So far he is 8 for 14 this spring. The guy can hit, and will be a nice option off the bench this year. The D-Backs seem to come up with one of these veteran guys every year that make major contributions. With Counsell's uncertain health and the fact that Overbay is a rookie, and the way Brenly likes to shuffle people in and out, I can see Baerga getting alot of at bats this year. I think Brenly likes Carlos in the two hole.
Carlos Baerga
- Thread starter mark1
- Start date
adbacksfan
Rookie
Baerga
I've been impressed with him from what I have heard also. He sounds like a real aggressive player.
Although, he has been compared to Brian Anderson as far as weird incidents go. I think he has a good chance at making this team.
I've been impressed with him from what I have heard also. He sounds like a real aggressive player.
Although, he has been compared to Brian Anderson as far as weird incidents go. I think he has a good chance at making this team.schillingfan
All Star
I liked this signing when they made it. A smart move by the D-Backs, who seem to have an excellent eye for veteran bench-type talent, mananging to cull the fungibles for some productive players like McCracken, Batista.
DWKB
ASFN Icon
Now if they'd just learn not to pay them so much after a year.
Fungible - where did you learn a word like that?
adbacksfan
Rookie
LOL, Schillingfan...I knew that question was coming. Fortunately for me I read about it on the Az Dacks message board when you posted it there. I will happily let you reply to it.
schillingfan
All Star
Actually the full credit for that word belongs to Peter Gammons - believe it or not. It's truly a great word which Websters essentially defines as "being of such a nature that one part or quantity may be replaced by another equal part or quantity". In other words those major league baseball players that are cheaply and readily replaceable wth other similar appearing players.
The trick, of course, is to sift through the fungible players and find the real gems. I think the D-Backs have done that well in some cases. Hopefully the same is true of Baerga.
It's truly a great word which Websters essentially defines as "being of such a nature that one part or quantity may be replaced by another equal part or quantity". In other words those major league baseball players that are cheaply and readily replaceable wth other similar appearing players.The trick, of course, is to sift through the fungible players and find the real gems. I think the D-Backs have done that well in some cases. Hopefully the same is true of Baerga.
DWKB
ASFN Icon
Originally posted by schillingfan
Actually the full credit for that word belongs to Peter Gammons - believe it or not.
The trick, of course, is to sift through the fungible players and find the real gems. I think the D-Backs have done that well in some cases. Hopefully the same is true of Baerga.
For even more eye rolling, Peter seemed to have stolen the word (and the application of it in regards to relief pitchers) from Baseball Prospectus and Joe Sheehan, whose been using it since at least 2000 that I recall.
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/20000316daily.html
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/20010306daily.html
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/20010625daily.html
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/20010720daily.html
(just do a search on "fungible" to see the instances).
So SF, using a term made popular in the baseball world by BP now are we? Why, would that make you a budding stat-head?
Next thing to come are phrases like "replacement value" and "context neutral" or "era adjustment".
Ole Peter has his moments of clarity sometimes ;-)
Last edited:
unc84steve
Veteran
Did anybody notice what the Angels paid their "Craig Counsell" David Eckstein?Originally posted by DWKB
Now if they'd just learn not to pay them so much after a year.
This was after paying Brad Fulmer around $1 million.
I'd rather have anonymous kids as my "fungible" players, but even players like Carlos Baerga have some potential value.
I'll preemptively stipulate a guilty plea to being emotionally prejudiced against Mark Grace.
What's galling is that Baerga & Chris Donnels both have more versatility and the same expectation of offensive contribution as Mark Grace. Yet Baerga, Donnels, and a couple of others are competing for the one infield spot, while everyone is joking about Grace not knowing that he's not a coach yet as he's injured.
If Grace's $1.5M contract is "peanuts", then the club should entertain cutting him to freeing up the roster spot. They could give him the choice of becoming a coach with the option of going to AAA to do some "mentoring" in Tucson, or stretching his playing days elsewhere.
RLakin
All Star
Couldn't agree more.
I'm not sure that Donnels has more flexibility than Grace, but one could argue that he is a better pinch hitter, which should supersede defensive concerns, especially since defense is not the top priority of a 1st baseman, and this is an area that Lyle Overbay is supposedly very strong in.
And it would have nice to add those "peanuts" ($1.5 million) to Greg Colbrunn’s contract proposal, so that we’d still have the best right handed pinch hitter on a bench (and lineup) that is lacking right handed power.
Oh, but Matt Williams will provide that. As if that isn’t a stupid enough idea to begin with, I’d like to ask the organization, furthermore, why they think a man who’s trademark is swinging at a first pitch, is in any way cut out for Colbrunn’s primary pinch hitting role.
Sadly, the latter is exactly why Williams will start ahead of Craig Counsell. Not because he’s a better player or asset to the lineup, but because like Jay Bell last year, Williams will be a non factor on a team that is paying a hefty price for his unwarranted and unneeded presence on the active roster.
DWKB
ASFN Icon
As much as I agree with you about defense at 1B being less of a concern, Overbay is not a defensive wiz like he seems to be getting billed as. This seems to be a logical leap that certain 1B who hit for a high avg. with little power must have a good glove with them ( Miinkiewicz, Olerud, Grace, etc..).
RLakin
All Star
That's great.
So somebody tell me why this organization is so high on this kid then?
After all, if wanted someone w/ a high batting average, average defense and little power, wouldn't Chris Donnels be the Diamondbacks starting third baseman.
Thank God Durazo is gone.
Derek in Tucson
Veteran
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2002
- Posts
- 179
- Reaction score
- 0
Doesn't RLakin have another doctoral thesis to write on how bad Matt Williams is? I guess that's why he can't find the time to learn about Overbay's defensive capabilities. Hey Lakin, Overbay's only been in the organization now for 3 years or so, and it's not like he came out of nowhere. He's been getting pub ever since he became the first player in the history of baseball to have over 100 RBI in short season rookie ball.
I know, why don't we trade RLakin off for another DBacks basher. I'm sure there's some fungible talent out there....like someone who'll complian about how old the team is or how ugly those purple uniforms are. They'd be just about as useful as this "local area media pundit on the DBacks".
I know, why don't we trade RLakin off for another DBacks basher. I'm sure there's some fungible talent out there....like someone who'll complian about how old the team is or how ugly those purple uniforms are. They'd be just about as useful as this "local area media pundit on the DBacks".
Nice Baerga article. Sounds like he has the job sewn up.
http://www.azstarnet.com/star/today/30307dbacksbaerga.html
http://www.azstarnet.com/star/today/30307dbacksbaerga.html
Last edited:
schillingfan
All Star
Is he a pundit on the D-Backs? I don't think I've ever seen him post on anything about the D-Backs other than Matt Williams. I've decided that he bears a strong resemblance to Captain Ahab in his constant pursuit of bashing Matty. And granted I'm a Matty basher myself, but that's not my primary interest in the D-Backs, I have others. (Yeah, yeah, no wisecracks about what my primary interest in the D-Backs is.
AZZenny
Registered User
Wait- can there be TWO Ahabs after Moby Matty? I've been honing my harpoon all off-season!
As to Overbay - Not that I know squat or that it means a thing, but he just hasn't had that early-on, big-league "feel" at any point to me - unlike, say, Spivey, or Patterson or (IMHO) Capuano or Olson - the sense that this kid has the requisite fierce drive and the smarts as well as talent. (the fact that he sounded rather...hmm... well... (thesaurus) ...phlegmatic on a couple radio interviews last season may have contributed to that impression.) The older, very regular ST/Sidewinder fans I sat among yesterday are not impressed - I heard a couple "I know Mark Grace, and you're no Mark Grace," type jokes. Worse indicator, BB made a comment in Overbay's defense today along the lines of "he's willing to work and he'll come around."
Neither Donnels nor Baerga have Grace's sex appeal, but then, Lyle certainly doesn't either. Oh, quit the eye-rolling sneers - I can tell you that Grace attracts a surprising number of otherwise baseball-neutral females - at least I was surprised that a great many women friends of mine who know very little about the game know Grace (and have for a decade!!), and they know Gonzo. It's those spectacular smiles. The organization is not blind to that and they want Grace here when he retires partly for that reason.
As to Overbay - Not that I know squat or that it means a thing, but he just hasn't had that early-on, big-league "feel" at any point to me - unlike, say, Spivey, or Patterson or (IMHO) Capuano or Olson - the sense that this kid has the requisite fierce drive and the smarts as well as talent. (the fact that he sounded rather...hmm... well... (thesaurus) ...phlegmatic on a couple radio interviews last season may have contributed to that impression.) The older, very regular ST/Sidewinder fans I sat among yesterday are not impressed - I heard a couple "I know Mark Grace, and you're no Mark Grace," type jokes. Worse indicator, BB made a comment in Overbay's defense today along the lines of "he's willing to work and he'll come around."
Neither Donnels nor Baerga have Grace's sex appeal, but then, Lyle certainly doesn't either. Oh, quit the eye-rolling sneers - I can tell you that Grace attracts a surprising number of otherwise baseball-neutral females - at least I was surprised that a great many women friends of mine who know very little about the game know Grace (and have for a decade!!), and they know Gonzo. It's those spectacular smiles. The organization is not blind to that and they want Grace here when he retires partly for that reason.
RLakin
All Star
Originally posted by schillingfan
Is he a pundit on the D-Backs? I don't think I've ever seen him post on anything about the D-Backs other than Matt Williams.
?????????????????????????????//
adbacksfan
Rookie
I admire a player who will play any position just because he wants to play. Baerga is willing to play the outfield if that's what is asked of him. His ego is in his back pocket and he just wants a job ( unlike some players I know but I wont mention Rubys name):wink:
I have been impressed with his effort.
I have been impressed with his effort.
DWKB
ASFN Icon
adbacksfan
Rookie
Thanks DWKB for setting me straight. I am not a fan of Gomez, so when I heard that story I didn't put any weight into it. However, I kept hearing that accusation over and over by other sources and soon believed it must be true. Even the Dbacks' announcers were stating it as truth. But if Curt says its not true then okay I owe Ruby an apology. Sorry Ruby! I still believe he wasn't thrilled with playing right field but if he didnt refuse then great I won't hold it against him.
RLakin
All Star
It's funny how this myth about Durazo's refusal is still circulating. I heard it on the Arizona Sports Report last week in a piece that McCabe did on Durazo.
Seems to me the Diamondbacks would have served themselves better to clear the air about this situation before they traded Durazo, especially since it was the truth.
Then again that would make the manager look bad, and fans may not have been so eager to see the only viable power source outside of Luis Gonzalez go for a guy named Elmer.
Moose Lady
Veteran
So, starting on Elmer now are we? Is there anyone on this team that you sincerely like? Every one of your posts seems to have something mean and/or degrading about someone on this team. Does anyone on the team or in the management area ever do anything to your liking? What's the point of picking on Elmer before he's even shown what he can or can't do?? And Durazo is gone. No point in dwelling on that subject any longer. Rather than Durazo I would rather lament the fact of Colby being gone. That, I think, will hurt this team more. There are going to be games that they will need a power right-handed bat to come in and get the big hit and that is when they and us will miss Colby the most. The man could deliver when it was needed.
RLakin
All Star
Enough with this childish stuff. Of course there are players that I like, but you're not going to see me starting "Isn't Gracie Great," or "Give Matty a chance" threads. That fluff just doesn't interest me.
I like debate, and perhaps 9 out of 10 times I'll take a stand against the organization if nobody else does. Think about it, have you ever read a dissenting opinion by anybody in the local media let alone our #1 daily, The AZ Republic. No, instead we get columns from Gomez talking about how Durazo refused and assignment, when it turns out he didn't. My next question would be: So, why didn't the team clear the air about this? I would think they would want to because Durazo was on the block this summer, and clubs are generally a little more reluctant to add players who (allegedly) refuse assignments for the good of the team.
If you have a problem with my little shot at Elmer, feel free to give me some statistics to defend your guy. And please stop with the good fan/bad fan debate, because I have no desire to partake in a dialogue, will all due respect, that a 10 year old could have.
AZZenny
Registered User
I wish I could place exactly where I saw/heard it, (I think it was his weekly radio show) but last year Brenly at least ONE time did state publically that Durazo didn't refuse, but said he was uncomfortable in the outfield because of the elbow problems he'd had before - and it was right around the time of all the swirling rumor. I recall this because I mentioned it a couple places and was largely pooh-poohed.
Dessens isn't looking awful in ST, and I propose we give the guy half a dozen regular season games before we pass final judgment on him.
Dessens isn't looking awful in ST, and I propose we give the guy half a dozen regular season games before we pass final judgment on him.
schillingfan
All Star
Too true. My philosophy is that I will scream and yell and moan when the team makes a move I hate, but after that initial bitching period I will give the move a bit of team to see how it works out, then I'll complain all over again and say "I told you so". But if it works out good, I'll eat crow.
But if we can't complain at the time the team makes the moves, why are we here talking?
