what I can on my end with my limited abilities to resolve the situation, but I can assure you that it won't fix the core issue.

 

[BC867]

Respectfully disagree, Chris. In general, when you have an individual who's knowingly inciting negative reactions, that's trolling.

I don't believe that 1Sun is posting to incite negative reactions. Or that he is a troll.

If you look back, you'll see that most of what he has predicted has sadly come true.

I believe that what pisses off people about his posting behavior is obsessively repeating
the same things over and over.

Why? Because when he sees comments with which he disagrees, he posts it -- every time.

I would attribute that to a mild case of OCD -- obsessive compulsive disorder. Plenty of
people are walking around with that to some degree. Including myself. Self diagnosed.

The biggest case in point? Criticizing "management". History shows that Robert Sarver is
incompetent and meddling (a bad combination). It is typical for someone like that to
surround themselves with incompetents. Promote people without the credentials to
stand up to him. We've seen it over and over.

The performance of our turnover of General Managers and Head Coaches, and their failures
over the past decade, support that. From our prospective as fans, it is frustrating rooting
for losers. The Suns have indeed remained losers. And we as fans have remained victims.

Posters such as 1Sun are town criers. Sarver is coming! Sarver is coming! Just as in the
days of the Revolutionary War. We can't stop them from coming. But we can vent.

Or, as I've done to no avail, writing to Jerry Colangelo (and received a generic response)
and to Sarver's gang of co-investors and to the NBA. It made me feel a little better.

Unfortunately, there is no hope in sight. And ASFN, among others, is the place to lament
over it. I am sure that 1Sun, as the rest of us, would rather be ecstatic as we were for
the first two weeks of the season when Aron Baynes was the difference maker before
age caught up with him.

 

[1Sun]

I don't believe that 1Sun is posting to incite negative reactions. Or that he is a troll.

If you look back, you'll see that most of what he has predicted has sadly come true.

I believe that what pisses off people about his posting behavior is obsessively repeating
the same things over and over.

Why? Because when he sees comments with which he disagrees, he posts it -- every time.

I would attribute that to a mild case of OCD -- obsessive compulsive disorder. Plenty of
people are walking around with that to some degree. Including myself. Self diagnosed.

The biggest case in point? Criticizing "management". History shows that Robert Sarver is
incompetent and meddling (a bad combination). It is typical for someone like that to
surround themselves with incompetents. Promote people without the credentials to
stand up to him. We've seen it over and over.

The performance of our turnover of General Managers and Head Coaches, and their failures
over the past decade, support that. From our prospective as fans, it is frustrating rooting
for losers. The Suns have indeed remained losers. And we as fans have remained victims.

Posters such as 1Sun are town criers. Sarver is coming! Sarver is coming! Just as in the
days of the Revolutionary War. We can't stop them from coming. But we can vent.

Or, as I've done to no avail, writing to Jerry Colangelo (and received a generic response)
and to Sarver's gang of co-investors and to the NBA. It made me feel a little better.

Unfortunately, there is no hope in sight. And ASFN, among others, is the place to lament
over it. I am sure that 1Sun, as the rest of us, would rather be ecstatic as we were for
the first two weeks of the season when Aron Baynes was the difference maker before
age caught up with him.

Indeed I would...

 

[Raze]

I've been posting on Suns' forums since the mid 90's. I've never "ignored" anyone in that entire time... until now. My decision wasn't based on WHAT is being said as opinions vary wildly on EVERY forum, rather it's the sheer VOLUME of posts with a repetitive nature that drove me to click the button. Couple that with the apparent lack of audience awareness and you get an amplified irritation from normal posters. (I've actually un-ignored the same poster 3 times to try and give them a chance. I lasted 5 minutes each time. Went right back to ignore.)

It's not dissimilar from that guy who repetitively taps his pencil. People politely ask him to stop, but he passively continues. After a time, someone blows their top, while the tapper stares in disbelief. Then continues to tap. The whole room turns on him and starts to yell, while he looks at everyone like they are insane... and continues to tap. Therefore no one is surprised when the boss places the guy in the closet (ala what Jim did to Ryan on "The Office").

To be clear, this is NOT directly aggressive behavior. I haven't witnessed any directly aggressive posts by this particular poster. However, it's a clear example of passive-aggressive behavior. I've literally witnessed hundreds of passive-aggressive posts by this particular poster.

Passive-aggressive: "of or denoting a type of behavior or personality characterized by indirect resistance to the demands of others..." -Google dictionary

Call it passive-aggressive trolling if you like. I see it as willfully being disrespectful to the posters. It's selfish to come on to a board, know that what you are doing is consistently irritating people, and then continue to do so at your own pleasure.

That said, I don't think ANY punishment should be given. I see no reason to make a martyr of someone undeserving. These type of people will go away when they continue to betray their audience and thus, sadly, end up alone. Their own arrogance will be their undoing.

As for forums like this one, that is why man invented the "ignore" button. I encourage everyone effected to use it.

 

[Superbone]

The forum software needs to get smarter about not showing replies to ignored posters. At least make it an option. My patience was gone very early, probably over a year ago, but I continue to see post after post out of context that are obviously replies to my lone ignored poster.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I've been posting on Suns' forums since the mid 90's. I've never "ignored" anyone in that entire time... until now. My decision wasn't based on WHAT is being said as opinions vary wildly on EVERY forum, rather it's the sheer VOLUME of posts with a repetitive nature that drove me to click the button. Couple that with the apparent lack of audience awareness and you get an amplified irritation from normal posters. (I've actually un-ignored the same poster 3 times to try and give them a chance. I lasted 5 minutes each time. Went right back to ignore.)

It's not dissimilar from that guy who repetitively taps his pencil. People politely ask him to stop, but he passively continues. After a time, someone blows their top, while the tapper stares in disbelief. Then continues to tap. The whole room turns on him and starts to yell, while he looks at everyone like they are insane... and continues to tap. Therefore no one is surprised when the boss places the guy in the closet (ala what Jim did to Ryan on "The Office").

To be clear, this is NOT directly aggressive behavior. I haven't witnessed any directly aggressive posts by this particular poster. However, it's a clear example of passive-aggressive behavior. I've literally witnessed hundreds of passive-aggressive posts by this particular poster.

Passive-aggressive: "of or denoting a type of behavior or personality characterized by indirect resistance to the demands of others..." -Google dictionary

Call it passive-aggressive trolling if you like. I see it as willfully being disrespectful to the posters. It's selfish to come on to a board, know that what you are doing is consistently irritating people, and then continue to do so at your own pleasure.

That said, I don't think ANY punishment should be given. I see no reason to make a martyr of someone undeserving. These type of people will go away when they continue to betray their audience and thus, sadly, end up alone. Their own arrogance will be their undoing.

As for forums like this one, that is why man invented the "ignore" button. I encourage everyone effected to use it.

Really agree with the tapping of a pencil analogy. Though it would have to accompanied with the person occasionally looking around and saying "see I told you this is the noise it would make" before continuing to tap.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Respectfully disagree, Chris. In general, when you have an individual who's knowingly inciting negative reactions, that's trolling. It's a lot different than the KM subject. Yeah, the name calling and personal attacks in that situation can be better managed by individual posters, but it's gotten to the point in this situation where a large contingent of posters are becoming frustrated with the level of discourse. Yeah, we can use the "ignore" feature, but that doesn't eliminate the posts where others who I'm not going to put on ignore continue to respond to their posts. So, in essence, it doesn't fix the core issue.

I'm not asking for a perma-ban by any stretch, but it warrants some form of action by the moderators, in my opinion. Maybe you've already handled the situation in private, but I hope it's been addressed with the poster in question.

Moreover, I don't recall a situation on this board in which it was fractured because of an action moderators took, but certainly, addressing this situation isn't going to rip the board to shreds.

I'll do what I can on my end with my limited abilities to resolve the situation, but I can assure you that it won't fix the core issue.

I guarantee if all of you that think he was a troll just ignored him like some of us he’d run outta oxygen and it would considerably cut down on the one-sided posts most of us would have to read complaining about him.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The forum software needs to get smarter about not showing replies to ignored posters. At least make it an option. My patience was gone very early, probably over a year ago, but I continue to see post after post out of context that are obviously replies to my lone ignored poster.

Now THAT would be amazing.

 

[1Sun]

I've been posting on Suns' forums since the mid 90's. I've never "ignored" anyone in that entire time... until now. My decision wasn't based on WHAT is being said as opinions vary wildly on EVERY forum, rather it's the sheer VOLUME of posts with a repetitive nature that drove me to click the button. Couple that with the apparent lack of audience awareness and you get an amplified irritation from normal posters. (I've actually un-ignored the same poster 3 times to try and give them a chance. I lasted 5 minutes each time. Went right back to ignore.)

It's not dissimilar from that guy who repetitively taps his pencil. People politely ask him to stop, but he passively continues. After a time, someone blows their top, while the tapper stares in disbelief. Then continues to tap. The whole room turns on him and starts to yell, while he looks at everyone like they are insane... and continues to tap. Therefore no one is surprised when the boss places the guy in the closet (ala what Jim did to Ryan on "The Office").

To be clear, this is NOT directly aggressive behavior. I haven't witnessed any directly aggressive posts by this particular poster. However, it's a clear example of passive-aggressive behavior. I've literally witnessed hundreds of passive-aggressive posts by this particular poster.

Passive-aggressive: "of or denoting a type of behavior or personality characterized by indirect resistance to the demands of others..." -Google dictionary

Call it passive-aggressive trolling if you like. I see it as willfully being disrespectful to the posters. It's selfish to come on to a board, know that what you are doing is consistently irritating people, and then continue to do so at your own pleasure.

That said, I don't think ANY punishment should be given. I see no reason to make a martyr of someone undeserving. These type of people will go away when they continue to betray their audience and thus, sadly, end up alone. Their own arrogance will be their undoing.

As for forums like this one, that is why man invented the "ignore" button. I encourage everyone effected to use it.

Just remember that similar accusations befell the likes of Woodward and Bernstein...until people finally realized that they had some important points to raise, and that people being annoyed by their incessant reporting wasn't going to sway them. Same goes for Ruth Bader Ginsberg in her career as a litigator not being deterred by those annoyed with her incessant points about sexism.

Just saying...

 

[Mainstreet]

I can't believe someone just drew a comparison to Bob Woodward, Leonard Bernstein and Ruth Bader Ginsberg.

 

[1Sun]

I can't believe someone just drew a comparison to Bob Woodward, Leonard Bernstein and Ruth Bader Ginsberg.

Carl Bernstein.

And imagine the authoritarian, fascist, dystopian society in which we would live if people were afraid to speak up, or even if they simply didn't bother to speak up, because they were concerned others were annoyed by what they had to say.

Ignore me. Disagree with me. Call me what you want. None of that will stop me from expressing my opinions here or elsewhere, as is my natural right to do.

 

[Mainstreet]

This is a forum not the "authoritarian, fascist, dystopian society" of which the poster speaks.

 

[JerkFace]

I don’t mind bad takes, but I have a huge pet peeve of misinformation and straight up lies on message boards. People come here not only for other’s takes, but also for information. When people start spreading rumors or false information under the guise of truth it is worse than trolling and it spreads beyond the control of the ignore function.

 

[Phrazbit]

I don’t mind bad takes, but I have a huge pet peeve of misinformation and straight up lies on message boards. People come here not only for other’s takes, but also for information. When people start spreading rumors or false information under the guise of truth it is worse than trolling and it spreads beyond the control of the ignore function.

Yup.

Stuff like... Baynes probably has a career altering injury... Oubre is signing with the Knicks for the max... what was the new one today? Ayton for Gallinari...?

Inane trash that is claimed to have been "heard", but is totally unsourced and information that cannot be found anywhere else but from someone who always takes the most negative view possible.

I'm sorry... but a spade is a spade.

I am not calling for any bannings, I am not questioning why someone is "allowed" to post, but I do feel pretty strong that their motivation is not to share their thoughts as a fan, but instead to piss people off.

"Just saying..."

 

[82CardsGrad]

Yup.

Stuff like... Baynes probably has a career altering injury... Oubre is signing with the Knicks for the max... what was the new one today? Ayton for Gallinari...?

Inane trash that is claimed to have been "heard", but is totally unsourced and information that cannot be found anywhere else but from someone who always takes the most negative view possible.

I'm sorry... but a spade is a spade.

I am not calling for any bannings, I am not questioning why someone is "allowed" to post, but I do feel pretty strong that their motivation is not to share their thoughts as a fan, but instead to piss people off.

"Just saying..."

100%... The issue of dispensing “misinformation” is what ultimately led my use of the ignore option. I am totally supportive of differing views and opinions. However, when a poster simply refuses to accept he/she is wrong, while also continuing to spew inaccurate and unfounded info, well... it’s time to ignore.
I have only ever placed two posters on ignore... One is the subject of this thread. The other has an oddly similar posting characteristic to the subject of this thread... [emoji6]

 

[JCSunsfan]

The forum software needs to get smarter about not showing replies to ignored posters. At least make it an option. My patience was gone very early, probably over a year ago, but I continue to see post after post out of context that are obviously replies to my lone ignored poster.

I it’s really not hard to ignore replies to ignored posters. If everyone who is frustrated with a poster puts him on ignore, it’s done.

 

[GatorAZ]

I it’s really not hard to ignore replies to ignored posters. If everyone who is frustrated with a poster puts him on ignore, it’s done.

It’s not hard to ignore posters if they’re not on ignore. I skip it.

 

[JCSunsfan]

It reminds me of parenting. I remember once getting in an argument with one of my children, then it hit me that he was three years old. No one ever wins an argument with a three year old. Once I came to grips with that, and just said “no”, parenting got a lot easier.

 

[Cheesebeef]

you guys know you're giving him exactly what he wants here, right?

btw, @1Sun, I do want to thank you for comparing yourself to the men who brought down a US President. Needed a good laugh on a day when another GOP President was thrusting us toward WW3.

 

[gimpy]

 

[Chris_Sanders]

This thread is closed.