Give a little credit

[AZCARDSFANATIC]

Ok I for one have been all over this Oline for their awful play, but today they actually showed up. The held SF to one sack and Justin Smith to Nada not even a tackle, so good on ya Levi Brown. It's too bad your effort was wasted on what was arguably the worst QB performance since Dave Brown.

 

[Duckjake]

Ok I for one have been all over this Oline for their awful play, but today they actually showed up. The held SF to one sack and Justin Smith to Nada not even a tackle, so good on ya Levi Brown. It's too bad your effort was wasted on what was arguably the worst QB performance since Dave Brown.

Sadly something that is an all too regular occurrence for the Big Red the last couple of years.

The Cards QBs have been so bad that our two top guys going into preseason last year are now backups on other teams. Our big time FA acquisition had a 46.9 passer rating against one of the worst pass defenses in the NFL. His backup just put up a stellar 10.5 passer rating.

But, the young guys on the D were seeming to get better every week. I just hope losing Big Dan doesn't set them back in the run game.

 

[187]

Sadly something that is an all too regular occurrence for the Big Red the last couple of years.

The Cards QBs have been so bad that our two top guys going into preseason last year are now backups on other teams. Our big time FA acquisition had a 46.9 passer rating against one of the worst pass defenses in the NFL. His backup just put up a stellar 10.5 passer rating.

But, the young guys on the D were seeming to get better every week. I just hope losing Big Dan doesn't set them back in the run game.

I don't see any plausible way that it doesn't end up screwing over our run D in the base D. Our LB play isn't strong enough to make up for it. David Carter can penetrate and disrupt some plays, but he's not going to clog up the middle.

 

[GatorAZ]

Not proud to admit i once owned a Dave Brown jersey.

 

[Catfish]

Good Post-----after all the grief this unit has had to endure since Whiz and company got here, I give the O-line huge props for their performance today. Not only did they protect the QB today, but they actually gained yards on nearly every running play today. While they didn't have huge running plays, the gained 3-4 yards often, (making me wonder why we only ran the ball once nearly each offensive series). We could have used the time to rest the Defense who also played very well for the most part. (Allowing only 9 points on the first 6 trips the Niners made into the red zone was remarkable).

I guess Whiz must have believed that being invested in the game would bring him a win, because there was not one indication that he game planned for this game in the least. I will say it once again. Whiz created our QB mess. It has become quite clear that he has no idea how to fix it. Anybody who doesn't yet understand why he didn't receive an endorsement from Cowher for the Pittsburgh job, is more than likely never going to understand that Whiz and company are not capable of being a successful head coach in this League.

 

[Broseph]

offense, qb play, play calling, no running game, and a lack of a #2 wide receiver are reasons that good teams like the niners will laugh at us every time we take the field. we are not fooling anyone, and instill little fear into any teams. throw on the fact that we also don't utilize the tight end position as well. but yeah, i guess our o-line was okay today, still get destroyed on the field though.

 

[Duckjake]

Good Post-----after all the grief this unit has had to endure since Whiz and company got here, I give the O-line huge props for their performance today. Not only did they protect the QB today, but they actually gained yards on nearly every running play today. While they didn't have huge running plays, the gained 3-4 yards often, (making me wonder why we only ran the ball once nearly each offensive series). We could have used the time to rest the Defense who also played very well for the most part. (Allowing only 9 points on the first 6 trips the Niners made into the red zone was remarkable).

I guess Whiz must have believed that being invested in the game would bring him a win, because there was not one indication that he game planned for this game in the least. I will say it once again. Whiz created our QB mess. It has become quite clear that he has no idea how to fix it. Anybody who doesn't yet understand why he didn't receive an endorsement from Cowher for the Pittsburgh job, is more than likely never going to understand that Whiz and company are not capable of being a successful head coach in this League.

On the other hand allowing a team 6 trips into the redzone isn't something you want to see your defense do but that's our boys. They've been allowing teams to drive down the field only to stop them in the red zone for quite awhile now. 3 blocked FGs by CC in one season. Amazing. Calais is having a great season.

Too bad its only because he's in a contract year.

 

[az1965]

On the other hand allowing a team 6 trips into the redzone isn't something you want to see your defense do but that's our boys. They've been allowing teams to drive down the field only to stop them in the red zone for quite awhile now. 3 blocked FGs by CC in one season. Amazing. Calais is having a great season.

Too bad its only because he's in a contract year.

Not all defense... Beanie and Peterson fumbles and, I believe, one of Skelton's pick had already put them in FG range. so, 3/6 red zone trips are courtesy of our offense/ST.

 

[Duckjake]

Not all defense... Beanie and Peterson fumbles and, I believe, one of Skelton's pick had already put them in FG range. so, 3/6 red zone trips are courtesy of our offense/ST.

Forgot about the turnovers but Petersons fumble was in the 2nd half so 4/6 were on the D.

Overall SF was in scoring territory 9 times. Our guys blocked two FGs and intercepted a pass. Not bad.

 

[D-Dogg]

Yeah, that was a great performance by the oline.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Yeah the OLine held up pretty well. However the Niners only brought 4 for most of the game. They had zero fear of Skelton beating them through the air.

 

[WarnerHOF]

Yeah the OLine held up pretty well. However the Niners only brought 4 for most of the game. They had zero fear of Skelton beating them through the air.

That's an improvement since the Niners have only rushed three against this oline the last couple years and still dominated.

 

[Duckjake]

Yeah the OLine held up pretty well. However the Niners only brought 4 for most of the game. They had zero fear of Skelton beating them through the air.

Wouldn't it be the other way around? They kept 7 in coverage because they had zero fear of the Cards beating them on the ground? I think teams have realized the Cards only hope on offense is the Alien making his Alien catches because the Cards won't run the ball and that they can get pressure with 4 and so are going to just run dime packages and blanket our receivers.

 

[Phrazbit]

Wouldn't it be the other way around? They kept 7 in coverage because they had zero fear of the Cards beating them on the ground? I think teams have realized the Cards only hope on offense is the Alien making his Alien catches because the Cards won't run the ball and that they can get pressure with 4 and so are going to just run dime packages and blanket our receivers.

These arguments for and against these 2 QBs are getting so mixed up. We hear that Skelton locks onto Fitz too much, while even Kolb's backers knew that Kevin did that for weeks straight. Skelton is bad because he cant beat 7 man coverages, while Kolb is excused because he supposedly faces constant blitzs in shotgun... even though he never reads the blitz and never finds the open man.

The stinker that Skelton put up yesterday was one Kolb is every bit as capable of doing. Except maybe swap out one of Skelton's picks and a couple incompletions and turn them into Kevin Kolb sacks and fumbles.

 

[kerouac9]

Yeah the OLine held up pretty well. However the Niners only brought 4 for most of the game. They had zero fear of Skelton beating them through the air.

Duck's right; this analysis is backward. Good defenses rush QBs they're not afraid of in hopes of creating negative plays. There were times that the 49ers were only rushing 3 because they knew we had no will to run the ball.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Duck's right; this analysis is backward. Good defenses rush QBs they're not afraid of in hopes of creating negative plays. There were times that the 49ers were only rushing 3 because they knew we had no will to run the ball.

The Niners played a base defense the entire game because they could. They didn't fear our QB or our running game. They didn't have to take chances blitzing Skelton. The only thing they did was double Larry.

Billick even said during the telecast that the Niners didn't waste time disguising coverages because they felt Skelton wouldn't try to read them. All they needed to do was sit back, be patient and wait for Skelton to force the ball.

It's really a shame because our defense and special teams were playing so well yesterday. The offense really let them down.

 

[kerouac9]

The Niners played a base defense the entire game because they could. They didn't fear our QB or our running game. They didn't have to take chances blitzing Skelton. The only thing they did was double Larry.

Billick even said during the telecast that the Niners didn't waste time disguising coverages because they felt Skelton wouldn't try to read them. All they needed to do was sit back, be patient and wait for Skelton to force the ball.

It's really a shame because our defense and special teams were playing so well yesterday. The offense really let them down.

I'm baffled as to how this changes the facts as I laid them out.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I'm baffled as to how this changes the facts as I laid them out.

You said:

Good defenses rush QBs they're not afraid of in hopes of creating negative plays.

Well we just played a good defense that forced our QB to throw bad passes without even having to rush more than 4. I thought it was pretty obvious to see watching the game.

Hell even Kent Sommers said:

The 49ers did nothing elaborate on defense all day. They didn't have to. They played simple coverages and allowed their good players to take over. The 49ers are 9-1 because of their defense, and the Cardinals needed efficient quarterback play to have a chance to win. They didn't get it.


Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/sports/cardinals/articles/2011/11/20/20111120arizona-cardinals-san-francisco-49ers-rewind.html?page=3#ixzz1eNyxFezd

The Cardinal offense was so bad that the Niners treated this game like it was a preseason game.

 

[kerouac9]

You said:



Well we just played a good defense that forced our QB to throw bad passes without even having to rush more than 4. I thought it was pretty obvious to see watching the game.

Hell even Kent Sommers said:



The Cardinal offense was so bad that the Niners treated this game like it was a preseason game.

This is some pretty ridiculous a priori reasoning: The 49ers are a good defense, so whatever the 49ers defense did was the best structural way to approach a quarterback they're unafraid of?

That must've been why teams were rushing 3 and dropping 8 all year last year against Derek Anderson, John Skelton, and Max Hall. Oh, wait. That's not what happened at all. Last year teams went mercilessly against our crappy QBs because they knew that they couldn't identify the hot route and get the ball to the open receiver.

Skelton has developed enough to this point that he can identify the hot receiver and get the ball to him with room to run. The next step is to flood the field with coverage players and see if Skelton can identify coverages. What Fazio said was that Skelton wasn't in that position yet. He's coming out the the Patriot League, for Christ's sake.

Next Skelton needs to work on diagnosing coverages, and the defenses around the league will start disguising them.

The fact remains that when teams are faced with good quarterbacks like Brady, Brees, Rodgers, and Manning, they don't blitz the QB if they're trying to win. They rush four or fewer and crowd the field with coverage to make the QB throw through tight windows. That's why New Orleans needs to run the ball now more than ever--to ensure that teams are putting seven or eight men in the box to open up throwing lanes.

I'm not comparing Skelton to those elite quarterbacks; Skelton's facing much more elementary coverages, but it's a step forward when teams realize that they can't blitz a young QB into making mistakes and instead sits back and asks the QB to beat them.

 

[MadCardDisease]

The fact remains that when teams are faced with good quarterbacks like Brady, Brees, Rodgers, and Manning, they don't blitz the QB if they're trying to win. They rush four or fewer and crowd the field with coverage to make the QB throw through tight windows. That's why New Orleans needs to run the ball now more than ever--to ensure that teams are putting seven or eight men in the box to open up throwing lanes.

I'm not comparing Skelton to those elite quarterbacks; Skelton's facing much more elementary coverages, but it's a step forward when teams realize that they can't blitz a young QB into making mistakes and instead sits back and asks the QB to beat them.

I'm not debating that at all. You don't blitz great QB because they will beat you every time. Hell we saw that with Warner on an almost weekly basis.

I'm saying that the Niners completely threw that way of thinking out the window. The whole reason teams blitz young QBs is to force them into bad decisions. Skelton made bad decisions without much pressure what so ever. There was zero need to blitz.

 

[AZCARDSFANATIC]

Too be honest the 49ers are one of the lowest % blitzing teams. They really didn't alter things that much, they have been successful against most of their opponents without blitzing much.

 

[Jetstream Green]

as far as pass blocking, the OL gave their best performance against the Niners and it was wasted

 

[nationsrj]

I checked the play by play and the first half SF possessions were

1) Get ball on SF 19 after punt(and penalty), result a Blocked FG from the AZ 28(on the defense).

2) Get ball on AZ 38 after Interception, result a Missed FG from the AZ 31(defense no first downs).

3) Get ball on SF 37 after Punt and 15 yard penalty, result FG from the AZ 4(on the defense).

4) Get ball on AZ 26 after fumble, result FG from the AZ 25(defense no first downs).

5) Get ball at SF 39 after punt, result Blocked FG from the AZ 12.(on the defense.)

6) Get ball at SF 14 after punt and penalty, result FG from the AZ 11(on the defense).