Final Cuts: Direction of the Cardinals

[RugbyMuffin]

Jeremy Bridges, Todd Heap, Paris Lenon, Clark Haggans, Vonnie Holliday and Justin Bethel

First things first. Justin Bethel is on the 53 man roster, but this coaching staff has continually had 4 safeties and 5 cornerbacks on the roster.

CB:
Peterson
Flemming
Gay

S:
Wilson
Rhodes
Bethel

That would leave 4 open spots in the Cardinals traditional roster breakdown. If the Cardinals choose to keep more then it effects the rest of the roster.

Not only that, how the linebacker situation is going to sort out is trickier then it looks, and of course the offensive line is a complete mess.

Some is going to get cut for the sake of youth, IMO.

Our starting defense quite possibly will look like the following:

DE: Dockett
NT: Williams
DE: Campbell
OLB: Bradley
ILB: Lenon
ILB: Washington
OLB: Acho
CB: Peterson
FS: Rhodes
SS: Wilson
CB: Flemming

Again, the Cardinals usually keep 4 OLB'ers and 4 ILB'ers.

OLB:
Acho
Schofield
Haggans
Groves

ILB:
Washington
Lenon
Bradley
Walker

What is the problem ? Nothing, except you only can active 45 players on game day. That is 21 players for defense.

1-11: Are the starters listed above
12. David Carter
13. Nick Eason
14. Clark Haggans
15. Quetin Groves
16. O'Brien Schofield
17. Reggie Walker
18. William Gay
19. GregToler
20. Rashad Johnson
21. Justin Bethel

So, you sit Vonnie Holliday, James Sanders, the 5th CB on the roster ? Unless you sit the 4th, and 5th CB and put Bethel as your dime CB, and activate James Sanders ? The next question is Clark Haggans THAT valuable. Clark is one my favorites. A good vet that works hard to prepare, and plays solid. But, Groves is faster, and plays special teams. At this point I would rather have Stewart Bradley on the field before Haggans at OLB as well. So, why keep him ? Cut Haggans, and keep Brandon Williams who can be de-activated most of the year, and has played well enough that in a pinch he can be a backup at OLB.

As I wrote about in the thread about the 5th preseason game and the offensive line, there is something going on with Jeremy Bridges. He played one preseason game at RT, and hasn't played any OT since. The way the offensive line is going I cannot fathom putting Bridges (another vet that I very much like) in at guard before Senio Kelemete. And if Bridges is not playing tackle anymore, does that mean the Cardinals put Nate Potter, or DJ Young (I think Young is as good as cut, IMO) ?

I have Todd Heap on here, because honestly? His one attribute that gives him any worth, his hands, have been about as good as Rob Housler's this offseason, and that is not a complement. Rob Housler can drop key passes for us, and he is younger, and less expensive.

Again it comes down to the 21 active players on offense, (Please bare with me on the offensive line, and QB starters since that is a "mystery")

1. Kevin Kolb
2. Chris Wells
3. Anthoney Sherman
4. Larry Fitzgerald
5. Andrea Roberts
6. Jeff King
7. D'Anthony Batiste
8. Daryn Colledge
9. Lyle Sendlien
10. Adam Snyder
11. Bobby Massie
12. John Skelton
13. Ryan Williams
14. LaRod Stephens-Howling
15. Early Doucet
16. Michael Floyd
17. Jim Dray
18. Rob Housler
19. DJ Young/Nate Potter
20. Senio Kelemete
21. Probably your 5th WR.

Tho I like a lot of these veterans, at least two of them should be cut by the end of the offseason. This offense is a complete mess, and with hold this team back this year, IMO. The Cardinals, IMO, are trying to get blood from a stone this year. A year to invest would be a good thing at this point. Not the best for wins, but for the future.

Invest in youth, and there is the potential to come away with a new starting CB#2 in Flemming, a new OG in Kelemete, a pair of OT's in Batiste, and Massie, and a new starting ILB in Bradley.

Getting way ahead of myself, I would put a goal for the Cardinals to have something like this by 2013:

QB: [Concentrate all offseason efforts on this] 1st priority
HB: Ryan Williams
FB: Anthony Sherman/WR3:Andre Roberts
WR: Larry Fitzgerald
WR: Michael Floyd
TE1: Jeff King/TE2:Rob Housler

LT: Levi Brown
LG: Senio Kelemete
OC: Lyle Sendlein
RG: Daryn Colledge
RT: Bobby Massie

1st OT in: D'Anthony Batiste
1st c/G in: Adam Snyder
2nd OT in: Nate Potter


DE: Darnell Dockett
NT: Dan Williams
DE: Calias Campbell
OLB: [2nd offseason priority]
ILB: Stewart Bradley
ILB: Daryl Washington
OLB: Sam Acho
CB: Patrick Peterson
FS: Kerry Rhodes
SS: Adrian Wilson
CB: Jamell Flemming

Strange, the NFL has really gotten to a point where the coaching and athletes are so good that there are 3 positions that all teams need, and that the natural world doesn't produce enough athletes for. The ability, work, and skills needed to play QB, OT, and be a pass rusher are so rare that there are not 32 in the world of each position that are what a team needs to compete in this sport.

If things go well for the Cardinals, and lets say those starting lineups hold true. Then the Cardinals go into the offseason looking for.

QB:
LT:
OLB:

A quarterback, left tackle, and a pass rusher.....just like the rest of the NFL. The key to that is, of course, Kelemete, Massie, and Batiste showing that they belong in the NFL. Which for the Cardinals would be great.

 

[Reddog]

Nice work Rugby. It would help to have you add a final list of your cuts from the current roster in one list the way you laid out your O and D rosters 1 - 21.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Nice work Rugby. It would help to have you add a final list of your cuts from the current roster in one list the way you laid out your O and D rosters 1 - 21.

I would be I am not sure I have one yet. Thus the post. A lot will be told when the starting offense goes out on the field against Denver.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Good stuff!

Can't imagine that Jeremy Bridges, as the number one swingman is not on the game day roster. What's going on with him, you ask? Simply - he's a known commodity..

 

[PACardsFan]

Very nice RM! I don't always agree with you, but this is very good!

 

[Snakester]

I like your idea of having Bradley start at OLB with Lenon still starting inside. That would give us a better run defense as Bradley is stronger at the POA than Schofield. Then next year start him inside and draft a passrusher in the first or second round next year.

I also agree we should start Fleming over Gay at the two spot. I like Sturdivant more than I do Walker as the other ILB, but because Walker had a decent game against the Titans I think he will get the spot and Sturdivant will go to the practice squad again.

Another thing the Cards better get next year are some D-linemen. We will only have four next year that are worth having on the roster. I have to believe this will be Vonnie Holiday's last year and Nick Eason is just not that good. We really need two new D-linemen next year. I thought we would have drafted one this year and one next year, but now we will need two. Both should be taken in the first four rounds.

 

[Vermont Maverick]

Great read. Thank you.

I would add that I think there will be a decision between S Sanders and S Johnson. I don't think both of them will make the roster. I could see us keeping 3 more corners in addition to your definites. That is where it gets tricky: Jefferson, Adams, Toler and Butler.

I agree that the "We know what he can do" line with Bridges is odd.

 

[Vermont Maverick]

Another thing the Cards better get next year are some D-linemen. We will only have four next year that are worth having on the roster. I have to believe this will be Vonnie Holiday's last year and Nick Eason is just not that good. We really need two new D-linemen next year. I thought we would have drafted one this year and one next year, but now we will need two. Both should be taken in the first four rounds.

They also kept Ronald Talley around last year. I wonder if he makes the cut. Though he has not stood out to me (not that I have been looking that hard at the 3's)

 

[Garthshort]

I hope Young and Potter end up on the PS. We need an OT, for this season, off the WW. If either Young or Potter get into a game, we're in trouble. B/t/w, I agree with your take on Bradley and last week posted my suggestion to go with three OLB's and five ILB's, with Haggens out and Sturdivent in.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Starters:

OFFENSE (26)
QB (3): Kevin Skelton/John Kolb, Ryan Lindley
RB (5): Beanie Wells, Ryan Williams, LSH, William Powell or Alfonso Smith, Anthony Sherman
WR (5): Fitz, Roberts, Doucet, Floyd, Byrd
TE (4): Heap/King, Housler, Steve Skelton
OL (9): Baptiste, Colledge, Sendlein, Snyder (ugh), Massie, Bridges, Kelemete, Ohrnberger, Potter

DEFENSE (24);
DL (6): Calais Campbell, Darnell Dockett, Dan Williams, David Carter, Nick Eason, Vonnie Holliday
OLB (4): Sam Acho, O'Brien Schofield, Quentin Groves, Clark Haggans
ILB (4): Daryl Washington, Paris Lenon, Shawn Bradley, Reggie Walker
CB (5): PP21, William Gay, Fleming, Toler, Adams
S (5): A-Dub, Kerry Rhodes, Rashad Johnson, James Sanders, Justin Bethel

SPECIALISTS (3):
K: Jay Feeley
P: Zastudil
LS: Mike Leach

53 total. That's how I see it right now.

Where we're a bit heavy: TE, OL, S
Where we're a bit light: WR

Players I struggle on: Alfonso Smith vs. William Powell. Powell has looked good running the rock, Smith is a very good pass blocker and has played well when called upon. Powell has practice squad eligibility, while I'm pretty certain Smith does not. I would lean Smith in this situation and keep Powell on the PS.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Krang

Fullback?

 

[Krangodnzr]

Krang

Fullback?

Listed under RB; Little Skelton will back him up.

 

[Cardiac]

Krang

Fullback?

He listed Sherman with the RB's.

 

[Garthshort]

Hope it's Jefferson, or Parker, over Adams.

 

[Krangodnzr]

As far as the direction of the team goes:

QB: I think the long term answer isn't on the roster. Kevin Kolb is by no means the ideal starter as he's too skittish under pressure and he's been injured far too much in so few starts. John Skelton doesn't have the requisite accuracy to play in the modern age; with so many QBs throwing for nearly or greater than 70% accuracy, Skelton's numbers (hovering around 50%) would've been bad in the early 90's. And this isn't something that QBs make a marked jump. Skelton has already made this jump in my opinion and I think we've seen almost the best out of Skelton so far. Lindley is a limited prospect since his accuracy also looks to be suspect.

RB: I think the writing is on the wall that Ryan Williams, barring injury, will be the answer at RB sooner rather than later. He's a more dynamic player than Beanie Wells. Wells has his place on an NFL team though, as the grinder and goal to go guy.

WR: Fitz is the present and future of this team and has shown no indication of slowing down. While some have been underwhelmed by Floyd, I'll give him more than a preaseason before I judge him. Roberts and Doucet are backup/slot guys and nothing more, but neither are elite either. The Cardinals could still use an elusive slot guy who isn't on the roster yet.

OL: I think going forward we've got at least one good interior prospect in Kelemete, a guy who could develop into either a starter or swing OG/OT guy, and one good prospect at tackle in Massie. Massie is very much a work in progress; watch him get beat badly on one play, then follow up with dominating blocks on his man the rest of the drive. Once the game slows down and he improves his pass sets I think Massie could be pretty good. The troubling problem is that in no way will Levi Brown be the answer at LT and we have no good young prospect here. The Cardinals could stand to use at least one pick in rounds 1-3 next year on a tackle prospect, and continue to use midround picks on interior linemen.

TE: Rob Housler is our answer as the "game breaker" TE and with King on the roster, we don't really have a need for that do-it-all TE. Not much of a need.

DL: With Campbell, Williams, Carter, and Dockett, we have a good nucleus of linemen with a nice mix of veteran leadership and youth. I think as Dockett begins to age, David Carter should begin to move more into his spot. One issue that will rear it's head in the next season or two is depth. With all the other needs and the overall strength of the position, it shouldn't be a huge priority. A late round pick or a flyer on a mid career veteran.

LB: Daryl Washington will emerge this year as one of the better linebackers in all of football. Over the years, I've begun to favor playmakers at LB much more so than guys that are just great run stoppers, and this is getting to be of much greater importance with a heavier reliance on passing games. Bradley will step into the SILB job and will be the QB of the LB corps, and the strong run stuffer this group needs. I like Acho; but I'm not as high on him as most of the board. I see him as Clark Haggans 2.0, a guy you could replace with a better player but a solid starter. Where we need a jolt is at Schofield's spot. Maybe Schofield finally steps up but that remains doubtful. Watching Kamerion Wimbley the other night just showed how much we could use a player who forces blocking attention. We need one of our own, and I doubt that guy is on the roster.

CB: We have Peterson and we have Fleming. I expect Peterson to join the Revis class real soon, but I think the fans need to temper their expectation on what Fleming should be. What he needs to be is competent, not a shutdown corner opposite Peterson. I think will be ok at CB, we have a number of decent players here.

S: As others have pointed out, A-Dub isn't getting any younger and Rhodes isn't exactly a young player either. Rashad Johnson has never developed into more than a back up caliber player, so safety is a position we need to address very soon. Bethel might be the answer at FS long term, but that remains to be seen. The Cards should think of using a pick in round 1-3 in the upcoming drafts on a SS to have Adrian Wilson's heir apparent on the roster before he retires.

K/P: Not really a fan of either guy, the Cards need to replace both soon.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Hope it's Jefferson, or Parker, over Adams.

I've liked what I've seen from Parker, and I think Jefferson has more game than most of the board, but I just can't bring myself to not list Adams on the roster.

A special teams core of Peterson, Adams, Bethel, LSH, Campbell, Schofield and Walker is as good as any special teams groups in the NFL. Demarco Sampson is another guy that might make the roster as a special teamer as well.

Either way I think we've got a lot of good special teamers on this team now.

 

[Jetstream Green]

"The ability, work, and skills needed to play QB, OT, and be a pass rusher are so rare that there are not 32 in the world of each position that are what a team needs to compete in this sport."

I would also throw in the position of CB but we were able to get Peterson, because you need to find a CB that is tall enough to match up with all the large WRs currently in the pros, which is not an easy task. 6' ft. CBs usually are not as smooth in their hips or acceleration out of their breaks and unlike the past, they are not allowed to compensate for that lack with being physical in coverage. QB, OT, elite Pass rusher and a good #1 CB, crucial positions needed for success. I think we have the CB in Peterson, still need to find that elite pass rusher to force the offense to scheme around the threat and limit them (we sort of are there as a combined unit and Campbell almost fits that bill), we do not have the QB or OT at the moment. We are 1.5 out of 4 it seems lol

 

[JeffGollin]

The problem with putting Powell and Potter on the PS is that they have to clear waivers. The odds are pretty good that at least one of the 31 other teams will value a productive RB or a future LT like Potter enough to warrant picking both of these guys up.

 

[Duckjake]

Watching Kamerion Wimbley the other night just showed how much we could use a player who forces blocking attention. We need one of our own, and I doubt that guy is on the roster.

In one thread you say we are fine with our pass rush because we were top 10 in sacks and in another you say we need better players at OLB which is the key to a good pass rush for a 3-4 defense. So which is it?

And you knew we were talking about upgrading our pass rush with better OLBs like Ingram, Coples, and Merciless vs taking another WR when you responded in the other thread.

 

[Krangodnzr]

In one thread you say we are fine with our pass rush because we were top 10 in sacks and in another you say we need better players at OLB which is the key to a good pass rush for a 3-4 defense. So which is it?

And you knew we were talking about upgrading our pass rush with better OLBs like Ingram, Coples, and Merciless vs taking another WR when you responded in the other thread.

LOL those statements aren't mutually exclusive. We can still generate a pass rush, but that doesn't mean we have a dominate player there.

I like Ingram and I watch South Carolina football regularly, but Floyd was BPA, and you don't build your football team by reaching, especially on 1 year wonders like Mercilus or 3-4 defensive ends like Coples.

We need to continue drafting there until we have the horse we need. Schofield/Acho etc. are adequate but not dominate.

 

[Krangodnzr]

The problem with putting Powell and Potter on the PS is that they have to clear waivers. The odds are pretty good that at least one of the 31 other teams will value a productive RB or a future LT like Potter enough to warrant picking both of these guys up.

Powell is very likely to clear waivers. There are literally 60 backs in the NFL that are better. I would bet on Potter getting picked up before Powell, which is why if I were making the decision I would sign Powell to the PS one more year and keep Alfonso Smith.

 

[Shane]

Powell is very likely to clear waivers. There are literally 60 backs in the NFL that are better. I would bet on Potter getting picked up before Powell, which is why if I were making the decision I would sign Powell to the PS one more year and keep Alfonso Smith.

Yup. Powell is a dime a dozen RB.

 

[JeffGollin]

Yup. Powell is a dime a dozen RB.

Respectfully disagree. He's looked better than any of our RB's in presaeason, and in terms of vision, cutting and second effort reminds me of a poor man's Barry Sanders.

Sometimes you gotta have to forget whether or not a player was drafted and just go with what your eyeballs tell you. Powell showed me a lot.

 

[Mitch]

Respectfully disagree. He's looked better than any of our RB's in presaeason, and in terms of vision, cutting and second effort reminds me of a poor man's Barry Sanders.

Sometimes you gotta have to forget whether or not a player was drafted and just go with what your eyeballs tell you. Powell showed me a lot.

I agree, Jeff. I not only want to keep this guy, I want us to play him. Keep Hyphen fresh for STs and occasional touches on offense.

 

[Goldfield]

Starters:

OFFENSE (26)
QB (3): Kevin Skelton/John Kolb, Ryan Lindley
RB (5): Beanie Wells, Ryan Williams, LSH, William Powell or Alfonso Smith, Anthony Sherman
WR (5): Fitz, Roberts, Doucet, Floyd, Byrd
TE (4): Heap/King, Housler, Steve Skelton
OL (9): Baptiste, Colledge, Sendlein, Snyder (ugh), Massie, Bridges, Kelemete, Ohrnberger, Potter

DEFENSE (24);
DL (6): Calais Campbell, Darnell Dockett, Dan Williams, David Carter, Nick Eason, Vonnie Holliday
OLB (4): Sam Acho, O'Brien Schofield, Quentin Groves, Clark Haggans
ILB (4): Daryl Washington, Paris Lenon, Shawn Bradley, Reggie Walker
CB (5): PP21, William Gay, Fleming, Toler, Adams
S (5): A-Dub, Kerry Rhodes, Rashad Johnson, James Sanders, Justin Bethel

SPECIALISTS (3):
K: Jay Feeley
P: Zastudil
LS: Mike Leach

53 total. That's how I see it right now.

Where we're a bit heavy: TE, OL, S
Where we're a bit light: WR

Players I struggle on: Alfonso Smith vs. William Powell. Powell has looked good running the rock, Smith is a very good pass blocker and has played well when called upon. Powell has practice squad eligibility, while I'm pretty certain Smith does not. I would lean Smith in this situation and keep Powell on the PS.

Powell will get claimed if released. I keep him on the roster. I agree with rest of roster, and I want Bradley to start at olb over schofield.