ESPN Believes Cards Can Be a Quick Rebuild.

[dreamcastrocks]

Plus our record in one score games was a real outlier. It's fixable if not this year than the next.

Yep. It is why I don't think our team quit for Kliff.

 

[PACardsFan]

Indicated where?

You can't use something like that for the foundation of your whole argument without referencing it. "I heard it from some random guy on Twitter" doesn't count.

I‘m semi retired, sole caregiver for my 25 year old special needs son. I listen to NFL Radio quite a bit & heard that exact story on 2 different occasions. Once last week & once this week. There’s absolutely no reason to not give credence to it. And I certainly don’t have time to write down on paper who exactly said it. I can’t be the only one who listens to PHNX podcasts or NFL radio. Funny how both of my other sons heard the excerpts. But, instead, we should listen to someone like you that lives to hate Kyler Murray?

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Get Murray right.

#1 priority - when Kyler is at his best, he can cover up a lot of flaws.

 

[Harry]

Yeah Mao's talking crap. A google search shows Kyler donated $25k. I'm talking about actually doing something himself, not his agent donating money in his name.

Of which actually there are only one $25k to GENYOUth. There was $20k handover he showed up to while he was begging for a fat contract. The one and only time he's every appeared in public in Arizona in a none football capacity. To hand out one of those big cardboard checks because his PR guy said you need to something if you want to get paid. But it wasn't even his money.

Like this

Kyler Murray spent his day on March 24 attending two separate charity events and making contributions to give back to the local community. Murray hosted a brief trivia event where winners received an autographed football. For them, the generous donation will go toward supporting the foundation’s mission of celebrating excellence and cultivating equity in pre-K to 12th grade education.

Shortly after the first event, the Boys & Girls Clubs of the Valley hosted the second event, where Murray held a personal training session to demonstrate proper football techniques and skills.

“The second highest-paid quarterback in the NFL is known to be an active participant in charitable works. He has made numerous donations in the past and continues to support causes more frequently than ever. In August 2020, Murray donated $80,000 to a charity of choice after winning the sum from the Twitch Rivals Streamer Bowl.“. He played for the charity.

 

[Stout]

I‘m semi retired, sole caregiver for my 25 year old special needs son. I listen to NFL Radio quite a bit & heard that exact story on 2 different occasions. Once last week & once this week. There’s absolutely no reason to not give credence to it. And I certainly don’t have time to write down on paper who exactly said it. I can’t be the only one who listens to PHNX podcasts or NFL radio. Funny how both of my other sons heard the excerpts. But, instead, we should listen to someone like you that lives to hate Kyler Murray?

Yeah, there hasn't been anything on the board about it, which there would be if it was anything more than rumor. So you're trying to pull a he said/she said in defense of Kyler. Whatever. I will wait and see how he takes to a new coach and see if he's turned himself around. Until then, your defense of him is mere words. He stunk last season, so until he doesn't stink, the speculation will continue.

Cue the overreaction to saying he stunk last season.

 

[PACardsFan]

Yeah, there hasn't been anything on the board about it, which there would be if it was anything more than rumor. So you're trying to pull a he said/she said in defense of Kyler. Whatever. I will wait and see how he takes to a new coach and see if he's turned himself around. Until then, your defense of him is mere words. He stunk last season, so until he doesn't stink, the speculation will continue.

Cue the overreaction to saying he stunk last season.

As a Murray hater, you saying he stunk has ZERO cred. Considering the crap all around him, he was closer to exceptional than he was to “he stunk”. In reality he was probably somewhere in between.

 

[oaken1]

As a Murray hater, you saying he stunk has ZERO cred. Considering the crap all around him, he was closer to exceptional than he was to “he stunk”. In reality he was probably somewhere in between.

he stunk exceptionally
common ground

 

[Cheesebeef]

As a Murray hater, you saying he stunk has ZERO cred. Considering the crap all around him, he was closer to exceptional than he was to “he stunk”. In reality he was probably somewhere in between.

He was closer to exceptional?!

That comment is as unhinged as your bombastic support for Keim was until a couple months ago after his GLARING flaws had been obvious for half a decade.

Also makes me think you’re just making up whatever “you heard” about Kyler wanting a tough coach so you can back up your ridiculousness. As if ANY new story about Kyler Murray that was “discussed two different times on NFL radio” wouldn’t have found its way to the board and then been talked about to DEATH. Just hardens the opinion you live in a fantasy land.

Closer to exceptional… that is high comedy.

 

[Stout]

As a Murray hater, you saying he stunk has ZERO cred. Considering the crap all around him, he was closer to exceptional than he was to “he stunk”. In reality he was probably somewhere in between.

Closer than exceptional than to stinking, eh? How many passes over 30 yards did he complete this season?

"But, but coaching! But, but injuries! But, but excuses! But, but any reason other than any responsibility falling on Kyler!"

I know how this conversation goes.

 

[daves]

with a better than average defense, the 2020 (not even the 2021) version of Kyler Murray gets them into the playoffs and are competitive when they are there

The Cardinals' defense in 2020 was ranked 12th (points) / 13th (yards).
The Cardinals' defense in 2021 was ranked 11th (points) / 11th (yards).

Oh well.

...dave

 

[dreamcastrocks]

He was closer to exceptional?!

That is as unhinged as your bombastic support for Keim was until a couple months ago after his GLARING flaws had been obvious for half a decade.

Also makes me think you’re just making up whatever “you heard” about Kyler wanting a tough coach so you can back up your ridiculousness.

As if that story wouldn’t have been talked about to DEATH on this board if it actually existed anywhere but your own brain.

Closer to exceptional… that is high comedy.

Right? I'm seemingly having to argue for Kyler but closer to exceptional than stinking is blind. You could have made that argument last year, but definitely not this one.

 

[kerouac9]

The league as a whole thinks more highly of Kyler than this board does but yes there’s still some question marks there. Of course the overall roster is below average thanks to Keim.

We also forget that 7 of the 16 teams make the playoffs. It’s not that big of a lift even in ‘23 if we get 12 games of healthy Kyler with his wires uncrossed. SB contenders of course not but if the above comes together no reason we couldn’t have a season like this year’s Seahawks or Giants or Jacksonville

I dunno. Outside of a handful of especially noisy people, I feel like the board has a pretty accurate view on Kyler. People in the League are busy, and don't watch every Kyler snap unless they're playing him. I think that the League sees the highlights, which are amazing, and thinks that if he could do that more often, or HAVE TO do that less often, he could be great.

That lines up with what I think most of the board (or at least I) think. But there's a lot of smoke going around about Kyler being a difficult personality. That's probably also real. If Kyler finally gets a 5k passing season, it doesn't matter. Until he wins himself into the playoffs, he's going to be in the Kirk Cousins/Jay Cutler tier.

Kyler question as the thread is leaning that way...

When was the last time Kyler appeared on any TV show or podcast? I see other QB's all the time. Burrow, Mahomes, Allen, Hurts, Rodgers, Brady, Dak, Cousins, Lamar etc I see them regularly on Rich Eisen, Pat McAfee, various podcasts and so on.

Kyler is in year 4 and I don't recall seeing him on anything since the 2019 draft disasters.

That's not good. It speaks of a guy that thinks that either he is above all that or is so reclusive he avoids speaking. Does anyone recall any starting NFL QB. Especially a #1 pick, being so elusive of the media?

As a fan I don't know him at all. There are 3 things I know about him. He plays football, he likes playing video games and he lives in Texas as much as he can. After 4 years that seems pretty poor.

This doesn't matter even a little.

I believe people are truly underestimating how badly this team has been resourced over the years.

Unless Monti & the FO really hits it off in the draft & FA, which is possible, I think we won’t be truly competitive until 2026. I do think we could make a late run in 2025, but just not enough due to lack of talent.

What does "truly competitive" mean? As others have posted, nearly half the teams in each conference make the playoffs. Can we stay "in the hunt" until January (like the Ravens or Lions) next season? I don't see why not.

That said, I think it would take a couple of years to be in a position to compete for a division championship.

What’s funny is Keim’s last draft might end up being one of his best. Probably because he wasn’t around to screw things up. McBride looks like he will be a stud. Sanders and Thomas showed some promise. Hayes and Smith could turn into long term starters. Christian Matthew could stick and Luketa was worth a flier in the 7th rd. Only flat out bust I can see is Ingram. Not impressed with him at all. But he was a 6th rounder so no big deal.

They could, but so could any draft prospect that plays little over the course of their rookie season. Hayes didn't play at all and didn't show enough in camp to convince anyone to keep him available once he recovered from his injury.

Lecitus Smith started two games and was benched for the last five games. Not promising!

As with any fan forum, what people on this board think is based too much on emotion and not enough on facts. What the league thinks of a player is far more accurate than what a fan forum thinks. Kyler has already indicated to Bidwill that he wants a TOUGH HC. One that will demand attention to detail. Those that think Murray’s head isn’t right are clueless in that respect. With the right coaching, Murray will be as dangerous as any QB in the NFL. Even as a big fan of Murray, my biggest concern has nothing to do with his skills or his mind. It 100% is about him staying healthy. Kyler has had one major injury, so I’m not about to even remotely say he‘s injury prone, but he still has to come back strong & prove he can play a full season.

Need a citation on this.

Utter nonsense. Teams have had one year turn around a after being in the Cardinals position.

What teams? Usually teams as bad and skeletal as the Cards take a couple of seasons with Top 10 draft picks to recover. It's basically what happened after Kyler/Simmons, and then Keim screwed it up.

The Jags pre-Trevor Lawrence were an absolute dumpster fire. No WRs, poor OL, no QB, no RBs, no TEs. Defense had a few pieces, but lots of holes as well.

If the Cardinals can resign Murphy and Allen and have a stellar draft, they should be on the right path. The biggest fix is getting Murray to play to his capabilities. That was the single biggest issue this year.

Yeah... that's a lot of hopium you're serving up. Especially considering you came into this season claiming that all was well and people were being unnecessarily pessimistic about the roster.

Plus our record in one score games was a real outlier. It's fixable if not this year than the next.

We ended up 1-6 in games decided by a TD or less. Oof.

 

[OmahaCardsFan]

This is the equivalent of an obese person saying they ate some lettuce 3 years ago so it's not all bad.

Yeah we already covered 2 of these. One of them wasn't his money (the 20k one) he was just handing the check over.

And it's absolutely nothing to do with the point I raised. Donating pocket change for a millionaire is nothing. The point all along has been about his time and effort and doing things outside of football. Media, charity work, PR, community work etc

Yeah i get the point. We are looking for signs of true character and insight into who Kyler is given none of us really know. So the obvious 1st step is "what do other great QB leaders do that are your franchise?". "Do they promote the brand?". "Now that they are millionaires 10 times over, do they spend time in the community for which their brand exists to help and do something thats not about themself?". "Do they do anything to help grow the fan base, e.g. leverage media channels as such?". These are things that i believe are important when you are a leader and care about your team, fans and the brand. It of course has nothing to do with playing football as an NFL QB, but it sure as hell gives SOME insight into whether or not as franchise QB you are cable of leading a team to success. With that said, those traits above or the lack there may not tell the whole story and we may never know. Even if Kyler had those traits the team could still suck.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I dunno. Outside of a handful of especially noisy people, I feel like the board has a pretty accurate view on Kyler. People in the League are busy, and don't watch every Kyler snap unless they're playing him. I think that the League sees the highlights, which are amazing, and thinks that if he could do that more often, or HAVE TO do that less often, he could be great.

That lines up with what I think most of the board (or at least I) think. But there's a lot of smoke going around about Kyler being a difficult personality. That's probably also real. If Kyler finally gets a 5k passing season, it doesn't matter. Until he wins himself into the playoffs, he's going to be in the Kirk Cousins/Jay Cutler tier.



This doesn't matter even a little.



What does "truly competitive" mean? As others have posted, nearly half the teams in each conference make the playoffs. Can we stay "in the hunt" until January (like the Ravens or Lions) next season? I don't see why not.

That said, I think it would take a couple of years to be in a position to compete for a division championship.



They could, but so could any draft prospect that plays little over the course of their rookie season. Hayes didn't play at all and didn't show enough in camp to convince anyone to keep him available once he recovered from his injury.

Lecitus Smith started two games and was benched for the last five games. Not promising!



Need a citation on this.



What teams? Usually teams as bad and skeletal as the Cards take a couple of seasons with Top 10 draft picks to recover. It's basically what happened after Kyler/Simmons, and then Keim screwed it up.



Yeah... that's a lot of hopium you're serving up. Especially considering you came into this season claiming that all was well and people were being unnecessarily pessimistic about the roster.



We ended up 1-6 in games decided by a TD or less. Oof.

If you could predict the level of injury and how much Murray regressed...and like @Chris_Sanders stated, low performance in high leverage situations.

I predicted between 7-11 wins. I don't believe in exact record predictions because of the fluid nature of the NFL. The Cardinals weren't even close because of the level of injuries they faced.

 

[DVontel]

What does "truly competitive" mean?

Competing for division title & a SB.


I think just being “competitive” is what the Giants was this year. Over-delivering on expectations, but just not enough to make a SB or even a conference title game due to not enough talent.

 

[slanidrac16]

Geez for the sake of ASFN and all of us we need to hire a head coach….

 

[PACardsFan]

He was closer to exceptional?!

That comment is as unhinged as your bombastic support for Keim was until a couple months ago after his GLARING flaws had been obvious for half a decade.

Also makes me think you’re just making up whatever “you heard” about Kyler wanting a tough coach so you can back up your ridiculousness. As if ANY new story about Kyler Murray that was “discussed two different times on NFL radio” wouldn’t have found its way to the board and then been talked about to DEATH. Just hardens the opinion you live in a fantasy land.

Closer to exceptional… that is high comedy.

Learn to read. That’s not what I said & you‘re better than that.

 

[Harry]

I stand corrected. 4 in 4 years totalling about 35 minutes.

It's not never. It's just extremely rare.

No need to stand. You can remain sitting.

 

[gimpy]

Kool aid time. I always think for the best for our Cardinals, until this year. Then those bad thoughts started creeping into my head (dark siders thinking/thoughts?). I started blaming everyone, SK, KK, K1, and maybe others (MB? Ummmm).

But, all that has passed, FOR Me. New GM, hopefully new coaches (more than one), new personality coming. I'm all in right now. I'm not giving up on this team for this year. People point to some of the close games we lost this year. I think that might change some next year, hopefully, we'll win a couple of those. I saw the 3 plays that K1 ran before he got hurt. Just those 3 plays excited me. I thought he was coming out of the funk he had been in.

Any way, I'm all in and drinking the Kool Aid. No more dark siders allowed in my head.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Learn to read. That’s not what I said & you‘re better than that.

learn to become more self-aware of the ridiculousness you post. I wasn't the only one who commented on the assinine statement you made.

 

[PACardsFan]

learn to become more self-aware of the ridiculousness you post. I wasn't the only one who commented on the assinine statement you made.

You must have had poor grades in reading comprehension. It’s silly as hell to argue with some of you. Too many of you will be eating huge helpings of crow……..again.

 

[Krangodnzr]

You must have had poor grades in reading comprehension. It’s silly as hell to argue with some of you. Too many of you will be eating huge helpings of crow……..again.

Cardinals luck is that the people eating crow one year, are feeding the crow the next.

I commented on Steve Keim's roster building last year that he wasn't good at building sustainable teams. Hopefully Ossenfort is better.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yup. Every single one on the regular.

It has everything to do with football. How you are as a person is how you are as a player. No media, no charity work, no PR is just odd and indicates a reclusive, selfish character.

Go to work, go home, play video games.

Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, Lamar, Cousins, Dak, heck probably every QB in the league has a charitable foundation. Not Kyler. Even Andy Dalton has one.

You don't think that being the only starting QB (certainly the only high profile one) in the league with no media, no charity work, no PR work and that does nothing in the local community is indicative of some serious character issues?

I know some here are going to defend him but that's just weird. Really weird.

I mean . . . one second google.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[BulldogCard]

It's a quick rebuild if both lines get built, players are well coached, accountable, don't commit penalties, drop balls, throw picks..you know the easy stuff.

 

[BritCard]

Like this

Kyler Murray spent his day on March 24 attending two separate charity events and making contributions to give back to the local community. Murray hosted a brief trivia event where winners received an autographed football. For them, the generous donation will go toward supporting the foundation’s mission of celebrating excellence and cultivating equity in pre-K to 12th grade education.

Shortly after the first event, the Boys & Girls Clubs of the Valley hosted the second event, where Murray held a personal training session to demonstrate proper football techniques and skills.

“The second highest-paid quarterback in the NFL is known to be an active participant in charitable works. He has made numerous donations in the past and continues to support causes more frequently than ever. In August 2020, Murray donated $80,000 to a charity of choice after winning the sum from the Twitch Rivals Streamer Bowl.“. He played for the charity.

Yeah. I've already covered that.

It's the only community/charity appearance he's made in 4 years as far as I can find. It was this off season after he scrubbed socials and put that memo out. It was very obviously some weak attempt by his agent to try to improve Kyler's image and it wasn't his money. This is one of the articles you mentioned earlier "Kyler donates $20k" to youth projects. He didn't, it was some deli chain's money, he was just paid to hand the cardboard check over.

People arguing Kyler donating $85k of his own money, $80k he won gaming that wasn't his money and turning up to hand over a cardboard check once of someone else's money as evidence of his charity work when he's received $60m so far in his career is some weak sauce. Josh Allen has raised millions. He has a $1.4m wing in a Childrens hospital named after his Grandmother that his foundation paid for.

And no, before anyone argues, it doesn't make him a better or worse QB. But it speaks to his priorities and his character and how he views his role as leader of this franchise.