Draftcity.com rumor

[elindholm]

Ugh, make that "their" chemistry, not "they're."

I think they'd consider trading O'Neal if they could, but who's going to take him?

 

[Evil Ash]

What part of "I could be wrong" don't you understand?

All of it

 

[devilalum]

You could say the same things for Grant Hill, Tracy McGrady and Shaquille O'Neal though couldn't you - it all depends on the situation I think and I know you disagree with me - but this isn't just a one season thing like the rumors as far as Kidd and Webber went - this has been going on for four years now - I think that sets this situation apart from all others.

The one thing that makes me wonder if Kobe will ever leave LA is his apparent love for the LA lifestyle. Everytime I look he's at some world premier or red carpet event with his wife. The guy seems to relish the limelight.

There ain't much limelight in Phoenix.

Of course LA is only an hours flight by Leer Jet?

 

[devilalum]

Ugh, make that "their" chemistry, not "they're."

I think they'd consider trading O'Neal if they could, but who's going to take him?

And would he be willing to except a deal to a team that he didn't like. He could just threaten to retire.

I still think the Suns could send Marion the #7 another #1 and Vujanic for him, I don't know. Its my fantasy but I think it benefits both sides.

The Suns are the only team that has cap room and a descent group of talented players. (maybe Denver but they don't have a player as good as Amare, Melos a baby) Shaq might be talked into coming here. The Lakers aren't going to get even talent for Shaq and even if they could find a team to send them 2 All Stars would that team still be championship caliber once the trade was complete?

A team that trades for Shaq has to be thinking win in the next 3 years. I heard some people suggest Dallas but the Lakers would have to take $30 mil back in salaries. Dirk, Finley and ? Would the Mavs be better after this trade? Would they have a shot in the next 3 years?

 

[JS22]

1. Stay in LA - not gonna happen unless they trade Shaq - plain and simple - e - I'm pretty sure you don't live in Los Angeles so you aren't brow beaten to death with everything Laker - I am - and I and evreyone else in this city knows those two guys ain't never playing together again.

Assume whatever you like. I've stated many times on this board where I live.

I'm not saying that Bryant will absolutely not come to the Suns. I just think it's unlikely. The media love to stir up conflict -- especially in Tinseltown. It's the same as when Kidd was threatening to leave New Jersey, or Webber Sacramento. There's a whole lot of hand-wringing, and the rumor mill works overtime -- but usually, stars stay where they are.

Will Bryant's case be different? Possibly, but don't bet on it.

Did you see the post game press conference after game 7?

Reporter: Kobe, simple question. Will you sign an extension?
Bryant: *pause* "...NOPE"

He will either be in prison, or in a suns uniform come next season. How do I feel about that? I'm not sure. But it IS better than getting rid of our entire team for Tmac.

 

[Joe Mama]

Did you see the post game press conference after game 7?

Reporter: Kobe, simple question. Will you sign an extension?
Bryant: *pause* "...NOPE"

He will either be in prison, or in a suns uniform come next season. How do I feel about that? I'm not sure. But it IS better than getting rid of our entire team for Tmac.

of course he isn't going to sign an extension. He's going to opt out of his contract. That doesn't mean he's going to leave the Lakers though. He would re-sign as a free agent with Bird rights. In that press conference he also said that he was not opposed to playing with Shaquille O'Neal and Phil Jackson again.

I think that in the end the Lakers will do whatever they have to do to keep Kobe Bryant around.

Joe Mama

 

[JS22]

And would he be willing to except a deal to a team that he didn't like. He could just threaten to retire.

I still think the Suns could send Marion the #7 another #1 and Vujanic for him, I don't know. Its my fantasy but I think it benefits both sides.

The Suns are the only team that has cap room and a descent group of talented players. (maybe Denver but they don't have a player as good as Amare, Melos a baby) Shaq might be talked into coming here. The Lakers aren't going to get even talent for Shaq and even if they could find a team to send them 2 All Stars would that team still be championship caliber once the trade was complete?

A team that trades for Shaq has to be thinking win in the next 3 years. I heard some people suggest Dallas but the Lakers would have to take $30 mil back in salaries. Dirk, Finley and ? Would the Mavs be better after this trade? Would they have a shot in the next 3 years?

Barbosa
Johnson
Marion
Amare
O'neal

What God would I have to please to make that happen? Can you guys imagine O'neal and Amare in the same front-court?

 

[hcsilla]

They have the MLE to use, plus the possibility of bringing Malone back if he's healthy enough for one final shot.

Not plus. Either or.

 

[elindholm]

Not plus. Either or.

Depending on how much Malone demands, right. I forgot that they don't have Bird rights for him. Maybe they could split the MLE with Malone and other player, but you're right, it's not as good as I said.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Not plus. Either or.

Malone could just resign a vet Min like he did this year right?

 

[Joe Mama]

If you read further down the article it says that Harris has been relatively unimpressive in his workouts. They say that in a workout against the other top point our prospects (Gordon, Nelson, and Livingston) Harris was the worst of them. They have him slipping quite far down in their mock draft today. I'm still not sold on Livingston, but it sounds like all of the draft web sites and anonymous general managers sure are.

Well, you the Suns stay at #7 they are going to get a shot at one of the following players.

Andre Iguodala
Luol Deng (this sounds unlikely)
Josh Childress
Ben Gordon (my favorite choice for a point guard)
Livingston


Joe Mama

 

[elindholm]

Well, you the Suns stay at #7 they are going to get a shot at one of the following players.

Andre Iguodala
Luol Deng (this sounds unlikely)
Josh Childress
Ben Gordon (my favorite choice for a point guard)
Livingston

At this point, I'll be extremely surprised if Iguodala is still on the board. His stock seems to be soaring. Of the players on that list, I think Childress is the only one likely to be available at #7.

Biedrins appears to be dropping and I think he'll be there too. George O'Brien may get his wish after all.

The top six picks at this point (if the consensus of mock drafts is to be believed) are Okafor, Howard, Deng, Livingston, Iguodala, and Gordon, in no particular order.

 

[George O'Brien]

Well, you the Suns stay at #7 they are going to get a shot at one of the following players.

Andre Iguodala
Luol Deng (this sounds unlikely)
Josh Childress
Ben Gordon (my favorite choice for a point guard)
Livingston

At this point, I'll be extremely surprised if Iguodala is still on the board. His stock seems to be soaring. Of the players on that list, I think Childress is the only one likely to be available at #7.

Biedrins appears to be dropping and I think he'll be there too. George O'Brien may get his wish after all.

The top six picks at this point (if the consensus of mock drafts is to be believed) are Okafor, Howard, Deng, Livingston, Iguodala, and Gordon, in no particular order.

At this point I have to assume that either the Suns aren't interested in Biedrins or they are doing a "stealth" bit to keep other people from knowing their interest. I am beginning to think it is is former since they seem focused on getting immediate help.

A couple of weeks ago I said that Childress would be the "wildcard". I remain convinced that is case. I am not wildly excited about him, but at least he would not be a complete project.

 

[F-Dog]

Well, you the Suns stay at #7 they are going to get a shot at one of the following players.

Andre Iguodala
Luol Deng (this sounds unlikely)
Josh Childress
Ben Gordon (my favorite choice for a point guard)
Livingston

At this point, I'll be extremely surprised if Iguodala is still on the board. His stock seems to be soaring. Of the players on that list, I think Childress is the only one likely to be available at #7.

Biedrins appears to be dropping and I think he'll be there too. George O'Brien may get his wish after all.

The top six picks at this point (if the consensus of mock drafts is to be believed) are Okafor, Howard, Deng, Livingston, Iguodala, and Gordon, in no particular order.

Don't forget Josh Smith, either. I would slide him in there instead of Childress.

The worst scenario for me is if what's left for the Suns at #7 is Gordon, Harris, Childress, Biedrins and Podkolzine. I'm hoping that at least one of the HS kids (Josh Smith or Livingston) falls, and if they both fall, then the Suns are sitting pretty.

Right now, it looks like Livingston won't fall, though.

 

[elindholm]

I'd be satisfied with Gordon. Maybe he'd develop into a PG and maybe he wouldn't, but it's worth a shot. The Suns could always go back to their plan of using Joe Johnson as the lead guard.

I find the reports of Josh Smith's attitude problems to be pretty scary, and my guess is that the Suns will too. Childress is boring and I think the Suns will trade the pick if he's the best option left.

 

[George O'Brien]

Don't forget Josh Smith, either. I would slide him in there instead of Childress.

The worst scenario for me is if what's left for the Suns at #7 is Gordon, Harris, Childress, Biedrins and Podkolzine. I'm hoping that at least one of the HS kids (Josh Smith or Livingston) falls, and if they both fall, then the Suns are sitting pretty.

Right now, it looks like Livingston won't fall, though.

There are rumors that the Clips MIGHT take Livingston with the second pick. I think this is just smoke, but he must be pretty impressive at workouts.

I cannot see the Suns taking Josh Smith. They sounded less than enthusiastic after his workout and none of the teams that have worked him seem excited about this guy. Most mock drafts have him in the lottery, but I think he will fall further than most expect.

 

[elindholm]

Josh Smith could be this year's Qyntel Woods. Woods was in the top five of many mock drafts two years ago, and we all saw what happened to him. Smith doesn't have (known) drug problems, but a questionable attitude is just as alarming.

 

[F-Dog]

I'd be satisfied with Gordon. Maybe he'd develop into a PG and maybe he wouldn't, but it's worth a shot. The Suns could always go back to their plan of using Joe Johnson as the lead guard.

I find the reports of Josh Smith's attitude problems to be pretty scary, and my guess is that the Suns will too. Childress is boring and I think the Suns will trade the pick if he's the best option left.

The Suns were very high on Josh Smith after his workout, though. All of those negative reports are coming from other teams.

Smith is the first player that gives off the same vibe that Amare did, and like Amare, he's projected to fall into the late lottery. My feeling (that the Suns are targeting him) is stronger than ever at the moment.


I'm not thrilled with the idea of adding Ben Gordon. In college, he reminded me of Baron Davis, who's a very good player but not somebody I would want running my favorite team.

There's a good chance Gordon will be gone by the Suns' pick, of course.

 

[George O'Brien]

Josh Smith could be this year's Qyntel Woods. Woods was in the top five of many mock drafts two years ago, and we all saw what happened to him. Smith doesn't have (known) drug problems, but a questionable attitude is just as alarming.

The rush to college players is driven in part by the total lack of fundimentals by most HS players. It is not a coincidence that the top college players all played for elite coaches who do a good job at teaching basketball skills. Smith is a physical talent, but just too raw to be much help for a while.

 

[F-Dog]

Since George and I disagree on the Suns' report, here it is in raw form:

Question: What are your impressions of the guys that worked out?

Mike D’Antoni: (Josh Smith has) got a lot of upside, a lot of talent. He’s going to be a very good player. (Anderson) Varejao, I’ve seen him play at Barcelona three years ago. We played against him and I thought he was a good player and a good prospect, but in three years he’s really improved, most his shot. He put on an impressive demonstration on his shot. He’s a big guy at 6-11, he’s strong. He’s getting a lot better. That’s surprising, it’s great.

The other kid, (Sasha) Vujacic, I’ve seen for a while. When I was coaching at Benetton, he was at Udine, which is right up the road. He was in Chicago last year and had a great pre-draft camp workout, and impressed a lot of people. He has improved some; 6-5 ½, 6-6 point guard, he should be pretty good.

These are three nice prospects. Somebody’s going to be pretty happy to get (any) one of them.

Question: There has been some questions about Smith’s desire and effort. Did you see any of that in his workout?

D’Antoni: That’s what the say about high school kids, but when you’re so talented and it comes so easy, he’s never been pushed and that’s something that you need to be careful about saying, just because I haven’t ever seen a high school kid have a lot of effort. If you’re a straight A student, then you don’t need to study and I don’t see him studying. He’s an unbelievable player and he hasn’t been pushed. Looks like today he’s pushed a little bit and he’s responded well. Again, he’s going to be impressive.

Question: How tough is it to evaluate kids coming out of high school?

D’Antoni: You have to be lucky. You don’t know how high he can get. His potential, his upside, is enormous, but you really don’t know what they have in their heart of in their head and who’s talking to them on the outside. We were really fortunate with Amaré (Stoudemire), who was like a sponge and keeps working, and keeps getting better. You hope the same thing when you draft a high school kid. You also could miss out. That’s something that you can’t judge. You try to make the best judgment you can. We know that he has a lot of potential. I don’t know where we’re going yet on the draft, but he’ll be a great prospect.

Question: How valuable is it to get some one-on-one time with these prospects?

D’Antoni: A lot. You get a feel. You have lunch with them, the night before you have dinner. You get a feel for them. It’s not like all of a sudden you’re an expert on their personalities. You just try to get a feel and then you put the talent with it, and then try to make an educated guess.

Question: With the youth on the Suns already, are you hesitant to draft a young player that will need a lot of seasoning?

D’Antoni: We’re going to try to get the best player. If he’s young, he’s young. That’s just something that you can’t say, “Okay, let’s try to get a mediocre player because he’s older.” It would be nice if they were old and great, but old and great guys have contracts already. We’ll have to get a young, and hopefully, very good player.

Question: Why did Sebastian Telfair not work out for the team as planned?

D’Antoni: He has a pulled groin. He’s hurt. He wanted to go. He really felt bad about it. He wanted to go and he can’t go right now.

Question: Have you ever seen him play before?

D’Antoni: I saw him when he was in ninth grade, does that count? I was at a camp for a week with him and I was impressed as a ninth grader. To be honest, I haven’t seen him since then.

Question: What did you think of Smith’s defensive skills?

D’Antoni: On defense, he shouldn’t be able to play. There’s no reason for him, he’s never had to play it in high school. But he’s so athletic and such a talent, and shoots the ball so well, this guy’s going to be pretty good. We’ll just see his dedication, his heart, depending on how good he’s going to be, but he’s going to be good.

Question: Rumor has it Smith out-leaped the vertical leap machine. What happened?

D’Antoni: He did. It was amazing. They had to lift it up a little bit. His vertical is about 37, 38. I saw a tape of him with two hands above the square (on the backboard) with the ball dunking, so he gets up.

Question: What were your impressions of Smith’s personality and attitude?

D’Antoni: His demeanor is kind of laid back and people start talking about that. You can always pick out things he can’t do, but I know a lot of things he can do and he’s pretty impressive.

 

[elindholm]

Hmmm....

On the whole I'd have to say that's more positive than negative. So now the question is, what kind of poker player is D'Antoni?

 

[George O'Brien]

To me it sounded like "damning with faith praise". His reference to Amare soaking up stuff like a spounge sounded like a criticism of Smith, if only indirect.

Relatively speaking, their reviews of guys like Childress and Jackson were a lot more upbeat with far fewer "on the other hand" type references.

BTW, no one doubts that Smith is a great physical talent. However, I think assuming he will be the next Amare is a mistake. Amare's drive is what separates him from other promising athletes. Nothing I've read convinces me that Smith has that drive to become great. He thinks he already is great.

 

[Joe Mama]

The Suns were very high on Josh Smith after his workout, though. All of those negative reports are coming from other teams.

Smith is the first player that gives off the same vibe that Amare did, and like Amare, he's projected to fall into the late lottery. My feeling (that the Suns are targeting him) is stronger than ever at the moment.


I'm not thrilled with the idea of adding Ben Gordon. In college, he reminded me of Baron Davis, who's a very good player but not somebody I would want running my favorite team.

There's a good chance Gordon will be gone by the Suns' pick, of course.

It wouldn't surprise me if the Phoenix Suns take Josh Smith either. It's possible that only Livingston has more upside in this draft.

I also think that Ben Gordon is very similar to Baron Davis. He might be a better shooter though. I say if the Phoenix Suns contract they gave us like player in the trap at #7 it would be sheer lunacy not to do it.

Joe Mama

 

[pokerface]

If they keep Kobe and Shaq then they will have no chance of winning the title next year.

And they're going to win a title with only one of them?

Well it looks like no title with one or both of them. No title is no title.


They were obviously outmanned in the finals and they have no way to improve their team.

They weren't outmanned, they were outplayed and outcoached. There's a difference.

They were outcoached, outplayed, AND outmanned.



They have the MLE to use, plus the possibility of bringing Malone back if he's healthy enough for one final shot. And if O'Neal and Bryant can put aside their bickering long enough to realize how much they need each other (sounds unlikely, but it has happened before), their chemistry will be a lot better.

Malone is getting older and more broken down. At his age you cant assume anything about his productivity. At any time his stats could plummet.

 

[F-Dog]

It wouldn't surprise me if the Phoenix Suns take Josh Smith either. It's possible that only Livingston has more upside in this draft.

I also think that Ben Gordon is very similar to Baron Davis. He might be a better shooter though. I say if the Phoenix Suns contract they gave us like player in the trap at #7 it would be sheer lunacy not to do it.

Joe Mama

Gordon might be a slightly better shooter, but he's also slightly smaller and less athletic than Davis is.

I don't see anything wrong with passing on a Davis-like player at #7--I'm hoping there's someone even better available, for one thing.