Green should swallow pride and accept part of the blame

[Lex]

A caller on the Denny Green show yesterday asked about the Kendall move:

Denny said "I really believe you must play your draft picks."

We replaced a high priced free agent guard, converted to center one year ago, with argueably the best center in the draft, from the Big Ten, with a National Championship on his resume.

Most of our surprising defensive players are brand new Denny guys.

Most of our offensive players are the same ones we had last year.

 

[clif]

A caller on the Denny Green show yesterday asked about the Kendall move:

Denny said "I really believe you must play your draft picks."

We replaced a high priced free agent guard, converted to center one year ago, with argueably the best center in the draft, from the Big Ten, with a National Championship on his resume.

Most of our surprising defensive players are brand new Denny guys.

Most of our offensive players are the same ones we had last year.

I can go with that.

 

[red desert]

1) He messed up the OL, not that it was good before, but he has made it worse than it HAS to be. And the argument that longterm he'll fix it is irrelevant to me because AC isn't part of that longterm and neither is Spikes, and apparently to him at least neither is LJ. Green keeps glossing over the problems Step is having as either youth or inexperience, we had 2 experienced Centers on the team, he cut them both, he can't use that as an excuse now it's simply duplicitous.

2) green committed to josh, even Green is openly admitting he's not running the offense the way it's meant to be run. Green either has to get Josh to fix it, or put someone else in there. This is Green's QB, he chose to cut Blake, cut Parsons, keep Josh, sign King and draft Navarre, all 3 QB's are his personal choice, again he can't claim inexperience because he created the situation. NO problem with Parsons gone, understand why he cut Blake, but in the end you can't complain about the depth of a hole you dug.

3) playcalling. If Wood is calling plays poorly, and he's Green's choice for OC, again it's on Green. If Green takes over the playcalling, and we're dink and dunk downfield, either the playcalling stinks, or it's good but his QB just screwed it up with mistakes. Frankly we could have had 28 points Sunday so I'm not convinced the calls were all bad, I just think the QB messed it up with 3 fumbles, and Williams with a 4th. but Green does keep putting Josh into positions where his penchant for mistakes is going to crop up, that's on him to either eliminate those situations, or replace Josh.

4) Playmakers, we have one on the roster and he's recovering from knee surgery. Green chose to keep Smith as his starter and not pursue a breakaway RB. Green chose to take Fitz over a better athlete(Roy), a young QB (Ben) or an impact defensive player(Sean taylor). The fact that people keep saying Josh can't make plays because there are no playmakers is partly on Green because so far his first pick isn't making plays. He's going to be good, and with a better QB he'll be a huge redzone asset, but again Green picked him, if he's not good enough now, that's partly on Green.


Overall I think on the field Green is doing a terrific job, his defensive choices have paid huge dividends, his draft largely looks great. The team is clearly headed in the right path. But the fact that we're 0-3 is directly related to offensive decisions he's made that haven't panned out yet.

Exactly.

 

[Russ Smith]

A caller on the Denny Green show yesterday asked about the Kendall move:

Denny said "I really believe you must play your draft picks."

We replaced a high priced free agent guard, converted to center one year ago, with argueably the best center in the draft, from the Big Ten, with a National Championship on his resume.

.

So you think Step is better than Jake Grove. Again that's JAKE the top rated C in the draft, and the first one picked, and did I mention his name is Jake?

The only oen arguing Step is the best C in the draft is you. Do you think Craig Krenzel was arguably the best QB in the draft, he too won a NC and played in the Big 10.

Come on lex, just say you think the guy has a future, I do too, but he's not ready to start now and that lack of readiness has hurt us 3 games in a row.

 

[spanky1]

So you think Step is better than Jake Grove. Again that's JAKE the top rated C in the draft, and the first one picked, and did I mention his name is Jake?

The only oen arguing Step is the best C in the draft is you. Do you think Craig Krenzel was arguably the best QB in the draft, he too won a NC and played in the Big 10.

Come on lex, just say you think the guy has a future, I do too, but he's not ready to start now and that lack of readiness has hurt us 3 games in a row.

I wanted us to draft Jake Grove.....but he was going to go too high and in Dansby we helped out our cause better.....especially since LeVar Fisher went kaput!. I'm not sure he'll turn out any better than Steph in the long run......they are not too disimilar.

Steph is not the weak link in the O-Line........and the experience he's getting right now will pay off huge before too long!

 

[Lex]

Russ-

I did say "argueably" because I knew there would be a debate about that.

He was a National Champion center, can't take that away from him.

I like Big Ten centers because they run the ball in the Big Ten.

I also think we could debate weather or not sticking a young guy in there sink or swim has long term benefits. Denny seems to think it's best to let them play.

And I'm not really sure his line calls are the reason our line has struggled. Denny seems to think our coaching staffs' calls have been suspect.

I think players should realize that when Dennis Green drafts TWO players at your position, you should cancel your local newspaper delivery, and call a real estate agent.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Russ-

I did say "argueably" because I knew there would be a debate about that.

He was a National Champion center, can't take that away from him.

I like Big Ten centers because they run the ball in the Big Ten.

I also think we could debate weather or not sticking a young guy in there sink or swim has long term benefits. Denny seems to think it's best to let them play.

And I'm not really sure his line calls are the reason our line has struggled. Denny seems to think our coaching staffs' calls have been suspect.

I think players should realize that when Dennis Green drafts TWO players at your position, you should cancel your local newspaper delivery, and call a real estate agent.

Lex,

While I will agree with you that Step has a bright future, it cannot be overstated how starting him right now, is hurting the oline. It showed in the Rams game, showed even more in the Pats game when Wilfork did everything to him but bend him over, and then again in this last game when he made Coleman look like a superstar.

As bad as everyone comes down on Clement I would say that right now Step is a greater liability. (Not greater than Spikes it appears)

I think he will be fine in the long run but he is certainly not anywhere close yet.

 

[clif]

Lex,

While I will agree with you that Step has a bright future, it cannot be overstated how starting him right now, is hurting the oline. It showed in the Rams game, showed even more in the Pats game when Wilfork did everything to him but bend him over, and then again in this last game when he made Coleman look like a superstar.

As bad as everyone comes down on Clement I would say that right now Step is a greater liability. (Not greater than Spikes it appears)

I think he will be fine in the long run but he is certainly not anywhere close yet.

I agree that Kendall not being there is hurting the team right now, but I will take hurting now for results and a bright future down the road.

Lets look at it this way... had kendall been here the line probably would have been playing better, but would that have meant the difference between playoffs and elimination? I seriously doubt it. This team is being groomed for the future and what better way to get your team solid up the middle than having your young center and your young QB growing and learning together?

 

[Lex]

I also think Stepanovich would look a lot better if Leonard Davis was lined up next to him like Kendall had.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

I also think Stepanovich would look a lot better if Leonard Davis was lined up next to him like Kendall had.

Can't that arguement go both ways? I mean cant Spikes say he would be playing a lot better if he had Kendell beside him instead of a rookie?

 

[red desert]

I do not care if we shut Vick down or not. We lost and that is the measure that counts.

Too true. That's my point. How anyone can disagree with that is beyond me.

 

[red desert]

Russ-

I think players should realize that when Dennis Green drafts TWO players at your position, you should cancel your local newspaper delivery, and call a real estate agent.

That's an interesting point. I wonder if Kendall was gone long before the alleged "mole" incident?

 

[Russ Smith]

But I like his chances on fixing the offense as opposed to the defense.
As you said before, this team could get good in a hurry if the defense keeps up it's play.

Oh I totally agree, I was trying to make a logic argument and did so poorly. The same people saying hey it's 3 games, you can't declare the QB a bust, the offense a bust, the OL a bust etc, are also raving about the defense.

If the offense can't be judged after 3 games, neither should the defense. We all like what we see in the defense and that's why we're willing to accept that Green's staff is responsible(adding talent, and scheme). We dislike the offense so hey it's just some tweaking needed. Yes Quan and Shipp make a difference as others have said, but the fact is Green BENCHED Shipp, we have no idea how much he'd be playing now we're all guessing on that point.

 

[Russ Smith]

I wanted us to draft Jake Grove.....but he was going to go too high and in Dansby we helped out our cause better.....especially since LeVar Fisher went kaput!. I'm not sure he'll turn out any better than Steph in the long run......they are not too disimilar.

Steph is not the weak link in the O-Line........and the experience he's getting right now will pay off huge before too long!

In short Grove's a better athlete across the board, thus the higher ranking. Step is smart, hard working, a competitor, and has been on a winner, Grove is simply a better talent.

Grove has been brought along slower in Oakland because they kept their Frank Garcia in Adam Treu knowing Grove wasn't ready to call the linecalls, we didn't.

 

[Russ Smith]

Russ-

I did say "argueably" because I knew there would be a debate about that.

He was a National Champion center, can't take that away from him.

I like Big Ten centers because they run the ball in the Big Ten.

I also think we could debate weather or not sticking a young guy in there sink or swim has long term benefits. Denny seems to think it's best to let them play.

And I'm not really sure his line calls are the reason our line has struggled. Denny seems to think our coaching staffs' calls have been suspect.

I think players should realize that when Dennis Green drafts TWO players at your position, you should cancel your local newspaper delivery, and call a real estate agent.

I guess I would say how many people have to make the argument before it's an argument? Find even one scouting report pre draft that had Step ahead of Grove, haven't seen one. Everyone had him going about where we took him or later. Not even the Cards radio guys who presumably have some inside knowledge are touting his play yet.

I do agree he probably will eventually be a solid player, has a pedigree, has tenacity, he's just a limited athlete and that's why he likely will never be a great C, just hopefully a good one.

Frankly I felt he was as much to blame as anybody in the New England game, there were clearly blocking breakdowns totally on scheme, he makes those calls.

 

[pete]

I guess I would say how many people have to make the argument before it's an argument? Find even one scouting report pre draft that had Step ahead of Grove, haven't seen one. Everyone had him going about where we took him or later. Not even the Cards radio guys who presumably have some inside knowledge are touting his play yet.

I do agree he probably will eventually be a solid player, has a pedigree, has tenacity, he's just a limited athlete and that's why he likely will never be a great C, just hopefully a good one.

Frankly I felt he was as much to blame as anybody in the New England game, there were clearly blocking breakdowns totally on scheme, he makes those calls.

Step has made mistakes but you expect that from a rookie in his first season. You don't really expect it from players like Big and AC though. They should be beyond some of the mistakes they are making.

Green said they had targeted Step and that he was very high on the Card's draft board. Based on the way some of these other draft picks are turning out, I expect Step will pan out too. He's playing a difficult position for a rookie but Green knew that when he decided to start him. I bet by about the middle of the season, he will look much more solid than he does now.

 

[Russ Smith]

Step has made mistakes but you expect that from a rookie in his first season. You don't really expect it from players like Big and AC though. They should be beyond some of the mistakes they are making.

Green said they had targeted Step and that he was very high on the Card's draft board. Based on the way some of these other draft picks are turning out, I expect Step will pan out too. He's playing a difficult position for a rookie but Green knew that when he decided to start him. I bet by about the middle of the season, he will look much more solid than he does now.

agree. but I think that would be the case if we had kept Garcia or another veteran named pete and groomed Step for the job the way the Raiders are Grove.

 

[Duckjake]

In short Grove's a better athlete across the board, thus the higher ranking. Step is smart, hard working, a competitor, and has been on a winner, Grove is simply a better talent.

Grove has been brought along slower in Oakland because they kept their Frank Garcia in Adam Treu knowing Grove wasn't ready to call the linecalls, we didn't.

How do we know that Kendall was ready to make the linecalls last season?

How do we know that it wasn't Kendall's inexperience at C that caused the horrific problems with the Oline last year.

How do we know that Kendall didn't pull a Chavous and tell Green that he wasn't going back to Guard only then to change his mind for Jets green?

Anybody got any facts?