Clerks II

[abomb]

Dont worry, I have enough Kevin Smith love for me AND D-Dogg. That being said, I am pretty skeptical of this flick. I would still see SOaP that weekend if I could only see one.

A-Bomb

 

[PDXChris]

you're a jason lee fan?

 

[jenna2891]

i guess i would have thought you'd have given some indication of that before now...

 

[PDXChris]

i guess i would have thought you'd have given some indication of that before now...

I have been slacking im my promoting of anything Jason Lee related with the exception for my pic, quotes and username, but I have not talked about much of anything here lately.

 

[Stout]

Good writer, not a very good director.

Oh? How so?

 

[jenna2891]

I have been slacking im my promoting of anything Jason Lee related with the exception for my pic, quotes and username, but I have not talked about much of anything here lately.

don't worry too much about it, i was just kidding.

 

[NEZCardsfan]

don't worry too much about it, i was just kidding.

is this thing on??

 

[Chaplin]

Oh? How so?

This has already been discussed ad nauseum... Actually, I believe we both were part of that original discussion.

Kevin Smith is a great writer but he can't direct actors. Of course, that's my opinion, but his track record hasn't been too good for a while.

 

[Stout]

This has already been discussed ad nauseum... Actually, I believe we both were part of that original discussion.

Kevin Smith is a great writer but he can't direct actors. Of course, that's my opinion, but his track record hasn't been too good for a while.

Did we? I really don't recall. I have to disagree, though. We can agree he's a masterful actor, but he's also nearly the only one that can get Affleck to actually act. He took a lot of flak for it, but Jersey Girl was also well done. I certainly defy anybody to knock Chasing Amy for its directing. Jay and Silent Bob, fire away...I liked it, but admittedly it was a 'here you go, fan boys' movie. Dogma...I liked it, but it was certainly not spectacular directing, though not bad either. Mallrats was a sellout movie, but still funny as all get out. I know you're not going to knock him for the directing in Clerks, right?

I'm interested...why don't you like his directing?

 

[PDXChris]

don't worry too much about it, i was just kidding.

I figured, but I can be alittle overpertective of my obsession, err I mean appreciation of Jason Lee

 

[Chaplin]

Did we? I really don't recall. I have to disagree, though. We can agree he's a masterful actor, but he's also nearly the only one that can get Affleck to actually act. He took a lot of flak for it, but Jersey Girl was also well done. I certainly defy anybody to knock Chasing Amy for its directing. Jay and Silent Bob, fire away...I liked it, but admittedly it was a 'here you go, fan boys' movie. Dogma...I liked it, but it was certainly not spectacular directing, though not bad either. Mallrats was a sellout movie, but still funny as all get out. I know you're not going to knock him for the directing in Clerks, right?

I'm interested...why don't you like his directing?

I'm hoping you meant we agree he's a great writer, because he most certainly is NOT a good actor. In fact, he's a better director than actor.

I think Chasing Amy was his best movie and I enjoyed Dogma, even though it was shoddy directing. He's not very good at directing a huge cast, especially one full of "stars".

And Clerks didn't need any directing. It was just sit around and talk about stuff...

Just because stuff a guy makes is funny doesn't make him a good director.

 

[Stout]

I'm hoping you meant we agree he's a great writer, because he most certainly is NOT a good actor. In fact, he's a better director than actor.

I think Chasing Amy was his best movie and I enjoyed Dogma, even though it was shoddy directing. He's not very good at directing a huge cast, especially one full of "stars".

And Clerks didn't need any directing. It was just sit around and talk about stuff...

Just because stuff a guy makes is funny doesn't make him a good director.

Okay, well, FIRST OF ALL...yes, I meant writer...d'oh! Not actor, although he is funny. It was late, and I was dog tired.

I'm just looking for specifics, because I only know a little about directing, and you're the movie guy. You keep saying he's not a good director, but not really saying why. You say he's not good at directing a huge cast, especially one of 'stars', yet it seems to me that he's the only one that can get Affleck to actually act.

 

[Chaplin]

I'm just looking for specifics, because I only know a little about directing, and you're the movie guy. You keep saying he's not a good director, but not really saying why. You say he's not good at directing a huge cast, especially one of 'stars', yet it seems to me that he's the only one that can get Affleck to actually act.

Gus van Sant got Ben Affleck to act as well, and I don't think he was all that great in Jersey Girl or even Dogma. So I'm not sure where you get that from. He was pretty decent in Chasing Amy, but again, the script really helps, hence the good performance in Good Will Hunting.

When you have a huge cast, it's difficult to get everyone to do everything you want them too. In Dogma, it was like he just put Matt Damon, Ben Affleck, Chris Rock, Salma Hayek and Linda Fayorintino into a set and said, "Act!" without actually telling them what to do.

He's not very creative with the camera, either, but I hardly blame him for that--most comedies are not creative with the camera. The simple point is that his scripts carry his movies. That's not a bad thing, but I still think he's overrated because everyone pegs him for being this great director, and he is not. Jay and Silent Bob is the ultimate proof of that.

 

[Pariah]

I don't like Kevin Smith.

 

[Stout]

Gus van Sant got Ben Affleck to act as well, and I don't think he was all that great in Jersey Girl or even Dogma. So I'm not sure where you get that from. He was pretty decent in Chasing Amy, but again, the script really helps, hence the good performance in Good Will Hunting.

When you have a huge cast, it's difficult to get everyone to do everything you want them too. In Dogma, it was like he just put Matt Damon, Ben Affleck, Chris Rock, Salma Hayek and Linda Fayorintino into a set and said, "Act!" without actually telling them what to do.

He's not very creative with the camera, either, but I hardly blame him for that--most comedies are not creative with the camera. The simple point is that his scripts carry his movies. That's not a bad thing, but I still think he's overrated because everyone pegs him for being this great director, and he is not. Jay and Silent Bob is the ultimate proof of that.

All fair enough. There's no doubt his scripts are pure genius, and they certainly carry the movies.

 

[jenna2891]

I figured, but I can be alittle overpertective of my obsession, err I mean appreciation of Jason Lee

no worries. i'm the same way with owen wilson!

 

[Chaplin]

All fair enough. There's no doubt his scripts are pure genius, and they certainly carry the movies.

Another thing I thought about is that Affleck's best performances were of relatively simple guys who are most like himself. It's no secret he was pretty similar to his character in Good Will Hunting--nice guy, down on his luck, liked hanging with the guys. Chasing Amy wasn't a stretch either. But ask him to play a blind superhero or a tax attorney or a young bravado on an ocean oil rig, and he doesn't look good at all. So all the credit can't got to Kevin Smith.

 

[Stout]

Another thing I thought about is that Affleck's best performances were of relatively simple guys who are most like himself. It's no secret he was pretty similar to his character in Good Will Hunting--nice guy, down on his luck, liked hanging with the guys. Chasing Amy wasn't a stretch either. But ask him to play a blind superhero or a tax attorney or a young bravado on an ocean oil rig, and he doesn't look good at all. So all the credit can't got to Kevin Smith.

No, of course all the credit can't go to Kevin Smith. I just see that he usually plays his best roles with him. I think he stretched himself to do Jersey Girl, which I thought was a very good film.

 

[D-Dogg]

no worries. i'm the same way with owen wilson!

For God's sake.

This has to stop, Jenna. I also happen to love Owen...he makes me laugh in everything he's in. In fact, in Behind Enemy Lines it took me about thirty minutes to feel ok about not laughing everytime he delivered a line.

 

[abomb]

I agree with the point made, he isnt that good of a director, but his writing is some of the most entertaining stuff out there to me. I think sometimes I laugh harder reading the script to "Clerks" or "Mallrats" than I do when I actually watch the movies.

A-Bomb

 

[Chaplin]

I agree with the point made, he isnt that good of a director, but his writing is some of the most entertaining stuff out there to me. I think sometimes I laugh harder reading the script to "Clerks" or "Mallrats" than I do when I actually watch the movies.

A-Bomb

Tarantino is pretty similar, although is directing expertise has really improved since the debacle that is Jackie Brown. While the Kill Bill movies weren't masterpieces, they were extremely strong pieces of cinema.

 

[Stout]

Tarantino is pretty similar, although is directing expertise has really improved since the debacle that is Jackie Brown. While the Kill Bill movies weren't masterpieces, they were extremely strong pieces of cinema.

Wow, don't you think Pulp Fiction was well directed? I think it was masterfully done.

 

[Chaplin]

Wow, don't you think Pulp Fiction was well directed? I think it was masterfully done.

I'm on record as saying that Pulp Fiction is the most overrated piece of filmmaking of that decade. I loved it when I first saw it, then I kept watching it over and over, and something about it started bothering me--then I found it--it was a stage play. Great script, but unlikable characters and a gimmicky plot (not to mention the sleep-inducing scenes with Travolta and Uma Thurman--until the OD). It's a fine movie, certainly better than a lot of stuff (and much better than Jackie Brown), but horribly overrated.

 

[D-Dogg]

Tarantino is pretty similar, although is directing expertise has really improved since the debacle that is Jackie Brown. While the Kill Bill movies weren't masterpieces, they were extremely strong pieces of cinema.

Kill Bill v. 2 is fantastic. That movie is great, IMO. It's well up there on my list of favorite movies. Vol. 1 is not however...a little too cartoonish for my tastes. V.2 had more of the story and drama to it, and I thought that was very well done.

I disagree on Pulp Fiction (though I do see your point on it being a stage play). It's a movie that I thought was ok on first viewing, and through the years it keeps climbing up my list of favorites. Repeated viewings have been good for me with this movie.

 

[abomb]

I'm on record as saying that Pulp Fiction is the most overrated piece of filmmaking of that decade. I loved it when I first saw it, then I kept watching it over and over, and something about it started bothering me--then I found it--it was a stage play. Great script, but unlikable characters and a gimmicky plot (not to mention the sleep-inducing scenes with Travolta and Uma Thurman--until the OD). It's a fine movie, certainly better than a lot of stuff (and much better than Jackie Brown), but horribly overrated.

I love PF (top 3) and actually more than like Jackie Brown. But I see what you are saying. I often wonder, with respect specifically to Kevin Smith and QT, if we (guys 20-35) like these movies because of the movie or because the quotable lines and scenes that have become entrenched in our vernacular.

A-Bomb