Can I Just Ask...

[Mitch]

True

But I know the 49ers got many of theirs rushing four

The cards got theirs by blitzing

Bingo.

 

[GuernseyCard]

True

But I know the 49ers got many of theirs rushing four

The cards got theirs by blitzing

So?

Our pass 'D' held up better than San Fran's despite the blitzing and our total doesn't include what additional contributions we may have had from Schofield in the latter half of the season.

 

[Mitch]

Like when we passed up Jonathon Ogden in order to draft Simeon Rice?

How about this decade when we passed up Adrian Peterson in order to draft Levi Brown?

 

[GuernseyCard]

How about this decade when we passed up Adrian Peterson in order to draft Levi Brown?

There is no Ogden in this draft and there isn't even a Rice.

I'm watching the Raven's O-line dominate and that's what we need in our division.

 

[Mitch]

So?

Our pass 'D' held up better than San Fran's despite the blitzing and our total doesn't include what additional contributions we may have had from Schofield in the latter half of the season.

What in the world are you talking about?

The 49ers were 4th in the NFL in both run defense (94.2 ypg) and pass defense (200.2 ypg).

Some of the things you say are mystifying---c'mon, man.

 

[GuernseyCard]

What in the world are you talking about?

The 49ers were 4th in the NFL in both run defense (94.2 ypg) and pass defense (200.2 ypg).

Some of the things you say are mystifying---c'mon, man.

Perhaps overstated, but I was considering our number of interceptions off blitz pressure. As for thoughts that are sometimes mystifying, please, not from you.

 

[PJ1]

We have no offense. Start with finally fixing the OL. We watched two teams with physical and talented offensive lines tonight.

 

[Chopper0080]

I would take Jarvis Jones and Demantre Moore over Warmack. But that's just me.

I think in terms of value you are correct. Personally, in terms of the Cardinals I think you have to draft Warmack. The offense needs help badly and at some point you HAVE to give it some help. I know there aren't any guarantees in terms of draft picks, but Warmack is as close as you can get IMO. We aren't going to be able to add a top QB which hurts the offenses ability to improve and so you have to find other ways to improve on that side of the ball.

You just can't have a year like we did last year offensively, and then ignore that side of the ball.

 

[JeffGollin]

We have no offense. Start with finally fixing the OL. We watched two teams with physical and talented offensive lines tonight.

I have a somewhat different (& oblique) take -

Of course, you can't win consistently without talent at key positions (like QB and OL), but, in the end, what we need on every play in every situation is an "answer." During the final 3/4 of last season and late in games, you had the sinking feeling that "anything we tried would be fruitless."

Answers can come from three or four sources -

- An inspired, mentally tough team that decides it's time to hit the other guys in the mouth.

- One or more elite athletes capable of carrying the team on their backs.

- A creative and resourceful coaching staff that "on the fly" can consistently pull something out of their butts to flip a game.

- Or when you don't have the physicality, toughness, talent or creativity, you go to "Door #4" - Experience in the form of a coach or coordinator who's seen it all and knows what will work in every situation.

For Doors #3 and #4 to work, it helps to have versatility on your roster - a mobile QB who can beat you with his feet. A couple of 325 lb nose tackles who can stone the enemy's inside run game. A big-armed QB who can beat you deep. A smashmouth inside RB. A 4.25 speedster who can break open a football game with a long run. A pass rushing idiot-savant.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I believe that modern day football teams cannot afford to be one-dimensional because most opposing NFL teams will adjust to your strengths and you'll have to adjust to their adjustments (& so on). Gotta have a lot of different arrows in the old quivver.

 

[MadCardDisease]

But finding an elite pass rusher is alot harder than finding an elite OG. I don't care how good the guard is, I would never take one over a pass rusher.

I agree. It's so hard to find a guy who can consistantly get to the QB. I wouldn't be shocked if the Cardinals went after a pass rusher in the 1st if they grade higher than the OL left on the board.

 

[Chopper0080]

But finding an elite pass rusher is alot harder than finding an elite OG. I don't care how good the guard is, I would never take one over a pass rusher.

I watched arguably the best front 7 in the NFL get shut down by a smart, physical offensive line last night. While I agree a top pass rusher can be more valuable, this is still an offensive league that doesn't call holding. Warmack makes a bigger impact for this team and in the NFC West than Demontre Moore, Jarvis Jones or Barkevious Mingo.

 

[Totally_Red]

I watched arguably the best front 7 in the NFL get shut down by a smart, physical offensive line last night. While I agree a top pass rusher can be more valuable, this is still an offensive league that doesn't call holding. Warmack makes a bigger impact for this team and in the NFC West than Demontre Moore, Jarvis Jones or Barkevious Mingo.

Totally agree! Great pass-rushers fit with a great offensive team like Indy in the Peyton Manning years. They jump on top and force you to play catch-up while siccing Mathis and Freeney on you. Unless or until the Cardinals can field a legitimate offense, a top flight pass rusher falls in the luxury category. Fix the offense first!

 

[Azlen]

An edge rusher and an OT are just opposite sides of the same coin. You want your Def to get to the other QB and you want your Off to keep them away from your QB.
The Cardinal offense needs a lot more work than the defense. That's pretty clear.

 

[Chopper0080]

An edge rusher and an OT are just opposite sides of the same coin. You want your Def to get to the other QB and you want your Off to keep them away from your QB.
The Cardinal offense needs a lot more work than the defense. That's pretty clear.

This is very true. The issue becomes, how do the Cardinals improve the offense if improving the QB position isn't really an option? Most would agree Kolb can be a servicable NFL QB when protected. The issue with him is his cap number and his ability to stay on the field more than his play (which I think stinks but I am in the minority). So if you buy into this, you believe it is cap restrictive to cut him, AND there aren't any good options in the draft how do you improve the offense, how do you upgrade at QB?

If you can't upgrade the offense through improving the actual QB running it, then you have to improve the structure that allows that QB to be successful. In our case the logical conclusion is adding difference makers at positions that aren't dependant on the QB position which translates to upgrading the offensive line and running game. IMO, in the draft, there are very few players that fall into this category and one of those players is Chance Warmack.

 

[john h]

Are we ever going to draft a legitimate edge rushing threat?

At the time when the 49ers drafted Aldon Smith, they already had two better than average edge rushers in Ahmad Brooks and Parys Haralson---yet they see how Aldon Smith can make their defense all the more explosive and they draft him.

Interesting too that the 49ers said this week that Aldon Smith is their MVP.

As I have been arguing for years---some of the reason why our offensive tackles struggle, particularly early in games is that they have no speed edge rushers to block in practice.

We need some speed and quickness on the edge, now more than ever with Kaepernick and Wilson in our own division for the next 10 years.

We can also ask the same about a QB and OT Mitch. We have a lot of needs come to think of it. I sure like Campbelll on the outside with all his blocked passes and he has become a stopper on tackles. We got an all pro in him for some years to come. I sure wish we had Anquan back but we have no one who can throw to him so I guess it makes little difference. It was more difficult for the defenses to cover both Fitz and Anquan. He was a great successful draft but as usual we did not keep him long enough. He was tough as usual yesterday.

 

[john h]

Are we ever going to draft a legitimate edge rushing threat?

At the time when the 49ers drafted Aldon Smith, they already had two better than average edge rushers in Ahmad Brooks and Parys Haralson---yet they see how Aldon Smith can make their defense all the more explosive and they draft him.

Interesting too that the 49ers said this week that Aldon Smith is their MVP.

As I have been arguing for years---some of the reason why our offensive tackles struggle, particularly early in games is that they have no speed edge rushers to block in practice.

We need some speed and quickness on the edge, now more than ever with Kaepernick and Wilson in our own division for the next 10 years.

During the year SF made some significant move on their line by moving guys from one slot to another successfully. Do we ever do that? I know our posters have often pleaded for us to move some of our guys from one side to the other. As a team we do not appear to be very proactive in our personally placement. Maybe that will change with the new regime. I wonder just how deep into our football Michael Bidwill gets. I sure hope he is not in the Xs and Os or where players should play or not play. A little knowledge can be dangerous. It is erector set and he has the authority to do with it as he pleases.

 

[john h]

Exactly!

He has been a standout all year or all his career. He is one strong receiver. Not great speed but if he gets his hands on the ball no one is going to take it away from him. He an Fitz were two of the best ever on one team. Add to that Warner and you had us in the Super Bowl. It will be many years before we see the likes of this again.

 

[john h]

We have a top 10 D now and no offense, run game, or pass blocking, and some of you still think a DE is a top priority? We would all love a DE who get 15 sacks a year, but it is a luxury not a necessity at this point in our futility.

Give me a team with a great QB and two great receivers and some protection and I will get you deep into the playoffs. Might add that a good RB would add greatly to that configuration.

 

[john h]

Are we ever going to draft a legitimate edge rushing threat?

At the time when the 49ers drafted Aldon Smith, they already had two better than average edge rushers in Ahmad Brooks and Parys Haralson---yet they see how Aldon Smith can make their defense all the more explosive and they draft him.

Interesting too that the 49ers said this week that Aldon Smith is their MVP.

As I have been arguing for years---some of the reason why our offensive tackles struggle, particularly early in games is that they have no speed edge rushers to block in practice.

We need some speed and quickness on the edge, now more than ever with Kaepernick and Wilson in our own division for the next 10 years.

First things first and that will always be a QB. No QB then no playoffs no matter who is an edge runsher. Yes we sure need one but not at the expense of a drafting a QB. Everyone in football know the value of a QB but we have very poor success in finding one. In our efforts to find one we become even worse. Kolb and Leinart cost us a lot of money while teams like SF find a star in round 3 or NE in round 9. Is that all just luck or are they just a lot smarter? Kolb and Leinart have set us back 3-4 years at least.

 

[john h]

Are we ever going to draft a legitimate edge rushing threat?

At the time when the 49ers drafted Aldon Smith, they already had two better than average edge rushers in Ahmad Brooks and Parys Haralson---yet they see how Aldon Smith can make their defense all the more explosive and they draft him.

Interesting too that the 49ers said this week that Aldon Smith is their MVP.

As I have been arguing for years---some of the reason why our offensive tackles struggle, particularly early in games is that they have no speed edge rushers to block in practice.

We need some speed and quickness on the edge, now more than ever with Kaepernick and Wilson in our own division for the next 10 years.

First things first and that will always be a QB. No QB then no playoffs no matter who is an edge runsher. Yes we sure need one but not at the expense of a drafting a QB. Everyone in football know the value of a QB but we have very poor success in finding one. In our efforts to find one we become even worse. Kolb and Leinart cost us a lot of money while teams like SF find a star in round 3 or NE in round 9. Is that all just luck or are they just a lot smarter? Kolb and Leinart have set us back 3-4 years at least.

We need not only some smarts this year in the draft but a little luck would help. We got Boldin at #2, Warner as a FA pickup, Campbell somewhere but then we get guys like Leinart, Hall, Skelton and a host of other would be QBs. Hall is one that amazes me. He was dead on arrival. I think many thought what we paid for Kolb was robbery for a guy with little starting experience. Leinart was a logical pick at that time but little did we know he was more a playboy than a QB. Living in that Hollywood environment and with his good looks sort of ruined him. He also played on a team with a lot of future pro players which made him look better than he was. When we gave him all that money he was done for. On the record he looked like a steal but you have to wonder why did 11 other teams pass on him?

This is all behind us now so it is up to the new regime to start us on the path to recovery.

 

[Denny Green Fan]

Yes next year and his name is Jadaveon Clowney

 

[JeffGollin]

Give me a team with a great QB and two great receivers and some protection and I will get you deep into the playoffs. Might add that a good RB would add greatly to that configuration.

That's the point - If you're a defense facing the Niners your top defenders are spread out accounting for Crabtree and Moss at WR, Davis and Walker at TE and Gore at RB in the receiving game plus Gore, Kaepernick (& Ginn on the Jet Sweep) running the ball.

Add to this a strong OL and an interesting X & O scheme involving sudden changes of direction at the handoff or in the hole - and you've got a handful to deal with.

 

[kerouac9]

This is very true. The issue becomes, how do the Cardinals improve the offense if improving the QB position isn't really an option? Most would agree Kolb can be a servicable NFL QB when protected. The issue with him is his cap number and his ability to stay on the field more than his play (which I think stinks but I am in the minority). So if you buy into this, you believe it is cap restrictive to cut him, AND there aren't any good options in the draft how do you improve the offense, how do you upgrade at QB?

If you can't upgrade the offense through improving the actual QB running it, then you have to improve the structure that allows that QB to be successful. In our case the logical conclusion is adding difference makers at positions that aren't dependant on the QB position which translates to upgrading the offensive line and running game. IMO, in the draft, there are very few players that fall into this category and one of those players is Chance Warmack.

All of this is true.

 

[john h]

Are we ever going to draft a legitimate edge rushing threat?

At the time when the 49ers drafted Aldon Smith, they already had two better than average edge rushers in Ahmad Brooks and Parys Haralson---yet they see how Aldon Smith can make their defense all the more explosive and they draft him.

Interesting too that the 49ers said this week that Aldon Smith is their MVP.

As I have been arguing for years---some of the reason why our offensive tackles struggle, particularly early in games is that they have no speed edge rushers to block in practice.

We need some speed and quickness on the edge, now more than ever with Kaepernick and Wilson in our own division for the next 10 years.

Would you consider Campbell an edge rushing threat? Looking at all the prognosticators it seems there will be a large group of edge rushers going early in the first round. Some edge rushers are very good because of a good DC who calls the right plays at the right time.

 

[JeffGollin]

Would you consider Campbell an edge rushing threat? Looking at all the prognosticators it seems there will be a large group of edge rushers going early in the first round. Some edge rushers are very good because of a good DC who calls the right plays at the right time.

Depends on the scheme.