How credible is Matt Miller? Interesting things he said.

[Arz101]

Has no one ever heard of the word "sarcasm" on this board?

 

[Krangodnzr]

Looks like my Sarcasm in the post didn't come through.

Sarcasm really requires more inflection to be effective.

IMO the Cardinals need to give Rosen one more year UNLESS a team offers at least a 1st and a 3rd for him. I'd consider that, because even though I don't like the idea of missing on Bosa, Murray is a pretty damn good player and I think he has a good shot to be pretty good.

 

[wa52lz]

Maybe 5" 10". Some of the pundits are waiting to see if he remeasures at his "pro day" as the probers are questioning his combine measurement. If he does not remeasure.....

Soon as I heard he measured 5'10" this is all I could think about...

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[wa52lz]

take all the - talk on all these guys with some sugar...remember last year
Lamar Jackson won't be a QB - can't read a defense - will have to play WR, yea how'd that work out
QUOTE]


Pretty good if you have a defense that only gives up 16.7pts (pts given up in his 6 wins) and are looking for a game manager that completes 58.24% of the 25 or less passes he attempts a game, and you only need him to throw for 3 TDs in the 6 games he wins. He had 5 total in his 7 starts, 2 in a loss to KC

 

[cardpa]

First year stats of QBs who went on to success. Giving up on Rosen after just one year with an offense that ran the ball over 70% of the time between the center and guard and a Oline that couldn't hold a block for more than a couple of seconds and receivers that couldn't catch a cold and he's now a bust? Then all these guys should have been tossed to the wayside too if you are going to judge him after a single season.

Troy Aikman
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
11 293 155 52.9 1,749 6.0 159.0 9 18 55.7

John Elway
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
11 259 123 47.5 1,663 6.4 151.2 7 14 54.9

Payton Manning
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
16 575 326 56.7 3,739 6.5 233.7 26 28 71.2

Joe Theismann
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
14 163 79 48.5 1,036 6.4 74.0 8 10 59.8

Steve Young
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
14 363 195 53.7 2,282 6.3 163.0 8 13 65.5

Eli Manning
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
9 197 95 48.2 1,043 5.3 115.9 6 9 55.4

Jared Goff
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
7 205 112 54.6 1,089 5.3 155.6 5 7 63.6

And Rosen's stats
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
14 393 217 55.2 2,278 5.8 162.7 11 14 66.7

 

[cardsunsfan]

First year stats of QBs who went on to success. Giving up on Rosen after just one year with an offense that ran the ball over 70% of the time between the center and guard and a Oline that couldn't hold a block for more than a couple of seconds and receivers that couldn't catch a cold and he's now a bust? Then all these guys should have been tossed to the wayside too if you are going to judge him after a single season.

Troy Aikman
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
11 293 155 52.9 1,749 6.0 159.0 9 18 55.7

John Elway
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
11 259 123 47.5 1,663 6.4 151.2 7 14 54.9

Payton Manning
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
16 575 326 56.7 3,739 6.5 233.7 26 28 71.2

Joe Theismann
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
14 163 79 48.5 1,036 6.4 74.0 8 10 59.8

Steve Young
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
14 363 195 53.7 2,282 6.3 163.0 8 13 65.5

Eli Manning
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
9 197 95 48.2 1,043 5.3 115.9 6 9 55.4

Jared Goff
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
7 205 112 54.6 1,089 5.3 155.6 5 7 63.6

And Rosen's stats
G Att Comp Pct Yds Avg Yds/G TD Int Rate
14 393 217 55.2 2,278 5.8 162.7 11 14 66.7

I gave similar stats as well as to why you should have to give up a lot to get Rosen.. first year QB's often suck and you sacrifice that year with them so they can get some experience.. kind of would suck to start all of over again...

 

[Solar7]

Has no one ever heard of the word "sarcasm" on this board?

My bad, read it at a glance right before I had to step back to the office, so I didn't get a chance to pick up on the undertones.

 

[juza76]

The rookie season is hard to judge
But what can be considered is when a player regress game by game, this is more then a issue, is a mental factor
That remind me the path of Blaine Gabbert

 

[Jetstream Green]

The rookie season is hard to judge
But what can be considered is when a player regress game by game, this is more then a issue, is a mental factor
That remind me the path of Blaine Gabbert

But the starting roster got worst too around him. That's not mental, that is the reality

 

[Zeno]

But the starting roster got worst too around him. That's not mental, that is the reality

Yep, he kept losing OL and eventually Kirk.

 

[HeHasRosen]

I would much rather have Bosa and if Rosen fails have a chance at Tua or Lawrence. I think they are better prospects than Murray. If we draft Murray we wont be taking either of them.

 

[JeffGollin]

“Whoever takes Murray will be in the playoffs and probably deep into the playoffs”

If Murray can't immediately get us into the playoffs, why draft him?

We'd be better off using the #1 pick on Bosa or Q Williams, riding the Rosen horse and praying.

 

[Krangodnzr]

If Murray can't immediately get us into the playoffs, why draft him?

We'd be better off using the #1 pick on Bosa or Q Williams, riding the Rosen horse and praying.

Yep and again, if Rosen doesn't show a ton of progress....get Tua who I like more than Murray.

 

[scandalous_b]

I just read his post combine analysis & mock draft. He basically said "now that the draft is over, my thoughts on what I think & what I'm hearing". He said "I haven't talked to one coach, agent, Scout or general manager that doesn't believe the cardinals will draft anyone other than kyler Murray with the #1 pick". Either the cardinals are putting up a damn good smokescreen or everyone already knows? Other links I'm reading say they're shopping rosen to other teams. I realize there's been a gazillion threads about this already but we have the #1 pick & it needs to be talked about. I just don't want them to screw this pick up on the wrong player. Many on this board want Rosen gone while others want them to keep Rosen. Personally I think rosen needs more time, but what if they don't draft Murray & he becomes an all world QB for another team? Then all the talking heads will say the cardinals screwed the #1 pick up. Then again, if they trade Rosen, he becomes a damn good QB & murray ends up being a bust, we all know how that will be talked about, it could set us back another 5-10 yrs. Lots of unknowns right now, I'll get on board with whatever decision they make because I'm a lifelong cardinals fan but I want them to get it right. The safest bet would be to take bosa & keep Rosen, build around him & see what happens. Or trade down, pick up Williams or allen, keep Rosen & build with the extra picks & free agency. Time will tell but all the talk isn't going away until the draft gets closer.

Matt Miller is a big 49ers fan that wants Nick Bosa.

I honestly do wonder about his motives. He’s been at the forefront of stirring the pot with all the Kyler Murray to Arizona talk. Even before he was mocking Murray to Arizona - he was mocking them Quinnen Williams.

He REALLY want Bosa to fall to the 9ers.

 

[wkycardsfan]

I think this is just a major smokescreen or at least that what I'm trying to convince myself. If the front office is really set on drafting KM then why in the hell would you let it leak out this far ahead of the draft? At a minimum keep your options open and listen to the trade offers all the way up until you hand in the card on draft night. The only way this whole story makes any sense to me is if it is all BS. If this is truly legit and we have let everyone know that we are sticking at #1 and drafting Murray then I will be 100% convinced that SW wasn't the biggest problem last season. This will be a whole new level of stupid.

 

[GatorAZ]

I think this is just a major smokescreen or at least that what I'm trying to convince myself. If the front office is really set on drafting KM then why in the hell would you let it leak out this far ahead of the draft? At a minimum keep your options open and listen to the trade offers all the way up until you hand in the card on draft night. The only way this whole story makes any sense to me is if it is all BS. If this is truly legit and we have let everyone know that we are sticking at #1 and drafting Murray then I will be 100% convinced that SW wasn't the biggest problem last season. This will be a whole new level of stupid.

I haven’t seen any of the top guys out there say they’ve been shopping Rosen and dead set on Murray. This whole thing took off when video was dug up of KK lobbing compliments at Murray before Tech played OU. It’s combine/mock draft season so some of these people need the clickbait like they need oxygen.

 

[Proximo]

The whole premise of your argument is that the team is no worse if Murray fails than if Rosen fails which is absolutely false. Do you really think the team minus either of those players is better with or without Bosa/Williams? The chances of the player we draft with the Rosen return on a trade is minuscule because what the going to be a great deal as people know the Cards have to rid themselves of him.

This is all completely ignoring the fact that the $8million in dead cap space is at least 1 starter we could sign this offseason.

So if Murray fails, no Bosa or Williams, no potential starter in free agency.

If Rosen fails, we’d still have Bosa or Williams and a potential starter signed in free agency.

In which scenario would the team be better off?

No you are wrong. If we get a first for Rosen there is virtually no difference between Rosen or Murray failing. The guy we draft with the first has every bit as much chance of being a player as Rosen. Personally I think the odds are Rosen will not be an above average Qb after what I saw last season, and that is what you need to compete.

The situation where the team is better off is simple Murray proves to be better then Rosen.

 

[oaken1]

No you are wrong. If we get a first for Rosen there is virtually no difference between Rosen or Murray failing. The guy we draft with the first has every bit as much chance of being a player as Rosen. Personally I think the odds are Rosen will not be an above average Qb after what I saw last season, and that is what you need to compete.

The situation where the team is better off is simple Murray proves to be better then Rosen.

Yeah. It is simple. Rosen is better than murray and he continues to develop while we have the benefit of another star player on defense

 

[PACardsFan]

That last part might be the silliest thing I have read on this board in a LONG time. Murray is not taking any team on a deep playoff run as a rookie. Lots of generational QBs have struggled getting wins as rookies and he is far from that level of talent

Let’s just wait and see. Didn’t Mahomes do it in his 1st season as a starter? I believe that Murray is every bit as talented as Mahomes is. But, we’ll just have to wait and see.

 

[PACardsFan]

Dude the man love for untested unproven 5’10” rookie is a little over the top don’t ya think???

“Whoever takes Murray will be in the playoffs and probably deep into the playoffs”

Wow dude.... stop already just stop... lol

Time will tell. Murray is a special talent. Time will tell.

 

[DRM08]

Let’s just wait and see. Didn’t Mahomes do it in his 1st season as a starter? I believe that Murray is every bit as talented as Mahomes is. But, we’ll just have to wait and see.

The Chiefs made the playoffs in 2017 without him. I will say they had a much better defense in 2017 than they did in 2018. If not for Mahomes playing at a much higher level than Alex Smith, they probably would not have made the playoffs in 2018. The defense was horrendous.

As far as talent goes, Kyler is amazing in his own way. Different skillsets between Mahomes and Murray, but both phenomenal talents. With everything the Cardinals have invested in Josh Rosen, it seems foolish to abandon ship. Seems like a very steep sunk cost. Rosen is a pretty talented guy in his own right.

 

[PACardsFan]

The Chiefs made the playoffs in 2017 without him. I will say they had a much better defense in 2017 than they did in 2018. If not for Mahomes playing at a much higher level than Alex Smith, they probably would not have made the playoffs in 2018. The defense was horrendous.

As far as talent goes, Kyler is amazing in his own way. Different skillsets between Mahomes and Murray, but both phenomenal talents. With everything the Cardinals have invested in Josh Rosen, it seems foolish to abandon ship. Seems like a very steep sunk cost. Rosen is a pretty talented guy in his own right.[/QUOTE

Rosen can throw right spirals into tight windows.....occasionally. He also exhibits poor judgement frequently. And he did that at UCLA often. If we truly want KK to be successful, then Rosen is not going to make that happen as well as Murray would. If BA we’re still the HC, then Rosen would be worth the time to further develop him. My fear is that if we decide it’s Rosen, the KK will be gone in 3 years. And the carousel continues.

 

[DRM08]

Rosen can throw right spirals into tight windows.....occasionally. He also exhibits poor judgement frequently. And he did that at UCLA often. If we truly want KK to be successful, then Rosen is not going to make that happen as well as Murray would. If BA we’re still the HC, then Rosen would be worth the time to further develop him. My fear is that if we decide it’s Rosen, the KK will be gone in 3 years. And the carousel continues.

The question is do you believe Murray by himself is better than Rosen plus Bosa?

Kliff had a 18 year old statue in the pocket this past season who was really damn good. I think Rosen can be pretty effective with Kliff's mentorship and playcalling.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

It'll be Josh Allen - he's the perfect 3-4 fit DE. The KM talk is just hype to see if they can get someone to move up for him.
Allen ranks higher the Clowney did coming out....he's is 100% the pick

Bet the house it's not Bosa - there is no way they're running a 3-4 with Vance Joesph as D Coordinator and trying to put Bosa who'd be a square peg in a round hole....NO WAY...if they do the Cardinals are beyond dumb...as Bosa is 100% a 4-3 DE...then again this is the team that drafted Leonard Davis who was always a guard and moved him to Tackle...and he failed...went to Dallas and they made him a guard and he was all pro every season with them....and the same team who drafted a WR and tried to move him to CB (failed)....and again a team who drafted a CB who'd only played one season of football at CB...and failed. You'd think they'd learn by now to draft guys at a position and leave them there...but it's AZ so what makes sense isn't what they always do.

I'd put the odds the #1 on the Cardinals draft HQ at:
Allen 95%
KM 5%
Boss 0%

take all the - talk on all these guys with some sugar...remember last year
Lamar Jackson won't be a QB - can't read a defense - will have to play WR, yea how'd that work out
Josh Rosen - too weak, will crumble when hit in the NFL - injury concern injury concern - they wouldn't shut up about it.- yea dude was hit 200+ times and got up every time.

All the talking heads do now is make stuff up to get click bait....and Charley C ...made his quota for the month...the same as the fool who posed KK was running around the combine guaranteeing the cards were drafting KM.....yea right.

I agree that josh Allen would be a better fit in the VJ defense, Josh Allen played in a 3/4 defense at Kentucky & I watched him cover TE's all yr long. He's also very disruptive in the backfield against the run as well. He was being held in every game this past season almost every play. I did watch bosa at the combine do all the drills, he looks very fluid & is built like a rock. I just don't know how well he would fare in a 3/4 defense? He played DE at Ohio St in a 4/3.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Sarcasm really requires more inflection to be effective.

IMO the Cardinals need to give Rosen one more year UNLESS a team offers at least a 1st and a 3rd for him. I'd consider that, because even though I don't like the idea of missing on Bosa, Murray is a pretty damn good player and I think he has a good shot to be pretty good.

If the hype on Murray is correct & they draft him then great? I'm just afraid they draft him & he becomes a bust. Makes us look stupid considering the draft picks we gave up last yr to draft him, only to give up on him after one season. Considering the crap OL he had blocking for him. If they trade Rosen, they had better get a 1st round pick & maybe a 3rd. I think they should keep Rosen, trade down, accumulate more picks (compensation for the picks traded to get Rosen) to build next yrs team. We need so many players on offense & defense.