I had a friend email me this last night...

[RFIP]

Against the Rams, Kurt threw 20 great passes, had 3 or 4 dropped, but then made 3 awful interceptions and a costly fumble.

His mistakes were bad mistakes.

Unfortunately, for Kurt and his teammates, all four of the mistakes that he made proved very costly to his team.

Right now, it's save-your-own-skin time for everyone in the Cards organization.....lots of finger-pointing and anger.

Let's recap....

Owner Bidwill sits on his remaining salary cap,
Coach Green's team continues to make mistakes and penalties by the bushel, Cornerbacks (Rolle included) can't cover anyone,
High-priced FA's like Bertrand Berry just get owned by opposing tackles,
the O-line gets us excited when they just don't suck really bad,
the teams signs a FA RB for $15M this season yet still looks like they can't rush the ball into the endzone from 2 yards away,
and the list goes on,
....but only one person will lose their job this week.

Kurt will be a scapegoat again.

In every game this season, Kurt Warner had to be the one to win the game.

It's not like the Cardinal defense or running game can take the pressure off the QB, and mistake free football can win the game.

In this system, the QB had to make the plays...thread the needle to receivers without much separation, make the throws in the redzone (since Edge can't get any yards in short yardage), and do all of this behind a suspect offensive line.

There was quite a bit of pressure on Warner.

Make all the plays, but don't make mistakes.

He made most of the plays; but, yes, also made his share of mistakes.

Warner was not the caretaker of the QB position until Leinart put in his learning time.

He was much more than that.

He was, by far, the most important player on the team!!!!

From here on out, I don't know how Leinart can be "protected" in this offense.

Like Warner, he will also need to be the most important player on the team.

Good luck to him.

Kurt had a good run.

He should have just asked to be traded when the Cards drafted Leinart.

No one would have blamed him if he didn't want to go throught this same **** again.

Even when he won player of the week, he was getting booed!!!

 

[Evil Ash]

Against the Rams, Kurt threw 20 great passes, had 3 or 4 dropped, but then made 3 awful interceptions and a costly fumble.

His mistakes were bad mistakes.

Unfortunately, for Kurt and his teammates, all four of the mistakes that he made proved very costly to his team.

Right now, it's save-your-own-skin time for everyone in the Cards organization.....lots of finger-pointing and anger.

Let's recap....

Owner Bidwill sits on his remaining salary cap,
Coach Green's team continues to make mistakes and penalties by the bushel, Cornerbacks (Rolle included) can't cover anyone,
High-priced FA's like Bertrand Berry just get owned by opposing tackles,
the O-line gets us excited when they just don't suck really bad,
the teams signs a FA RB for $15M this season yet still looks like they can't rush the ball into the endzone from 2 yards away,
and the list goes on,
....but only one person will lose their job this week.

Kurt will be a scapegoat again.

In every game this season, Kurt Warner had to be the one to win the game.

It's not like the Cardinal defense or running game can take the pressure off the QB, and mistake free football can win the game.

In this system, the QB had to make the plays...thread the needle to receivers without much separation, make the throws in the redzone (since Edge can't get any yards in short yardage), and do all of this behind a suspect offensive line.

There was quite a bit of pressure on Warner.

Make all the plays, but don't make mistakes.

He made most of the plays; but, yes, also made his share of mistakes.

Warner was not the caretaker of the QB position until Leinart put in his learning time.

He was much more than that.

He was, by far, the most important player on the team!!!!

From here on out, I don't know how Leinart can be "protected" in this offense.

Like Warner, he will also need to be the most important player on the team.

Good luck to him.

Kurt had a good run.

He should have just asked to be traded when the Cards drafted Leinart.

No one would have blamed him if he didn't want to go throught this same **** again.

Even when he won player of the week, he was getting booed!!!

8 fumbles, 4 Ints in 3 games. Thats unacceptable at the college level let alone the NFL.

Warner had a good run but IMO he's finished and he's earned being booed.

This has nothing to do with Bidwill or Green, its just Warner is not executing

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I don't care how many great passes Warner threw, no QB can expect to turn the ball over and keep their job. Sorry, but nine fumbles in three games to go along with four picks is simply unacceptable.

 

[vince56]

8 fumbles, 4 Ints in 3 games. Thats unacceptable at the college level let alone the NFL.

Exactly. These stats are impossible to overcome. Impossible for any fan, no matter how much of a Warner-homer, to defend.

Let's put that garbage up in big-ass letters for everyone to see & soak in, shall we...

8 Fumbles

4 Interceptions

in only 3 games.




******* cardinals

 

[jefftheshark]

I don't care how many great passes Warner threw, no QB can expect to turn the ball over and keep their job. Sorry, but nine fumbles in three games to go along with four picks is simply unacceptable.

I suspect that RFIP's friend who emailed him this pack of excuses is Brenda Warner.

The Shark

 

[jmr667]

Owner Bidwill sits on his remaining salary cap,

High-priced FA's like Bertrand Berry just get owned...,

the teams signs a FA RB for $15M this season yet still....

Stopped paying attention after this part. Bidwill is too cheap to spend to the salary cap AND over spends on FA's... trying to follow that twist of logic.... maybe a few more beers would help.

 

[RFIP]

Exactly. These stats are impossible to overcome. Impossible for any fan, no matter how much of a Warner-homer, to defend.

Let's put that garbage up in big-ass letters for everyone to see & soak in, shall we...

8 Fumbles

4 Interceptions

in only 3 games.




******* cardinals

Well now, let's see. Warner has 8 fumbles but lost TWO (a note conviniently missed) and 4 pic's, to go with 5 TD's..

Carson Palmer thru 3 games: 5 fumbles (2 lost), 4 pic's, 6 TD's..

Oh and Palmer has been sacked THIRTEEN TIMES, Kurt? 5.

But I did hear that Marvin Lewis was thinking about changing QB's too...

Give me a break.

 

[RFIP]

And this from the RAMS BOARD:

First: Denny Green is at least as responsible for losing that game as any player. The strategy of continuing to run plays when they were in the dead center of the field, for a 40 yard (or less) FG, was very foolish. I believe when they lost the fumble the FG attempt was about 35 yards. Why keep running? This is the NFL. Bad things can ALWAYS happen, including penalties. How about a nice holding call to move you back 10 yards?

All that needed to happen was for Kurt to take the snap and take a knee. Let the clock run down, stop it with a timeout and kick the FG. They have an excellent, experienced, accurate FB kicker. Instead, they wanted to get even closer and it cost the Cards.

That was Green's call all the way but he has shouldered none of the blame for that.

Second: to have Warner shoulder most of this loss is one thing. To bench him in favor of a rookie who barely knows how to find his locker is suicide. This is a gross overreaction and the fans at Arizona deserve better.

Green is a highly overrated HC. Tom Brady throws INTs. Favre has always thrown a lot of INT's and fumbles too often. Jake Plummer is an INT machine this year. The list goes on. Warner has always thrown more INT's than typical because he is a high risk high reward mindset QB. If you want a game mananger, you don't want Kurt Warner. Warner's history of INT's, fumbles, extreme accuracy, and unmatched ability in reading Ds was ALL known to Green.

In deciding to start Leinhert, Green has shown himself to be what I've always called him: a media-darling less-than-average-HC. He's playing to the media and the fans to start Leinhert. The kid has little to no chance to doing anything. Rookie QBs don't fare well in the NFL.

Oh well. The Cards are no longer going to be an issue in the NFC West. Those gurus who actually picked the Cards to win the West can go back into their holes.

And, I have a hunch that by throwing Kurt under the bus, Green will keep his Arizona address one more season. But, that'll about be it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Well now, let's see. Warner has 8 fumbles but lost TWO (a note conviniently missed) and 4 pic's, to go with 5 TD's..

Carson Palmer thru 3 games: 5 fumbles (2 lost), 4 pic's, 6 TD's..

Oh and Palmer has been sacked THIRTEEN TIMES, Kurt? 5.

But I did hear that Marvin Lewis was thinking about changing QB's too...

Give me a break.

you're missing a couple key stats - 3-0 - two wins on the road - division title last year.

But yeah, besides those key stats, oh and 32 TDs to 10 int. last year, it's a good comparison!

 

[RFIP]

Oh and, there was this nice little 3 play stretch for carson on Sunday. I'll highlight in RED for the Vince56

3-7-CIN40(6:43) C.Palmer sacked at CIN 35 for -5 yards (C.Haggans). FUMBLES (C.Haggans), recovered by CIN-K.Watson at CIN 37. K.Watson to CIN 48 for 11 yards (T.Polamalu).1-10-CIN48(6:43) C.Palmer sacked at CIN 43 for -5 yards (L.Foote). FUMBLES (L.Foote), recovered by CIN-E.Ghiaciuc at CIN 43. E.Ghiaciuc to CIN 43 for no gain (C.Hoke).2-15-CIN43(6:43) C.Palmer pass short right intended for C.Henry INTERCEPTED by D.Townsend at PIT 46. D.Townsend ran ob at PIT 46 for no gain.

Man what a bum! How does this cat keep his job? Good thing fat-man Green ain't his coach!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Oh and, there was this nice little 3 play stretch for carson on Sunday. I'll highlight in RED for the Vince56

3-7-CIN40(6:43) C.Palmer sacked at CIN 35 for -5 yards (C.Haggans). FUMBLES (C.Haggans), recovered by CIN-K.Watson at CIN 37. K.Watson to CIN 48 for 11 yards (T.Polamalu).1-10-CIN48(6:43) C.Palmer sacked at CIN 43 for -5 yards (L.Foote). FUMBLES (L.Foote), recovered by CIN-E.Ghiaciuc at CIN 43. E.Ghiaciuc to CIN 43 for no gain (C.Hoke).2-15-CIN43(6:43) C.Palmer pass short right intended for C.Henry INTERCEPTED by D.Townsend at PIT 46. D.Townsend ran ob at PIT 46 for no gain.

Man what a bum! How does this cat keep his job? Good thing fat-man Green ain't his coach!

4TDS - A WIN ON THE ROAD AGAINST THE DEFENDING SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS.

Is there a reason you're leaving those little nuggets of info out of the equation here?

 

[RFIP]

Add up Carson's MVP's, SB's, and all time records... Then do the same for Warner.

Moron-ic comparison. Warner has earned the right to lead this team out of it's haplessness. But I honest to God PRAY he gets yanked for Matt. Honest to GOD I pray for it.

I've seen that movie play out before. It ain't going to be any pretty this time, but you all keep dreaming....

BTW, does anyone think that playing IN Atlanta after they got beitch-slapped, changed fat-@rse Green's mind about playing ML?

Come on, I give some of you guys more credit than that. It's right in front of your faces...

 

[Cheesebeef]

Add up Carson's MVP's, SB's, and all time records... Then do the same for Warner.

Moron-ic comparison.

you're right - because you're living in the past and we're talking about the present.

Besides, AREN'T YOU THE ONE WHO IS MAKING THE FREAKING COMPARISON IN THE FIRST PLACE?

 

[RFIP]

A yeah, a win because HIS DEFENSE GOT 5 TURNOVERS. How many did Kurt's get him? One? PLEASE DUDE, get your facts straight before speaking.

The dude fumbled 3 times, threw 2 pic, and was sacked 8 times! Yeah, HE won that game against Pittsburgh!

WOW...

 

[Cheesebeef]

seriously - you bring up Carson Palmer, then list off all his bad stats and compare him to Warner, but when all of his good stats are brought up, you call it moronic to compare the two QBs - how the hell does that make any sense?

 

[Derm]

you lovebirds need to get a room....

 

[Cheesebeef]

A yeah, a win because HIS DEFENSE GOT 5 TURNOVERS. How many did Kurt's get him? One? PLEASE DUDE, get your facts straight before speaking.

The dude fumbled 3 times, threw 2 pic, and was sacked 8 times! Yeah, HE won that game against Pittsburgh!

WOW...

4 TOUCHDOWN PASSES - 2 Pics - his TD:Turnover ration was better than 2:1 whereas you're boy was 1:4. No one said Carson singlehandedly won anything, but you're damn right that he was involved in the win, whereas Warner was singlehandedly responsible for the loss.

 

[RFIP]

Palmer is a great QB, a GREAT QB. What I'm saying is, you have to believe in your QB, through thick and thin, it's the only way it works.

You can not have your QB playing afraid to make a mistake. If Kurt is your QB or he is not. He is going to HAVE TO make plays each and EVERY WEEK if the Cards are to have ANY chance.

Carson is NOT in that situation.

Some weeks it may get ugly but, IF he is allowed to be the guy he will NOT be the reason this season fails. He WILL BE a huge reason it may be a success.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Palmer is a great QB, a GREAT QB. What I'm saying is, you have to believe in your QB, through thick and thin, it's the only way it works.

You can not have your QB playing afraid to make a mistake. If Kurt is your QB or he is not. He is going to HAVE TO make plays each and EVERY WEEK if the Cards are to have ANY chance.

Carson is NOT in that situation.

Some weeks it may get ugly but, IF he is allowed to be the guy he will NOT be the reason this season fails. He WILL BE a huge reason it may be a success.

Carson EARNED that right last year leading the Bengals to an incredible offense and Division Title - Warner has been 3-10 with a horrific TD:Turnover ratio with the Cardinals and has already been a blown off of two teams. You're comparing apples to oranges. Warner hasn't earned SQUAT playing the Cardinals. He's two teams and five years removed from even adequate QB play.

 

[Russ Smith]

So Kurt fumbled the snap on a handoff play but would NOT have fumbled it if he was just taking a knee? and fans on the ram board know this because?

I don't get the Palmer comparison, he's been sacked 10 times in the last 2 games and yet has only 4 INT's and he threw 4 TD passes against the super bowl champs, and he's coming off major knee surgery. Warner you said 5 sacks but it's actually 9, many of them his fault, and he's had the 4 picks. You apparently think fumbles that aren't lost don't mean anything, how often does a team gain yardage from recovering their own lost fumble by the QB?

And in case you haven't noticed Bengals fans WERE saying Palmer was off to a slow start, even in the win over Pitt he had some problems. Kurt meanwhile looked great against the 49ers, struggled much more against Seattle than Palmer did against Pitt, and then completely blew the game against the Rams. The Bengals are 3-0 and averaging 28+ ppg, we're 1-2 and averaging just over 19 PPG, 12 PPG in the last 2 games.

And the biggest omission is Warner is 35, Palmer turns 27 in December, don't you think that factors into how coaches evaluate QB's?

 

[devilalum]

If Warner had played better the Cards would have won, that is a fact.

But the Cards could have won in spite of Warner's bad play if we had a team around him that was half way descent.

Want to make a comparison. How about Warner and Plummer.

I know 99% of the people on this board believe that Warner is better than Plummer but who has the better record over the last 2 seasons. If Warner played for Denver he'd have a great record too.

 

[Russ Smith]

A yeah, a win because HIS DEFENSE GOT 5 TURNOVERS. How many did Kurt's get him? One? PLEASE DUDE, get your facts straight before speaking.

The dude fumbled 3 times, threw 2 pic, and was sacked 8 times! Yeah, HE won that game against Pittsburgh!

WOW...

Actually he was only sacked 6 times not 8 but you're right that he did fumble 3 times and had 2 picks. Of course you're also forgetting to point out that Seattle dropped what 3 easy picks last week, and in the opener an SF CB dropped a sure TD int very early in the game. Warner COULD have 8 picks quite easily right now if not for some luck. And yes I know DB's are DB's because they can't catch the ball.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Are we really comparing these two? I mean none of you take into consideration that Warner is actually responsible for this team winning. He has a small semblance of a running game at best, a porous oline, and a defense, on a good day, that is average.

If you think that any QB in the league could come in and do better in this situation you are seriously kidding yourself. Palmer is still making these mistakes with a top 10 offense and a top 10 defense, a rb who is 4th in the NFL in rushing, and a very good offensive line.

We can blame Warner all we want but frankly I fail to see where any QB could have great success with these issues.

Now having said all of the above, the second point is that he is responsible for this play-period, and that many turnovers are unacceptable. 8 fumbles (who cares if he has only lost 2, that number will certainly rise) and 4 ints is pathetic and he deserves all of the criticism he is getting. And a benching may be in order...

But if you are delusional enough to think that this team, under Leinart, will have better success because he "was a winner in college" or "is the future of the team" or "Is a smart guy" or any other of the flat out dumb-ass reasons I have seen on this board in the last few days, then keep drinking the Leinart koolaid....It will be bitter.

 

[D-Dogg]

But the Cards could have won in spite of Warner's bad play if we had a team around him that was half way descent.

I don't agree with that.

We allowed just 16 points. We turned the ball over in the red zone 3 times, one of them where we would have won the game by just not turning it over. Another of our turnovers gave the Rams the ball in our territory and led directly to points.

The team around him was more than halfway decent..they put in an effort that would have been deemed an ass-kicking of the Rams. It is very rare in a team game like football to pin a loss directly on one guy, but Kurt was directly responsible for taking off a MINIMUM of 9 points and a max of 17, while delivering an easy 3 points to the other team. Someone who does that looks around the room and realized that everyone is looking at him and all he sees is the tips of their index fingers.

 

[devilalum]

I don't agree with that.

We allowed just 16 points. We turned the ball over in the red zone 3 times, one of them where we would have won the game by just not turning it over. Another of our turnovers gave the Rams the ball in our territory and led directly to points.

The team around him was more than halfway decent..they put in an effort that would have been deemed an ass-kicking of the Rams. It is very rare in a team game like football to pin a loss directly on one guy, but Kurt was directly responsible for taking off a MINIMUM of 9 points and a max of 17, while delivering an easy 3 points to the other team. Someone who does that looks around the room and realized that everyone is looking at him and all he sees is the tips of their index fingers.

So you don't think a better running game, more time to throw and recievers getting more seperation would have made any difference?

I said I too believe that Warner could have made the difference but he's not the only problem.