Did Graves blow it again?? - Declined TJ for Norman Hand?

[BACH]

http://eastvalleytribune.com/index.php?sty=3828

I think Norman Hand would have helped the team, but at the same time I think his price is too high. He has base salaries of $3.9 million for 2003 and $4.5 million for 2004, which clearly is too much at this point in his career, but with all the room we have, why not?

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Yes

He definitely blew it here.

 

[Ed B]

Oh god.

Can this debacle get any worse?

 

[Chris_Sanders]

If we had picked up Norman Hand

I would have no real problem with our draft.

 

[pinnacle]

I read this in the paper and had to comment...this is nuts. I understand not wanting rodgers..given the linebackers we have now have he probably would not have made the roster...but norman hand would have played in a rotation with bell, tanner and bryant.. I am sure it was because of his contract ($4 mil +/- for 2 seasons)...but we will struggle to spend the cap this season..and if we cut the guy in year 2 it would not have killed our cap. If we were going to take sullivan at #6 - then they know we need dtackles...why not add hand for a season or two?? Did graves try to be cute again and think we could get him for $1 mil after the saints cut him? 310 lbs..he has to be an upgrade over some of our tackles..what pride is there in cutting thomas jones and getting nothing (graves seems to imply in the az republic he would rather cut jones as opposed to getting a marginal player or a late round pick)..rod is losing me on this one.

 

[pinnacle]

and where is seattle coming up with cap space? Seems holgrem is doing everything possible to win this season...appears mac is not being given the same consideration..heck..it seems normans contract is like a dream contract for the cardinals..no upfront $$, you can cut him and the escalation is reasonable..and only for 2 years!

This one is pissing me off more than some of our draft moves..the draft moves were well intentioned but backfired..no excuse for not trading thomas jones for norman hand..unless we get someone better (unlikely) at a need position in a trade for jones..

 

[ChiCard]

Makes my post about this draft more relevant. What are they doing?

 

[Ed B]

I really can't believe this. Not like we're hurting for cap room.

 

[Russ Smith]

Re: Yes

Originally posted by Chris_Sanders
He definitely blew it here.

I can't get the article to load I'm assuming we rejected a deal for Hand? Doesn't make much sense since we're apparently trying to unload TJ for anything we can.

 

[Dback Jon]

According to CNN, we turned down the offer to swap our sixth round pick for Hand - dumb move, IMHO.


We also turned down offers for TJ for 7th round picks.

 

[BW52]

Norman Hand 6`3 310 ? Age 30 DT
Tackles 30 assists 9 sacks 2.5
Supposed to be a decent run stuffer with a questionable work ethic and attitude. Would he be worth 3.9 mill this year.Not in my book.No big loss.

 

[Shane]

Re: Re: Yes

Originally posted by Russ Smith
I can't get the article to load I'm assuming we rejected a deal for Hand? Doesn't make much sense since we're apparently trying to unload TJ for anything we can.

Well we apparently arent trying to unload him for anything we can.

 

[Northern Card]

8.4 million over two years for a guy who doesn't play every down.... Yeah!!! Graves was a real idiot for not taking that deal.

P.S. - why do you think NO wanted to dump him?

 

[pinnacle]

I heard on the radio the saints would have taken tj or a 6th rounder for hand...their is a quote from graves saying effectively that they would rather cut tj than get a very late round pick for him..logic? Northern card: I am tired of getting pushed around in the middle of the dline..hand may have helped on this..we will not spend close to the cap at this rate anyway..he is 31 - good for another year or two...probably would have been a 1 year deal anyway with a cut before year 2.

 

[BACH]

Originally posted by Northern Card
8.4 million over two years for a guy who doesn't play every down.... Yeah!!! Graves was a real idiot for not taking that deal.

P.S. - why do you think NO wanted to dump him?

I agree, that it's too much for Hand, but do you other suggestions how we're going to spend the remaining cap space?

 

[Northern Card]

Originally posted by BACH
I agree, that it's too much for Hand, but do you other suggestions how we're going to spend the remaining cap space?

No idea at this point, other than seeing what occurs after June 1.

A gagging lack of knowledge I share with most on this board.

 

[RedStorm]

"To be honest with you, I'd rather see us cut him before we do that," said Rod Graves, the team's vice president for football operations. "I wouldn't feel good about (trading) a guy I believe can still play in this league and giving him up for a seventh-round pick."

This a Graves quote from AZCentral article this morning.

I don't get it. I know it is early this morning and I am still reeling from this draft but I wonder, what do we get if we cut him? Does this statement make sense? Does it sound like he knows what he is doing?

 

[Northern Card]

Originally posted by pinnacle
I

I am tired of getting pushed around in the middle of the dline..hand may have helped on this..

So am I, but wouldn't pay $8.4 over two years on a "may" have helped on this.

By the way, before Tanner hurt his ankle last year we were not getting pushed around on the inside. The weak spot was when our LDE (Wakefield) pinched inside, lost contain - and poor Thompson had to take things on all by his lonesome...

 

[Tangodnzr]

Wow, 4 mill a year for a guy that has questionable work ethic,
could be a bad influence attitude wise, plus what kind of message would that send to the rest of the team, paying a player like that...that kind of money.

And people are ragging on that as ignorant or stuped??????

Amazing, simply amazing!

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr
Wow, 4 mill a year for a guy that has questionable work ethic,
could be a bad influence attitude wise, plus what kind of message would that send to the rest of the team, paying a player like that...that kind of money.

And people are ragging on that as ignorant or stuped??????

Amazing, simply amazing!

I must say that I actually agree with Tango!

 

[RedStorm]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr
Wow, 4 mill a year for a guy that has questionable work ethic,
could be a bad influence attitude wise, plus what kind of message would that send to the rest of the team, paying a player like that...that kind of money.

And people are ragging on that as ignorant or stuped??????

Amazing, simply amazing!

Tango,

I can not begin to know if Hand would be good or not. But, Graves quote from AZCentral I posted above leaves me wondering his logic. What do we get if we cut TJ? Does it seem to make any sense to you?

 

[ajcardfan]

Since all of his contract here would be salary, he could be cut after this season for no cap hit . The deal should've been done, IMO. Hmmmm....Hand or Davis? Sheeesh!

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Originally posted by BW52
Norman Hand 6`3 310 ? Age 30 DT
Tackles 30 assists 9 sacks 2.5
Supposed to be a decent run stuffer with a questionable work ethic and attitude. Would he be worth 3.9 mill this year.Not in my book.No big loss.

BINGO!

4 million for 30 tackles?

are you kidding me?

everybody needs to take it down a couple of notches. Ok?

 

[Krangodnzr]

Hand sucks.

Anyone who will tell you otherwise is full of it. Look at how bad the Saints were last year against the run. Hand and Grady Jackson, both are around 330, but both have a tendency to balloon to around 400.

If he is soooo good why do you think they only wanted a 6th rounder or TJ for him? The Saints were trying to rape us more, since Graves already proved to them that he is an idiot.

 

[RedStorm]

The Saints were trying to rape us more, since Graves already proved to them that he is an idiot.

You probably are correct. NO trying to go back to the well once too often. Give them an A for trying...LOL