Carlos Baerga

[RLakin]

Originally posted by schillingfan
But if we can't complain at the time the team makes the moves, why are we here talking?

Agreed.

 

[BC867]

Originally posted by finleyfanatic
There are going to be games that they will need a power right-handed bat to come in and get the big hit and that is when they and us will miss Colby the most. The man could deliver when it was needed.

No one agrees with that more than I do. We are going to miss Greg Colbrunn.

But with Quinton McCracken, Carlos Baerga, David Dellucci, and Mark Grace on the bench, I think we'll have a pinch-hitting staff second to none.

And I believe the group of Craig Counsell, Danny Bautista, Quinton McCracken, and Carlos Baerga will be highly regarded as the best at getting timely hits, as any in the league.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At Saturday's Spring Training game against the Padres, when 'Q' came up for the first time (with a runner on third and one out) after replacing Gonzo, I said to my wife, "He's going to drive in that runner. Right now!"

He hit the first pitch to the warning track in left field and the runner scored.

I had no reservation in making that prediction. As a fan, that's a good feeling!

 

[DWKB]

So if I expect Dessens to give us 160+ IP with a 4.30 ERA in around 30 starts would I be "picking on him", or "not giving him a chance"?

Just curious on that.

 

[Derek in Tucson]

But if we can't complain at the time the team makes the moves, why are we here talking?

Well some poeple do like to talk about the team their a fan of without complaining all the time. Maybe Mr Lakin finds it childish to actually root for the home team, but I don't. But then from the sound of it, Mr Lakin seems to be more interested in debating than he is in being a fan of the DBacks.

It just seems to me that sometimes the complaints overwhelm the positive aspects about the Diamondbacks and their accomplishments. And if somebody tries to curb that tide, they are greeted with ad hominen attacks by poeple like Mr Lakin who refers to them as 10 year olds.

 

[RLakin]

Originally posted by Derek in Tucson
But then from the sound of it, Mr Lakin seems to be more interested in debating than he is in being a fan of the DBacks.

Is there some kind of D-backs litmus test that you want me to pass before I post?

I'll save you the trouble. I'm not really a big fan of the Diamondbacks. I'm a baseball fan, though, and so I'll follow the local team. I think baseball is most localized sports that there is, and by that I mean it's almost impossible to be a fan or follow a team that it is out of state. It's a unique and great sport in that way, because you get to know the tendencies of all the players on a team that you follow that nobody else could do unless they watched on a regular basis. Satellites make the possible for some out of state baseball fans, but the majority of the rest (including the national media) are left to interpret the data of a team like the D-backs. It's for this reason that ESPN seems like the national Yankee network, because the majority of their staff resides in NYC and follows the team daily. It's also the reason you get stupid stories like The Boss against Jeter and David Wells drunkenness every night on Sportscenter.

And that's great if you like to focus on the more positive aspects of the D-Backs. I don't. I tend to think issues like that are boring, and so I refrain from comment. There's no politically correct, equal opportunity posting rule here, so my subject matter is strictly up to me.

And I'm not trying to brand people as 10 year olds, I just really don't feel like getting involved in juvenile debates about how I'm always being mean to the D-backs. That just sounds childish to me.

 

[AZZenny]

well, all I said was "before we pass final judgment on him." I agree that when a team makes a trade, all fans have a god-given right to sound off as pompously or as fatuously as we want.

And I understand from the stat-head stuff posted at the time why that would lead to certain predictions. I suppose my only point is - they are only 2003 predictions, not 2003 season stats.

He's here, he's surprised me at least in how good he looks so far this Spring, given how many of you described him, and I would think some mildly curious "wait-and-see" is now in order rather than keep talking like this was definitely the worst trade of the yet-young Millenium. (Not aimed at any single person.)

I'm curious, DWKB - would you rather be wrong in your prediciton (e.g., he does better) or right?

 

[DWKB]

Originally posted by AZZenny

I'm curious, DWKB - would you rather be wrong in your prediciton (e.g., he does better) or right?

It's always a crappy position to be in. I always want the team to succeed, even at the expense of my ego. I'm sure you feel the same way regarding your stance on Matty. I doubt you're going to be rooting for him to fail this year. I won't be looking at Dessens to fail either.

 

[AZZenny]

Good analogy. I figure it's no-lose, though. If Matty proves me wrong and has a fabulous season, it has to help the team, which is the priority. If he fails miserably I can be smug and make mean jokes and have a perfect scapegoat!

 

[Moose Lady]

Originally posted by RLakin
Enough with this childish stuff. Of course there are players that I like, but you're not going to see me starting "Isn't Gracie Great," or "Give Matty a chance" threads. That fluff just doesn't interest me.
I like debate, and perhaps 9 out of 10 times I'll take a stand against the organization if nobody else does. Think about it, have you ever read a dissenting opinion by anybody in the local media let alone our #1 daily, The AZ Republic. No, instead we get columns from Gomez talking about how Durazo refused and assignment, when it turns out he didn't. My next question would be: So, why didn't the team clear the air about this? I would think they would want to because Durazo was on the block this summer, and clubs are generally a little more reluctant to add players who (allegedly) refuse assignments for the good of the team.
If you have a problem with my little shot at Elmer, feel free to give me some statistics to defend your guy. And please stop with the good fan/bad fan debate, because I have no desire to partake in a dialogue, will all due respect, that a 10 year old could have.

The reason that "fluff" doesn't interest you is because the only thing you want to talk about are all the negative things about this team. And, by your own admission, i.e. "I'll take a stand AGAINST the organization if no one does". Why do think there has to be someone to take a stance against the team? Just for the sake of debate? If that's all you want, there are plenty of chat rooms that enjoy engaging in debates.
And Elmer is not "my guy" but I don't see a reason for dissing him before he has even done anything. You say you want stats. Stats from when? It's only Spring Training which, btw, he has some very good stats. 5 shutout innings and 2 hits today. At least give the man a chance. I really don't care what he has done in the past. All I care about is what he can do for us in the present. And I did not say anything about a good fan/bad fan. But if all you want to do is start arguments/debates, I guess I'm not understanding the "Why".

 

[Moose Lady]

Originally posted by RLakin

And that's great if you like to focus on the more positive aspects of the D-Backs. I don't. I tend to think issues like that are boring, and so I refrain from comment. There's no politically correct, equal opportunity posting rule here, so my subject matter is strictly up to me.

So in other words your just following that old saying of "If you can't say something nice don't say anything at all". Nice way to live. Well at least we all know now that if we don't like reading negative articles or posts, we should just put your posts on delete. I'm sorry that I would rather dwell on the positive rather than the negative. I can't even imagine anyone being so negative as to say they find positive issues boring. Ok, I won't bring up again.

 

[RLakin]

Issue: A point or matter of discussion, debate, or dispute

I probably misspoke in labeling issues as either positive or negative.

There are sides to every story and I enjoy partaking in debates about the D-backs that have good give and take on both sides of the issue at hand. Matt Williams is always a great topic, as is Durazo and Kim. And nobody likes hearing one side of an issue, so therefore a topic about how great a player is doesn't do as much for me as another topic that's more argumentative in nature. That's just the way I feel, and no I don't look at myself as a negative person or as someone who has a negative outlook on life. Lets just keep the focus here on baseball.

 

[DWKB]

Originally posted by RLakin
Lets just keep the focus here on baseball.

I second this!!

 

[Derek in Tucson]

Is there some kind of D-backs litmus test that you want me to pass before I post?

No, but it says it all when you say you're not really a fan of the DBacks. That's one of the problems though when living in a place like Phoenix....there's too many of your kind of people around who criticize the home team at every turn while showing up at the BoB in the road team's hats or some other sort of non-DBack gear. That comes with the territory though when you're in a growing area and you get vagabonds from the dieing economies of the Midwest and Northeast. These people come to Arizona and all I hear is what a great place they came from and how it sucks out here. Well maybe if they embraced their new life instead of trying to hang onto the last vestiges from their past, they'd find happiness......but I doubt that's crossed their minds.

And while you amight find it "boring" to root for the home team, I think their's enough DBacks fans still around here who'll refute that statement. Your latest post doesn't surprise me at all though. I've always had the feeling that you weren't really a DBacks fan at all and that you only like to promote yourself as some kind of investigative journalist out to dig up the "real story" behind the Dbacks. It just doesn't sound right to you and others, like Pedro Gomez, when Colangelo says he refuse to put up with the wife beaters and the drug users. His effort to promote his teams in a more positivie light than the Yahkees with their Steve Howes and Darryl Strawberrys just ddoesn't fit the profile of the owner who will do whatever it takes to win.

I coomend you that at least you've finally come clean and admitted you don't like the DBacks too much. At least that veiled existence that you've been living under is finally out in the open for everybody to see.....you're just a muckraker out to get a reaction.

edit: Of course you want to just focus on baseball. If your intentions are questioned, then that gets in the way of your DBacks bashing. To me it's a pathetic existence....the anti-fan way of life who focuses on the negative of the local team.

 

[Moose Lady]

DEREK:

 

[RLakin]

Let's sort through some of the myths (about me) that you spout in your little diatribe here.

No, but it says it all when you say you're not really a fan of the DBacks.

I would be more of a follower than a fan. I started out a fan, but the way this organization talks down and insults their fans at every corner really turned me off.

Diagnosis: Somewhat True

That's one of the problems though when living in a place like Phoenix....there's too many of your kind of people around who criticize the home team at every turn while showing up at the BoB in the road team's hats or some other sort of non-DBack gear

Since non-DBack gear incorporates everything else people wear without the D-backs logo on it, I would have to agree. I don't wear any other team's hats, however.

Diagnosis: Half-True. But don't you live in Tucson?

hat comes with the territory though when you're in a growing area and you get vagabonds from the dieing economies of the Midwest and Northeast. These people come to Arizona and all I hear is what a great place they came from and how it sucks out here. Well maybe if they embraced their new life instead of trying to hang onto the last vestiges from their past, they'd find happiness......but I doubt that's crossed their minds.

No, lived here my whole life, but I know what you're talking about. I would say vagabonds from NY bother me and fit the above description more than anything, though.

Diagnosis: Very false

And while you amight find it "boring" to root for the home team

Never said that.

Diagnosis: False

It just doesn't sound right to you and others, like Pedro Gomez, when Colangelo says he refuse to put up with the wife beaters and the drug users. His effort to promote his teams in a more positive light than the Yahkees with their Steve Howes and Darryl Strawberrys just doesn't fit the profile of the owner who will do whatever it takes to win.

No, it's an admirable effort by Colangelo, although it will never work in basketball. And I think he does try whatever it takes to win, unlike other local organizations and owners that have been further exposed as of late.

Diagnosis: False

I commend you that at least you've finally come clean and admitted you don't like the DBacks too much. At least that veiled existence that you've been living under is finally out in the open for everybody to see.....you're just a muckraker out to get a reaction.

I never hide anything so veiled is hardly applicable. And I wouldn't say I'm a muckraker or a that a don't like the D-Backs too much. Rather that I'm a follower of the team and a crusader for the truth.

Diagnosis: False X 3

If your intentions are questioned, then that gets in the way of your DBacks bashing. To me it's a pathetic existence....the anti-fan way of life who focuses on the negative of the local team.

My only intention is to talk about baseball and I am not anti-fan nor someone with a pathetic existence. I find it funny and ironic, though, for someone so adamant about not being negative in the context of the team to label someone with that. Kind of like anti-war demonstrators rioting at one of their peace rallies, I guess.

Diagnosis: False

Of course you want to just focus on baseball.

As much as I'd love to continue this discussion, unfortunately that's very true.

 

[Derek in Tucson]

Oh, so you fancy yourself as a "crusader for the truth"? That's laughable and quite a straight line, but I won't go there. Well, I just have to ask you one thing....Are you a caped cursader, or just a regular crusader? What exactly have the Diamondbacks done to you that has put you on this path of idealistic anarchy?

Oh I could see getting a little bent out of shape when the Diamondbacks raised ticket prices on Fan Appreciation Weekend back in the inaugural season. Hey, I wasn't too pleased with that either, but I got over it. And I could see being perturbed over some of the trades they've made. I wasn't too happy with that Mantei deal for Penny/Nunez/Nunez, but it did get the DBacks their first NL West title and a 100 win season so I got over that too.

I mean, is there any team, no matter what sport, that satisfies their fans with even close to a 100% success rate? I don't think so. Just look around baseball and you'll find owners like Loria, Naimoli, and that billionaire Pohlad up in Minnesota who have done a lot worse than whatever insults Colangelo and his partnership have tossed our way. Not a ringing endorsement by any means, but when you're dealing with owners there really isn't a lot to like about them anyway, is there?. I mean, they did put Selig in charge, right?

Btw, I'm not adamant at all about everybody being non negative when posting in here. I just don't think that I when I go to a fan site of the team I root for I should feel the need to defend them at every turn. After all, this is the Arizona Sports FAN website, right? I think there should be more balance from people like you, who write a tome about Matt Williams that's filled with personal insults directed towards him. I also think that when the Diamondbacks are in the playoffs, the fans shouldn't be booing one of their own players.

But on to the specifics of your last post. No I don't live in Phoenix, but I have been to over 100 games there, and have read/posted to these types of internet message boards for about 6 years now so I think I have enough experience in that area to talk about it. Even at today's Mariners game there was a Seattle fan who constantly moaned about how "their grass" was better than ours.

And pardon me for lumping you in with the dregs of society that come to live in this area just to complain and root for the other team. Of course that doesn't make you any more likeable.

I still don't get the whole anti-fan thing though. And even though you say you're not one, if you post in thread after thread nothing but negative comments about the team, then how does that keep you from qualifying? You've already admitted that you have no interest in posting anything positive because you find that "boring". Btw, I guess I'd better bring up a quote since you've denied this.

And that's great if you like to focus on the more positive aspects of the D-Backs. I don't. I tend to think issues like that are boring, and so I refrain from comment.

See, that's why I labeled you as an anti-fan. Even though the Diamondbacks have won the NL West 3 out of the last 4 years, and a World Series title thrown in for good measure, I just find it hard to believe that there's a ton of negatives to focus on, or that it should be the sole focus of posting. But that sure hasn't stopped you from trying, now has it? And even though you just "want to talk baseball", which only means to me that you want to go back to bashing Matt Williams, at least now I know a little better about where you're coming from. Still left wondering why you're so bitter though.

 

[RLakin]

Originally posted by Derek in Tucson I still don't get the whole anti-fan thing though. And even though you say you're not one, if you post in thread after thread nothing but negative comments about the team, then how does that keep you from qualifying?

Pretty easy if you think about it.


Originally posted by Derek in Tucson
"See, that's why I labeled you as an anti-fan. Even though the Diamondbacks have won the NL West 3 out of the last 4 years, and a World Series title thrown in for good measure..."

That is unless the Diamondbacks are a team of fans.

 

[Derek in Tucson]

I guess the Caped Crusader has been taken over by The Riddler.

 

[schillingfan]

Originally posted by Derek in Tucson
I guess the Caped Crusader has been taken over by The Riddler.

Really, I was wondering about that myself.

Honestly, I have no clue what RLakin's problem is with the D-Backs. It's either personal, or he simply enjoys complaining. I think the D-Backs are very lucky to have an owner like Colangelo who wants to win. He went into debt to win. I bet you couldn't find even a handful of other owners willing to do that.

The issue of how the team treats its fans seems like a whole smokescreen considering that he doesn't even claim to be a fan.

 

[RLakin]

Originally posted by Derek in Tucson
I guess the Caped Crusader has been taken over by The Riddler.

I thought the bold letters might help, but I guess not.

Here goes, again:

I still don't get the whole anti-fan thing though. And even though you say you're not one, if you post in thread after thread nothing but negative comments about the team, then how does that keep you from qualifying?

Your Question: If I post a negative thread about the team how does that not make me anti-fan. That's pretty simple, I'm not ant-fan because my negative comments (as you say) are about the team. I would think that would make more anti-team than anti-fan.

"See, that's why I labeled you as an anti-fan. Even though the Diamondbacks have won the NL West 3 out of the last 4 years, and a World Series title thrown in for good measure..."

Anti: Opposed to; against.

Diamondbacks: A baseball team in the National League West

So really you had two options with these two paragraphs (if your aim was to make any sense):

"I still don't get the whole anti-fan thing though. And even though you say you're not one, if you post in thread after thread nothing but negative comments about the fans, then how does that keep you from qualifying?"

or

"See, that's why I labeled you as an anti-team . Even though the Diamondbacks have won the NL West 3 out of the last 4 years, and a World Series title thrown in for good measure..."

Both charges I would say are incorrect, however, but you might as well throw in the anti-team charge for good measure. Let see, you've already called me an unlikeable, bitter, nomadic muckraker, anti-fan, who's nomadic and veiled existence is only vindicated by taking personal attacks on Matt Williams.

That's pretty funny considering your main charge against me was personal attacks and negativity, both of which you seem to be showing a lot of right now. Up until now I've refrained from giving you such a label, but there's one that comes too clear to mind:

Hypocrite: a person who professes beliefs and opinions that they do not hold

 

[DbaxJ]

Lets end the pissing contest before this thread becomes locked!!

Regards, your friendly neighborhood Moderator!

 

[Derek in Tucson]

Well it looks like the moderator is stepping in, but I just have to say that if you can't see the difference between a board exchange, and having articles published about Matt Williams with insult after insult then you don't really have any room to call me a hypocrite. But if you want, we can take this off the board to the PM department.

Btw, Moderator J, this isn't a pissing contest. I'm just trying to clear the air about where Lakin is coming from since he's never revealed his angle when it comes to the DBacks. To me he's just another NEM.....just some troll poster who isn't really a fan of the Diamondbacks at all, but who likes to show up occasionally and throw as much dirt on them as he can. But hey, if you think he should be allowed free movement in here, then that's your perogative. I won't even call you a hypocrite either.

 

[schillingfan]

Originally posted by RLakin
Your Question: If I post a negative thread about the team how does that not make me anti-fan. That's pretty simple, I'm not ant-fan because my negative comments (as you say) are about the team. I would think that would make more anti-team than anti-fan.

"anti" can also mean opposite of as opposed to just being against something.

I believe Derek meant anti-fan, in the same vein as anti-hero. An anti-hero is not against heroes, an anti-hero is the opposite of a hero, or someone who's personality characteristics are the opposite of a hero.

Thus, as an anti-fan, he meant that your characteristics as a poster are the opposite of what a typical fan's characteristics are.

Unlike Derek, it doesn't bother me, because I'm only a semi-fan of the D-Backs. I enjoy watching them and rooting for them, but they are not my team, as Derek points out to me., which is true.

Some people on this board seem to feel that people who are not "true" D-Backs fans are less entitled to express their opinion. But I don't let it bother me.

Oh and I like Derek a lot, we just have a difference of opinion on this particular issue. Differences of opinion are what make the world go round.

And I have never seen you say anything positive about the D-Backs that I can ever recall. Just rants against Matty for the most part. But as I said, that doesn't bother me.

 

[DbaxJ]

If there were to be a reason for me to step in, it would be that this thread has gone way off topic as I see it. It may not be a pissing contest, but it is degrading at a rapid rate.

I see both sides of the fence here, and I have my own opinion. Unfortunately, RLakin has the right to post whatever he wants, (obviously within reason and considered deemable by the board admin) whether we like it or not. I am not thrilled with his takes, albeit negative, all the time, but none the less, he has the right to say it.

As long as things stay civil, I have no problems, but let me also add, that breaking down EVERY sentence of someones post gets old.. real fast. I dont care who is doing it.... if you want to do that stuff, take it to pm please, or continue to express your views here in a manner in which we all can read without having to get an tylenol!

 

[adbacksfan]

AMEN