"Defense Wins Championships" is a steaming pile of Cliche

SECTION 11

vibraslap
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The difference in the Holiday Bowl wasn't Suggs' two sacks (the only thing people remember) is was K-State's 224 to 17 rushing yards advantage, and Ell Roberson's four touchdowns.



Don't let Tampa and Baltimore suck you into believing in the latest style.
Play to your stregnths and build your own myth. Make your own trend.
 

40yearfan

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Yeah-----I sure wish we could get Terry Bradshaw to come out of retirement.:D
 
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SECTION 11

SECTION 11

vibraslap
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Why draft our QB of the future, complete with a tutor in place, when we can draft a speed rusher with no speed?

What am I thinking?
 
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SECTION 11

SECTION 11

vibraslap
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Tampa Bay
New England
Baltimore
St. Louis
Denver
Denver
Green Bay
Dallas
San Francisco
Dallas
Dallas
Washington
N.Y. Giants
San Francisco
San Francisco
Washington


I see a trend. A running back, and a quarterback.
 

Cardinals.Ken

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Originally posted by SECTION 11
Tampa Bay
New England
Baltimore
St. Louis
Denver
Denver
Green Bay
Dallas
San Francisco
Dallas
Dallas
Washington
N.Y. Giants
San Francisco
San Francisco
Washington


I see a trend. A running back, and a quarterback.

I see a trend, stingy defenses!

Some research will have to be done Section, as I can assure you that each one of those teams had a top 10 defense during their championship runs...
 
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SECTION 11

SECTION 11

vibraslap
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Originally posted by Cardinals.Ken
I see a trend, stingy defenses!

Some research will have to be done Section, as I can assure you that each one of those teams had a top 10 defense during their championship runs...

They had top 10 everything in the 80's and 90's, but the teams that actually won did it on the shoulders of combos like Elway/Davis, Faulk/Warner, Farve/Levens, Aikman/Smith, Young/Watters, Montana/Craig, Riggins/Theisman
 

kerouac9

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Originally posted by SECTION 11
They had top 10 everything in the 80's and 90's, but the teams that actually won did it on the shoulders of combos like Elway/Davis, Faulk/Warner, Farve/Levens, Aikman/Smith, Young/Watters, Montana/Craig, Riggins/Theisman

Yeah, but you're not advocating for a stingy D and powerful O, you want to forget about the D for the next three years and focus purely on the offense. That's not the way to win Super Bowls. Elway was just a good QB before TD. And their D was good.

Also, it's silly to compare franchises before the advent of the salary cap, because it's comparing apples and orages. Look at the last five years, and you'll see teams with balance and better Ds winning the ring.
 
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SECTION 11

SECTION 11

vibraslap
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Originally posted by kerouac9
Yeah, but you're not advocating for a stingy D and powerful O, you want to forget about the D for the next three years and focus purely on the offense.


Like you, I agree that we have talent on the defense.
Personally, I think we have a lot of it.
As a matter of fact, enough talent where taking the QB and gambling on a 235 pound, 4.35-40 RB with vision and game breaking plays against top competition makes sense.

But to hope to win it all with a scrub QB like Dilfer because your defense is so strong is like betting on double zero.
 

kerouac9

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Originally posted by SECTION 11
But to hope to win it all with a scrub QB like Dilfer because your defense is so strong is like betting on double zero.

Watch out, implying that Blake is a "scrub" will likely get you cracked down upon by the optimism police.

If you think that our D as it stands can limit teams to less than 21 points a game week in and week out to allow our explosive offense-of-three-years-from-now to win games, I have ten examples from last season that suggest otherwise...
 

Shane

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Section 11,

We are boys and all but the bottom line is take off your fantasy cap and move on WE WILL NOT DRAFT LEFTWICH OR MCGAHEE!

Remember where you heard this!

Oh and by the way Defense does win Chamionships :)
 
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SECTION 11

SECTION 11

vibraslap
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Originally posted by Shane H
WE WILL NOT DRAFT LEFTWICH OR MCGAHEE


I don't think we will either.

I'd be perfectly happy with Robertson, to tell you the truth. Hell, we could draft that tub of goo Aaron Golliday with the sixth pick, I'm still wearing my "we will win it all" hat come game time.
 

Krangodnzr

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Originally posted by kerouac9
Watch out, implying that Blake is a "scrub" will likely get you cracked down upon by the optimism police.

If you think that our D as it stands can limit teams to less than 21 points a game week in and week out to allow our explosive offense-of-three-years-from-now to win games, I have ten examples from last season that suggest otherwise...

I agree...though my definition of a scrub QB is more along the lines of Tony Banks, Shane Matthews, and Danny Wuerfell. Blake, while he is no world beater, is better than all three of those combined...
 

Cardinals.Ken

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Originally posted by SECTION 11
But to hope to win it all with a scrub QB like Dilfer because your defense is so strong is like betting on double zero.

Double zero? You mean Jim Ott?
 

JasonKGME

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Section 11 "They had top 10 everything in the 80's and 90's, but the teams that actually won did it on the shoulders of combos like Elway/Davis, Faulk/Warner, Farve/Levens, Aikman/Smith, Young/Watters, Montana/Craig, Riggins/Theisman"

I just looked at the last 10 SB's instead of all the way back here is my thoughts:

Tampa Bay- Defense accounts for 5 sacks, 5 Int a fumble recovery and 21 points. Offense Johnson throws 215 yards and 14 points, rushing 124 yards from main rusher and no score. I give this win primarily to the defense.

New England - Defense accounts for 3 sacks, 2 Int, a fumble recovery and 7 points. Offense Brady throws 145 yards and a score, rushing 92 yards from main rusher no score. I give this win primarily to the defense

Baltimore - Defense accounts for 4 sacks, 4 Int, a fumble recovery and 7 points. Offense Dilfer throws 153 yards and a score, rushing 102 yards and a score from main rusher. I give this win primarily to the defense

St. Louis - Defense accounts for 1 sack, no Int, no fumble recovery and no points. Offense Warner throws 414 yards and 2 scores, rushing only 17 yards and no scores. This was the Warner show, Offense.

Denver - Defense accounts for 3 sacks, 2 Int, no fumble recovery no score. Offense Elway throws 336 yards and a score, rushing 102 yards from main rusher and a score. I actually think Denver had one of the most balanced teams and think this should be neither offense or defense but a great team effort.

Denver - Defense accounts for 1 sack, 1 Int, 1 fumble recovery no score. Offense Elway throws 123 yards no score, rushing 157 yards and 3 scores. This was the Terrell Davis show, give it to the offense

Green Bay - Defense accounts for 5 sacks, 4 Int, no fumbles and 1 score. Offense Favre throws 246 yards and 2 scores, rushing 61 yards from main rusher. Overall Favre had a good game, rushing wasnt really that good, I give slight edge to defense here.

Dallas - Defense accounts for 4 sacks, 3 Int, no fumbles no scores. Aikman throws 209 yards and a score, rushing 49 yards and 2 scores. This is another one to me that was more a team win than anything.

San Francisco - Defense accounts for 2 sacks, 3 Int, no fumble recovery no score. Young throws 325 yards and 6 scores, and is also the main rusher at 49 yards and no scores. This was the Steve Young show, give it Offense.

Dallas - Defense accounts for 3 sacks, 1 Int, 2 fumble recover and 1 score. Aikman throws 207 yards no scores, rushing 132 yards and 2 scores from main rusher. This is either slightly defense or at worse split, I'll give it split.



So what does this give us? 2 things:

#1 Defense accounts for Defense had 4 wins, offense had 3 wins and total team effort accounted for 3 wins. IN the last 5 years however (which is the idea of "trend" you take the most recent trend not an "overall" picture, the trend is 3 defense, 1 offense and 1 team, saying trend is defense overall and on the recent trend.

#2 your statement that the offense on the shoulders of a QB/RB tandem doesnt hold water at all. Look at the 3 offensive wins, you had #'s that were so lopsided twords either a fabulous QB stats (Warner with 414 yards and 2 Td's vs Faulk with 17 yards and no TD's) (Steve Young with 325 yards and 6 Td's vs Watters with less rushing yards then Young allthough he did do a good job recieving wise w/2 of Youngs TD passes) and (Terrell Davis with 153 yards rushing and 3 Td's vs Elway with 123 yards and no scores). This means that offense wins not on the backs of a good QB/RB tandem, but when either a QB or a RB truly steps up their game and takes the whole team on thier shoulders to win the game.
 

Krangodnzr

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Originally posted by JasonKGME


#2 your statement that the offense on the shoulders of a QB/RB tandem doesnt hold water at all. Look at the 3 offensive wins, you had #'s that were so lopsided twords either a fabulous QB stats (Warner with 414 yards and 2 Td's vs Faulk with 17 yards and no TD's) (Steve Young with 325 yards and 6 Td's vs Watters with less rushing yards then Young allthough he did do a good job recieving wise w/2 of Youngs TD passes) and (Terrell Davis with 153 yards rushing and 3 Td's vs Elway with 123 yards and no scores). This means that offense wins not on the backs of a good QB/RB tandem, but when either a QB or a RB truly steps up their game and takes the whole team on thier shoulders to win the game.

I think that it doesn't necessarily mean that the RB as well as the QB, I think he means that you have to have both to make it to the big game more often than not.

And that clearly is the case.
 

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To quote Sir Charles, who once said about basketball "This game isn't really that hard"....or words to that effect.

Same, same here. Football is still a TEAM game. No 1 or 2 players are ever going to make a consistant winning team.
The Bears didn't go anywhere until Walter Payton got a lot more talent around him.....and that's just one tiny example.
 

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man 11, im going to have to disagree with you on this one...


if you had to coach a superbowl, and you were given the choice between a great offense and a weak defense, or a great defense and a weak offense, which would you choose?

I pick the defense every time. Why? not only do they keep the other team out of the endzone, but they either score points them selves, or set up your offense with field position.

a great defense actually provides offense

but does a great offense provide defense?
 
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