Going shopping: 2012 Free Agency

[JCSunsfan]

Babby says the Suns will have enough for 2 max free agents this summer. There are two key questions. How are they going to free up that much money? And who would they pursue? It sounds like they are planning on going after someone.

Freeing up that much money. The Suns are on the hook for $30 million for next year. That is without Nash, Hill, or Lopez and without any cap hold for picks. The max contract for a player with 6 or fewer years in the league is $14.5 million. The max for 7-9 years is $17.4 million. The salary cap is probably going to be around $58.5 million. So the Suns would be about $28 million under. They can gain a little bit of room by amnestying Childress ($6.5 million). That would give them $34.5 million. Then you subtract a first round pick cap hold of $2 to $2.5 million. That puts them at $32 million. They could waive Warrick and/or Frye and under the stretch provision gain up to an additional $7 million depending on the need.

So, they could have nearly $40 million in free agent money, but they would do that without Nash, Hill, Childress, Frye, and Warrick. That would also include not resigning any of the one year deals (Telfair, Brown, Price etc.) In fact, its easier to list the players that they would have. Gortat, Dudley, Morris and the rookie they draft. That's it.

I believe Hill will resign for the vet minimum after we have signed free agents. I would guess that we paid him what we did this year with that expectation. We will make an offer to Nash of $6 million or so and I expect he will take it. We will let Lopez walk. I just don't see a future here for him based upon recent performance. Frye and Warrick will remain unless we really see an opportunity to sign someone. So plan on having around $24 million available.

 

[JCSunsfan]

That would mean we have max dollars for one FA and some for another, but not max money. Deron Williams and Dwight Howard would be $17.5 million free agents. I am not sure who else would be considered max free agents.

Gordon at $14.5 million would be a possibility. But injuries are a concern there. I would consider DWilliams. Other reasonable ideas?

 

[hcsilla]

Batum for 8-10 millions.

However, for this amount he probably will have more (a lot of?) suitors.

I think that there is a zero chance that Deron Williams will sign to the Suns, he will have much more desirable destinations.

 

[Folster]

Darrell Arthur is a guy I really like and is restricted this year. I believe he was poised for a breakout year at PF for Memphis especially with Randolph out. His season ending injury may be a blessing in disguise as the Grizzlies may not elect to keep him with Speights now on the team. The Suns could nab him for cheap

 

[jandaman]

Celtics
Mavericks

will also have around 30 Million available.

Celtics also can resign Ray Allen and Garnett for veteran minimum, which will definitely make it very attractive for FA stars.

Mavericks have Dirk Nowitski and a bunch of good role playing former stars.... and Cuban who isnt afraid to spend money to win rings...

Those 2 teams alone are going to be very very tough to compete with in terms of winning over FAs.

On top of that, the new CBA allows teams to offer more cash and offer MAX to rookies who have been all-stars during their rookie contracts....



For 2012 and 2013, the draft is the best way to obtain youth. The league for the immediate future looks to be shifting to a multiple stars teaming up together and teams keeping their rookie stars.


Unless Suns overpay for Batum, Mayo, Beasley etc.... Smart drafting, placing your team to draft a great prospect, signing 3rd option-type players to decent contracts is the way to go.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Clearly, neither Williams nor Howard are coming here. We know that nobody else deserves a max contract.

Paying Gordon anywhere near 14.5 or Batum 8-10 million per year would be the height of stupidity, but wouldn't surprise me. Bad teams have cash to burn, and continuing the farce that is the Nash show will compel us to overpay for mediocre talent, further setting our future back.

And JC, you're living in a fantasy land if you think Nash will sign for 6 million. Considering he's been underpaid his entire tenure here, and playing at as high a level as before, it's extremely unlikely that he'd settle for less than what he's currently making.

Let's face it, the Suns will not get back to being a legit contender until we get some stars, and filling up our cap with the Gordons/Batums of the world only exacerbate the truly ******** signings of late. (Chilz/Frye/Warrick)

Really, our only real chance of acquiring a franchise changing player will be the draft, and we've given up any hope of making that happen. So we'll trot out General Nash and crew for a couple more years, sign a couple stupid contracts, miss the playoffs and US Airways center will be a ghost town. On the bright side, we'll also be bereft of young talent! Good times.

 

[jandaman]

Offering Max for Eric Gordon is a BAD move.

(1) Coming off a knee injury.
(2) 6'3 Shooting Guard with a history of knee injury, who isnt a sharp shooter, isnt Wade-like athletic.


Batum @ 7-8 Million a year is OK.... anything over is NOT OK.


Suns need to get serious of finding that next SUPER STAR if they ever want to contend again.


For 2013, I wouldnt mind Suns offering 10-12 Million a year for James Harden, he looks to be a solid borderline star... 20ppg 5rpg 5apg type... Joe Johnson type player.

2013 Draft also has another superstar potential talent... Shabaaz Muhammad and Jabari Parker comes to mind.

 

[Cheesebeef]

oh good lord... Batum/Gordon is EXACTLY like Villanueva/Gordon. a move that does nothing but keep us a 30 win team forever.

we just need to bottom out. The best teams in the league pretty much ALL revolve around someone picked in the top 5 of their respective drafts. Unless we can somehow swing a miracle and get Howard/Williams, that ain't gonna happen here either in FA or in the draft.

 

[jandaman]

oh good lord... Batum/Gordon is EXACTLY like Villanueva/Gordon. a move that does nothing but keep us a 30 win team forever.

we just need to bottom out. The best teams in the league pretty much ALL revolve around someone picked in the top 5 of their respective drafts. Unless we can somehow swing a miracle and get Howard/Williams, that ain't gonna happen here either in FA or in the draft.

Yeah... TANKING is actually the BEST option, but I can understand if fans dont want to see Suns purposely lose.

But theres a way around it.... Put Nash on the shelf every 3rd game or DNP, make an excuse "Sore thighs" or something.

 

[sunsfan88]

I don't care if Gordon has injury problems, I don't care if he has a broken leg. If we can offer big cotracts to scrubs like Warrick, Frye & Childress then why the hell can't we offer the max to a young player who could be fixed up by our medical staff.

And don't forget, Gordon isn't like Amare.....EG actually plays well on both ends of the court!

 

[JCSunsfan]

Clearly, neither Williams nor Howard are coming here. We know that nobody else deserves a max contract.

Paying Gordon anywhere near 14.5 or Batum 8-10 million per year would be the height of stupidity, but wouldn't surprise me. Bad teams have cash to burn, and continuing the farce that is the Nash show will compel us to overpay for mediocre talent, further setting our future back.

And JC, you're living in a fantasy land if you think Nash will sign for 6 million. Considering he's been underpaid his entire tenure here, and playing at as high a level as before, it's extremely unlikely that he'd settle for less than what he's currently making.

Let's face it, the Suns will not get back to being a legit contender until we get some stars, and filling up our cap with the Gordons/Batums of the world only exacerbate the truly ******** signings of late. (Chilz/Frye/Warrick)

Really, our only real chance of acquiring a franchise changing player will be the draft, and we've given up any hope of making that happen. So we'll trot out General Nash and crew for a couple more years, sign a couple stupid contracts, miss the playoffs and US Airways center will be a ghost town. On the bright side, we'll also be bereft of young talent! Good times.

Its a fantasy to think that any other team is going to offer Nash $14 million. I am not counting on Nash resigning here. It just looks to me like that is what he is going to do. Otherwise he would be gone already.

 

[JS22]

I like Gordon, though I'm a little worried about his injuries this year. 10-12 million isn't ridiculous IMO. Truth is, the Suns are going to need to overpay a little in order to get some talent here. I think Gordon can become that 20-25 points a night scorer that the Suns desperately need.

Pair him with Nash and Gortat and you'd at least make some noise as long as you can strengthen your bench a little. I've accepted the fact that the Suns aren't going to go into full rebuild mode. So I think Gordon would be a great option if he's healthy.

Isn't the Suns starting lineup the third or fourth most efficient in the league? I think I read that somewhere. It's the bench that is KILLING them. Gordon would make the Suns starting lineup one of the best in the league. Dudley can move to the 3 if Hill retires, or to the bench as a 6th man if Hill returns.

Any way the Suns could get Lou back? If Hill sticks around, having Dudley, Lou, Frye, and ?Redd? of the bench would be pretty solid. Just need a decent PG. Too bad they traded Dragic for ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

Nash
Gordon
Hill
Morris
Gortat
--
PG?
Redd (If he returns on a small contract & is healthy.)
Dudley
Amundson
Frye

Would be a pretty good 10 man rotation if you could get a decent PG here.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Its a fantasy to think that any other team is going to offer Nash $14 million. I am not counting on Nash resigning here. It just looks to me like that is what he is going to do. Otherwise he would be gone already.

He currently makes 11.6 million, nice try though. We'll see if he ends up closer to that # or your 6 million dollar fantasy.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I like Gordon, though I'm a little worried about his injuries this year. 10-12 million isn't ridiculous IMO. Truth is, the Suns are going to need to overpay a little in order to get some talent here. I think Gordon can become that 20-25 points a night scorer that the Suns desperately need.

Pair him with Nash and Gortat and you'd at least make some noise as long as you can strengthen your bench a little. I've accepted the fact that the Suns aren't going to go into full rebuild mode. So I think Gordon would be a great option if he's healthy.

Isn't the Suns starting lineup the third or fourth most efficient in the league? I think I read that somewhere. It's the bench that is KILLING them. Gordon would make the Suns starting lineup one of the best in the league. Dudley can move to the 3 if Hill retires, or to the bench as a 6th man if Hill returns.

Any way the Suns could get Lou back? If Hill sticks around, having Dudley, Lou, Frye, and ?Redd? of the bench would be pretty solid. Just need a decent PG. Too bad they traded Dragic for ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

Nash
Gordon
Hill
Morris
Gortat
--
PG?
Redd (If he returns on a small contract & is healthy.)
Dudley
Amundson
Frye

Would be a pretty good 10 man rotation if you could get a decent PG here.

10-12 wouldn't be awful for Gordon, but wouldn't be great either. He's a decent young player but too short for 2 guard, doesn't distribute and isn't a very good defender. 10-12 per year is a lot, especially considering now he's an injury risk.

In any event, best case scenario, where do you see that team ending up? Nash and Hill will both be a year older. Is it worth overpaying for Eric Gordon to just miss the playoffs, or to be a 7-8 seed with no flexibility and getting our asses kicked in the first round?

Still waiting on Budden and Superbone to put together their concrete explanations of how the critics of Sarver's "master" plan are wrong.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think Kris Humphries, Javale McGee and Roy Hibbert will be among the attractive players in free agency. Ersan Ilyasova might be a good pickup perhaps flying just under the radar. I do covet another big man. I left Brook Lopez (and Robin Lopez) off my list. In addition the Suns obviously need another PG and a SG. There may not be a lot of big name players but I do think there are some unpolished or hidden gems available.

Here is a link:

http://www.hoopsworld.com/2012-nba-free-agents

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I think Kris Humphries, Javale McGee and Roy Hibbert will be among the attractive players in free agency. Ersan Ilyasova might be a good pickup perhaps flying just under the radar. I do covet another big man. I left Brook Lopez (and Robin Lopez) off my list. In addition the Suns obviously need another PG and a SG. There may not be a lot of big name players but I do think there are some unpolished or hidden gems available.

Here is a link:

http://www.hoopsworld.com/2012-nba-free-agents

Well, we have a center, and I'm not sure if Gortat can play PF. We know McGee and Hibbert can't play PF.

I'd be ok with a Humphries or Ilyasova, but if either is one of your top 3 players, you're still an awful team. I'd be fine giving guys like this a 1 or 2 year deal for 5 or so, but you know there will be teams with cash to burn who will outbid us, or cause us to bid too much.

We're in an awful place right now. Can't get a franchise player to come here, and we refuse to accept the reality that a top 3-5 pick is our only chance to get a franchise player.

We'll be like many of the other also-rans in the league - not good enough to attract top talent, forced to overpay for mediocre talent once good players commit, and killing our flexibility and chance at a top pick. Good times!

 

[JCSunsfan]

I have a problem with bringing in Brook Lopez as a pf. I think his mobility would be an issue. Markieff Morris is a nice piece at pf. He has a nice combination of skills. Lets get an all-star wing.

Over paying for Gordon might be the way we have to go. Just insure the contract.

 

[Folster]

Eric Gordon reportedly admitted to having "minor" cartilage damage in his knee that he just had surgery on.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I have a problem with bringing in Brook Lopez as a pf. I think his mobility would be an issue. Markieff Morris is a nice piece at pf. He has a nice combination of skills. Lets get an all-star wing.

Over paying for Gordon might be the way we have to go. Just insure the contract.

Brook Lopez is a center, and an average one at that. Decent scorer, horrible passer, joke of a rebounder and poor defender. Definitely not someone to build around, especially if you already have a center.

You really think Morris can be a starting PF in this league?

And we don't "have" to do anything RE: Gordon. Paying him more than 12 mil per year would go against everything that Babby said.

 

[JS22]

Eric Gordon reportedly admitted to having "minor" cartilage damage in his knee that he just had surgery on.

Well that sucks.

I know the Suns don't want to rebuild over a 3-4 year period, but that's really the best option. I'm just trying to come up with scenarios that don't involve doing so, since they've clearly stated that they're going to try and become "elite" again in 1-2 years.

 

[jandaman]

I don't care if Gordon has injury problems, I don't care if he has a broken leg. If we can offer big cotracts to scrubs like Warrick, Frye & Childress then why the hell can't we offer the max to a young player who could be fixed up by our medical staff.

And don't forget, Gordon isn't like Amare.....EG actually plays well on both ends of the court!

Eric Gordon's first 4years in the NBA

Played 78 out of 82 games
Played 62 out of 82 games
Played 58 out of 82 games
Played 2 out of 66 games (assuming he is out for the season with cartilage damage on his knees)


Yup, this isnt an Amare Stoudemire case at all....
Gordon is 6'3.... HE IS ALREADY short for a shooting guard.... he cant play point guard..... he relies heavily on his athletics, running, movement....
I'd take a risk on him for maybe 6-7 million a year MAX..... Suns staff can help him.... BUT, you dont sign a high risk player to a friggin 20% of the team's cap room especially for the Suns who NEED to rebuild carefully....

Gordon is not a superstar anyways, he is a potential star player, but too short to be a superstar at the SG position.... Monta Ellis tier type....
If Gordon had Wade like athletics.. then I can see him dominating but sadly he is just a decent athlete and not an elite one.

Suns need a different direction.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Brook Lopez is a center, and an average one at that. Decent scorer, horrible passer, joke of a rebounder and poor defender. Definitely not someone to build around, especially if you already have a center.

You really think Morris can be a starting PF in this league?

And we don't "have" to do anything RE: Gordon. Paying him more than 12 mil per year would go against everything that Babby said.

Yes, I think Morris can be a starter--not a star starter. Championship teams have two or three stars. The other starters, while not stars are highly competent players. I think Morris could be a non-star type starter. He plays the whole game, offense, defense, rebounding, shooting. He is not bad at anything. Its sort of the Raja Bell type of role.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Yes, I think Morris can be a starter--not a star starter. Championship teams have two or three stars. The other starters, while not stars are highly competent players. I think Morris could be a non-star type starter. He plays the whole game, offense, defense, rebounding, shooting. He is not bad at anything. Its sort of the Raja Bell type of role.

He may not be bad at anything, but he's not great at anything either. Most fringe starters are exceptional at something, and we saw earlier what happened when Quieff started. I think he'll be a fine bench guy, but don't see him as a starter on a good team.

 

[BC867]

... we saw earlier what happened when Quieff started. I think he'll be a fine bench guy, but don't see him as a starter on a good team.

What we saw was a rookie playing a power position who didn't immediately learn how to stay out of foul trouble.

And, so far, he has closed some good games for us, right from the start.

I defer to what his Coach thinks about him.

 

[Superbone]

What we saw was a rookie playing a power position who didn't immediately learn how to stay out of foul trouble.

And, so far, he has closed some good games for us, right from the start.

I defer to what his Coach thinks about him.

Right on, BC.