I’m Not the Only One Who Thinks They’re Tanking

Jetstream Green

Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Posts
29,476
Reaction score
16,649
Location
San Antonio, Texas
I would argue that if you were tearing it down and rebuilding, there would not be a place for Ertz or Conner or Beachum on this roster. Also, you would have started re-building in free agency vs skipping free agency.

Our offseason is broken down to this.

1 - We let some of our best, young players sign elsewhere.

2 - Participated in the draft, prioritizing 2024 assets.

3 - Cut our best player.

None of this fits the "building" part of "rebuilding".
Weez rebuilding in the sense we are clearing the deck for the construction trucks to show up with the goods, and I do believe in the current staff to draft better.. though that is not much of a stretch compared to Ka Ka Keim :)
 

ASUCHRIS

ONE HEART BEAT!!!
Joined
Sep 2, 2002
Posts
16,468
Reaction score
14,603
Weez rebuilding in the sense we are clearing the deck for the construction trucks to show up with the goods, and I do believe in the current staff to draft better.. though that is not much of a stretch compared to Ka Ka Keim :)
The concern is that you're not going to rebuild through the draft alone - at best, you may get one or two guys every year that contribute right away, and maybe a couple later on.

Ignoring all other avenues of improvement seems to be a rather narrow opportunity for success.
 

Jetstream Green

Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Posts
29,476
Reaction score
16,649
Location
San Antonio, Texas
The concern is that you're not going to rebuild through the draft alone - at best, you may get one or two guys every year that contribute right away, and maybe a couple later on.

Ignoring all other avenues of improvement seems to be a rather narrow opportunity for success.
The draft is the major major major foundation of any stable franchise and why overspending in free agency till you really know what you have with the draft is not very advantageous... well, that makes sense to me at least
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
28,260
Reaction score
40,225
Location
Colorado
Weez rebuilding in the sense we are clearing the deck for the construction trucks to show up with the goods, and I do believe in the current staff to draft better.. though that is not much of a stretch compared to Ka Ka Keim :)
I have zero reason to believe Monti is competent as a GM. He has earned that belief by choosing to not participate in the off-season other than the draft. Even in that, he passed on a top prospect in 2023 for an unknown in 2024. Maybe he will turn out to be, I don't know, but in his first year as GM he has constructed one of the worst rosters in the NFL. He is a failure until he is not.
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
38,356
Reaction score
29,701
Location
Gilbert, AZ
The draft is the major major major foundation of any stable franchise and why overspending in free agency till you really know what you have with the draft is not very advantageous... well, that makes sense to me at least

Examples?
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
28,260
Reaction score
40,225
Location
Colorado
The draft is the major major major foundation of any stable franchise and why overspending in free agency till you really know what you have with the draft is not very advantageous... well, that makes sense to me at least
What is overspending? Paying market rate? Even if the Cardinals chose to forego the top of the market, nothing prohibited them from selecting from the mid market.

It takes all avenues to build a good roster. Trade. FA. Re-signing players. The draft. We elected to only use one.
 

Jetstream Green

Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Posts
29,476
Reaction score
16,649
Location
San Antonio, Texas
I have zero reason to believe Monti is competent as a GM. He has earned that belief by choosing to not participate in the off-season other than the draft. Even in that, he passed on a top prospect in 2023 for an unknown in 2024. Maybe he will turn out to be, I don't know, but in his first year as GM he has constructed one of the worst rosters in the NFL. He is a failure until he is not.
I have zero facts to believe or not believe, but I do know or rather not feeling out of whack he can draft better than Keim... come on
 

Jetstream Green

Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Posts
29,476
Reaction score
16,649
Location
San Antonio, Texas
I have zero reason to believe Monti is competent as a GM. He has earned that belief by choosing to not participate in the off-season other than the draft. Even in that, he passed on a top prospect in 2023 for an unknown in 2024. Maybe he will turn out to be, I don't know, but in his first year as GM he has constructed one of the worst rosters in the NFL. He is a failure until he is not.
 

ASUCHRIS

ONE HEART BEAT!!!
Joined
Sep 2, 2002
Posts
16,468
Reaction score
14,603
and why overspending in free agency till you really know what you have with the draft is not very advantageous... well, that makes sense to me at least
Yes- if you're trying to sell a front office on years of job security, this is a hell of a pitch. You're talking about years down the line in a year to year league.

Who said anything about overspending in FA? Not every FA is an overpay!
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
38,356
Reaction score
29,701
Location
Gilbert, AZ
I have zero reason to believe Monti is competent as a GM. He has earned that belief by choosing to not participate in the off-season other than the draft. Even in that, he passed on a top prospect in 2023 for an unknown in 2024. Maybe he will turn out to be, I don't know, but in his first year as GM he has constructed one of the worst rosters in the NFL. He is a failure until he is not.
People aren't really considering the possibility that Houston could be good or even mediocre this year.

They play the AFC North and NFC South along with the AFC South.

Could they beat Tampa, Carolina, and Atlanta? Maybe!

Could they beat Pittsburgh and Cleveland? Potentially!

Could they go 3-3 against Indy, Jacksonville, and Tennessee? Could be!

If the Texans go 8-9 and Monti gets the 12th pick in the draft for trading out of #3 overall, are we gonna feel super-good?
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
28,260
Reaction score
40,225
Location
Colorado
I have zero facts to believe or not believe, but I do know or rather not feeling out of whack he can draft better than Keim... come on
Lots of inexperienced, first-time GMs get fired for being as bad at the draft as Keim was. Monti would not be the first. And, he definitely will get fired if he chooses to only build through the draft because he doesn't have 5 seasons to build a winner. He inherited a roster with limited talent, and has made it worse.
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
28,260
Reaction score
40,225
Location
Colorado
People aren't really considering the possibility that Houston could be good or even mediocre this year.

They play the AFC North and NFC South along with the AFC South.

Could they beat Tampa, Carolina, and Atlanta? Maybe!

Could they beat Pittsburgh and Cleveland? Potentially!

Could they go 3-3 against Indy, Jacksonville, and Tennessee? Could be!

If the Texans go 8-9 and Monti gets the 12th pick in the draft for trading out of #3 overall, are we gonna feel super-good?
Definitely possible.
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,247
Reaction score
11,850
I would argue that if you were tearing it down and rebuilding, there would not be a place for Ertz or Conner or Beachum on this roster. Also, you would have started re-building in free agency vs skipping free agency.

Our offseason is broken down to this.

1 - We let some of our best, young players sign elsewhere.

2 - Participated in the draft, prioritizing 2024 assets.

3 - Cut our best player.

None of this fits the "building" part of "rebuilding".
All 3 of these players aren't likely to be on the roster after this year. Beachum is a one year deal, Connor will likely be cut after this year. The same goes with Ertz, although could stay due to his Eagles connection.
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
38,356
Reaction score
29,701
Location
Gilbert, AZ
Eagles getting to the Super Bowl with their drafted roster as one of freaking many... rock on unless you liked Keim overspending
Must've missed when they drafted A.J. Brown, Marcus Epps, C.J. Gardner-Johnson, and Darius Slay.

Definitely missed how everyone else was totally on their first contract with the team and wasn't re-signed from a previous administration.
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
28,260
Reaction score
40,225
Location
Colorado
All 3 of these players aren't likely to be on the roster after this year. Beachum is a one year deal, Connor will likely be cut after this year. The same goes with Ertz, although could stay due to his Eagles connection.
Creating more holes on a roster full of them, and following an off-season where we chose to ignore the ones we already had. If the goal is not to be competitive for 4 years, we are certainly on the right track.
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,247
Reaction score
11,850
Creating more holes on a roster full of them, and following an off-season where we chose to ignore the ones we already had. If the goal is not to be competitive for 4 years, we are certainly on the right track.
I guess I'm not understanding your point. You are arguing that there shouldn't be a place in a rebuilding team for those 3 players. I'm saying that they won't be here after this year, which we seemingly agree. Yet somehow we don't?
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
38,356
Reaction score
29,701
Location
Gilbert, AZ
I guess I'm not understanding your point. You are arguing that there shouldn't be a place in a rebuilding team for those 3 players. I'm saying that they won't be here after this year, which we seemingly agree. Yet somehow we don't?
Because their cap holds will. Ertz will have a dead cap hold of $5 million in 2024 if he's released before June 1. Conner will have a dead cap hold of $3 million if released in 2024.

If the idea is to "take our medicine and get right with the cap" this year to maximize flexibility next year, what are these dudes doing on the roster?

I think Beachum is fine as a third tackle/sixth OL through 2024, TBH.
 

Cbus cardsfan

Back to Back ASFN FFL Champion
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
21,458
Reaction score
7,616
I have zero reason to believe Monti is competent as a GM. He has earned that belief by choosing to not participate in the off-season other than the draft. Even in that, he passed on a top prospect in 2023 for an unknown in 2024. Maybe he will turn out to be, I don't know, but in his first year as GM he has constructed one of the worst rosters in the NFL. He is a failure until he is not.
I was going to post something very similar.
Lots of blind faith being thrown at Monti and Gannon.

Hell, neither was even Mikey’s first choice. Now they’re the architects of a complete roster makeover and many are happy just because it’s not Steve Keim.
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,247
Reaction score
11,850
Because their cap holds will. Ertz will have a dead cap hold of $5 million in 2024 if he's released before June 1. Conner will have a dead cap hold of $3 million if released in 2024.

If the idea is to "take our medicine and get right with the cap" this year to maximize flexibility next year, what are these dudes doing on the roster?

I think Beachum is fine as a third tackle/sixth OL through 2024, TBH.
If the Cards are willing to eat 20M for their best player and cut him anyway, why would 3 and 5 matter?
 

Billy Bob

Cardinals Fan
Joined
Apr 3, 2006
Posts
3,280
Reaction score
1,775
Location
Phoenix Arizona
Because their cap holds will. Ertz will have a dead cap hold of $5 million in 2024 if he's released before June 1. Conner will have a dead cap hold of $3 million if released in 2024.

If the idea is to "take our medicine and get right with the cap" this year to maximize flexibility next year, what are these dudes doing on the roster?

I think Beachum is fine as a third tackle/sixth OL through 2024, TBH.
Because, maybe we're not tanking?
 

Latest posts

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
552,640
Posts
5,401,556
Members
6,313
Latest member
50 year card fan
Top