Implications of the Rivers to LAC Deal

[JCSunsfan]

Here are the implications of that deal as I see them:

1. Paul has committed to the Clips or Rivers would not have allowed the deal.
2. Paul and Howard will not be able to unite in free agency. I cannot see how the Clips can clear the space and the Lakers are not going to trade him to the Clips.
3. Howard will stay with the Lakers. Free agent destinations do not look nearly as attractive to him without Paul going along.
4. Houston, Dallas, and Atlanta are not going to make cap clearing deals if the signing of Howard and/or Paul is so remote.
5. Suns are not likely to pick up Thomas Robinson or the #13 pick.

Am I off base?

 

[Chaplin]

I think you're correct on all points except for 1/3 of point 4. I think Houston has already cleared their space to sign Howard. The hard part is convincing him to sign.

 

[chickenhead]

I think a Lakers/Clippers trade is still possible. The Lakers will just have to decide what return is adequate for Howard in a vacuum, plus whatever market share they feel they are sacrificing to a crosstown rival. Personally, I don't think the Lakers have any cause for worry about conceding LA even a little bit.

This article details a trade involving Bledsoe and Griffin.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...ight-howard-to-clippers-would-boost-lake-show

 

[PDXChris]

This is how I see it playing how. LA and Boston finish KG for Jordan, Piece comes not too long after. Then the Clippers and Laker trade Griffin and Bledsoe for Howard.

Clippers lineup
PG Paul
SG Crawford
SF Peirce
PF KG
C Howard

Bench
Chauncey Billups
Caron Butler
Lamar Odom
Ryan Hollins

The Clippers got older, but better.

Lakers
PG Nash
SG Bryant
SF Metta World Peace
PF Griffin
C Gasol

Bench
Bledsoe
Jamison
Blake

The lineup works so much better for Coach D and Bledsoe could learn from Nash for a year and with Nash getting older and more prone to injury, he will be playing a lot anyways.

 

[PDXChris]

I think a Lakers/Clippers trade is still possible. The Lakers will just have to decide what return is adequate for Howard in a vacuum, plus whatever market share they feel they are sacrificing to a crosstown rival. Personally, I don't think the Lakers have any cause for worry about conceding LA even a little bit.

This article details a trade involving Bledsoe and Griffin.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...ight-howard-to-clippers-would-boost-lake-show

Here is a thread with a more reliable source saying the same.

Sorry, I hate bleacherreport.com

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f64/cp3-dwight-howard-teammates-196083.html#post2848634

 

[AzStevenCal]

Here are the implications of that deal as I see them:

1. Paul has committed to the Clips or Rivers would not have allowed the deal.
2. Paul and Howard will not be able to unite in free agency. I cannot see how the Clips can clear the space and the Lakers are not going to trade him to the Clips.
3. Howard will stay with the Lakers. Free agent destinations do not look nearly as attractive to him without Paul going along.
4. Houston, Dallas, and Atlanta are not going to make cap clearing deals if the signing of Howard and/or Paul is so remote.
5. Suns are not likely to pick up Thomas Robinson or the #13 pick.

Am I off base?

I don't see it. Even without Paul, the Clippers have a lot more to work with than the Celtics do and Rivers wanted no part of a rebuild. Maybe Paul stays, maybe he goes but I don't think he's given any assurances to Doc's camp IMO.

I see no reason for Howard to want to stay in LA. I think they are poised for hard times in Laker land and while I like their chances of returning to relevance quicker than we will, it will still be a few years. Unless someone is willing to give them premium draft picks for their remaining assets, I think they're going to be in our boat real soon. Of course much of this is predicated on Kobe being finished. I also think Dwight has seen enough of LA to realize he's in over his head there. He's probably already heard more negative reactions in one year from the local media, teammates and fan-base than he's faced in his career and that includes the coach-killer portion of his Orlando stay.

I do agree with your last point but I'm not sure the Clippers new coach has anything to do with that. Until this organization actually absorbs salary in order to gain a future asset I'll continue to believe we are not willing to do so.

Steve

 

[elindholm]

Do you think Dallas's interest in dumping the #13 was contingent upon being able to make a run at Howard? I thought they were lukewarm about the pick either way.

How about this?

Phoenix gets
#13 pick
Shawn Marion (9.3, 2014)

Dallas gets
Luis Scola (4.5, 2015)
Shannon Brown (3.5, 2014)

It's possible that this trade could not be made official until some time after the draft, because of Scola's contract situation.

 

[Chaplin]

Do you think Dallas's interest in dumping the #13 was contingent upon being able to make a run at Howard? I thought they were lukewarm about the pick either way.

How about this?

Phoenix gets
#13 pick
Shawn Marion (9.3, 2014)

Dallas gets
Luis Scola (4.5, 2015)
Shannon Brown (3.5, 2014)

It's possible that this trade could not be made official until some time after the draft, because of Scola's contract situation.

Yes. And if we can get the #10 from Portland for Gortat, then jump on it. My question for you is why Dallas would do that.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yes. And if we can get the #10 from Portland for Gortat, then jump on it. My question for you is why Dallas would do that.

agreed. they're looking to dump salary, not bring any back.

 

[elindholm]

My question for you is why Dallas would do that.

It saves them money for this year, and Scola is a pretty cost-effective asset for a team trying to win now.

 

[elindholm]

agreed. they're looking to dump salary, not bring any back.

Dallas reduces their salary obligations in the proposed deal.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Dallas reduces their salary obligations in the proposed deal.

not enough to make a run at Howard and another FA. You dump a lotto pick and you're looking to clear space, not a couple million.

 

[Chaplin]

It saves them money for this year, and Scola is a pretty cost-effective asset for a team trying to win now.

Are they trying to win now though?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Are they trying to win now though?

you bet your ass that Cuban is going to at least TRY to make a huge splash in FA. They're pretty much in a position of Howard or bust after breaking up the Mavs after their title run and then signing a bunch of one year deals last year.

i don't think it'll work, but I think they make a major run at Howard...maybe Monta Ellis too go with him.

 

[elindholm]

not enough to make a run at Howard and another FA.

Hang on, let me put on my Manu4five hat:

"cheesebeef: Learn to read."

Man, that felt good! I should become a Spurs fan!

I asked in my original post whether Dallas wanted to unload the #13 only if it meant making a play for Howard, or even if it didn't. I've read that they want to dump it either way, but I don't know if that's true. Thus the speculation.

They have to fill their roster with someone. Scola is much better value than they're likely to get any other way. Brown is a sunk cost, but it's only for one year.

Are they trying to win now though?

Yes. Everything I've read says that they're in win-now mode until Nowitzki retires.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Hang on, let me put on my Manu4five hat:

"cheesebeef: Learn to read."

Man, that felt good! I should become a Spurs fan!

jesus...didn't see that comment. no reason to be a jerk.

 

[PDXChris]

Yes. And if we can get the #10 from Portland for Gortat, then jump on it. My question for you is why Dallas would do that.

The local radio here in Portland wants that deal to get done. They know Hickson is gong to get paid by someone else and don't feel there is a starting big at that pick.

 

[HooverDam]

I don't see the Mavs wanting Scola. They want to clear a ton of cap to try to get Howard and if they don't get him maybe they go for Josh Smith or someone else.

Mavs can trade Marion and 13 for basically nothing.

Bruce Cooper, in an otherwise mediocre article, proposed the idea of Scola to OKC for their #32. That makes some sense as it would help their depth and he makes more sense on a contender. Perkins has been such a zero for them, Scola would be an upgrade even though he's more of a 4 than a 5.

If that deal happened, or something like it, the Suns could send their 2 second round picks in this daft to Dalls for Marion and 13.

Then do the Gortat to PDX for the 10 trade as well, and you've got a stew going! 5,10 and 13... One of the picks has got to pan out!

 

[Cheesebeef]

I don't see the Mavs wanting Scola. They want to clear a ton of cap to try to get Howard and if they don't get him maybe they go for Josh Smith or someone else.

Mavs can trade Marion and 13 for basically nothing.

Bruce Cooper, in an otherwise mediocre article, proposed the idea of Scola to OKC for their #32. That makes some sense as it would help their depth and he makes more sense on a contender. Perkins has been such a zero for them, Scola would be an upgrade even though he's more of a 4 than a 5.

If that deal happened, or something like it, the Suns could send their 2 second round picks in this daft to Dalls for Marion and 13.

Then do the Gortat to PDX for the 10 trade as well, and you've got a stew going! 5,10 and 13... One of the picks has got to pan out!

if i'm OKC, i'd do that deal. he gives tha team a little more dirty grit and a guy who can get a couple low post scores.

 

[Chaplin]

if i'm OKC, i'd do that deal. he gives tha team a little more dirty grit and a guy who can get a couple low post scores.

The real question is if the Suns themselves would consider Scola, especially at his salary, consider Scola worth the #32.

 

[elindholm]

The real question is if the Suns themselves would consider Scola, especially at his salary, consider Scola worth the #32.

And the answer is No. The #32 pick in this draft has virtually no value. If they can't get a better offer than that for Scola now, they'll be able to later.

 

[SirStefan32]

And the answer is No. The #32 pick in this draft has virtually no value. If they can't get a better offer than that for Scola now, they'll be able to later.

Yeah, I cannot imagine a scenario where the Suns don't get a first-round pick for Scola.

 

[Mainstreet]

Yeah, I cannot imagine a scenario where the Suns don't get a first-round pick for Scola.

Same here.

I don't think Scola can be traded until after the draft unless the league allows it under future considerations.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Same here.

I don't think Scola can be traded until after the draft unless the league allows it under future considerations.

Did you come to this opinion through a source or is it your best guess? I've looked at several explanations regarding the amnesty clause and I've yet to find a good writeup on the limitations once you've signed an amnestied player. I've seen a couple of references to the fact you can't sign him until the season has ended but I don't know it they were researched offerings or merely a repeat of what someone else has said. It would be nice to know what our options really are.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

Did you come to this opinion through a source or is it your best guess? I've looked at several explanations regarding the amnesty clause and I've yet to find a good writeup on the limitations once you've signed an amnestied player. I've seen a couple of references to the fact you can't sign him until the season has ended but I don't know it they were researched offerings or merely a repeat of what someone else has said. It would be nice to know what our options really are.

Steve

Scola cannot be traded until July 1st. This is referenced in an article written by Paul Coro dated 2-8-13 and elsewhere. Some fans and at least one reporter talk like he can be traded during the draft. I don't think so unless the NBA allows it as a future consideration.

The Suns can commit to him as an example because they are unable to trade him until July 1 because they acquired him as Houston’s amnesty waiver.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/sun...-showing-young-phoenix-suns-path-success.html