I Know You Didn't Like My Cutler Suggestion But......

[Harry]

BA does.


http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/w...-for-jay-cutler-if-he-and-the-bears-cut-ties/

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

Ok......great, BA loves a sniveling, strong-armed QB....... Awesome.

But what if that sniveling, strong-armed QB had less than 2 seconds, to get a long-ball 20+ yards down the field?

It would look no different than Carson Palmer with the current offensive line.


/yawn


At the end of the day... We need a solid (and deep) offensive line... Or a mobile QB.


One or the other.... (both would be nice) But Jay Cutler would be a lateral move at best.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

I think Jay Cutler would be fine behind our OLine - I think he can takes the hits...

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[Mitch]

BA had a reason back then to talk up Cutler. There are good reasons why the guy has repeatedly lost in the league, not only on the scoreboard but with the fans.

 

[Beaver]

Doooon't Caaaaare

 

[GatorAZ]

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[Russ Smith]

Again my issue with Cutler is he doesn't have the same excuses that say Palmer did. The Bengals were horrible when Palmer got there and horribly run. The Raiders were horrible when he got there and horribly run. Cutler went to Denver with Shanahan as the coach on a playoff team that had some ex Cardinal QB who Shanahan was fed up with. That he didn't last in Denver should tell you something he had all the right personnel and people around him and failed.

His last year there he threw for 4500 yards and 25 TD's(18 picks). But they hired McDaniels as coach and he was trying to get Cassel(coached him in NE) and Cutler was so upset he forced the trade and Denver got Orton and 2 first round picks and never looked back.

Chicago was not a bad team when Cutler got there he just never made them better.

Do I think Cutler could put up numbers in our system yes, if we get him more reliable Wr's and a better OL, but so could lots of QB's without all the headaches Jay Cutler brings.

He is the classic coach killer IMO.

 

[Harry]

You guys may be right on Cutler, but I think he give the Cards a lot more cap space and Fitz might stay. I'm fairly sure BA would like to try to fix him and it would be Cutler's last stand if he didn't make it. In the meantime BA could work on a QBOTF. Keim could work on an O-line and a couple of receivers.

 

[Russ Smith]

You guys may be right on Cutler, but I think he give the Cards a lot more cap space and Fitz might stay. I'm fairly sure BA would like to try to fix him and it would be Cutler's last stand if he didn't make it. In the meantime BA could work on a QBOTF. Keim could work on an O-line and a couple of receivers.

Oh I fully believe it COULD go that way, would not surprise me at all coaches don't commit to 37 year old QB's.

I'm just saying I'm not convinced even Arians can fix Cutler.

His 2 best years in Chicago were back to back, 28 and 18 picks and 21 and 11. But if you really look they did that by getting him to dial back the gunslinger stuff, his YPA was down the 28-18 year but the % was up and he was lower risk.

I think people see him as the ultimate Jeff George put him on the right team like George with the Vikings and look out, but we don't have Moss and Carter in their prime and we don't have a great OL like the Vikes did on that team.

 

[kerouac9]

Again my issue with Cutler is he doesn't have the same excuses that say Palmer did. The Bengals were horrible when Palmer got there and horribly run. The Raiders were horrible when he got there and horribly run. Cutler went to Denver with Shanahan as the coach on a playoff team that had some ex Cardinal QB who Shanahan was fed up with. That he didn't last in Denver should tell you something he had all the right personnel and people around him and failed.

His last year there he threw for 4500 yards and 25 TD's(18 picks). But they hired McDaniels as coach and he was trying to get Cassel(coached him in NE) and Cutler was so upset he forced the trade and Denver got Orton and 2 first round picks and never looked back.

Chicago was not a bad team when Cutler got there he just never made them better.

Do I think Cutler could put up numbers in our system yes, if we get him more reliable Wr's and a better OL, but so could lots of QB's without all the headaches Jay Cutler brings.

He is the classic coach killer IMO.

More speculative fiction from Russ Smith.

The 2008 Denver Broncos had the #2 offense in the NFL, 16th in scoring, 1st in DVOA. Shanhan got fired and they "only" went 8-8 because there defense was 29th in yardage, 30th in scoring, and 31st in DVOA. They lost their last three games, and Cutler threw 2 TDs and 4 INTs during that time.

Chicago has been .500 with Cutler as the starter; if they're a bad team, he's definitely raised them to mediocre.

I think Cutler's probably been misunderstood, but he's broken beyond repair from a perception standpoint.

 

[DeAnna]

Wow, then you'd REALLY have chemistry problems. He's the anti-Carson Palmer.

 

[PJ1]

I would puke if they signed this loser. Friggin headcase.

 

[Russ Smith]

More speculative fiction from Russ Smith.

The 2008 Denver Broncos had the #2 offense in the NFL, 16th in scoring, 1st in DVOA. Shanhan got fired and they "only" went 8-8 because there defense was 29th in yardage, 30th in scoring, and 31st in DVOA. They lost their last three games, and Cutler threw 2 TDs and 4 INTs during that time.

Chicago has been .500 with Cutler as the starter; if they're a bad team, he's definitely raised them to mediocre.

I think Cutler's probably been misunderstood, but he's broken beyond repair from a perception standpoint.

So he didn't join a team that was 13-3 the year before denver drafted him? That didn't happen?

Because it sure seems that's what happened, 13-3 the year before they drafted him, 9-7 his first year when Shanahan switched from Plummer to Cutler during the year. He was a rookie of course, he went 2-3 as the starter at the end of the year, not bad, the next year he was the fulltime starter they went 7-9. The next year he was the starter they went 8-8 then Shanahan was gone they hired McDaniels who didn't believe in Cutler and wanted to get Cassel who he knew from NE, that didn't happen but Cutler was so upset with that they moved him to Chicago.

9-7 for the Bears the prior year, Cutler came in and they went 7-9. the very next year they were 11-5, 10-5 with Cutler, he had 23 TD's to 16 picks or numbers you routinely refer to as mediocre or bad when they're put up by Palmer but apparently are good when put up by Cutler. Why'd they go 11-5? Because they gave up the 4th fewest points in the league, they scored the 21st most, yep defense led that team.

Next year 8-8 defense fell back. Next year 10-6 why, defense back up to 3rd.

Jay Cutler has never improved a team he was on, and he's been on some decent teams unlike Palmer who spent the bulk of his career on bad teams.

Now yes the Cards have a good defense and if we do FA well we'll have a good defense next year, but even in good situations Cutler is going to be Cutler. Now put him in a system where you have to throw deep, without extra protection, and ask him to throw a bunch of timing routes where you let it go before the WR makes his move. I'm going to guess he's going to throw even more INT's than he normally does.

He has 7 seasons of 15 or more games he has 119 INT's in those 7 seasons, that's an average of 17 a season. In those 7 seasons the lowest he ever got was 11 and that was last year which is why Bears fans were hoping this was the year, it wasn't. I think some would call it "regressing to the mean."

He has a great arm, when he's on he looks fantastic, but we've got 11 seasons of data that suggest it's unlikely he's going to thrive as the Cards qb next year if we get him.


Statistically Palmer and Cutler are very similar players, you constantly blame Palmer for problems here yet somehow thinking getting a younger less good version of him is a good idea? Palmer joined a team that won 2 games the year before the drafted him, he joined a Raiders team that hadn't won more than 5 games in 7 straight years before going 8-8. Cutler has consistently been on better teams and not done any better, marginally worse as a player.

 

[DeAnna]

If it had to do with Jake Plummer, Russ will have it memorized

 

[kerouac9]

That 2005 Broncos team that went 13-3 was 3rd in scoring defense, 15th in yardage and 9th in DVOA. It happened, but not just because of their offense. As I said, the Broncos faltered because their defense declined. You're trying to pin it on Cutler, which isn't supportable.

I "constantly blame Palmer for problems here"? Justify THAT. I think that Palmer is now who he has always been, and that 18 games between 2014 and 2015 are anomalous. I don't think that either player is going to do much to make the players around him better (at least consistently).

I think Palmer's done; I'm not sure that Cutler is. I'd rather have Tannehill or someone younger, but that's not really a solution that's on the table. I think the team is going to roll with Palmer for another season; this conversation is pretty academic.

 

[NJCardFan]

I'm tired of this team getting retread QB's. Draft and develop one. Haven't done this since Plummer.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I think the team is going to roll with Palmer for another season; this conversation is pretty academic.

I have no idea why they would not.

The offensive line regressed this season, and to say the wide receivers on this team regressed is a HUGE understatement. They went from an asset to the team's biggest liability out on the field. Yes, even more than the offensive line.

Carson Palmer has been, and always will be an average NFL QB, and when he has a good offensive line, and good wide receivers you get 2015, and when you have a bad offensive line, and wide receivers that look like they are making a collective effort to damage their own team as much as possible you get 2016.

I have literally stopped counting how many dropped passes for 1st downs these receivers have dropped. They MUST have the record for most dropped passes that have hit them right in the hands. These guys make Early Doucet look like greatest possession receiver of our time.

I do not see a single veteran QB that is going to be available that would do better or as good under the current circumstances, and if the Cardinals draft someone, then Palmer is going to be a good asset to have for that transition.

I do not see Cutler being any better or worse behind this line and with these receivers. The Cardinals have a host of other areas to work on and look into, and that includes bringing in a QoF, and a backup quarterback, because as much as I like Drew Stanton, there is no reason to keep him around next season.

 

[kerouac9]

I have no idea why they would not.

The offensive line regressed this season, and to say the wide receivers on this team regressed is a HUGE understatement. They went from an asset to the team's biggest liability out on the field. Yes, even more than the offensive line.

Carson Palmer has been, and always will be an average NFL QB, and when he has a good offensive line, and good wide receivers you get 2015, and when you have a bad offensive line, and wide receivers that look like they are making a collective effort to damage their own team as much as possible you get 2016.

I have literally stopped counting how much dropped passes for 1st downs these receivers have dropped. They MUST have the record for most dropped passes that have hit them right in the hands.

I do not see a single veteran that is going to be available that would do better or as good under the current circumstances, and if the Cardinals draft someone, then Palmer is going to be a good asset to have for that transition.

I do not see Cutler being any better or worse behind this line and with these receivers. The Cardinals have a host of other areas to work on and look into, and that includes bringing in a QoF, and a backup quarterback, because as much as I like Drew Stanton, there is no reason to keep him around next season.

I dunno. I think that if just Floyd had regressed, it would be one thing. But what are the odds that every WR and Andre Ellington regressed at the same time, and at least some of that isn't attributable to the guy throwing the ball? I don't know enough about quarterbacking to say what might be up with Palmer, but I don't think it's just the entire WR depth chart, or that 6 receivers all independently fell off a cliff (Oh, and Fitz is dropping balls, too).

It's like a woman who says, "Why is it that every single guy I date ends up cheating on me?" There's only one common denominator in that equation.

 

[Bert]

The offensive line has to get fixed. Look at what Dallas is doing.

We have good defensive core, and I still believe we have the offensive weapons to win, but this offensive line is making it impossible.

So In my opinion, the Cardinals can either try to find the next Russel Wilson in the draft, good luck with that, or they can focus on the Oline and just try to improve on what we have.

Calling some plays that don't require 23 step drops would also be helpful. Although, there were times on Sunday where I felt like Carson could have stepped into the pocket and he didn't, but that's what happens when you are getting murdered every play...

Talking about this team just depresses me right now.

 

[Stout]

You guys may be right on Cutler, but I think he give the Cards a lot more cap space and Fitz might stay. I'm fairly sure BA would like to try to fix him and it would be Cutler's last stand if he didn't make it. In the meantime BA could work on a QBOTF. Keim could work on an O-line and a couple of receivers.

Good point, Harry. If we jettison Palmer, grabbing Cutler might get Fitz to stay. Plus, even if he isn't 'the' answer, he gives us a vet stopgap so we can get a QBOTF.

 

[Big D]

I hate Cutler but if Palmer is not the QB next year for whatever reason you have to at least kick the tires.

Depressing

 

[TJ]

I like Cutler more than most, but this recurring theme of 30+ y/o stopgaps is neither the short nor long-term solution anymore. The solution is to find a QB in next season's draft who can learn under Palmer for 1-2 years and be ready to take over when Palmer leaves.

 

[PJ1]

Palmer is tougher than Cutler ever dreamed of being.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I dunno. I think that if just Floyd had regressed, it would be one thing. But what are the odds that every WR and Andre Ellington regressed at the same time, and at least some of that isn't attributable to the guy throwing the ball? I don't know enough about quarterbacking to say what might be up with Palmer, but I don't think it's just the entire WR depth chart, or that 6 receivers all independently fell off a cliff (Oh, and Fitz is dropping balls, too).

It's like a woman who says, "Why is it that every single guy I date ends up cheating on me?" There's only one common denominator in that equation.

Normally I would be right there with you.

Can you explain why Floyd is not catching balls throw right into his hands ? I cannot, I am still baffled by the whole situation, not just Floyd.

Yes, Palmer has had bad throws to Floyd but more times than not they have hit him in the hands.

John Brown has been a shell of himself, and while that is not John Brown's fault, it is certainly not Palmer's fault that one of the receivers he is known to work very closely with has been literally hurt all year long.

That leaves you with Jaron Brown who is on I.R., and JJ Nelson, who much like Floyd, is just dropping passes that hit him right in the hands.

Andre Ellington, I will certainly agree there. There is nothing wrong with Ellington and Palmer cannot seem to hit him in the hands or even get it close this year.

Palmer is not having a great year, by any means, but then again, you may be one of the few people on the board, that understand Palmer's last season was an exception to the norm. Palmer is a very, average quarterback, and it is not helping that four out of his five receivers are not playing anywhere near the level they have been, and yes, Palmer has nothing to do with Floyd, and Nelson's drops, or John Brown and Jaron Brown's health.

Does Palmer share blame? Sure.

Is Palmer's regression the main reason for the decline of the passing game ? I say no. I think the receivers literally going from one of the better groups in the league to one of the worst is a much bigger part of the problem.

Larry Fitzgerald has 78 catches on the year. The closest wide receiver after that is John Brown with 31.........31. In this offensive that is ridiculous.

So, yeah, put heat on Palmer, he deserves it, but he is getting very little help from his receivers. This is one of the worst year's of receiver play from the Cardinals since pre-Anquan Boldin days. :shudder:

 

[mjb21aztd]

Yea I would not be to optimistic about cutler sure strong arm but little playoff experience and int machine. With that being said sad thing he might be the best veteran qb to have a shot at getting .