Cardinal Tough: Assessing the QB Situation

[TRW]

Sam Bradford had a 76.5 QB rating his rookie season. His offense mustered 6 points in an essential playoff game in Seattle. He had one 300-yard passing day against a Denver Broncos team that had given up on their coach and the season. His team went 7-9 and their one road win was against us.

Matt Stafford's career QB rating is 67.1. He's appeared in 13 games in his pro career.

Perhaps we should temper our enthusiasm for a player that might be in the same class as these two guys.

It wasn't "enthusiasm" so much as just a comparrison of abilities/potential. Both have shown flashes of excellent abilitites, time will tell if the flashes become the norm for them.

Again, I simply believe it is worth the gamble to draft a QB at #5. Probably won't happen, so all of these discussions will be moot a week from Thursday.

Peace!

 

[kerouac9]

Bradford's second half was pretty good. Wasn't it?

In November and December Bradford went 164-262 for 1683 yards, 6 TD, 6 INT. That's a 77.5 QB rating. He threw 1 TD in the month of December against 5 INTs, going 3-5 the last half of the season.

The Rams lost 44-6 against the Lions in Detroit when Bradford went 23-45 for 215 yards and 2 INTs against the worst secondary in the NFL after Houston's.

 

[Mulli]

In November and December Bradford went 164-262 for 1683 yards, 6 TD, 6 INT. That's a 77.5 QB rating. He threw 1 TD in the month of December against 5 INTs, going 3-5 the last half of the season.

The Rams lost 44-6 against the Lions in Detroit when Bradford went 23-45 for 215 yards and 2 INTs against the worst secondary in the NFL after Houston's.

Maybe I was thinking of the first half.

 

[moklerman]

In defense of Bradford's numbers, he did lose Clayton, Avery & Hoomanwanui to injuries, Gilyard was a bust who couldn't get on the field, Alexander took forever to get on the field, Bajema got hurt and Gibson and Robinson were the most "reliable" starting 12 and 11 games respectively.

I can't think of any of his receivers that he started to build a rapport with that didn't get hurt. He and Clayton for example were really in sync but as soon as they really started clicking, Clayton got hurt. It was like that all year with all the receiving corps. Bradford was really getting some production out of the TE position too but lost the top two TE's to injury.

I agree that some of the Bradford's numbers were artificial in that Shurmur and Spagnuolo were insulating him from any risk taking but I do think he played well enough when all things are considered to be optimistic about his future.

From game 6 to 11, he was on quite a roll putting up 11 TD to 1 INT. Not an incredible amount of production but when considering the really substandard receiving corps and injuries to boot, a pretty efficient 6 game stretch for a rookie QB on a 1-15 team.

He certainly hit the wall after that but IMO, injuries to his talent-challenged receiving corps and Shurmur's limitations as an OC were much more responsible than Bradford's own personal struggles on the field. Put him with anything resembling a decent offense and he's getting Flacco/Ryan praise for sure. Heck, he's even getting a little bit of that as it is which is saying something considering the Rams' scheme and personnel.

 

[Mulli]

From game 6 to 11, he was on quite a roll putting up 11 TD to 1 INT. Not an incredible amount of production but when considering the really substandard receiving corps and injuries to boot, a pretty efficient 6 game stretch for a rookie QB on a 1-15 team.

.

Ah ha! I was thinking of that half.

 

[DemsMyBoys]

Great stuff, Mitch! I am really enjoying reading this.

I think a huge amount of toughness is mental in the everyday world. Huge. But not in the NFL. I think Hall is smart and tough. I think the other players like him and respect him. I think I'd like to wave a magic wand over him and presto! He's 6" taller.

 

[kerouac9]

In defense of Bradford's numbers, he did lose Clayton, Avery & Hoomanwanui to injuries, Gilyard was a bust who couldn't get on the field, Alexander took forever to get on the field, Bajema got hurt and Gibson and Robinson were the most "reliable" starting 12 and 11 games respectively.

I can't think of any of his receivers that he started to build a rapport with that didn't get hurt. He and Clayton for example were really in sync but as soon as they really started clicking, Clayton got hurt. It was like that all year with all the receiving corps. Bradford was really getting some production out of the TE position too but lost the top two TE's to injury.

I agree that some of the Bradford's numbers were artificial in that Shurmur and Spagnuolo were insulating him from any risk taking but I do think he played well enough when all things are considered to be optimistic about his future.

From game 6 to 11, he was on quite a roll putting up 11 TD to 1 INT. Not an incredible amount of production but when considering the really substandard receiving corps and injuries to boot, a pretty efficient 6 game stretch for a rookie QB on a 1-15 team.

He certainly hit the wall after that but IMO, injuries to his talent-challenged receiving corps and Shurmur's limitations as an OC were much more responsible than Bradford's own personal struggles on the field. Put him with anything resembling a decent offense and he's getting Flacco/Ryan praise for sure. Heck, he's even getting a little bit of that as it is which is saying something considering the Rams' scheme and personnel.

I guess, if averaging less than 2 TDs a game for five games where your offense goes over 20 points exactly once is something impressive. I like Sam Bradford and he certainly outperformed my expectations, but my expectations were for him to be on IR three weeks into the season. I just think that people are acting like Bradford is an embryonic Tom Brady right now (and Brady didn't have much in weapons on the outside, either), and there's no evidence to point to that right now.

Part of the issue is that we saw such stunning garbage from the QB position as Cardinals fans that anything looks really good, but there are some people here who think that an actual productive QB like Alex Smith isn't good enough for the team.

 

[moklerman]

I guess, if averaging less than 2 TDs a game for five games where your offense goes over 20 points exactly once is something impressive. I like Sam Bradford and he certainly outperformed my expectations, but my expectations were for him to be on IR three weeks into the season. I just think that people are acting like Bradford is an embryonic Tom Brady right now (and Brady didn't have much in weapons on the outside, either), and there's no evidence to point to that right now.

Part of the issue is that we saw such stunning garbage from the QB position as Cardinals fans that anything looks really good, but there are some people here who think that an actual productive QB like Alex Smith isn't good enough for the team.

Well, that's why I tried to paint a complete picture. I agree that just under 2 TD's per game isn't dynamic but at the end of the year, that'd be about 30 TD's so it isn't chopped liver either.

If there's football, it will certainly be interesting to see what McDaniels can do for Bradford and the Rams offense. I really didn't care for Shurmur's results and between watching Whis run his offense and Spagnuolo and his tight sphincter approach, I'm eager to see something resembling confidence and aggression from the offensive side of the ball. Both teams were pretty painful to watch in '10.

I haven't heard any comparison of Bradford to Brady but I take your point and agree. I have heard plenty of Peyton comparisons and it's just unrealistic to put that kind of comparison on Bradford right now. While I think their early careers resemble one another, that means pretty much nothing in terms of Bradford's future.

As far as QB's not being good enough for the Cardinals, I have seen that on quite a few occasions when discussing a variety of QB's. It sure does seem like no matter which QB is brought up, he's not good enough for the Cardinals. I'm sure it just seems that way, but I certainly feel like it happens.

 

[Buckybird]

I guess, if averaging less than 2 TDs a game for five games where your offense goes over 20 points exactly once is something impressive. I like Sam Bradford and he certainly outperformed my expectations, but my expectations were for him to be on IR three weeks into the season. I just think that people are acting like Bradford is an embryonic Tom Brady right now (and Brady didn't have much in weapons on the outside, either), and there's no evidence to point to that right now.

Part of the issue is that we saw such stunning garbage from the QB position as Cardinals fans that anything looks really good, but there are some people here who think that an actual productive QB like Alex Smith isn't good enough for the team.

Wasn't Bradford a rookie NFL QB? Most other rooks that turn out to be good struggle in year 1 & possibly until year 3. I guess what your saying K9 is you don't think Bradford will amount to much as a pro...I beg to differ. This guy has star written all over him IMO & he will light us up for 10+ years unless our D dramactically improves or if he gets hurt...watch!!!

 

[D-Dogg]

Wait a second. NOBODY has made a reference to THESMEL yet? Nobody? With a qb rating scorechart and the Max Hall of the BYU scoring a 3 of the average with a high of a tenacious?

Really?

You guys are slipping. I'm totally out.

 

[Cardiac]

True but if Palmer does retire then where does that leave the Bengals.

Taking a QB in rd2 or trading back into rd 1, Mitch covers this with his post about Dalton.

Not sure what wierd universe I'm in right now.

Posts about Josh McCown and Max Hall being as good as the QB class this year.

Yeah I overstated it but when in Rome.....
I guess every single pundit has gone stupid and needs to have some QB's as
1st rounders for no other reason then it's some kinda man law or something.


Posts that Bradford isn't very good.

Find me one person that doesn't like Bradford that makes a living off of football. I have yet to hear anything but huge positives save internet posters.


Posts about Dalton being taken with the 4th pick in the draft.

Making a point to the extreme I guess/hope. No 6'2" QB will be taken as the
4th pick in any draft. Never say never but I'm betting the sun rises in the east tomorrow as well.

 

[Duckjake]

Yeah I overstated it but when in Rome.....
I guess every single pundit has gone stupid and needs to have some QB's as
1st rounders for no other reason then it's some kinda man law or something.

Well that is exactly what is going on.

Look at how Gabbert's draft stock skyrocketed the day Luck announced he was going to stay in College.

How quickly we forget how many pundits said Ryan Leaf was a better NFL QB prospect than Peyton Manning.

Where are they now?

David Carr, Joey Harrington and Patrick Ramsey. QB's drafted in the first round in 2002 the year McCown was taken by the Cardinals. The best QB that year turned out to be David Garrard...a 4th round pick!

 

[Mulli]

Well that is exactly what is going on.

Look at how Gabbert's draft stock skyrocketed the day Luck announced he was going to stay in College.

How quickly we forget how many pundits said Ryan Leaf was a better NFL QB prospect than Peyton Manning.

Where are they now?

David Carr, Joey Harrington and Patrick Ramsey. QB's drafted in the first round in 2002 the year McCown was taken by the Cardinals. The best QB that year turned out to be David Garrard...a 4th round pick!

Mel Kiper had Dan McGwire and Brett Favre rated the same.

 

[Cardiac]

Well that is exactly what is going on.

Look at how Gabbert's draft stock skyrocketed the day Luck announced he was going to stay in College.

I'm pretty sure your timing is off but one of the reasons Gabberts stock skyrocketed is that the experts were now taking a good look at him instead of just living off some stats.

How quickly we forget how many pundits said Ryan Leaf was a better NFL QB prospect than Peyton Manning.

Ryan Leaf had all the tools but was mentally defective, sorta like ML. The Chargers tried to trade up to #1 but the Colts rightly said no way.

Where are they now?


David Carr, Joey Harrington and Patrick Ramsey. QB's drafted in the first round in 2002 the year McCown was taken by the Cardinals. The best QB that year turned out to be David Garrard...a 4th round pick!

We are back in Rome. Yes there are misses on candidates at every position. It seems to me that in the past 4 or 5 years the number of 1st rd QB busts has all but been eliminated. ML and VY are the last I can think of and it's because they are weak willed and mentally off. I think that is basically the issue with every highly drafted QB that busts.