Cats vs. Dukes

[carey]

On ESPN2 now.

It's odd to be listening to Miles Simon since he's only a year older than me and we were at school at the same time. He isn't terrible...

 

[carey]

They are struggling to score points right now. Perry again seems to be the hardest working player on the floor 2-3 for 5 pts and 4 rebs.

Also, Josiah Turner is fast.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

One thing is for sure - Solo and Fogg better step it up and fast. And my bet is Kyryl and Turner might not be in the starting lineup much longer.

 

[carey]

Mayes getting hot from 3 saved them that's for sure. Chol sure is raw, but I like his potential. Perry with back to back double doubles is nice.

 

[TJ]

We are going to suffer an "upset" loss soon. I can see St. Johns beating us next week. This team's play is careless at the moment and there are players who need to step up. 20 turnovers and abysmal shooting from the line was frustrating to watch. Solo's is underperforming and Fogg is inconsistent. Right now, the star player is Jesse Perry. Moreover, we cannot count on KP3 to hit the ground running when he returns. It's just not realistic. So it may be until January we see a semblance of what he can do.

The freshman, for the most part, look decent. I think Chol is going to be something special. Nick Johnson too. Josiah needs to take a back seat to Mayes for the moment as he is clearly the more consistent, more reliable PG.

I pray this comes together sooner rather than later.

 

[Russ Smith]

One thing is for sure - Solo and Fogg better step it up and fast. And my bet is Kyryl and Turner might not be in the starting lineup much longer.

Turner didn't start that game, was benched for being late to shootaround.

Chad Ford doesn't seem too enamored with him.

"3. Josiah Turner, PG, Fr., Arizona
Top 100 Ranking: 26

Turner has as much potential as anyone in the Pac-12. The problem is ... he knows it. Turner reminds me a lot of KU's Josh Selby last season. He's an incredible talent, an elite athlete and can get to the rim at will. But his low basketball IQ and penchant for rubbing his teammates the wrong way could derail him.

As a pure basketball talent, he should be ranked 10 to 15 spots higher -- but the head and the heart matter, too, and scouts have serious questions about both."

It's early and UA is playing more halfcourt now than they want to and that's lessening Josiah's impact since he's much better in the open court. But he's gotta improve his shot, cut his turnovers and start playing real defense instead of just jumping the passing lanes for steals all game.

UA is better with mayes right now but Turner should be the better player eventually so if you're Miller you probably continue to play Turner until he either figures it out, or it's clear Mayes is the guy. My guess is Turner eventually figures it out.

 

[TJ]

Turner showing up 20 minutes late to shoot around in his 2nd game as a collegiate athlete isn't a sign of maturity. Might take a season for him to figure it out.

Mayes should be the starter and get the majority of minutes. While not as talented as Josiah, Mayes' head is on straighter.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I guess they're going to go after that Italian PG up at Findlay so Turner better figure it out here pretty quick.

 

[Lefty]

Turner didn't start that game, was benched for being late to shootaround.

Chad Ford doesn't seem too enamored with him.

"3. Josiah Turner, PG, Fr., Arizona
Top 100 Ranking: 26

Turner has as much potential as anyone in the Pac-12. The problem is ... he knows it. Turner reminds me a lot of KU's Josh Selby last season. He's an incredible talent, an elite athlete and can get to the rim at will. But his low basketball IQ and penchant for rubbing his teammates the wrong way could derail him.

As a pure basketball talent, he should be ranked 10 to 15 spots higher -- but the head and the heart matter, too, and scouts have serious questions about both."

It's early and UA is playing more halfcourt now than they want to and that's lessening Josiah's impact since he's much better in the open court. But he's gotta improve his shot, cut his turnovers and start playing real defense instead of just jumping the passing lanes for steals all game.

UA is better with mayes right now but Turner should be the better player eventually so if you're Miller you probably continue to play Turner until he either figures it out, or it's clear Mayes is the guy. My guess is Turner eventually figures it out.

Instead of worrying about the UofA you should worry about your UCLA team. They looked pretty bad in their 11-point loss to LMU. I read how Josh Smith was in better shape this year but after watching last night, those stories were false. The Bruins should expect to see a lot of zone defenses this year until they can hit the outside shots consistently.. I wonder if this could be Howland's last year?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I love the annual "Josh Smith is in the best shape of his life" commentary from UCLA fan. Dropping down to 330 from 340 means you can't use the word "best" when talking about someone's fitness level. The better way to put it would be slightly less terrible shape.

 

[Russ Smith]

Instead of worrying about the UofA you should worry about your UCLA team. They looked pretty bad in their 11-point loss to LMU. I read how Josh Smith was in better shape this year but after watching last night, those stories were false. The Bruins should expect to see a lot of zone defenses this year until they can hit the outside shots consistently.. I wonder if this could be Howland's last year?

I legitimately think Josh gained 10 pounds after the exhibition win. he was visibly fatter in the face on Fri than he was on 5 days earlier in the exhibition.

josh isn't the problem though there are issues with UCLA that aren't public yet but if they turn out to be true it will become clear why they lost this game.

Aside of course from the terrible game by Zeke and other obvious issues there's a big chemistry issue that UCLA has right now that will hopefully be resolved for the better soon.

 

[carey]

josh isn't the problem though there are issues with UCLA that aren't public yet but if they turn out to be true it will become clear why they lost this game.

Aside of course from the terrible game by Zeke and other obvious issues there's a big chemistry issue that UCLA has right now that will hopefully be resolved for the better soon.

I don't follow UCLA much, could you go in depth here? What's going on?

 

[Lefty]

I don't follow UCLA much, could you go in depth here? What's going on?

The Wear twins.

 

[Russ Smith]

The Wear twins.

Indirectly yes but what I was talking about is now public, Reeves Nelson is off the team.

I told Mao this in a PM yesterday morning before it was public I knew about it SUnday.

Long story short Nelson has a chip on his shoulder about the Wears because back in HS both UNC and UCLA preferred them to him. So when they show up at UCLA he's not happy. Nelson spends all summer working on his jumpshot because he beleives his NBA chances hinge on being a 3(he's not a 3) and then Howland annoints David Wear the 3. First real game starts with 5 consecutive shots by the twins and you can see Nelson fuming wanting the ball.

He has a lot of personality issues anybody who has seen him play gets that, but this was the last straw. He showed up late for a team meeting and stormed out when confronted and now it's reported he skipped practice Mon and didn't show for a meeting with Howland. They talked by phone he's currently suspended indefinitely.

I think the Wears ruffled some feathers over playing time and shooting alot but really it was Nelson's issue and how he deals with it will be up to him. I hope the kid gets the help he needs but what happened Fri was that Nelson stopped playing for half the game and was sulking and the problem sort of spread to Smith and Zeke was pressing too hard and suddenly you had a divided team playing selfishly.

THey might lose tonight it's a big loss and they have to play right away but in the long run this is best fo rthe team. Nelson will either get help or he won't but the team can't win with that distraction going on.

 

[Lefty]

Indirectly yes but what I was talking about is now public, Reeves Nelson is off the team.

I told Mao this in a PM yesterday morning before it was public I knew about it SUnday.

Long story short Nelson has a chip on his shoulder about the Wears because back in HS both UNC and UCLA preferred them to him. So when they show up at UCLA he's not happy. Nelson spends all summer working on his jumpshot because he beleives his NBA chances hinge on being a 3(he's not a 3) and then Howland annoints David Wear the 3. First real game starts with 5 consecutive shots by the twins and you can see Nelson fuming wanting the ball.

He has a lot of personality issues anybody who has seen him play gets that, but this was the last straw. He showed up late for a team meeting and stormed out when confronted and now it's reported he skipped practice Mon and didn't show for a meeting with Howland. They talked by phone he's currently suspended indefinitely.

I think the Wears ruffled some feathers over playing time and shooting alot but really it was Nelson's issue and how he deals with it will be up to him. I hope the kid gets the help he needs but what happened Fri was that Nelson stopped playing for half the game and was sulking and the problem sort of spread to Smith and Zeke was pressing too hard and suddenly you had a divided team playing selfishly.

THey might lose tonight it's a big loss and they have to play right away but in the long run this is best fo rthe team. Nelson will either get help or he won't but the team can't win with that distraction going on.

I can't see how this will end good. This will have a negative affect in recruiting. Coaches will have a field day talking negative about Howland and the program. The team is divided and I can't see it being fixed in the near future. Many of the current players will blame the Wear twins. I can see Howland being fired after this season.

 

[Russ Smith]

I can't see how this will end good. This will have a negative affect in recruiting. Coaches will have a field day talking negative about Howland and the program. The team is divided and I can't see it being fixed in the near future. Many of the current players will blame the Wear twins. I can see Howland being fired after this season.

Of course other teams do that, you don't think coaches are telling kids right now have you seen what Miller said about Sidiki? have you seen how bad Turner looks there and he's now benched?

Coaches will use this against UCLA and they'll use that against UA and in the end sometimes it might work.

nobody wanted this to happen with Nelson it looks bad, but it's for the best he either makes the changes he needs to make and comes back, or he doesn't. But the team is better off right now without the distraction although it will take more than one day for them to get past it IMHO.

I hope they win tonight but MTSU is better than Loyola(they just beat them) so it's not going to be easy. I'm glad they play though something to keep the focus off this issue for a couple of hours.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Howland is in trouble there, he'll still be able to recruit because it's UCLA but kids as a whole aren't buying what he's selling these days.

 

[Lefty]

You can't compare Miller with Howland. Turner and Johnson are freshmen, Nelson isn't. Miller is building a powerhouse and the players like him, Howland is on the hotseat and he has disension among his players. Even if Nelson leaves, that won't fix the problem in the locker room. Recruits will not care what coaches say about Miller, I can't say the same about Howland. I say things get ugly in Bruinland. This should be a good UCLA team but it looks like the players could be making it a season not to remember.

 

[Lefty]

If I was Howland I would ban any kind of social media. The season is just beginning and he has to put his foot down. He can't let the players act like they are. Suspending Nelson was the right move. He needs to have a team meeting if not already and get everyone on the same page. They are too talented to let the season go down the drain so early.

 

[Russ Smith]

You can't compare Miller with Howland. Turner and Johnson are freshmen, Nelson isn't. Miller is building a powerhouse and the players like him, Howland is on the hotseat and he has disension among his players. Even if Nelson leaves, that won't fix the problem in the locker room. Recruits will not care what coaches say about Miller, I can't say the same about Howland. I say things get ugly in Bruinland. This should be a good UCLA team but it looks like the players could be making it a season not to remember.

All I can say is you don't know as much about the locker room as I do. The main problem this year, has been Nelson. There was a camp this summer where Nelson was asked to leave because he was acting like a fool and the coaches didn't want him around the campers(using bad language etc).

There was a fight with a teammate he started that resulted in the teammate nearly quitting the team.

And then the current issue.

It's not dissension if the problems are all related to one kid. He's either going to stop acting up, or he'll be gone.

It likely should have happened when he was a freshman but if you recall Howland already had Gordon, Bobo, Anderson and Dragovic all with issues on the team at the time, so he probably let Nelson slide. I prefer the way Miller is handling his issues but you also have to remember he's only got 2 kids to deal with that appear to have issues.

Going forward UCLA still has Smith's weight, Lane's health and integrating the Wears but the kids all like each other and Nelson is either going to come back and be a model citizen, or he won't be back.

UCLA's issue is going to be guard play, not dissension, this incident will eventually fix their chemistry problems although it won't happen overnight.

I guess the big concern would be what do the recruits think and I can't answer that.

 

[Russ Smith]

Howland is in trouble there, he'll still be able to recruit because it's UCLA but kids as a whole aren't buying what he's selling these days.

Well that's easy to say now with the Nelson thing still in the news but he's got Adams(first kid from Oak Hill ever to UCLA) and he's got Kyle Anderson and he's still very much in play for Shabazz and Tony Parker. There's actually still a slight chance they get Goodwin, there's a reason he hasn't signed his LOI with Memphis yet his mom wants him to go to UCLA. He's not 18 so she has to sign it, and she won't sign it, wants him to think it over. My guess is he goes to Memphis but UCLA is somewhere between a 2 run homer and a grandslam right now.

now if this stuff were to put off the recruits then it could all snowball and fall apart but right now UCLA is recruiting better than they have in years.

It looks bad now but it'll blow over, hopefully the team pulls together and plays well that's where they will miss him, as a player.

I think Miller is handling Turner correctly. I'm not overly familiar with Sidiki.

 

[Lefty]

All I can say is you don't know as much about the locker room as I do. The main problem this year, has been Nelson. There was a camp this summer where Nelson was asked to leave because he was acting like a fool and the coaches didn't want him around the campers(using bad language etc).

There was a fight with a teammate he started that resulted in the teammate nearly quitting the team.

And then the current issue.

It's not dissension if the problems are all related to one kid. He's either going to stop acting up, or he'll be gone.

It likely should have happened when he was a freshman but if you recall Howland already had Gordon, Bobo, Anderson and Dragovic all with issues on the team at the time, so he probably let Nelson slide. I prefer the way Miller is handling his issues but you also have to remember he's only got 2 kids to deal with that appear to have issues.

Going forward UCLA still has Smith's weight, Lane's health and integrating the Wears but the kids all like each other and Nelson is either going to come back and be a model citizen, or he won't be back.

UCLA's issue is going to be guard play, not dissension, this incident will eventually fix their chemistry problems although it won't happen overnight.

I guess the big concern would be what do the recruits think and I can't answer that.

Then you have to put some blame on Howland because he recruited the players. UCLA has had quite a few players transfer under Howland and I'm sure if anymore players leave, that won't go well with potential recruits.

 

[Russ Smith]

Then you have to put some blame on Howland because he recruited the players. UCLA has had quite a few players transfer under Howland and I'm sure if anymore players leave, that won't go well with potential recruits.

i do place blame on him, that's why they have changed the assistant staff so much. Matthews and McCray weren't involved with any of the current or past players who had issues during their recruitment.

The kids on the current team who matthews recruited were Parker and Powell. McCray none on the current team.

After the 3 final 4's Howland was able to get some kids that were rated a bit higher and he did a very poor job of evaluating.

08 was Jrue, Lee, Anderson, Gordon and Morgan only 1 left and he's been in trouble.

09 was Honeycutt, Nelson, Lane, Moser and Stover(who redshirted). Currently only 2 kids off that group on the team and who've never been a problem.

So in those 2 classes you had 3 kids total who weren't problems for Ben, Lee, Lane and Stover. That's absolutely terrible evaluation.