Gasol

[GYDevil]

I got ripped for saying that the Suns should have given up a first round pick for Gasol, with some on this board saying they were too "intelligent" to mortgage the future for a rental player (although they would have had his Bird rights to try to keep him.)

Anyone check out his stats since the trade deadline? 20 points, 9 boards, .553 shooting %, 2 blocks per game (he is terrible on D remember), while our Forward rotation has hit the wall and is one of the worst front-lines in the NBA.

All because we weren't willing to give up one of the 3-4 first round picks this year? I still shake my head when I think about a rotation that includes Gasol, Bledsoe, Goran, Frye, Tucker starting and Miles, Morris squared, Green, etc off the bench. That team has a decent shot at a run in the playoffs. Instead, we get another late first round pick for an Archie Goodwin equivalent or a Euro that we won't even get for 2+ years.

Ridiculous.

 

[Chaplin]

You just don't get it. No reason to get Gasol. None. Especially when he was damaged goods at the trade deadline (and probably beyond).

 

[slinslin]

. Instead, we get another late first round pick for an Archie Goodwin equivalent or a Euro that we won't even get for 2+ years.

Ridiculous.

I will gladly take that Archie Goodwin 2.0 instead of 2 months of Gasol.

 

[desertdawg]

The cheese is old and unreliably moldy.

 

[GYDevil]

You just don't get it. No reason to get Gasol. None. Especially when he was damaged goods at the trade deadline (and probably beyond).

20 points, 9 boards, .553 shooting %, 2 blocks per game is pretty good for damaged goods.

 

[desertdawg]

20 points, 9 boards, .553 shooting %, 2 blocks per game is pretty good for damaged goods.

His psyche is as fragile as his body, he isn't an allstar by a long shot and he is on his way down. You don't give up first rounders for that guy, and who cares what he's done in less than a month.

 

[GYDevil]

You just don't get it. No reason to get Gasol. None. Especially when he was damaged goods at the trade deadline (and probably beyond).

And yes, I guess I don't get it. A lot of people think that winning more games and making a run in the playoffs is a reason to make a trade. You must have been in favor of trading Amare at the trade deadline back in 2010 rather than making a run to the Western Conference finals. He was not coming back either, so what was the point?

 

[desertdawg]

And yes, I guess I don't get it. A lot of people think that winning more games and making a run in the playoffs is a reason to make a trade. You must have been in favor of trading Amare at the trade deadline back in 2010 rather than making a run to the Western Conference finals. He was not coming back either, so what was the point?

When did Chaplin say that? The FOX NEWS style debate you just did there is weak reggae man.

 

[GYDevil]

His psyche is as fragile as his body, he isn't an allstar by a long shot and he is on his way down. You don't give up first rounders for that guy, and who cares what he's done in less than a month.

Oh, the untouchable first-rounders (we have three of them remember). Well, not sure if you noticed but our three first rounders are all currently projected to be 17-18 or higher. Want to guess the last time the Suns drafted a player 17 or higher in the first round that made a significant impact on the Suns? Michael Finley back in 1995 (#21 pick). Why these picks are held us as the greatest treasure on earth I don't know.

 

[GYDevil]

When did Chaplin say that? The FOX NEWS style debate you just did there is weak reggae man.

Reading comprehension must not be your strong suit. I am making an assumption that if a player that will not be on your team next year has no value (according to Chaplin), then why didn't the Suns trade away Amare in 2010? I personally think going to the Western Conference finals that year was worth the gamble.

Essentially I am asking Chaplin to expound on his opinion using past examples. Its called debate, which some people like to do on message boards. I happen to disagree with Chaplin so I am seeking additional information.

 

[desertdawg]

Oh, the untouchable first-rounders (we have three of them remember). Well, not sure if you noticed but our three first rounders are all currently projected to be 17-18 or higher. Want to guess the last time the Suns drafted a player 17 or higher in the first round that made a significant impact on the Suns? Michael Finley back in 1995 (#21 pick). Why these picks are held us as the greatest treasure on earth I don't know.

The greatest treasure on earth huh? You can spin whatever and however you want, you can bring Rick James and Charlie Murphy into the conversation, but it still doesn't make Gasol worth the first rounder the Suns wouldn't give for him. So let's see where everybody stands on this:

Everybody (including the Suns Org)

And then there's you

If you don't value first rounders, or care about spending too much than I really don't know what to tell you, except you probably didn't mind over paying for that Fat Head on your wall.

 

[desertdawg]

Reading comprehension must not be your strong suit. I am making an assumption that if a player that will not be on your team next year has no value (according to Chaplin), then why didn't the Suns trade away Amare in 2010? I personally think going to the Western Conference finals that year was worth the gamble.

Essentially I am asking Chaplin to expound on his opinion using past examples. Its called debate, which some people like to do on message boards. I happen to disagree with Chaplin so I am seeking additional information.

You can make an assumption out of you but you can't make one out of me. You suggested something to make yourself sound...I don't know....

So I can sit here and say since you wanted Gasol than you must like ketchup in your ice cream?

 

[Mainstreet]

Oh, the untouchable first-rounders (we have three of them remember). Well, not sure if you noticed but our three first rounders are all currently projected to be 17-18 or higher. Want to guess the last time the Suns drafted a player 17 or higher in the first round that made a significant impact on the Suns? Michael Finley back in 1995 (#21 pick). Why these picks are held us as the greatest treasure on earth I don't know.

I bet you didn't see many first round picks being traded at the trading deadline. The reason, this is an especially deep draft and because this is how you get good players on rookie scale contracts. The NBA is a changing.

Also I bet you see the Suns use some of these picks to obtain a star quality player.

 

[Catlover]

I got ripped for saying that the Suns should have given up a first round pick for Gasol, with some on this board saying they were too "intelligent" to mortgage the future for a rental player (although they would have had his Bird rights to try to keep him.)

Anyone check out his stats since the trade deadline? 20 points, 9 boards, .553 shooting %, 2 blocks per game (he is terrible on D remember), while our Forward rotation has hit the wall and is one of the worst front-lines in the NBA.

All because we weren't willing to give up one of the 3-4 first round picks this year? I still shake my head when I think about a rotation that includes Gasol, Bledsoe, Goran, Frye, Tucker starting and Miles, Morris squared, Green, etc off the bench. That team has a decent shot at a run in the playoffs. Instead, we get another late first round pick for an Archie Goodwin equivalent or a Euro that we won't even get for 2+ years.

Ridiculous.

Most of us were in favor of or at least okay with the idea of giving up our worst 1st round pick. Keep in mind the rumors often included multiple firsts or at least our best first and many of us were against that deal. You just don't know what you're going to get with Gasol though, it's one of the reasons that Memphis bailed on him in his prime and it's even worse today.

And his stats don't tell the full story, he's still a huge liability on defense more often than not. Also his Bird rights mean little as he's not going to be a highly sought after free agent and everything out of his mouth was that he didn't want to be here. On top of all that there was no way for us to know how serious his injury was given that he wasn't playing at all. He probably would have made us marginally better but to hear LA tell it, the dollar value of the deal meant nothing to them. They were only willing to move Pau if they could get ASSETS back and that does not sound like the Indiana pick to me.

 

[GYDevil]

The greatest treasure on earth huh? You can spin whatever and however you want, you can bring Rick James and Charlie Murphy into the conversation, but it still doesn't make Gasol worth the first rounder the Suns wouldn't give for him. So let's see where everybody stands on this:

Everybody (including the Suns Org)

And then there's you

If you don't value first rounders, or care about spending too much than I really don't know what to tell you, except you probably didn't mind over paying for that Fat Head on your wall.

Yea, because the fans and Suns front office never make mistakes...

The whole point of the post is to see if anyone else regrets not going harder after Gasol. You and Chap have made your opinions known, but I am pretty sure that is not "Everybody". If Everybody would rather have Miles, Frye and Len be your frontcourt for the playoffs than Gasol, then I will agree to disagree and go quietly into the night. But I am not sure that has been decided yet.

 

[desertdawg]

Yea, because the fans and Suns front office never make mistakes...

The whole point of the post is to see if anyone else regrets not going harder after Gasol. You and Chap have made your opinions known, but I am pretty sure that is not "Everybody". If Everybody would rather have Miles, Frye and Len be your frontcourt for the playoffs than Gasol, then I will agree to disagree and go quietly into the night. But I am not sure that has been decided yet.

It's not a question of who you would rather have, there is no tree with players growing on them that you can simply walk up to and choose. The ticket oak commercial wasn't real either bro. But as you suggest, you can save the Suns from making such mistakes. We got to get you a purple and orange polo and try to sneak you in there, so you can use this incredible intelligence you have on locking down Gasol for us.

:chamionship:

 

[Catlover]

Yea, because the fans and Suns front office never make mistakes...

The whole point of the post is to see if anyone else regrets not going harder after Gasol. You and Chap have made your opinions known, but I am pretty sure that is not "Everybody". If Everybody would rather have Miles, Frye and Len be your frontcourt for the playoffs than Gasol, then I will agree to disagree and go quietly into the night. But I am not sure that has been decided yet.

What about those of us that doubted we'd make the postseason with or without Gasol? Losing Bledsoe took us from a probable first round home court advantage to a team on the outside looking in. Getting Bledsoe back and keeping him healthy puts us back in the running for a playoff spot but we'd be looking at a first round loss to OKC, San Antonio or Houston and I don't see Pau changing that.

 

[Mainstreet]

I would have traded Okafor for Gasol straight up. Nothing more. And that would have been a bad financial decision but worth it for perhaps a playoff run.
I'm betting the Lakers wanted more like their 2015 first round draft pick back or more.

Okafor's insured contract saved the Suns 5+ million and the remainder of Gasol's contract would have cost the Suns millions more... for a rental. No way I would give the Lakers draft picks as well.

I want the Suns to be a financially sound, well run organization so when the right opportunity comes along, they are able to make it.

 

[Errntknght]

Often the devil is in the details and we still don't know what they were. Happily we have McD running things now and I'm not second guessing him on this one. In general terms I thought Pau was worth a gamble and seemingly McD considered it, which is what I wanted him to do. Bringing it up because Pau has had some good offensive games recently is sort of silly - we all knew that was a possibility back when the deal was being debated.

 

[sunsfan88]

The last team to give up a 1st round pick to rent a player for 3 months? The Nets when they traded Damian Lillard to the Blazers for Gerald Wallace. They ended up having to overpay him to keep him in BKY so they can justify the trade. Ask them how that turned out for them.

Last team to give up something valuable for a rental player? The Bucks when they have up Tobias Harris to rent Redick for 3 months. Ask them how that turned out for them

 

[Chaplin]

And yes, I guess I don't get it. A lot of people think that winning more games and making a run in the playoffs is a reason to make a trade. You must have been in favor of trading Amare at the trade deadline back in 2010 rather than making a run to the Western Conference finals. He was not coming back either, so what was the point?

The difference back then was that we still had a good team. Right now, why do you care about making the playoffs?

I happen to think making the playoffs with this group would be much more impressive than this group with Gasol. My problem is that a) there is NO way we would sniff a championship and b) getting Gasol does nothing beyond this year. This year is good for developing and it's great that we are ahead of schedule, but our assets should be used for long term gain--Gasol ain't that.

 

[GYDevil]

The last team to give up a 1st round pick to rent a player for 3 months? The Nets when they traded Damian Lillard to the Blazers for Gerald Wallace. They ended up having to overpay him to keep him in BKY so they can justify the trade. Ask them how that turned out for them.

Last team to give up something valuable for a rental player? The Bucks when they have up Tobias Harris to rent Redick for 3 months. Ask them how that turned out for them

Apples and oranges. The idiot Nets gave up their only first round pick, unprotected that ended up being #6. They didn't have any other first round picks in that draft. Suns have 3 first round picks, none of which are likely to be 17 or earlier. I speculate that if Gasol was healthy that they would have made a trade. It was too big a risk without that guarantee. Well, now he appears to be healthy and is playing lights-out. Hindsight, I know, but I thought it was worth the risk at the time. Oh well, playoffs or no, the future is a lot brighter than this time last year.

 

[sunsfan88]

You also have to realize that Pau is just stat padding on a bad team. I bet most of his points come when the other team is up by 15-20 and is hardly trying or has the benchwarmers in the game.

 

[Mainstreet]

Apples and oranges. The idiot Nets gave up their only first round pick, unprotected that ended up being #6. They didn't have any other first round picks in that draft. Suns have 3 first round picks, none of which are likely to be 17 or earlier. I speculate that if Gasol was healthy that they would have made a trade. It was too big a risk without that guarantee. Well, now he appears to be healthy and is playing lights-out. Hindsight, I know, but I thought it was worth the risk at the time. Oh well, playoffs or no, the future is a lot brighter than this time last year.

The reason I go into the financial situation on my last post is because it would have likely cost the Suns something like over 8 million to do the Okafor trade straight up for Gasol... a rental. It would have also saved the Lakers a huge amount of luxury tax. For the Lakers to ask for a first round pick or more in addition to Okafor is simply ridiculous on their part.

 

[Chaplin]

The reason I go into the financial situation on my last post is because it would have likely cost the Suns something like over 8 million to do the Okafor trade straight up for Gasol... a rental. It would have also saved the Lakers a huge amount of luxury tax. For the Lakers to ask for a first round pick or more in addition to Okafor is simply ridiculous on their part.

And because this trade was not going to net us a championship this year (or even a future championship), it becomes an almost purely financial decision. You can't really blame Sarver and the front office for going the way they did.