Cards Chances for more than 8 wins...

[AZ Native]

I'm thinking 9-7 but 10-6 keeps slipping in there.

 

[Gee!]

I think our floor in 6 wins and our ceiling is 8... MAYBE 9. But it's a rebuilding year for the most part, so i'm cool with the above and hoping to be pleasantly surprised.

Saaaay whaaaaat?? Rebuilding?

 

[vince56]

With all the question marks it's difficult to say. I'm hopeful that the Cardinals can go at least 10-6.

Totally. We need to figure out the QB situation, #58 and #92 have to grow into starters, and we have a lot of tough games early. The team could make the playoffs after a 2-5 start this year because our home games are so stacked in Nov and Dec and against lower talent teams.

I think we still have a lot of talent on the team, and I applaud management for immediately filling holes left by vacating players. It shows we're reloading rather than rebuilding, but with the O-line being shaky at best and the LB and CB corps still really undefined, we still don't really know what we have in Leinart, and the supposed strength of the team, our running backs, both have an unnerving tendency to put the ball on the ground.

Should make for an interesting and fun year with some really great wins and some really terrible losses. Fun!

 

[AzStevenCal]

Saaaay whaaaaat?? Rebuilding?

I could see calling it a rebuilding year. We aren't entering the season with as many question marks as usual (pre-Wiz) but the ones we have are pretty significant. Even if we resolve our line problems (both sides of the ball) we still have some quarterback questions. I think we win 7 games plus how ever many times we beat the 49'ers.

Steve

 

[D-Dogg]

the one problem with that thinking is that it assumes were going to win all the games we should win. Even when we've been good the last two years, we still throw up complete head-scratching stinkers and I think this team will be much more prone to that than the previous two years.

I'm really not sure how we put the Panthers up there. They've kicked the snot out of Wiz teams 3 of the 4 times they've played us, with 2 of those coming at home.

But they also tend to win games against teams they shouldn't, as well. Like the Vikings last year. They have a terrible habit of playing to the level of their competition, a dangerous game.

 

[D-Dogg]

I think we win 7 games plus how ever many times we beat the 49'ers.

Steve

So, 9-7.

 

[abomb]

I agree that 9 is the ceiling.

 

[D-Dogg]

I agree that 9 is the ceiling.

I don't think we can even guess at the ceiling. I think 9 is a solid, most likely landing spot. I can see them winning up to 11, or around 6. Our oline play will be crucial.

Right now, I don't think ANYONE has a handle on this team's ceiling because of all the new parts and the fact that Whis doesn't treat pre-season in a way that could tell us anything (he puts guys in tough spots they won't ever be in during reg season to see if they fail or succeed). There just isn't enough data points to give a ceiling.

However, we do know from a talent perspective and the state of the other teams in our division what our floor should be.

 

[AzStevenCal]

So, 9-7.

I prefer the cowardly way out. You know, the one I took. I really don't know what to expect from the 9ers. I thought we were clearly better than them last year and then watched as they beat us both times. We're probably a step or two behind last season and they're probably a little better than they were. Last year's results notwithstanding, I think that makes us pretty much a toss up. So yeah, 9-7

Steve

 

[82CardsGrad]

Our oline play will be crucial.

Yea... isn't that the case every year? And not just our team, but most every team?
Our o-line play has never been great - particularly over the past decade or more. Seriously, we have never been able to sustain any semblence of a running game, and it wasn't until we inserted a HOFer in Warner did our offense start clicking, albeit almost exclusively via the air.

I know it's not fair - to an extent. But, I'm not going to dismiss much poor play (however much there is) on the part of Matt and shift the blame to the o-line. He will have to, just like Kurt and just like many other QB's in the NFL, somehow find a way to effectively run the offense and deal with the reality that he will face, on a fairly routine basis, a heavy pass rush.
He watched one of the best ever find the way to deal with this situation. He is supposed to be immensely gifted as a QB. No... regardless of what happens with the o-line, the overwhelming majority of the responsibility for our success, or lack thereof, rests squarely on the shoulders of Matt.

 

[D-Dogg]

No... regardless of what happens with the o-line, the overwhelming majority of the responsibility for our success, or lack thereof, rests squarely on the shoulders of Matt.

I disagree. Whis is going to move this offense to a running offense with more playaction...the onus is on the oline to move the pile so the run game will be effective.

The responsibility of the success of this team falls on the Oline, the running backs and the defense. Let's not make Toast out for more than he is - he's no gunslinger and we won't be running the wing it and sling it offense we had in the past. It would be dumb to do so. It is rare to have a QB you build the offense around...Toast certainly isn't the kind that you do. He is, however, quite capable of leading an offense that is balanced, and he actually is a very good play action QB.

 

[Duckjake]

Yea... isn't that the case every year? And not just our team, but most every team?
Our o-line play has never been great - particularly over the past decade or more. Seriously, we have never been able to sustain any semblence of a running game, and it wasn't until we inserted a HOFer in Warner did our offense start clicking, albeit almost exclusively via the air.

I know it's not fair - to an extent. But, I'm not going to dismiss much poor play (however much there is) on the part of Matt and shift the blame to the o-line. He will have to, just like Kurt and just like many other QB's in the NFL, somehow find a way to effectively run the offense and deal with the reality that he will face, on a fairly routine basis, a heavy pass rush.
He watched one of the best ever find the way to deal with this situation. He is supposed to be immensely gifted as a QB. No... regardless of what happens with the o-line, the overwhelming majority of the responsibility for our success, or lack thereof, rests squarely on the shoulders of Matt.

The Cards were starting to show a really strong running game the second half of last season with Wells and Hightower. 8 times in the last 11 games over 100 yards. Twice over 180. The Offensive line was playing really well and the Cards had over 150 yards rushing against the #1 run defense in the NFL in a playoff game. (The year before they played the #2 rushing defense in the NFL in a playoff game and gained 33 yards.)

But now we have a significant change in the offensive line 4 of 5 in new positions. So I do agree that how the offensive line gels will have a huge role in how the season goes for Arizona.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I disagree. Whis is going to move this offense to a running offense with more playaction...the onus is on the oline to move the pile so the run game will be effective.

The responsibility of the success of this team falls on the Oline, the running backs and the defense. Let's not make Toast out for more than he is - he's no gunslinger and we won't be running the wing it and sling it offense we had in the past. It would be dumb to do so. It is rare to have a QB you build the offense around...Toast certainly isn't the kind that you do. He is, however, quite capable of leading an offense that is balanced, and he actually is a very good play action QB.

The Cards were starting to show a really strong running game the second half of last season with Wells and Hightower. 8 times in the last 11 games over 100 yards. Twice over 180. The Offensive line was playing really well and the Cards had over 150 yards rushing against the #1 run defense in the NFL in a playoff game. (The year before they played the #2 rushing defense in the NFL in a playoff game and gained 33 yards.)

But now we have a significant change in the offensive line 4 of 5 in new positions. So I do agree that how the offensive line gels will have a huge role in how the season goes for Arizona.

Guys, I'm not dismissing the changes this year on our o-line, nor am I discounting how much the scheme will shift more toward the running game. However, in the end the onus on #7 to make the right reads and hit the right guys are the right times. I honestly don't see us blowing out too many teams this year. We will be in dogfights most of the season. It will boil down to Matt in the majority of those cases. 4th quarter, 8 mins to go, can he score to salt away the win, or bring us back to win... Yea, our defense might grab a fumble or INT that could propel us to a W or two, but I still contend it will be about Matt.

 

[Duckjake]

Guys, I'm not dismissing the changes this year on our o-line, nor am I discounting how much the scheme will shift more toward the running game. However, in the end the onus on #7 to make the right reads and hit the right guys are the right times. I honestly don't see us blowing out too many teams this year. We will be in dogfights most of the season. It will boil down to Matt in the majority of those cases. 4th quarter, 8 mins to go, can he score to salt away the win, or bring us back to win... Yea, our defense might grab a fumble or INT that could propel us to a W or two, but I still contend it will be about Matt.

Without Rackers kicking his chances are much improved.

 

[D-Dogg]

Guys, I'm not dismissing the changes this year on our o-line, nor am I discounting how much the scheme will shift more toward the running game. However, in the end the onus on #7 to make the right reads and hit the right guys are the right times. I honestly don't see us blowing out too many teams this year. We will be in dogfights most of the season. It will boil down to Matt in the majority of those cases. 4th quarter, 8 mins to go, can he score to salt away the win, or bring us back to win... Yea, our defense might grab a fumble or INT that could propel us to a W or two, but I still contend it will be about Matt.

Or, Toast will do enough to have us ahead in the game on the road, and the defense will give up a 99 yard drive.

Oops, already saw that script play out. That's not Toast's fault; that's the defense.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Or, Toast will do enough to have us ahead in the game on the road, and the defense will give up a 99 yard drive.

Oops, already saw that script play out. That's not Toast's fault; that's the defense.

Like I said, that TN game was a point of hope for me. Toast will need to show that that was not a once a year type game... We'll see...

 

[D-Dogg]

Like I said, that TN game was a point of hope for me. Toast will need to show that that was not a once a year type game... We'll see...

Or maybe the defense or ST will give up a game, and Toast will lead them downfield for a game winning FG in the two minute drill, which the kicker will miss. And for fun, Toast will do the same thing the following week against an undefeated team that ends up going to the Super Bowl, and the kicker will miss again.

I don't know, those kinds of things could happen.

Bottom line, I trust Toast enough to put us in positions to win. He isn't going to win games all by his onesies, but he has proven in the past that he is very capable of putting the team in the position to win. If the rest of the team doesn't follow through, that isn't Toast's fault.

Warner covered for mistakes by the D and the kicker...just because Toast isn't going to cover for them doesn't mean the responsibility is on his shoulders. Only that failure by ST/D/running game will be more apparent when Toast isn't throwing 35 passes into the teeth of the D and the face of the blitz. That's not his game, and Whis isn't going to try and make him play that game (which isn't Whis' game either, he had to adjust to Warner's style himself).

 

[82CardsGrad]

Or maybe the defense or ST will give up a game, and Toast will lead them downfield for a game winning FG in the two minute drill, which the kicker will miss. And for fun, Toast will do the same thing the following week against an undefeated team that ends up going to the Super Bowl, and the kicker will miss again.

I don't know, those kinds of things could happen.

Bottom line, I trust Toast enough to put us in positions to win. He isn't going to win games all by his onesies, but he has proven in the past that he is very capable of putting the team in the position to win. If the rest of the team doesn't follow through, that isn't Toast's fault.

Warner covered for mistakes by the D and the kicker...just because Toast isn't going to cover for them doesn't mean the responsibility is on his shoulders. Only that failure by ST/D/running game will be more apparent when Toast isn't throwing 35 passes into the teeth of the D and the face of the blitz. That's not his game, and Whis isn't going to try and make him play that game (which isn't Whis' game either, he had to adjust to Warner's style himself).

Can't argue much with any of that... However, Matt's stats and the # of W's the team puts up this year will be a huge focus all year. Not only because of Warner now being gone, but because of Matt's contract situation. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to suggest that if Matt fails to impress (not really sure how Whiz will define "impress" for Matt), he won't be a Cardinal in 2011.
Needless to say, the kid has a boat-load of pressure stacked upon his shoulders. I just can't shake this vision I have of him wearing a Seahawk uniform next year...

 

[Duckjake]

Can't argue much with any of that... However, Matt's stats and the # of W's the team puts up this year will be a huge focus all year. Not only because of Warner now being gone, but because of Matt's contract situation. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to suggest that if Matt fails to impress (not really sure how Whiz will define "impress" for Matt), he won't be a Cardinal in 2011.
Needless to say, the kid has a boat-load of pressure stacked upon his shoulders. I just can't shake this vision I have of him wearing a Seahawk uniform next year...

I don't think a lot of people realize how important that is. Or maybe they do and just aren't talking about it. I hope it doesn't adversely affect the way the team performs this season. But you have to think it very well could affect Matt and others.

Somebody listed the NFL QBs and commented on how weak the position was overall. So unless Leinart really bombs this year it is very likely he would be a hot commodity and could get really big money as a Free Agent. Just look at what Bradford got paid.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I don't think a lot of people realize how important that is. Or maybe they do and just aren't talking about it. I hope it doesn't adversely affect the way the team performs this season. But you have to think it very well could affect Matt and others.

Somebody listed the NFL QBs and commented on how weak the position was overall. So unless Leinart really bombs this year it is very likely he would be a hot commodity and could get really big money as a Free Agent. Just look at what Bradford got paid.

I know the Hawks picked up Whitehurst this year as their backup and hopeful successor to Hasselback, but I still wouldn't be surprised to see Matt up in Seattle next year...

 

[PACardsFan]

Being a Cardinal fan over the years can certainly make their fans extremely pessimistic. But it still drives me insane to read some of these posts. Let the media think that Kurt carried this team, but WE should no better. What was Kurt's record as a starter before Whiz got here? Let's just say that it was bad. Dansby & Boldin played on some of the worst Cardinal teams in their history. When will we wake up and realize that the common denominator to our success was NOT Warner, Dansby, Boldin, & Rolle. It was & will always be Wisenhunt & his coaching staff. In his first year, we were decimated by injuries, had NO depth & still finished 8-8. SB in year 2 (with moderate depth) & our 9-7 record would have been much better had we not clinched so early. Even last year, we could have & should have won 12 games.

So go ahead & think the sky is falling. As long as KW is on OUR sideline, we have the chance to win many, many games. Unless we lose 50% of our starters, its embarrassing for Cardinal fans to think we have a chance to lose 9 or 10 games. There's a much bettter chance we'll win 11 or 12. HC is EVERYTHING in the NFL, so I like our chances.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

the one problem with that thinking is that it assumes were going to win all the games we should win. Even when we've been good the last two years, we still throw up complete head-scratching stinkers and I think this team will be much more prone to that than the previous two years.

I'm really not sure how we put the Panthers up there. They've kicked the snot out of Wiz teams 3 of the 4 times they've played us, with 2 of those coming at home.

Having said that though, if you look at the list of games that are a toss up/loss, we are more than capable of at least winning a couple of them. Who knows how the season will play out, but our schedule is looking extremely favorable and is my main reason for being optimistic.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Being a Cardinal fan over the years can certainly make their fans extremely pessimistic. But it still drives me insane to read some of these posts. Let the media think that Kurt carried this team, but WE should no better. What was Kurt's record as a starter before Whiz got here? Let's just say that it was bad. Dansby & Boldin played on some of the worst Cardinal teams in their history. When will we wake up and realize that the common denominator to our success was NOT Warner, Dansby, Boldin, & Rolle. It was & will always be Wisenhunt & his coaching staff. In his first year, we were decimated by injuries, had NO depth & still finished 8-8. SB in year 2 (with moderate depth) & our 9-7 record would have been much better had we not clinched so early. Even last year, we could have & should have won 12 games.

So go ahead & think the sky is falling. As long as KW is on OUR sideline, we have the chance to win many, many games. Unless we lose 50% of our starters, its embarrassing for Cardinal fans to think we have a chance to lose 9 or 10 games. There's a much bettter chance we'll win 11 or 12. HC is EVERYTHING in the NFL, so I like our chances.

Uh - not sure if you noticed but 84% voted that the Cards have a better chance of winning 9 games or more.

 

[Duckjake]

Being a Cardinal fan over the years can certainly make their fans extremely pessimistic. But it still drives me insane to read some of these posts. Let the media think that Kurt carried this team, but WE should no better. What was Kurt's record as a starter before Whiz got here? Let's just say that it was bad. Dansby & Boldin played on some of the worst Cardinal teams in their history. When will we wake up and realize that the common denominator to our success was NOT Warner, Dansby, Boldin, & Rolle. It was & will always be Wisenhunt & his coaching staff. In his first year, we were decimated by injuries, had NO depth & still finished 8-8. SB in year 2 (with moderate depth) & our 9-7 record would have been much better had we not clinched so early. Even last year, we could have & should have won 12 games.

So go ahead & think the sky is falling. As long as KW is on OUR sideline, we have the chance to win many, many games. Unless we lose 50% of our starters, its embarrassing for Cardinal fans to think we have a chance to lose 9 or 10 games. There's a much bettter chance we'll win 11 or 12. HC is EVERYTHING in the NFL, so I like our chances.

The one hole in your theory is that in 2008 and 2009 the Cards had more veteran players with more time in Arizona than at any time in the history of the franchise in the desert. Many of those veteran players are gone or are now in different positions. These guys are gone: Warner, Berry, Okeafor, Boldin, Dansby, and Rolle. That's 30+ years of experience(just as Cardinals).

People are so worked up over us having a new guy at QB, but how hard can it be to play QB in the NFL? After all last season we saw a 38 year old guy with a bad hip throw for 3,753 yards and 26 TDs, win more games than his franchise had in a single season in 35 years, and take his team to the 2nd round of the playoffs, and a 40 year old QB, who didn't even go to training camp, throw for 4,202 yards and 33 TDs and take his team to within a score of the SuperBowl.