East Valley Tribune: D'Antoni may get contract extension

[George O'Brien]

I know it is easy to compare D'Antoni to the previous head coaches: Ainge, Skiles, and FJ. However, there are a few differences.

1. D'Antoni had previous head coaching experience. He was a successful head coach in Europe and had a brief experience with Denver. Being head coach is a lot different than being an assistant. FJ in particular was not ready.

2. None of the previous three were brought in with the thought of them being a possible replacement. The Suns don't typically hire former head coaches as assistants. That was just one way D'Antoni was unusual.

3. The Colangelos mistake made was not replacing FJ with D'Antoni after Frank completed the 01-02 season. The idea that they could surround FJ with a great assistant coaching staff to make up for his inexperience was a neat idea, but it was fatally flawed. The longer he was coach, the less he listened to his assistants.

4. On D'Antoni and defense, late in the season the Suns did play more "man" defense than earlier. But the Suns had a terrrible size disadvantage and little depth, so it was not possible to play straight up as much as I would have liked. In any case, D'Antoni did not rely on "small ball" very much late in the season which was a huge improvement on defense.

5. It is hard to know how good an offensive coach D'Antoni is considering that he was starting a rookie PG who had not played the position before. Also, he had to install his approach during mid season with a constantly changing cast of players.

None of this means D'Antoni is sure to be successful. But I'm not sure the Suns are going to get better by joining the parade of teams that fired their head coaches over the past year (every team in the East has changed at least once). Unless it is becomes clear that D'Antoni simply can't coach, which was the conclusion drawn about FJ, then I think continuity may be more important than getting a "name" coach who was fired somewhere else.

 

[elindholm]

I just can't agree with some of those points:

2. None of the previous three were brought in with the thought of them being a possible replacement.

This simply isn't realistic. The last Suns head coach not to rise from an assistant position on the same staff was Cotton Fitzsimmons. Everyone knows that the #1 assistant is the "vice-coach" -- the guy next in line for the job when the head coach gets sacked.

Because of the change of ownership, it's possible this pattern will change. But otherwise, we all know that the Suns' next head coach will be Iavaroni or Grgrich.

3.... The idea that they could surround FJ with a great assistant coaching staff to make up for his inexperience was a neat idea, but it was fatally flawed.

I agree, but it's hardly any different with D'Antoni. The European game is nothing like the NBA (as we see from which players are successful where), and D'Antoni's stint in Denver was not only short but disastrous.

4.... In any case, D'Antoni did not rely on "small ball" very much late in the season which was a huge improvement on defense.

You don't consider McDyess at center to be "small ball"?

5. It is hard to know how good an offensive coach D'Antoni is considering that he was starting a rookie PG who had not played the position before. Also, he had to install his approach during mid season with a constantly changing cast of players.

True. But I wonder why coaches can't think a bit more about preparing for opponents, rather than teaching a "system." The Suns often had obvious defensive breakdowns, like leaving known shooters wide open in order to double-team non-threats closer to the basket. Whether doubling the post makes sense depends on the opponent, not the system. If we're all hoping for a "system" to be sufficient to give the Suns the appearance of a well-coached team, I think we're in for a disappointment.

(And yes, I see that your point here was mainly about offense, but I think my observation stands anyway.)

 

[George O'Brien]

I agree, but it's hardly any different with D'Antoni. The European game is nothing like the NBA (as we see from which players are successful where), and D'Antoni's stint in Denver was not only short but disastrous.

It was a learning experience. He had no talent and a GM that wanted his job. However, very few top coaches are great their first time around.

Your point about the differences between Euro ball and the NBA is well taken, although I think the jump from college is probably a lot greater. In any case, the role of the head coach is similar even if the way the game is played is different. Ainge, Skiles, and FJ had never been a head coach at any level.

4.... In any case, D'Antoni did not rely on "small ball" very much late in the season which was a huge improvement on defense.

You don't consider McDyess at center to be "small ball"?

Compared to playing Marion at PF, it was a lot bigger. McDyess is listed at 6'9" 245 and may be heavier than that. It is on the small side for a center, but he is similar in height to many small centers like Brian Grant and is about the same weight as Voskuhl. What was more important was that Dice played like an inside guy rather than like an out of position SF. Marion was almost always totally overmatched on the inside, while Dice was over matched only some of the time.

Since I have been pushing to get a big shot blocker, I can't say I'm satisfied with Dice at center. But using Dice was vastly better than moving Marion inside and generally better than using Voskuhl.

 

[elindholm]

Ah. Yes, I would certainly agree that a lineup with McDyess and Stoudemire as the two bigs is preferable to one with Stoudemire and Marion. On the other hand, that's a bit like saying I'd rather have my finger ripped out of its socket than have my entire hand amputated with no anesthesia.

 

[Joe Mama]

I haven't been happy with all of D'Antoni's coaching moves, but I think it's unfair to be overtly critical when you look at the team he was coaching. He took over the team a third of the way through the season. The Phoenix Suns starting lineup was the youngest in the NBA. They were a small team, and that really didn't have much to do with the coach's desire to play small ball. Lastly, they had the worst bench in the NBA.

Unless they make some spectacular moves I think it may be too much to expect them to make the playoffs next year. I do think they could be a .500team with a few personnel moves and some improvements from the players and coaching.

I also don't see anywhere that he is definitely going to get an extension. I really don't expect that he will.

Joe Mama

 

[Chaplin]

I haven't been happy with all of D'Antoni's coaching moves, but I think it's unfair to be overtly critical when you look at the team he was coaching. He took over the team a third of the way through the season. The Phoenix Suns starting lineup was the youngest in the NBA. They were a small team, and that really didn't have much to do with the coach's desire to play small ball. Lastly, they had the worst bench in the NBA.

Unless they make some spectacular moves I think it may be too much to expect them to make the playoffs next year. I do think they could be a .500team with a few personnel moves and some improvements from the players and coaching.

I also don't see anywhere that he is definitely going to get an extension. I really don't expect that he will.

Joe Mama

Agree and disagree here.

Agree--the D'Antoni stuff. Eric bringing up the Denver stuff is irrelevant. It was team he was thrown into in an organization that didn't care about him (Issel was the coach, not D'Antoni), AND it was the strike-shortened season. As far as I'm concerned, that year is nothing but a tiny blip on D'Antoni's resume.

Disagree--You don't give the team enough credit. Sure, we won't be vying for the top 5 spots in the West next year, but we are damn sure going to be competitive with Portland, Houston, Denver and Utah. It's one thing to have no faith in the team, it's another to have no faith 6 months before the season even begins!!

 

[elindholm]

Eric bringing up the Denver stuff is irrelevant.

Sheesh. It was George O'Brien who brought it up; I was countering that one shouldn't read too much into it.

 

[Joe Mama]

Disagree--You don't give the team enough credit. Sure, we won't be vying for the top 5 spots in the West next year, but we are damn sure going to be competitive with Portland, Houston, Denver and Utah. It's one thing to have no faith in the team, it's another to have no faith 6 months before the season even begins!!

.500 would make them competitive with Portland, Houston, Denver, and Utah. Portland went 41-41 this season, Utah was 42-40. Utah was 3-4 games over .500. You are looking at my prediction like it is a negative thing. I am looking at it as being positive. If they surpass my expectations by a few games they will be competing for one of the final playoff spots. I would say that is pretty optimistic based on what we saw from this team this season.

Joe Mama

 

[George O'Brien]

I think the Suns will get to the 41 to 45 wins range and compete for a playoff position as long as they stay moderately healthy. To get over 50 wins will require FA signings and/or dramtic improvement by some of their young players

To get to the elite level, Amare will have to fullfill his potential to be in the KG/J O'Neal/Duncan class while some of the other players make huge strides. I don't see that happening next season, but I think overall talent is there. If they could just learn to play defense....

 

[Errntknght]

George "5. It is hard to know how good an offensive coach D'Antoni is considering that he was starting a rookie PG who had not played the position before. Also, he had to install his approach during mid season with a constantly changing cast of players."

I didn't expect to see consistent, polished execution but I expected to see glimmerings of good team play and didn't. Here is a partial list of things we might have seen and didn't, in no particular order - none of which require a sophisticated offensive system:

1. Forcing and exploiting mismatches. Our opponents routinely did both so D'A had ample material to learn from. JJ often had a size mismatch without having to force it yet he never posted up.

2. Off-ball screens. Reggie runs his man off more screens in a game than the Suns guards do in a month. I don't think Amare has ever gotten a pass coming off a screen... I'm not sure one has ever been set for him. Marion is very effective curling up from the baseline off a screen or two but that was a rare sight this year. Setting screens is a concept apparently foreign to Shawn.

3. Passing the ball to the roll man off a pick and roll. We didn't do that even against the shoddiest of defenses - and once entrenched as a doormat we saw lots of shoddy defense. (By opponents, I mean!)

4. Our SF occasionally in the vicinity of the basket on offense.

5. Plays, manuevers, sets - whatever you want to call them - in which Amare was expected to pass the ball or where it was even an option.

6. Occasional use of the pinch-post maneuver - D'A should know this because it was the signature maneuver of the motion offense FJ installed. And we had three bigs that could have handled it - Zarko, Amare or Lampe. (It may have been accidental but Outlaw & Marbs ran it a few times the year before this one just past - Bo being an improble guy to plan it around.) [Essentially, it's a high screen where the ball is passed to screen setter before the screen is used.]

7. Dealing effectively against zones. As a successful European coach you'd think this would be a gimme for D'A but he did no better than FJ. He didn't even pick up on it when Zarko demonstrated the attack from the center - and Outlaw also showed the effectiveness of that the prior year.

I guess I might agree with your overall assessment if you meant that it was hard to judge whether D'Antoni was a 1 or a 2 on the scale of 1-10 for NBA coaches.

 

[George O'Brien]

If the Suns had a collection of veterans, I'd say the problem was the coaching. At this point, I'm not sure how much is offensive system and how much is the problem of recognition by inexperienced players.

In any case, the Suns had a lot less trouble with the zone once they started playing Dice at center. If anything the Suns should have exploited the hole at the foul line most zone defenses create. Voskuhl is not enough of threat to pull the center out, but Dice and Lampe are.

I think the Suns offense will look a lot better even if they don't change the system much as JJ and Barbosa learn more about playing the point. Even guys who played point in college often take a few years to learn to play it in the NBA. But without good point play, the offense is going to look pretty ragged although 44.3% shooting is hardly a disaster.

The Suns do need to add better ouside shooting for when opponents drop into a passsive zone. All the coaching in the world is not going to break a zone if everybody has to shoot from 5 feet in.

 

[crdnl85]

What a grievous mistake...but we are so accustomed to the C's today....to resign him before this current year actually gets underway. I want a REAL SEASONED coach to coach our Suns

Yes i saw George Karl sitting with Jerry Colangelo at a game,and thought he might be the Suns coach next seaspon.

 

[George O'Brien]

Yes i saw George Karl sitting with Jerry Colangelo at a game,and thought he might be the Suns coach next seaspon.

I would think that Karl's performance in Milwaukee would give anyone pause. He took a decent team and eventually drove them into the ground after floundering in his later years in Seattle.

From what I can tell, Karl is a good pick for an underachieiving veteran team - for a while. But I think the bad outweights the good with him.

 

[Errntknght]

George, "In any case, the Suns had a lot less trouble with the zone once they started playing Dice at center."

The Suns had little trouble with zones as the season wound down because opponents didn't bother to employ them - we weren't a big enough threat to warrant special treatment.

 

[George O'Brien]

George, "In any case, the Suns had a lot less trouble with the zone once they started playing Dice at center."

The Suns had little trouble with zones as the season wound down because opponents didn't bother to employ them - we weren't a big enough threat to warrant special treatment.

You've said that a couple of times. I don't get it. The Suns were playing teams that were fighting for home court advantage in the playoffs (which has been decisive in the second round). Why would they stop doing what works and thus lose games to the Suns?