Carson Palmer: No ‘major areas of concern’ for Cardinals’ Kyler Murray

[Jetstream Green]

In the NFL you have to throw players open. When Kyler is missing in games, and his accuracy is pretty good, they are not close misses. For example, in the drive after the McCaffery TD, Kyler missed DJ on first down badly. That put the Cardinals in 2nd and long which he was unable to handle. Kyler sometimes struggles to identify when he needs to just take what the defense is giving him.

I hope he eventually simmers down. The kid is rather high strung and just needs to chill a little more and take as you say what the defense allows because I think the expectations are playing on him more than they are for us fans or his demeanor wants to admit... he's still striving for a quick fix on every set of downs, boy needs some patience

 

[kerouac9]

So you would’ve passed on him and went with Rosen? Tell me how much better things would be.

Why does this have to be the only alternative? Why can't we both enjoy watching Murray play AND ALSO see that he has some mistakes and bad habits he has to clean up.

We're LONG past the draft process at this point. No one here is hoping for another 3-13 season, although it's weird that it seems like mostly Murray Cultists who would be fine with one as long as we lose 7-10 of those games by like 10 points or less Because Reasons.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Why does this have to be the only alternative? Why can't we both enjoy watching Murray play AND ALSO see that he has some mistakes and bad habits he has to clean up.

because some people can only argue things in absolute black and white terms.

I'm pretty stoked with a lot of Kyler's play and potential, but there's definitely some negatives... ones that I hope and think can be cured in the long-run, but def exist in the interim. For people to continue to completely discount any of the negatives so far and attack anyone who dares bring them up is a continual head scratcher to me.

 

[Krangodnzr]

What was Carson suppose to say? It wouldn't surprise me if he said similar things about Rosen early in the year.

With that said, I'm not concerned with KM yet. If the bad things he does continue later in the season I will be. I wasn't a fan of the pick but he has done well enough that I don't have a problem waiting to see how it goes as the year progresses.

What I am more concerned with on the offense is KKs playbook. It isn't terrible, but it is not as advertised and compared to the playcalling you see with the better offenses out there it looks pretty bland and will probably only get easier to defend. It looks like a game of checkers and not chess and people are wondering why our receivers have trouble getting open.

Why does this have to be the only alternative? Why can't we both enjoy watching Murray play AND ALSO see that he has some mistakes and bad habits he has to clean up.

We're LONG past the draft process at this point. No one here is hoping for another 3-13 season, although it's weird that it seems like mostly Murray Cultists who would be fine with one as long as we lose 7-10 of those games by like 10 points or less Because Reasons.

Nail on the head.

I love watching Murray and I think he is going to be really good, but he had probably made more bad plays than any other player on the team.

 

[kerouac9]

because some people can only argue things in absolute black and white terms.

I'm pretty stoked with a lot of Kyler's play and potential, but there's definitely some negatives... ones that I hope and think can be cured in the long-run, but def exist in the interim. For people to continue to completely discount any of the negatives so far and attack anyone who dares bring them up is a continual head scratcher to me.

I think I said this in Heroes and Goats this week, but watching Murray run around in the first two quarters on Sunday was the most fun I've had watching this team in (maybe) over a year and a half. I want to see him play like that — because it helps the Cards win and because it's fun as hell.

It's extremely strange that — since before the draft — some people have had to come in and Truther every and all less than effusive comments about Murray. Not one can go unresponded to.

 

[ARZCardinals]

Anyone with half a brain can see KM isn't the problem...he may have some issues, but as far as the 'team' goes.....you can make a list from 1 - 50 and KM isn't in the top 30.

You could list the entire O line - that's top5
you could list the play of the entire defense other than Chandler Jones - that's another 10
you could list coaching - staring with Vance J
you could list PP using PED's and masking them
you could list we have no TE - not a bad TE the have NO TE.
you could list David Johnson being paid as a top RB in the league, but rushing for under 30 yards a game, being slow and falling down on first contact
you could list 'unlucky' on getting fumbles that have come out, but not recovered...same thing for batted balls...they've gotten none that normally get intercepted...just bad or no luck
you could list Vance leaving every TE open like 7/11.

There are a ton of issues - even talking that KM is part of the problem is foolish.

 

[kerouac9]

Anyone with half a brain can see KM isn't the problem...he may have some issues, but as far as the 'team' goes.....you can make a list from 1 - 50 and KM isn't in the top 30.

What does this mean? If Kyler Murray plays better, we are likely undefeated. You can't have a winless team with a flawless QB.

 

[ARZCardinals]

What does this mean? If Kyler Murray plays better, we are likely undefeated. You can't have a winless team with a flawless QB.

KM plays better we are likely undefeated....what in the world are you smoking?

the defense has failed to stop anyone. Carolina punted the ball 1 time the entire game
The Ravens punted the ball 1 time the entire game. Not sure you put that on KM.

If you think KM is the issue - you're crazy 100%

the TEAM has a ton of issues - read above - when you can rank one and say KM is a bigger problem let's talk.

 

[kerouac9]

KM plays better we are likely undefeated....what in the world are you smoking?

the defense has failed to stop anyone. Carolina punted the ball 1 time the entire game
The Ravens punted the ball 1 time the entire game. Not sure you put that on KM.

If you think KM is the issue - you're crazy 100%

the TEAM has a ton of issues - read above - when you can rank one and say KM is a bigger problem let's talk.

Cards are down by 8 last week and Murray immediately throws an INT on the second play of the drive. Sometimes games are track meets. Murray played in the Big 12; that shouldn't be an unfamiliar feeling for him. We didn't get Kyler Murray and Kliff Kingsbury for games to finish 17-10.

Here's B-more's drive chart:

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Give me a break. Murray was THE WORST QB IN THE NFL LAST WEEK by Football Outsiders' metrics. He's nowhere near a lost cause, but if Murray finds a way punch the ball into the end zone at any time in the first half in Baltimore, that's a different game.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Chopper0080]

So you would’ve passed on him and went with Rosen? Tell me how much better things would be.

I wouldn't go that far, but I didn't and still don't see a huge difference between Murray and Daniel Jones as prospects, and honestly, I didn't see a huge difference between Murray and Rosen at the time of the draft. That being said, Murray is our guy for the next 3 years. If we want to win, he will need to get a lot better than he has shown so far. Hopefully he will.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think I said this in Heroes and Goats this week, but watching Murray run around in the first two quarters on Sunday was the most fun I've had watching this team in (maybe) over a year and a half. I want to see him play like that — because it helps the Cards win and because it's fun as hell.

It's extremely strange that — since before the draft — some people have had to come in and Truther every and all less than effusive comments about Murray. Not one can go unresponded to.

i think if you could somehow wipe the entire off-season of hype away, the overwhelming majority of the board would be in complete and utter agreement that pretty much everyone at least has reason for optimism about Kyler but need to see more before going all in. I can't think of anyone who has just been slamming him without finding any moment for praise (even the guys who REALLY hated the pick have admitted there's been moments to give them a little optimism). There are def some who are still hedging on the side of they fear he's going to suck... and def some who would believe he can do no wrong. but the majority of fans are in the middle... excited about what we've seen so far, but hoping to see more as the season goes on and he gains experience.

and I totally agree with the first part of your post. You said that first half was the the most fun you've had in over a year and a half? This whole season has been the first time I've had fun since we blew that 6-6 OT game against Seattle back in 2016. I knew 2017 was a complete exercise in futility season, bringing back the same OLDER gang that underachieved so bad in 2016 for a complete BS "one more run!" season. And I was out to lunch on 2018 the second we signed Bradford. I guess I got a little juice in the game where Rosen came in for the first time and almost marched us to a FG to try and beat the Bears and the next week against Seattle where it looked like we still had hope, but the rest of last season was just so damn depressing.

I am STOKED on this season and the way the O has grown by leaps and bounds while still figuring their stuff out.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

i think if you could somehow wipe the entire off-season of hype away, the overwhelming majority of the board would be in complete and utter agreement that pretty much everyone at least has reason for optimism about Kyler but need to see more before going all in. I can't think of anyone who has just been slamming him without finding any moment for praise (even the guys who REALLY hated the pick have admitted there's been moments to give them a little optimism). There are def some who are still hedging on the side of they fear he's going to suck... and def some who would believe he can do no wrong. but the majority of fans are in the middle... excited about what we've seen so far, but hoping to see more as the season goes on and he gains experience.

and I totally agree with the first part of your post. You said that first half was the the most fun you've had in over a year and a half? This whole season has been the first time I've had fun since we blew that 6-6 OT game against Seattle back in 2016. I knew 2017 was a complete exercise in futility season, bringing back the same OLDER gang that underachieved so bad in 2016 for a complete BS "one more run!" season. And I was out to lunch on 2018 the second we signed Bradford. I guess I got a little juice in the game where Rosen came in for the first time and almost marched us to a FG to try and beat the Bears and the next week against Seattle where it looked like we still had hope, but the rest of last season was just so damn depressing.

I am STOKED on this season and the way the O has grown by leaps and bounds while still figuring their stuff out.

I would agree with this, but the person hyping Murray the most this offseason has already adopted this very veiwpoint. I was also one of the "believers" in the offseason and I will fully admit that I see his potential and also believe he has things he needs to improve.

I think where the disconnect is is when people are either completely excusing him from any blame or are refusing to give him credit for some good things he has done. It seems some on this board only want to harp on the bad things and not give any praise whatsoever and that will make it seem like they are just hating. Especially if they were a "non-believer" in the offseason.

 

[SoonerLou]

After their first 3 starts



75 QB rating

65/122 846 yards 5 tds 4 ints 80 yards rushing

79 QB rating

84/137 830 yards 4 tds 3 ints 86 yards rushing

Any guesses as to who QB 1 and QB 2 are?

 

[Stout]

I would agree with this, but the person hyping Murray the most this offseason has already adopted this very veiwpoint. I was also one of the "believers" in the offseason and I will fully admit that I see his potential and also believe he has things he needs to improve.

I think where the disconnect is is when people are either completely excusing him from any blame or are refusing to give him credit for some good things he has done. It seems some on this board only want to harp on the bad things and not give any praise whatsoever and that will make it seem like they are just hating. Especially if they were a "non-believer" in the offseason.

You absolutely have been a cool head and a voice of reason thus far.

i think if you could somehow wipe the entire off-season of hype away, the overwhelming majority of the board would be in complete and utter agreement that pretty much everyone at least has reason for optimism about Kyler but need to see more before going all in. I can't think of anyone who has just been slamming him without finding any moment for praise (even the guys who REALLY hated the pick have admitted there's been moments to give them a little optimism). There are def some who are still hedging on the side of they fear he's going to suck... and def some who would believe he can do no wrong. but the majority of fans are in the middle... excited about what we've seen so far, but hoping to see more as the season goes on and he gains experience.

and I totally agree with the first part of your post. You said that first half was the the most fun you've had in over a year and a half? This whole season has been the first time I've had fun since we blew that 6-6 OT game against Seattle back in 2016. I knew 2017 was a complete exercise in futility season, bringing back the same OLDER gang that underachieved so bad in 2016 for a complete BS "one more run!" season. And I was out to lunch on 2018 the second we signed Bradford. I guess I got a little juice in the game where Rosen came in for the first time and almost marched us to a FG to try and beat the Bears and the next week against Seattle where it looked like we still had hope, but the rest of last season was just so damn depressing.

I am STOKED on this season and the way the O has grown by leaps and bounds while still figuring their stuff out.

Yes, yes, 1000 times, yes! THIS!!!

 

[Krangodnzr]

Anyone with half a brain can see KM isn't the problem...he may have some issues, but as far as the 'team' goes.....you can make a list from 1 - 50 and KM isn't in the top 30.

You could list the entire O line - that's top5
you could list the play of the entire defense other than Chandler Jones - that's another 10
you could list coaching - staring with Vance J
you could list PP using PED's and masking them
you could list we have no TE - not a bad TE the have NO TE.
you could list David Johnson being paid as a top RB in the league, but rushing for under 30 yards a game, being slow and falling down on first contact
you could list 'unlucky' on getting fumbles that have come out, but not recovered...same thing for batted balls...they've gotten none that normally get intercepted...just bad or no luck
you could list Vance leaving every TE open like 7/11.

There are a ton of issues - even talking that KM is part of the problem is foolish.

And then put like 10 aspects of Murrays game in the top 50 reasons why the Cardinals are 0-2-1 and you would be correct.

The offensive line would likely have given up hot even half the sacks with a competent vet playing behind them. Murrays game jitters against the Lions led that game to a tie. Running to the sideline and not throwing the ball away. Not stepping up in the pocket. Random periods of complete inaccuracy even though it's obvious the kid is very accurate. Not running when the lanes are there.

Murray has made dozens and dozens of mistakes. It's ok to admit it. I think Murray is going to be a very good QB in a short while.

 

[Stout]

And then put like 10 aspects of Murrays game in the top 50 reasons why the Cardinals are 0-2-1 and you would be correct.

The offensive line would likely have given up hot even half the sacks with a competent vet playing behind them. Murrays game jitters against the Lions led that game to a tie. Running to the sideline and not throwing the ball away. Not stepping up in the pocket. Random periods of complete inaccuracy even though it's obvious the kid is very accurate. Not running when the lanes are there.

Murray has made dozens and dozens of mistakes. It's ok to admit it. I think Murray is going to be a very good QB in a short while.

Krang, man, I give you tons of kudos for your level-headed analysis. He's made mistakes, and that's okay. He's a rookie, and it's easy to say he's made mistakes and still have tons of optimism for the future, even the near future. And I agree with you 100 percent.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Krang, man, I give you tons of kudos for your level-headed analysis. He's made mistakes, and that's okay. He's a rookie, and it's easy to say he's made mistakes and still have tons of optimism for the future, even the near future. And I agree with you 100 percent.

The thing is:

If Murray cleans half of mistakes, the Cardinals have a dynamic, great young QB.

I feel like I'm not wrong about wanting to draft him. With the kind of person he is, only injuries will derail this kid.

 

[Dr. Jones]

because some people can only argue things in absolute black and white terms.

I'm pretty stoked with a lot of Kyler's play and potential, but there's definitely some negatives... ones that I hope and think can be cured in the long-run, but def exist in the interim. For people to continue to completely discount any of the negatives so far and attack anyone who dares bring them up is a continual head scratcher to me.

My biggest negative so far is this:

He's not nearly as Quick or elusive as I expected. When Lamar goes..... The "Suddenness" of him is very telling. And no one catches up. When Kyler goes, he doesn't seem to have that same explosion. Or shiftiness that I was expecting.

All of the pocket stuff, sack stuff, and sliding stuff can be corrected with experience, and reps.

The other stuff, although still very above average, hasn't been the total dominance that one could expect when looking at such a comprehensive spider chart. #DidYouSeeWhatIDidThere?

 

[DVontel]

My biggest negative so far is this:

He's not nearly as Quick or elusive as I expected. When Lamar goes..... The "Suddenness" of him is very telling. And no one catches up. When Kyler goes, he doesn't seem to have that same explosion. Or shiftiness that I was expecting.

All of the pocket stuff, sack stuff, and sliding stuff can be corrected with experience, and reps.

The other stuff, although still very above average, hasn't been the total dominance that one could expect when looking at such a comprehensive spider chart. #DidYouSeeWhatIDidThere?

Idk, he looked pretty quick here.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

Who’s getting by the CB here outside of Lamar?

 

[Dr. Jones]

Idk, he looked pretty quick here.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

Who’s getting by the CB here outside of Lamar?

Agreed. He's still a stud, no doubt. that's why I said "well above average". I think he was clocked as the 2nd fastest QB of the week behind Lamar.

Still though...... It hasn't totally blown me away like I thought it might. Maybe it has been the quick "if a hand is near me I'm going down" stuff.

 

[SoonerLou]

My biggest negative so far is this:

He's not nearly as Quick or elusive as I expected. When Lamar goes..... The "Suddenness" of him is very telling. And no one catches up. When Kyler goes, he doesn't seem to have that same explosion. Or shiftiness that I was expecting.

All of the pocket stuff, sack stuff, and sliding stuff can be corrected with experience, and reps.

The other stuff, although still very above average, hasn't been the total dominance that one could expect when looking at such a comprehensive spider chart. #DidYouSeeWhatIDidThere?

Its the weight.

He probably weighed 190 at OU. He looks closer to 210 in the NFL.

Its that and as I said before Kyler left a LOT of yards on the field at OU. He could have rushed for 1400 yards if he wanted too, but would rather let the play die (figuring he could get the yards back by passing).

Tough to compare with Lamar. He makes cuts like Leveon Bell or Alvin Kamara. He's a natural "runner". Kyler is looking for space and then getting down.

 

[Krangodnzr]

My biggest negative so far is this:

He's not nearly as Quick or elusive as I expected. When Lamar goes..... The "Suddenness" of him is very telling. And no one catches up. When Kyler goes, he doesn't seem to have that same explosion. Or shiftiness that I was expecting.

All of the pocket stuff, sack stuff, and sliding stuff can be corrected with experience, and reps.

The other stuff, although still very above average, hasn't been the total dominance that one could expect when looking at such a comprehensive spider chart. #DidYouSeeWhatIDidThere?

When you run tentatively and are looking not to take big shots, even the fastest players dont look that fast.

Lamar Jackson is taking hits every week. Those hits add up.

 

[dscher]

I think the Panther's strengths and game plan made it highly unlikely for Kyler to have a big game statistically.

They specifically like to give teams short routes and believe in the defenders to make the necessary tackles.

Murray did exactly the right thing by hitting a bunch of underneath routes and that is why he was like 28-36 to start the game and the main two reasons the yardage total was really low was due to drops and guys not being able to make plays after the catch.

He started playing poorly after that point, but that is because they got behind and he/Kliff started to try and push the ball down the field instead of taking what was working the rest of the game in going underneath.

As to the offensive line, they may be playing to your expectations, but that is equalling them playing like a bottom 3-4 offensive line in the league.

Good take. We also have to remember just how close this game was at one point. The good thing after the game is how they recognized what happened and called it what it was...they got down by those two touchdowns late and defenses know what is coming, so they pin their ears back and attack. Sometimes credit goes to the other guys... I can live with that. And no, I am not dismissing how horrible Murray looked in that fourth. Also, that McCaffrey run was just really the dagger IMO.

 

[GoldGloveschmidt]

After their first 3 starts



75 QB rating

65/122 846 yards 5 tds 4 ints 80 yards rushing

79 QB rating

84/137 830 yards 4 tds 3 ints 86 yards rushing

Any guesses as to who QB 1 and QB 2 are?

Let's hear it. Obviously Kyler is 2

 

[SoonerLou]

Let's hear it. Obviously Kyler is 2

Andrew Luck was #1.