From AZCardinals message board: Fitzgerald asking for 18 million a year!!

[Crazy Canuck]

I just read on the AZCardinals message board that yesterday on the pre game for either the Bears/Seahawks or Jets/Patriots, Larry Fitzgerald's contract situation came up and the reporter said that Fitzgerald and his agent were looking to receive in the range of 18 million per year to sign a contract extension in Arizona.

Is so, that is ridiculous and we need to look long and hard at getting something in return. Signing Fitzgerald to an 18 million per year deal would go right up there with the Jake Plummer 15 million dollar bonus in 1998. It's a good idea to show the league that you are committed to keeping your core guys, but there has to be a limit.

No player other than an elite QB is worth that kind of money.

1) It's 18M per annum based on the likelihood of an 18 game season.
2) Under the new CBA one can expect the amount of $$$ available to go up in consideration of the new schedule of games.
3) League income is projected to go up (See) new ESPN deal
4) This is likely his representatives' opening position, so let's RELAX and see where this goes.
5) Whether in AZ or anywhere else, Fitz is likely to sign the highest non-QB contract of all time - and -
6) It's not your $$$

 

[ajcardfan]

No freaking way.

You'd need to average two TD's a game to be worth that much.

No way, no how.

That's not to say we won't do it but we'd be stupid to even get close to that, just bone stupid.

On the other hand, right now, we don't have much of anyone else worth extending at all. Letting Fitz walk for nothing in return would hurt the franchise far more long term IMO. And, I'm sure if we trade him it's going to be a hose job like we got with Boldin and Aeneas' deals.

 

[Mulli]

1) It's 18M per annum based on the likelihood of an 18 game season.
2) Under the new CBA one can expect the amount of $$$ available to go up in consideration of the new schedule of games.
3) This is likely his representatives' opening position, so let's RELAX and see where this goes.
4) Whether in AZ or anywhere else, Fitz is likely to sign the highest non-QB contract of all time - and -
5) It's not your $$$

 

[Crazy Canuck]

If this is correct...what this does is paint the Cardinals into a total corner. There is no way they can even consider $18M a year---heck they had a tough time offering Warner $11M.

Even worse---this would scare off teams that might be interested in trading for Fitz---unless Fitz's agent gives a "wink-wink" assurance to the other team that if they trade for him the asking price comes down.

What this really means---if correct---is that Fitz just wants to play out his contract and hit the market in 2012.[/QUOTE]

No. What it really means - if correct - is that he wants $18M.

 

[DemsMyBoys]

1) It's 18M per annum based on the likelihood of an 18 game season.
2) Under the new CBA one can expect the amount of $$$ available to go up in consideration of the new schedule of games.
3) This is likely his representatives' opening position, so let's RELAX and see where this goes.
4) Whether in AZ or anywhere else, Fitz is likely to sign the highest non-QB contract of all time - and -
5) It's not your $$$

Mulli beat me to it but . Especially on #4. People's mouths are likely to drop.

 

[Cheesebeef]

and who leaked this number? my guess... a team who's already begun their usual process of getting public opinion AGAINST the guy they probably know is going to leave because that player realizes we're a joke of an organization.

let the PR battle begin.

just my opinion.

 

[Shane]

and who leaked this number? my guess... a team who's already begun their usual process of getting public opinion AGAINST the guy they probably know is going to leave because that player realizes we're a joke of an organization.

let the PR battle begin.

just my opinion.

If your opinion is correct then good for them. Public opinion should be on the side of the Cards because that # is F'n ridiculous!

 

[Duckjake]

If your opinion is correct then good for them. Public opinion should be on the side of the Cards because that # is F'n ridiculous!

What makes it ridiculous? The Cardinals have the money to pay it.

The argument that Fitz only touches the ball 5-6 times a game has a huge hole in it. Defenses have to account for him on every play. A 1000 snaps a season. He's the only guy on our team that DC's have to game plan for or they'll get burned. It's a passing league so you must have weapons for your passing game.

The price only becomes a problem if it will put the Cards in a bad Salary Cap situation costing them good players at other positions. And even though fans keep saying that teams will end up in Salary Cap hell it never seems to happen.

Check out this link and the names that are on there:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/rec_td_year_by_year.htm

 

[Shane]

What makes it ridiculous? The Cardinals have the money to pay it.

The argument that Fitz only touches the ball 5-6 times a game has a huge hole in it. Defenses have to account for him on every play. A 1000 snaps a season. He's the only guy on our team that DC's have to game plan for or they'll get burned. It's a passing league so you must have weapons for your passing game.

The price only becomes a problem if it will put the Cards in a bad Salary Cap situation costing them good players at other positions. And even though fans keep saying that teams will end up in Salary Cap hell it never seems to happen.

Check out this link and the names that are on there:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/rec_td_year_by_year.htm

I have already stated in this thread what makes it ridiculous. The money to pay it is irrelevant to me. I know the "It's not your money blah blah blah." that aj and other like to use around here. I don't care.

That cap # would be higher than Tom freaking Brady. Whom just signed his extension in the last 4 months. If you can't see that there should be a salary disparity between Fitz and one of the greatest QB's of all time I just dont know what to tell you.

If you don't think an 18 million cap hit for a freaking WR on this team would hurt them in other areas? you are beyond even debating about with.

Its ludicrous anyway you guys try and rationalize it.

 

[Duckjake]

I have already stated in this thread what makes it ridiculous. The money to pay it is irrelevant to me. I know the "It's not your money blah blah blah." that aj and other like to use around here. I don't care.

That cap # would be higher than Tom freaking Brady. Whom just signed his extension in the last 4 months. If you can't see that there should be a salary disparity between Fitz and one of the greatest QB's of all time I just dont know what to tell you.

If you don't think an 18 million cap hit for a freaking WR on this team would hurt them in other areas? you are beyond even debating about with.

Its ludicrous anyway you guys try and rationalize it.

No its not ludicrous no matter how you try and spin it. You don't know that it would hurt the team in other areas. That's pure speculation on your part.

Who would the Cards have had to do without this past season if they'd paid Fitz $18 million? That's right, nobody. Fitz shouldn't make $18 million just because it would be more than what a QB makes? That's ridiculous.

Is he important to the team? Yes, very. Do you have the money to pay him? Yes. And you let him go simply because he would have been making more money than Tom Brady? No wonder your team goes 5-11 all the time.

 

[Shane]

No its not ludicrous no matter how you try and spin it. You don't know that it would hurt the team in other areas. That's pure speculation on your part.

Who would the Cards have had to do without this past season if they'd paid Fitz $18 million? That's right, nobody. Fitz shouldn't make $18 million just because it would be more than what a QB makes? That's ridiculous.

Is he important to the team? Yes, very. Do you have the money to pay him? Yes. And you let him go simply because he would have been making more money than Tom Brady? No wonder your team goes 5-11 all the time.

Hes not going to make 18 million so not gonna be an issue. No team would pay him that much. Hes just not worth it and doesn't impact a game enough. That's just a simple fact. This is a QB's league. Not a WR league. That's just how it is.

You saying the team CAN pay it and it wont hurt the team financially in the long run is also speculation and nothing more. I just believe my speculating to be more accurate than yours.

 

[DoTheDew]

It's better to not look at the total number and instead consider what percentage of the teams payroll he is asking for. $18 million isn't nearly what it was even last time Fitz signed in NFLs terms.

The Raiders and Cowboys payrolls, for example, were both estimated at $152 mill and $146 mill respectively. The Chiefs, on the other hand, had only $83 mill in payroll.

Now, when Fitz signed a 4 year $40 in 2008 it was $116.7 Mill. That would be 11.67% of the cap. There's no way to know what the cap would be next year if there even is one, but it was $128 mill in 2009, the last year that there was a cap, so we can guess it would have been at least $135 mill this year. At the rate things were going, $140+ seems like a very conservative number for 2011 had things continued the way they were.

Now, $18 mill is about 13% of a $140 mill. Not that that would be the number, but if it ends up being around there somewhere, $18 mill per is not that much more than his last deal in relative terms.

 

[Duckjake]

Hes not going to make 18 million so not gonna be an issue. No team would pay him that much. Hes just not worth it and doesn't impact a game enough. That's just a simple fact. This is a QB's league. Not a WR league. That's just how it is.

You saying the team CAN pay it and it wont hurt the team financially in the long run is also speculation and nothing more. I just believe my speculating to be more accurate than yours.

It's not speculation that the Cards cut payroll by $30 million in 2010. It's not speculation that the Cards don't have a star QB they have to pay millions. It's not speculation that other franchises have star QBs they pay multiple millions and still win. So it's not speculation that the Cards have the money and could pay Fitz without it hurting the team.

ESPN and the NFL are close to finalizing an agreement that would continue the run of “Monday Night Football” on the cable giant and more new media rights for a staggering figure of nearly $2 billion per year.

That's 62.5 million per team per year just from ESPN!

Letting players go simply because they aren't worth the money is a sure fire way to end up 5-11 every season. Is the player an integral part of the team? If so, find a way to pay him. If not let somebody else pay him.

BTW: if this is a QB (passing) league why are the Bears in the NFC Championship game and the Texans 6-10?

 

[mrbyte]

If this is correct...what this does is paint the Cardinals into a total corner. There is no way they can even consider $18M a year---heck they had a tough time offering Warner $11M.

Even worse---this would scare off teams that might be interested in trading for Fitz---unless Fitz's agent gives a "wink-wink" assurance to the other team that if they trade for him the asking price comes down.

What this really means---if correct---is that Fitz just wants to play out his contract and hit the market in 2012.

Exactly Mitch, As soon as I heard that there were extention talks going on, I was interested to hear what Fitz would be looking for as an indicator to what he really wants. *If true* this says to me 'I want out' but we will see, hopefully my gut feeling is wrong

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

for those that don't want to pay him,just think about our passing game of John Skelton to Stephen Williams, Max Komar, and Early Doucet . At least we'll still have Adrian Wilson though.

 

[Cardiac]

It's better to not look at the total number and instead consider what percentage of the teams payroll he is asking for. $18 million isn't nearly what it was even last time Fitz signed in NFLs terms.

The Raiders and Cowboys payrolls, for example, were both estimated at $152 mill and $146 mill respectively. The Chiefs, on the other hand, had only $83 mill in payroll.

Now, when Fitz signed a 4 year $40 in 2008 it was $116.7 Mill. That would be 11.67% of the cap. There's no way to know what the cap would be next year if there even is one, but it was $128 mill in 2009, the last year that there was a cap, so we can guess it would have been at least $135 mill this year. At the rate things were going, $140+ seems like a very conservative number for 2011 had things continued the way they were.

Now, $18 mill is about 13% of a $140 mill. Not that that would be the number, but if it ends up being around there somewhere, $18 mill per is not that much more than his last deal in relative terms.

This is the way to look at it, GREAT POST!!!

Don't get caught up in the numbers flying around but what % of the CAP it will be if you concerned about us affording other stars on the team.

Duckjake also has good info on the ESPN contract and how much money that is to each team.

My guess is Brady will get another new contract soon if Manning gets a deal that reflects these new TV contracts.

 

[freebyrd]

I just read on the AZCardinals message board that yesterday on the pre game for either the Bears/Seahawks or Jets/Patriots, Larry Fitzgerald's contract situation came up and the reporter said that Fitzgerald and his agent were looking to receive in the range of 18 million per year to sign a contract extension in Arizona.

Is so, that is ridiculous and we need to look long and hard at getting something in return. Signing Fitzgerald to an 18 million per year deal would go right up there with the Jake Plummer 15 million dollar bonus in 1998. It's a good idea to show the league that you are committed to keeping your core guys, but there has to be a limit.

No player other than an elite QB is worth that kind of money.

as someone pointed out in another thread, other successful franchises could get away with low balling their players,
WE however because of our losing tradition and our perception of cheapness can not,
this is a perpetual vicious cycle that probably contributes to our moribund position year after year,

what we should have done to break this cycle both in 98 and again in 2008 was sell the farm and KEEP every one of our players in free agency,

again, we got a little taste of winning and we suddenly act like we are the steelers or something and its ok....it'll be alright everybody will want to come here now...we were just in the superbowl by god.....WRONG!

let fitz walk and he'll go somewhere else and CHEAPER to win a championship, which is what players of his caliber want at this stage in their career
hell its probably too late now what should have happened was we should have sold the farm and done what it took to be sitting here with dansby and boldin the heart and soul of our offense and defense,
yeah rhodes was an upgrade from rolle but thats an anomaly ,
anyway heres to a successful 2018 season where we'll visit this scenario again. IF were lucky

 

[freebyrd]

I doubt it will be that high, Fitz is going to get paid here or some where else. Better be here, but we need that QB thingy to get Fitz signing long term.
Fitz is gonna get payed, but I see him wanting the success he has already tasted. This requires the Cards to be very active in getting some real talent behind center.

Loven your avatar more and more, it is mesmerizing.

YES!! that gap right between the legs below the "who-hah"
(its a family board i'm trying to stay family friendly here)
linda carter of wonder woman fame had a great GAP chasm whatever you want to call it.....it just feels like .....home
hey you guys brought it up

 

[cardsfanmd]

I just want a thread full of Shane's posts so I can see that avatar 15 times per page.

 

[joeshmo]

Everyone needs to stop thinking about 18 mill per year in terms of cap dollars or even in terms that he would actually make 18 mill per year. We should all know by now that although a contract is for 7 years 126 Mill total, the player is never going to actually make 126 mill over the life of the contract.

For Example, and this is a very simplified example, lets say Fitz signs for 7 years 126 mill total contract with 40 to 50 mill gauranteed.

The first 4 years of that deal he definently would not make 18 mill per year.

Year 1 - 5 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus, 20 mill signing bonus.
Year 2 - 6 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus
Year 3 - 7 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus
Year 4 - 8 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus

You fully gauranteed years 1 through 4 base salaries and you get 46 mill total in gauranteed money. You get an average cost of 12 mill per year, with the final 3 years back loaded in such a way that raises the total 7 year deal to 126 mill. He wouldnt actually see years 5,6,7 and actually make 18 mill per year, his cap figure will not be 18 mill per year.

Point being dont get stuck with the 18 mill per year number (which is crap by the way because neither party would have released this info to the media, that is a fact), get hung up with the structure and details of the deal instead.

 

[WildBB]

The first 4 years of that deal he definently would not make 18 mill per year.

Year 1 - 5 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus, 20 mill signing bonus.
Year 2 - 6 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus
Year 3 - 7 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus
Year 4 - 8 mill in base, 500k in workout bonus

You fully gauranteed years 1 through 4 base salaries and you get 46 mill total in gauranteed money. You get an average cost of 12 mill per year, with the final 3 years back loaded in such a way that raises the total 7 year deal to 126 mill. He wouldnt actually see years 5,6,7 and actually make 18 mill per year, his cap figure will not be 18 mill per year.

Point being dont get stuck with the 18 mill per year number (which is crap by the way because neither party would have released this info to the media, that is a fact), get hung up with the structure and details of the deal instead.

If they know the team would not honor the non-guaranteed part (95% sure), why even agree to structure such a deal?

Why not agree that you won't sign for less than 14 Mil. avg. (starting neg. @ 18M) over 4 yrs - guaranteed. I say that's what they're shooting for.

I realise you were only using an example. But I don't see them wanting a 7 yr. deal.

 

[joeshmo]

If they know the team would not honor the non-guaranteed part (95% sure), why even agree to structure such a deal?

Why does any player agree to such structures? And 99% of the NFL players do. One simple and easy answer - the 40+ mill gauranteed money in your pocket by the end of the first 4 years. In a league with no fully gauranteed contracts players only care about making money not over the long haul, but fast.

Why not agree that you won't sign for less than 14 Mil. avg. (starting neg. @ 18M) over 4 yrs - guaranteed. I say that's what they're shooting for.

But I don't see them wanting a 7 yr. deal.

Nothing but pure conjecture and guess work, so I cannot even give a rebuttal. I could just as easily say he is only looking for 10 mill over the first 4 years and be just a right.