I Can No Longer Defend this Coaching Staff

[PitchShifter]

Has Arians and company lost the team ? Sure feels like it.

Guys like Betcher, Amos, and some other coaches, they seem to be in over their head. Losing Todd Bowles was for a reason, and Betcher is no Todd Bowles, he is not Ray Horton either.

I agree.

We can debate the cause - talent, drafting coaching, scheme, accountability etc - but it's been trending the wrong way for a while now. When a team is routinely showing up flat, seemingly unprepared week after week, it looks like they've checked out from what the coaches are preaching.

Once that belief is broken, I doubt you can get it back.

 

[WildBB]

This brings up a very interesting question, twice now Bidwill has hired similar coaches in Arians and Whisenhunt. Will the third time be any different? Maybe the head coach problem is the type of coach that impresses Bidwill. He is the only common denominator in the equation. Is the source of the problem Michael Bidwill? Unless I am mistaken weren't both Whisenhunt and Arians OCs in Pittsburgh? If so there seems to be a trend here. Maybe the problem is we went from bowtie Billy to no tie Michael.

The year we hired Arians, he was like the last HC hired after 7-8 other teams hired their HC's. It worked out early or soon after but his play calling style has really not adjusted well enough to teams teeing off on Palmer or the organization pulling in the best recources to make it work optimately (on Keim).

They could have hired Andy Reed because he made it known he was interested. But the FO would have had to give on him having some personnel decision making, plus they passed on the price tag.

They may have to concede more control to someone to get the best candidate(s) to consider being here.

 

[Gandhi]

Who is his interim replacement? No clue; doesn't matter. A message that this degree of complacency will not be tolerated needs to be sent. LOUD AND CLEAR.

I guess you could say that the season is probably over anyway, but I think it does matter who the interim head coach would be. I think it is irrelevant to let go of Bruce Arians if you are not replacing him with someone who would take the organization in a different direction, and do anyone really feel that some of the coaches on the team would do that? I mean, Harold Goodwin, James Bettcher, even Tom Moore? It might be kind of fun to see Brentson Bucker get a shot but in my view no one else would bring something different than Arians, and thus making a change irrelevant in my opinion.

That said, I too am ready to give up on some of this coaching staff. I am a huge believer in the importance of continuity but at some point you obviously has to say stop. To me, all three coordinators should be replaced since this team keeps making the same mistakes, and having problems in the areas, that have been major issues for at least one and a half season now. That is simply not good enough, and if you choose to see it like me where firing Arians is not a good idea, then the coordinators are next in line to be held accountable, and yes, I believe that Goodwin has a lot of imput on the offense.

I even think that there is somewhat obvious replacement candidates on the coaching staff in Nick Rapone and Darryl Drake. Under Rapones watch Patrick Peterson has developed into a star, and the same can be said for Tyrann Mathieu until the injuries now might seem to have finally caught up to him. Giving the major struggles by Bettcher I also tend to give Rapone the credit for developing players such as Marcus Cooper, D.J. Swearinger and Tony Jefferson who all got huge contracts this offseason. Darryl Drake has not only helped making Fitzgerald into the smallest tight end in the league but has also tutored Michael Floyd, John Brown, Jaron Brown and J.J. Nelson into contributors on offense. I think the two of them should get their chance.

 

[Gandhi]

But who else would be a good hire right now? No coordinators sound appealing. College coaches are a crap shoot at best. Who would you want? I Definately want BA gone

My dream choice to replace Arians at some point in the future would be Jim Harbaugh. Not that I think it is a realistic dream, though.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I guess you could say that the season is probably over anyway, but I think it does matter who the interim head coach would be. I think it is irrelevant to let go of Bruce Arians if you are not replacing him with someone who would take the organization in a different direction, and do anyone really feel that some of the coaches on the team would do that? I mean, Harold Goodwin, James Bettcher, even Tom Moore?

Agreed.

If Arians goes, then you have to gut the coaching staff.


I think I have completely lost my mind, but I think if the Caridnals want to hire a coach, then a college coach may be the way to go.

I am going to write up something about coaching in the NFL soon, and it is based on "guys like Arians" who are going to be retiring soon.

Eventually, like it or not, the new spread offenses, with option reads, etc., etc. They are coming to the NFL.

It does not matter if those offenses "do not work" in the NFL. Eventually, all the football coaches and players that know the "old NFL style of football" are going to retire, and die off. Yes, dark but true.

The NFL style football is not taught, or played in youth football, highschool football, college football. So, eventually the old NFL style will die off because:

A. People will not know how to coach it - (see current offensive line play in the NFL).

B. Players will not be able to execute it - (see countless positions in the NFL where players are literally starting from zero once they get in the NFL).


I bashed the Eagles for hiring Chip Kelly. I know think it was the right move, but too soon. <-- My goodness, I am going to throw up over typing that.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

My dream choice to replace Arians at some point in the future would be Jim Harbaugh. Not that I think it is a realistic dream, though.

LOL!

That would be great. There are people who cannot STAND Arians' attitude, this would just make their heads explode.

Meh, I think Harbaugh is overrated these days, and I do not think the NFL will have the offensive line talent he needs to pull off his offense.

 

[Cards_Campos]

I'm still in awe that Arians thinks he can win with Stanton. Same idiocy when he thought he could win with Ryan Lindley..... We have no chance of winning. Fitz will get frustrated ....Patrick Peterson already is.....if we don't trade for a good QB or atleast give Gabbert a try....we could lose everyone talent wise soon. I hope and I dont mean in a mean way but maybe Stanton can get hurt but not a really bad way. Something that can Give Gabbert 2 games and show he is the better choice. Stanton looked awful yesterday.

 

[cardpa]

I really don't think Harbaugh will leave Michigan unless they send him packing. He has a good gig there and is certainly making a nice buck too.

 

[oaken1]

I have no idea about interim coaches...if BA were to go some of the coaches we have may just walk anyway...

but I do have a hunch that Mike Vrabel is going to be a good HC one day

 

[kerouac9]

Don't agree at all. First, preseason is useless. You should know that. I think the Browns were 4-0.
I do agree Amos is bad.

Cards have an old roster and I think that bodes terribly for special teams, which, if you combine that with Amos, you're going to have bad results.

So it's Keim's fault (primarily, at least)?

I just wonder what this team was thinking and working on all offseason. It seems like people on Hardy Drive were saying the same thing that you and others were, which was that this team was 11-5 if only they'd made more kicks. That take is wrong, but it seems like that was the intention.

Preseason record is pretty useless. How you use it to get your team ready for week 1 is pretty important. Especially when you have a turnstile offensive line that needs to learn to play together. This is the second year I have heard players state they are bored with the preseason. If you aren't using the time to get better, you letting someone else get ahead of you.

Results oriented individuals are always shocked at the end result, but folks invested in the process are rarely surprised.

Yes.

 

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[RugbyMuffin]

I just wonder what this team was thinking and working on all offseason. It seems like people on Hardy Drive were saying the same thing that you and others were, which was that this team was 11-5 if only they'd made more kicks. That take is wrong, but it seems like that was the intention.

+1.

The talk last year was "It is the SAME TEAM as 2015"

Yet, the 2016 club was not the same team, wasn't even close. That rhetoric could have carried over.

The Cardinals were "close" in 2015, and who knows what happens in 2014 if Palmer is healthy.

Last season, the 2016 season should have been when the alarm went off that things were over. The Cardinals seemed to only "half agree" with that notion.

 

[JeffGollin]

Ideally, you hire a staff that has just the right mojo for changing the team's culture and adding the right necessary pieces to complete the puzzle.

Takes a bit of luck, but we did that.

But then comes another even bigger challenge - to avoid becoming swell-headed and a legend in your own mind.

This coupled with a few really bad breaks has put us on a downward trajectory.

The changes proposed on this board are probably necessary, but there's no ironclad lock that any will work.

Two logical options - (1) stick with BA&SK and hope they can learn from their mistakes and make necessary changes (good luck with that). (2) Overhaul the complete jalopy (no guarantee it will be successful but you gotta do something). Add to this, competitive staffs who are getting better and better.

Bottom line - It's going to take skill, luck and the right people to turn this sucker around anytime soon. Cross your fingers.

 

[oaken1]

+1.

The talk last year was "It is the SAME TEAM as 2015"

Yet, the 2016 club was not the same team, wasn't even close. That rhetoric could have carried over.

The Cardinals were "close" in 2015, and who knows what happens in 2014 if Palmer is healthy.

Last season, the 2016 season should have been when the alarm went off that things were over. The Cardinals seemed to only "half agree" with that notion.

but ya see... 2016 is when BA was dealing with that kidney cancer or whatever... the organization knew about it but kept it on the DL.
That type of situation can have a major impact on a team...and rightly so.
However I still think he lost the team in 2015 after that loss to seattle. we limped through the playoffs, got destroyed by carolina and have not played a good game of football since.
I think the illness just bought BA more time from SK and MB...a pass year. But that time has passed and I dont see him getting a pass any longer. Changes need to be made. BA can take hold of the mantle of leadership and make those changes himself or he can watch on sportscenter as SK makes the changes. I am sure it will be his choice either way.

 

[oaken1]

Ideally, you hire a staff that has just the right mojo for changing the team's culture and adding the right necessary pieces to complete the puzzle.

Takes a bit of luck, but we did that.

But then comes another even bigger challenge - to avoid becoming swell-headed and a legend in your own mind.

This coupled with a few really bad breaks has put us on a downward trajectory.

The changes proposed on this board are probably necessary, but there's no ironclad lock that any will work.

Two logical options - (1) stick with BA&SK and hope they can learn from their mistakes and make necessary changes (good luck with that). (2) Overhaul the complete jalopy (no guarantee it will be successful but you gotta do something). Add to this, competitive staffs who are getting better and better.

Bottom line - It's going to take skill, luck and the right people to turn this sucker around anytime soon. Cross your fingers.

BA&SK are not joined at the hip. SK worked his way up in the organization and earned his position...then hired BA.
It is far more likely BA is fired by SK than it is that they are both let go.

 

[Gandhi]

LOL!

That would be great. There are people who cannot STAND Arians' attitude, this would just make their heads explode.

Well, not that I want to point fingers at anyone but I could not care less about his attitude. I want to win, and if a head coach manage to lead the team to that, he can have whatever attitude he wants for all I care.

Bruce Arians has not changed, by the way. It is just that his attitude was a lot more fun when he had the team winning. Then he was seen as the fun uncle to use his own words.

Meh, I think Harbaugh is overrated these days, and I do not think the NFL will have the offensive line talent he needs to pull off his offense.

I actually has not followed him that much since he left for Michigan. It just seems to me that he has had success everywhere he has been from Stanford, to the Niners, to at least last year at Michigan. Also, I really liked the coaching staff he assembled while he was with the Niners.

 

[ARZCardinals]

Time to hire Pat Patricia from the Pats.

 

[cardncubfan]

I'm still in awe that Arians thinks he can win with Stanton. Same idiocy when he thought he could win with Ryan Lindley..... We have no chance of winning. Fitz will get frustrated ....Patrick Peterson already is.....if we don't trade for a good QB or atleast give Gabbert a try....we could lose everyone talent wise soon. I hope and I dont mean in a mean way but maybe Stanton can get hurt but not a really bad way. Something that can Give Gabbert 2 games and show he is the better choice. Stanton looked awful yesterday.

Please tell me what other choices he had at the time?

 

[cardncubfan]

You all give up too easily. I see a lot of criticizing of the coaches & front office but I don't see any of you applying for a job in the NFL working for a team. I would think you would since you all know the answers it seems. (This is not directed at the OP) This is the same coaching staff that finished 13-3.

 

[Chopper0080]

You all give up too easily. I see a lot of criticizing of the coaches & front office but I don't see any of you applying for a job in the NFL working for a team. I would think you would since you all know the answers it seems. (This is not directed at the OP) This is the same coaching staff that finished 13-3.

Here is my stance on the staff. I think Arians has a system that can work. I think it needs exceptional offensive linemen to keep hits off the QB. I think Arians would be energized to mentor a young QB. That being said, I believe the defense is under served by an unqualified coordinator. I believe the same is true for special teams. I also believe Arians will force the front office to fire him if they ask him to let those two coordinators go. In that scenario, moving on from Arians is the right move.

 

[pemory09]

Time to hire Pat Patricia from the Pats.

It’s Matt Patricia, but yeah, interesting idea.

 

[Cards_Campos]

Please tell me what other choices he had at the time?

Roger Staubach. Steve young. Just kidding. But any QB would have been better. I'm sure there were other options....he played like 3 weeks and then the playoffs. Come on he threw for the lowest total ever. Anyone could Have done that. In fact I bet we could have gotten Warner out of retirement for playoffs

 

[cardncubfan]

Here is my stance on the staff. I think Arians has a system that can work. I think it needs exceptional offensive linemen to keep hits off the QB. I think Arians would be energized to mentor a young QB. That being said, I believe the defense is under served by an unqualified coordinator. I believe the same is true for special teams. I also believe Arians will force the front office to fire him if they ask him to let those two coordinators go. In that scenario, moving on from Arians is the right move.

I pretty much believe this as well. I just don't think we should fire everyone like some are claiming. Keim & Arians have both made mistakes & they have both done a spectacular job. DC should be the first to go. I can live with Famous Amos if need be.

 

[cardncubfan]

Roger Staubach. Steve young. Just kidding. But any QB would have been better. I'm sure there were other options....he played like 3 weeks and then the playoffs. Come on he threw for the lowest total ever. Anyone could Have done that. In fact I bet we could have gotten Warner out of retirement for playoffs

So anyone as you claim can learn the offense overnight & be ready to play? Can you name one of these anyones that was available?

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Anyone think Mike Leach would be a good coach? He is very innovative on offense.