Emmitt Smith vs Barry Sanders: ...The Debate Rages On

[CardLogic]

I'll put it this way: if Emmitt had been on the Lions and Sanders had been on the Cowboys, I don't think we'd even be having this conversation.

BINGO!!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Earl Campbell.

Right there is the best RB ever, and Jim Brown is right behind him, IMHO.

As for Smith and Sanders ?

Sanders without a shadow of a doubt.

Sanders was special. Smith was consistent. Emmitt Smith was about as good as Curtis Martin, IMO.

All those names above are great backs, anyway.

Yet, I take pure talent over system guys when I gauge a player.

When you are running behind Larry Allen and Nate Newton for most of your career, it is going to help your stats. It took Smith a long time to get that rushing record, and would have never done it without those two, IHMO.

 

[blindseyed]

Barry Sanders not even a debate. Will never convince me otherwise. Like chickenhead said if the teams were reversed we wouldn't be having this debate

 

[Duckjake]

Jim Brown is overrated as a pure RB. He was 6'2" 232. He was as big as many of the Defensive linemen in that era.

Can you imagine Darnell Dockett being able to run the ball like Tim Hightower?



Oh and by the way Mulli, 9-0 Don't be doing no fumblin'.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Jim Brown is overrated as a pure RB. He was 6'2" 232. He was as big as many of the Defensive linemen in that era.

Can you imagine Darnell Dockett being able to run the ball like Tim Hightower?



Oh and by the way Mulli, 9-0 Don't be doing no fumblin'.

I don't understand your logic here. Earl Campbell had bigger thighs than many of the defensive lineman he'd drag along behind him but I don't see why that would make him anything less than a stud - same with Brown. Defensive players were bigger and stronger when Earl played but he was 10 pounds heavier than Brown despite being 3 or 4 inches shorter. You use what you have and you can only really view these players within their own time frames.

Steve

 

[Duckjake]

I don't understand your logic here. Earl Campbell had bigger thighs than many of the defensive lineman he'd drag along behind him but I don't see why that would make him anything less than a stud - same with Brown. Defensive players were bigger and stronger when Earl played but he was 10 pounds heavier than Brown despite being 3 or 4 inches shorter. You use what you have and you can only really view these players within their own time frames.

Steve

Dlinemen outweighed Campbell by 40-50lbs. The biggest guy on Browns team only weighed 20lbs more than Jim. Brown outweighed most of the DBs on his own team by 40-50lbs! Adrian Wilson and Kerry Rhodes on the other hand are almost as big as our RBs. I just don't think a guy is a great runner if all he did was bowl over much smaller defenders.

To me the great running backs were guys like Sayers,Faulk,and Sanders. Guys who could make a big something out of nothing playing against defenders who outweighed them by 50+pounds. Or guys like Emmit Smith with great vision could find holes to run through when others couldn't. To me Brown was a great athlete being able to run with the football at his size but not the caliber of RB others were. I'm sure most people will disagree but that's why we have discussion boards.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Dlinemen outweighed Campbell by 40-50lbs. The biggest guy on Browns team only weighed 20lbs more than Jim. Brown outweighed most of the DBs on his own team by 40-50lbs! Adrian Wilson and Kerry Rhodes on the other hand are almost as big as our RBs. I just don't think a guy is a great runner if all he did was bowl over much smaller defenders.

To me the great running backs were guys like Sayers,Faulk,and Sanders. Guys who could make a big something out of nothing playing against defenders who outweighed them by 50+pounds. Or guys like Emmit Smith with great vision could find holes to run through when others couldn't. To me Brown was a great athlete being able to run with the football at his size but not the caliber of RB others were. I'm sure most people will disagree but that's why we have discussion boards.

Well, it seems to me that you're arguing about who is the best runner, not the best running back. It's almost like your discounting Brown because he had an unfair advantage but that would be like discounting a cornerback because he was unusually quick or discounting a QB because he had an unusually strong arm. There are many aspects to the running back position and I don't think it matters whether you excel because of size or strength or agility or vision or whatever. It just matters that you excel.

Steve

 

[CardLogic]

Jim Brown is overrated as a pure RB. He was 6'2" 232. He was as big as many of the Defensive linemen in that era.

...The biggest guy on Browns team only weighed 20lbs more than Jim. Brown outweighed most of the DBs on his own team by 40-50lbs! Adrian Wilson and Kerry Rhodes on the other hand are almost as big as our RBs. I just don't think a guy is a great runner if all he did was bowl over much smaller defenders.

Are you confusing Jim Brown with Marion Motley?

Brown had good speed and quick feet; of course not Sayer, or Sanders type moves; but he was way more than a bowling ball, such as you're suggesting.

I remember a quote about Brown and one of his contemporaries, Jim Taylor of Green Bay - "Brown will give you a leg then take it away, Taylor will give you a leg, then ram it through your chest."

The quote was made; by Jerry Kramer, iirc; in praise of Taylor, but what it implies is that Brown had finesse moves to go along with his power.

Brown certainly did more than use his size to run over people And he was also fairly good recieving the ball, during an era when RB's didn't get many passes in their direction.

 

[AZCARDSFANATIC]

Did people not understand this thread? Why are Campbell, Dickerson, Sweetness and Brown metioned when this is about the 90's. Barry made defensive players cringe because he was like tackling water. Emmit was great, but he was not Barry.

 

[Duckjake]

Well, it seems to me that you're arguing about who is the best runner, not the best running back. It's almost like your discounting Brown because he had an unfair advantage but that would be like discounting a cornerback because he was unusually quick or discounting a QB because he had an unusually strong arm. There are many aspects to the running back position and I don't think it matters whether you excel because of size or strength or agility or vision or whatever. It just matters that you excel.

Steve

Yes, I usually talk about who was the best runner. Best running back is subject to too many variables. For example Curtis Martin ran for over 1000 yards 10 years in a row. Is 4th all time in rushing yards and scored over 100 TDs.

Yet not one person has mentioned his name in this thread until now, probably will almost never come up in any conversation of all time great RBs, and he was passed over by the HOF folks this year.

 

[Mulli]

Yes, I usually talk about who was the best runner. Best running back is subject to too many variables. For example Curtis Martin ran for over 1000 yards 10 years in a row. Is 4th all time in rushing yards and scored over 100 TDs.

Yet not one person has mentioned his name in this thread, probably will almost never come up in any conversation of all time great RBs, and he was passed over by the HOF folks this year.

One person mentioned him. You.

What position did Jim Brown play? Running back.

 

[Duckjake]

One person mentioned him. You.

I realized right after I hit Submit Reply you would immediately come on here and say that so while you were doing exactly what I expected I was editing my post to add "until now".

You are getting really predictable.

 

[Mulli]

I realized right after I hit Submit Reply you would immediately come on here and say that so while you were doing exactly what I expected I was editing my post to add "until now".

You are getting really predictable.

Your real post is frozen in my quote of you.

:iwin:

 

[Duckjake]

Your real post is frozen in my quote of you.

:iwin:

And your predictable response is frozen in mine. You need some new material. Maybe now that Cheese's show has aired he could write some stuff for you.

 

[Mulli]

And your predictable response is frozen in mine. You need some new material. Maybe now that Cheese's show has aired he could write some stuff for you.

I am on you like white on rice. I will continue to haunt you.

 

[Duckjake]

I am on you like white on rice. I will continue to haunt you.

white on rice??!?!?!

C'mon Cheese help the poor guy out.

 

[Mulli]

white on rice??!?!?!

C'mon Cheese help the poor guy out.

 

[Duckjake]

Watch it.

I'm on you like picalillies on a Chicago Dog.

 

[Mulli]

Watch it.

I'm on you like picalillies on a Chicago Dog.

Why would you make that plural?

 

[Duckjake]

Why would you make that plural?

?

 

[Mulli]

I was really hungry? Of course all us Texans know Chicago Dogs suck anyway.

I only really ate them Chicago style before I came here. Prefer them with chili, cheese and mustard. Other stuff gets in the way. Tomatoes cucumbers peppers? Not necessary.

 

[gamebird98]

Prolly my favorite quote about Barry was... "if you miss him, don't worry, he'll be back" Imagine the numbers he would have put up if he hadn't retired early in his career!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Jim Brown is overrated as a pure RB. He was 6'2" 232. He was as big as many of the Defensive linemen in that era.

Can you imagine Darnell Dockett being able to run the ball like Tim Hightower?



Oh and by the way Mulli, 9-0 Don't be doing no fumblin'.

True.

Fast as all heck tho.

My thoughts on Brown, and Campbell are biased, of course since they come from myself, because that is the style running I think is most effective in the NFL.

Now that being said. I put Marshall Faulk higher on my list of all time greats, than most because of his versitility.

 

[AzStevenCal]

True.

Fast as all heck tho.

My thoughts on Brown, and Campbell are biased, of course since they come from myself, because that is the style running I think is most effective in the NFL.

Now that being said. I put Marshall Faulk higher on my list of all time greats, than most because of his versitility.

Yeah, I don't know where I'd put Marshall on the all-time list. He dominated the game in so many ways but I suspect the fact Indy gave up on him so early probably hurts his overall reputation. It opens the door for the "well, he played in the Martz system" comments which for some reason is often used to downgrade the success of certain players (see Warner).

In my lifetime the 4 backs that I've enjoyed watching play the most were (in this order) Earl Campbell, Marshall Faulk, Walter Payton and Marcus Allen. I'd love to see a young version of any of those 4 in a Cards uniform sometime soon - this year would be fine.

Steve

 

[Longcolts]

Someone thought Faulk was pretty good as he was voted in to the Pro Football Hall of Fame this year.