Raptors-Bulls junk swap
By Chad Ford
NBA Insider
Send an Email to Chad Ford Monday, November 24
Updated: November 24
10:37 AM ET
How pathetic has the first three weeks of the NBA season been?
Consider this. The passion with which the media covered, debated and propped up a potential Jalen Rose-for-Antonio Davis trade this weekend has been surpassed only by the opening-night hype of LeBron James' first game.
Insider breaks down the most intriguing story lines from Week 4, including that out-of-control trade rumor and the eye-opening play of two rookies not named LeBron or 'Melo.
A Raptors blockbuster or a bunch of Bull? Jalen Rose? Antonio Davis? Donyell Marshall? Jerome Williams? Alvin Williams? Morris Peterson? Does everyone really care that much about any of these players? I doubt it. So does Raptors head coach Kevin O'Neill, who delivered the line of the season after the trade rumors died down on Sunday.
"You guys, as media, love trade rumors more than the game."
You can probably put the fans on that same bandwagon, Kevin. When your team is dropping pathetic 62-point performances against teams like the Bucks, people are going to begin looking elsewhere for their entertainment.
As far as trade rumors go, the whole thing was a bit of yawner. It was the NBA equivalent of a yard sale -- two GMs swapping their unwanted junk.
Jalen Rose
Guard-Forward
Chicago Bulls
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
14 14.1 4.0 3.8 .379 .771
The Raptors have been trying to dump Davis and the Williams brothers for years. The Bulls have been pleading with just about everyone to take Rose off their hands. The only surprise really was that these two GMs under fire didn't find each other sooner.
For those of you who had more important things to do this weekend, like say, napping, WGN Radio out of Chicago broke late Friday afternoon that the Raptors and Bulls were on the verge of a BLOCKBUSTER!
The original reports had the Bulls ready to swap Rose for Alvin Williams, Jerome Williams and Peterson. From there, chaos ensued. On the air and in the press the deal started growing and growing.
Soon Marshall, Marcus Fizer, Eddie Robinson, Lonny Baxter and even Jamal Crawford were rumored to be involved on the Bulls' end. On the Raptors' end, Davis, Michael Bradley and even Chris Bosh and Vince Carter were drug into the muck.
You knew that things had finally gotten out of control when the rumors began circulating that Mark Cuban had also entered into the trade discussions -- offering Antawn Jamison and Tony Delk for Antonio Davis.
THAT deal would have been a blockbuster, if for no other reason then it would have been the third max-salary trade the Mavs had done in just over three months. Alas, Cuban, via e-mail, denied he was part of this monstrosity.
Antonio Davis
Center
Toronto Raptors
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
13 8.0 9.5 1.0 .371 .722
As you know by now, by Friday night it was pretty clear that things had gotten stretched out of proportion. Rose and Marshall played on Friday night, squashing the reports that a deal was imminent (teams almost always hold players out of the game if they are on the verge of being traded). On Saturday, all of the Raptors' principals were playing in New Jersey and the writing was on the wall.
By Sunday, Bulls GM John Paxson and Raptors GM Glen Grunwald had the unenviable task of trying to explain to a dozen guys why every media outlet in North America was reporting that they were as good as gone.
"My biggest disappointment is someone let this out, and that puts players in a horrible position. But that's my job, to smooth things over," Paxson said. "The worst part is when it becomes a distraction to the players, so I'll have to sort out the misinformation."
"It's part of the business, but it is unfortunate when (rumors) really get blown out of proportion," Grunwald told the Toronto Sun. "I look at it from the human nature of the players. These are people we're dealing with and their futures are being bandied about by people who are being a little irresponsible."
Grunwald can complain all he wants about the media, who clearly went a bit overboard on the whole deal, but at least one outlet is reporting that it was his own head coach who leaked the initial report.
The Sun Times' Jay Marrioti wrote on Saturday that O'Neill and the WGN radio station that broke the stories have ties that would explain how they got the information. O'Neill denied the charge on Sunday.
"Of course I didn't leak it to him," said O'Neill. "Why would I leak a rumor about our team? I was born at night, but not last night."
By late Sunday night, several league sources told Insider that the prognosis wasn't good on the deal surviving the night.
One rival GM, who claimed to have talked to both Paxson and Grunwald this weekend, declared the whole thing much to do about nothing.
"They talked, they had interest in each other's players, got some salaries that seemed to match up, they did a little more research and then began to back off," the GM told Insider. "I probably field four or five calls like this a week. The only difference is that they don't get leaked. Most trade talk is just that ... talk. Ninety-five percent of it falls through when push comes to shove."
Apparently, the original proposal was scuttled when Paxson learned that Alvin Williams' contract wasn't covered by insurance. With Williams' persistent knee problems, Paxson grew anxious about taking on the last five years of his deal.
Other permutations of the deal were explored over the weekend, but by most accounts, nothing ever got as close as the initial proposal.
So is the deal dead? I doubt it. Something has to be done and at some point this season Paxson and Grunwald will probably realize that there isn't a better deal on the table. Both the Bulls and the Raptors are on the verge of imploding. Although both teams may be doing little more than swapping junk, my grandma swears that one man's trash is another man's treasure.
The Bulls have tired of Rose's selfishness. They don't believe he and Crawford can coexist in the same backcourt. Despite his undeniable ability to score, his huge contract combined with a perception that he's a locker-room cancer have scared away just about everyone. While players like Davis and Jerome Williams won't turn the Bulls around overnight, they are the type of veteran, blue-collar hustle players the Bulls need around their young players. The Bulls don't lack for talent. What they lack is effort and passion. Both Davis and Williams, when healthy, can bring that to the table.
The Raptors need Rose's scoring in the worst way. Currently, the team is averaging a league-worst 76.6 ppg. The next closest team is the Nets with 85.3 ppg. Grunwald knows his job is on the line. If Carter has to keep carrying this team by himself, the Raptors won't be any good, and it will be just a matter of time before Vince breaks down again. Since Carter is the only other guy on the team who can really score, there should be enough shots for both Carter and Rose. Marshall is a guy the Raptors have coveted for a while, and he would fit in nicely at the four.
Neither team gets any real cap relief out of the deal, but the chances that a team is going to trade an expiring contract for the likes of Rose or Davis are slim to none.
A junk swap stealing headlines in week four? Compared to the mess out on the floor, the deal actually smelled pretty sweet.
Can Bosh and Wade catch Carmelo in the rookie race? The only good news coming out of Toronto right now is the play of rookie forward Chris Bosh. While most observers felt like Bosh was the consensus No. 4 pick and had a chance to be an all-star in the league, few predicted his success would come so quickly.
Chris Bosh
Power Forward
Toronto Raptors
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
13 9.8 5.3 0.3 .523 .791
Bosh is averaging 14.2 ppg, 6.6 rpg and 2.8 bpg on 51 percent shooting over the last five games. Next to Vince Carter, Bosh, 19, has been the Raptors' most consistent scorer and is drawing praise from just about everyone around the league.
"I've said all along he's going to be a special player in this league at some point," Raptors head coach Kevin O'Neill told the Globe and Mail. "He's a guy that, if we don't stunt his growth, will continue to make strides on a weekly basis."
"He's smart, you don't have to tell him how to play the game, you don't have to tell him things more than once or twice," O'Neill said. "He has great instincts for the game."
Right behind him, or perhaps in front of him, is Heat guard Dwyane Wade. Since coach Stan Van Gundy decided to let Wade do what he does best -- score -- he's taken a dramatic turn for the better. In his last five games, Wade is averaging 18.2 ppg, 4.4 rpg and 3.2 apg on 48 percent shooting from the field.
Dwyane Wade
Point Guard
Miami Heat
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
12 14.2 4.3 4.1 .384 .723
Now compare the numbers those two have put up with those of Carmelo Anthony, who many felt would run away with the Rookie of the Year honors this season.
After a hot start, Anthony is averaging 15.8 ppg, 9.6 rpg and 3.2 apg on 34 percent shooting. While Anthony's rebounding numbers continue to climb, his shooting percentage has been awful.
Over the same five-game period, Bosh made 23 of the 45 shots he took from the field. Wade made 35 of th 72 shots he took. Anthony made 28 of the 82 shots he took.
While LeBron continues to be the favorite, this is the first time in recent memory where you have four top players who appear worthy of the honor this early in the season.
Chauncey and Larry getting along just fine: Remember all of the preseason hand wringing about the relationship between Chauncey Billups and new Pistons head coach Larry Brown?
The fear was Brown would have a low tolerance for Billups, who is more of a shoot-first, ask-questions-later point guard. How would Chauncey adapt to Brown's more conservative expectations from his point guard?
He hasn't. Instead, it's been Brown who has modified his thinking about what role Billups' plays in the team's offense. Brown claims Billups is the best-shooting point guard he's had in three decades of coaching. He has no intention of cooling his team's hottest hand.
After Billups dropped 33 points, seven rebounds, five assists, three steals and four 3-pointers on the Grizzlies last week Brown pretty much summed up Billups' season so far.
"I don't know how you can play any better than he did," Brown said.
Billups agrees.
"He knows I can make that shot, but I don't think he has ever coached a point guard that plays the way I play," said Billups, who is averaging 23.3 ppg, 7 apg, 4.4 rpg on 46 percent shooting from the field over the last five. "It's going to take some time for him to be able to accept that, but that's what a new situation brings. You have to learn your players; I have to learn my coach. I've learned what he likes, and I have a lot more to learn.
"I know he doesn't like shots late in games, but he always tells me he doesn't want to take away what I do. If it's there, you have to take it, but the questionable shots that I shoot, and I know sometimes they're bad shots, those are the ones he has a huge problem with, and those are probably the ones I shouldn't be taking."
Continued...................
By Chad Ford
NBA Insider
Send an Email to Chad Ford Monday, November 24
Updated: November 24
10:37 AM ET
How pathetic has the first three weeks of the NBA season been?
Consider this. The passion with which the media covered, debated and propped up a potential Jalen Rose-for-Antonio Davis trade this weekend has been surpassed only by the opening-night hype of LeBron James' first game.
Insider breaks down the most intriguing story lines from Week 4, including that out-of-control trade rumor and the eye-opening play of two rookies not named LeBron or 'Melo.
A Raptors blockbuster or a bunch of Bull? Jalen Rose? Antonio Davis? Donyell Marshall? Jerome Williams? Alvin Williams? Morris Peterson? Does everyone really care that much about any of these players? I doubt it. So does Raptors head coach Kevin O'Neill, who delivered the line of the season after the trade rumors died down on Sunday.
"You guys, as media, love trade rumors more than the game."
You can probably put the fans on that same bandwagon, Kevin. When your team is dropping pathetic 62-point performances against teams like the Bucks, people are going to begin looking elsewhere for their entertainment.
As far as trade rumors go, the whole thing was a bit of yawner. It was the NBA equivalent of a yard sale -- two GMs swapping their unwanted junk.
Jalen Rose
Guard-Forward
Chicago Bulls
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
14 14.1 4.0 3.8 .379 .771
The Raptors have been trying to dump Davis and the Williams brothers for years. The Bulls have been pleading with just about everyone to take Rose off their hands. The only surprise really was that these two GMs under fire didn't find each other sooner.
For those of you who had more important things to do this weekend, like say, napping, WGN Radio out of Chicago broke late Friday afternoon that the Raptors and Bulls were on the verge of a BLOCKBUSTER!
The original reports had the Bulls ready to swap Rose for Alvin Williams, Jerome Williams and Peterson. From there, chaos ensued. On the air and in the press the deal started growing and growing.
Soon Marshall, Marcus Fizer, Eddie Robinson, Lonny Baxter and even Jamal Crawford were rumored to be involved on the Bulls' end. On the Raptors' end, Davis, Michael Bradley and even Chris Bosh and Vince Carter were drug into the muck.
You knew that things had finally gotten out of control when the rumors began circulating that Mark Cuban had also entered into the trade discussions -- offering Antawn Jamison and Tony Delk for Antonio Davis.
THAT deal would have been a blockbuster, if for no other reason then it would have been the third max-salary trade the Mavs had done in just over three months. Alas, Cuban, via e-mail, denied he was part of this monstrosity.
Antonio Davis
Center
Toronto Raptors
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
13 8.0 9.5 1.0 .371 .722
As you know by now, by Friday night it was pretty clear that things had gotten stretched out of proportion. Rose and Marshall played on Friday night, squashing the reports that a deal was imminent (teams almost always hold players out of the game if they are on the verge of being traded). On Saturday, all of the Raptors' principals were playing in New Jersey and the writing was on the wall.
By Sunday, Bulls GM John Paxson and Raptors GM Glen Grunwald had the unenviable task of trying to explain to a dozen guys why every media outlet in North America was reporting that they were as good as gone.
"My biggest disappointment is someone let this out, and that puts players in a horrible position. But that's my job, to smooth things over," Paxson said. "The worst part is when it becomes a distraction to the players, so I'll have to sort out the misinformation."
"It's part of the business, but it is unfortunate when (rumors) really get blown out of proportion," Grunwald told the Toronto Sun. "I look at it from the human nature of the players. These are people we're dealing with and their futures are being bandied about by people who are being a little irresponsible."
Grunwald can complain all he wants about the media, who clearly went a bit overboard on the whole deal, but at least one outlet is reporting that it was his own head coach who leaked the initial report.
The Sun Times' Jay Marrioti wrote on Saturday that O'Neill and the WGN radio station that broke the stories have ties that would explain how they got the information. O'Neill denied the charge on Sunday.
"Of course I didn't leak it to him," said O'Neill. "Why would I leak a rumor about our team? I was born at night, but not last night."
By late Sunday night, several league sources told Insider that the prognosis wasn't good on the deal surviving the night.
One rival GM, who claimed to have talked to both Paxson and Grunwald this weekend, declared the whole thing much to do about nothing.
"They talked, they had interest in each other's players, got some salaries that seemed to match up, they did a little more research and then began to back off," the GM told Insider. "I probably field four or five calls like this a week. The only difference is that they don't get leaked. Most trade talk is just that ... talk. Ninety-five percent of it falls through when push comes to shove."
Apparently, the original proposal was scuttled when Paxson learned that Alvin Williams' contract wasn't covered by insurance. With Williams' persistent knee problems, Paxson grew anxious about taking on the last five years of his deal.
Other permutations of the deal were explored over the weekend, but by most accounts, nothing ever got as close as the initial proposal.
So is the deal dead? I doubt it. Something has to be done and at some point this season Paxson and Grunwald will probably realize that there isn't a better deal on the table. Both the Bulls and the Raptors are on the verge of imploding. Although both teams may be doing little more than swapping junk, my grandma swears that one man's trash is another man's treasure.
The Bulls have tired of Rose's selfishness. They don't believe he and Crawford can coexist in the same backcourt. Despite his undeniable ability to score, his huge contract combined with a perception that he's a locker-room cancer have scared away just about everyone. While players like Davis and Jerome Williams won't turn the Bulls around overnight, they are the type of veteran, blue-collar hustle players the Bulls need around their young players. The Bulls don't lack for talent. What they lack is effort and passion. Both Davis and Williams, when healthy, can bring that to the table.
The Raptors need Rose's scoring in the worst way. Currently, the team is averaging a league-worst 76.6 ppg. The next closest team is the Nets with 85.3 ppg. Grunwald knows his job is on the line. If Carter has to keep carrying this team by himself, the Raptors won't be any good, and it will be just a matter of time before Vince breaks down again. Since Carter is the only other guy on the team who can really score, there should be enough shots for both Carter and Rose. Marshall is a guy the Raptors have coveted for a while, and he would fit in nicely at the four.
Neither team gets any real cap relief out of the deal, but the chances that a team is going to trade an expiring contract for the likes of Rose or Davis are slim to none.
A junk swap stealing headlines in week four? Compared to the mess out on the floor, the deal actually smelled pretty sweet.
Can Bosh and Wade catch Carmelo in the rookie race? The only good news coming out of Toronto right now is the play of rookie forward Chris Bosh. While most observers felt like Bosh was the consensus No. 4 pick and had a chance to be an all-star in the league, few predicted his success would come so quickly.
Chris Bosh
Power Forward
Toronto Raptors
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
13 9.8 5.3 0.3 .523 .791
Bosh is averaging 14.2 ppg, 6.6 rpg and 2.8 bpg on 51 percent shooting over the last five games. Next to Vince Carter, Bosh, 19, has been the Raptors' most consistent scorer and is drawing praise from just about everyone around the league.
"I've said all along he's going to be a special player in this league at some point," Raptors head coach Kevin O'Neill told the Globe and Mail. "He's a guy that, if we don't stunt his growth, will continue to make strides on a weekly basis."
"He's smart, you don't have to tell him how to play the game, you don't have to tell him things more than once or twice," O'Neill said. "He has great instincts for the game."
Right behind him, or perhaps in front of him, is Heat guard Dwyane Wade. Since coach Stan Van Gundy decided to let Wade do what he does best -- score -- he's taken a dramatic turn for the better. In his last five games, Wade is averaging 18.2 ppg, 4.4 rpg and 3.2 apg on 48 percent shooting from the field.
Dwyane Wade
Point Guard
Miami Heat
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
12 14.2 4.3 4.1 .384 .723
Now compare the numbers those two have put up with those of Carmelo Anthony, who many felt would run away with the Rookie of the Year honors this season.
After a hot start, Anthony is averaging 15.8 ppg, 9.6 rpg and 3.2 apg on 34 percent shooting. While Anthony's rebounding numbers continue to climb, his shooting percentage has been awful.
Over the same five-game period, Bosh made 23 of the 45 shots he took from the field. Wade made 35 of th 72 shots he took. Anthony made 28 of the 82 shots he took.
While LeBron continues to be the favorite, this is the first time in recent memory where you have four top players who appear worthy of the honor this early in the season.
Chauncey and Larry getting along just fine: Remember all of the preseason hand wringing about the relationship between Chauncey Billups and new Pistons head coach Larry Brown?
The fear was Brown would have a low tolerance for Billups, who is more of a shoot-first, ask-questions-later point guard. How would Chauncey adapt to Brown's more conservative expectations from his point guard?
He hasn't. Instead, it's been Brown who has modified his thinking about what role Billups' plays in the team's offense. Brown claims Billups is the best-shooting point guard he's had in three decades of coaching. He has no intention of cooling his team's hottest hand.
After Billups dropped 33 points, seven rebounds, five assists, three steals and four 3-pointers on the Grizzlies last week Brown pretty much summed up Billups' season so far.
"I don't know how you can play any better than he did," Brown said.
Billups agrees.
"He knows I can make that shot, but I don't think he has ever coached a point guard that plays the way I play," said Billups, who is averaging 23.3 ppg, 7 apg, 4.4 rpg on 46 percent shooting from the field over the last five. "It's going to take some time for him to be able to accept that, but that's what a new situation brings. You have to learn your players; I have to learn my coach. I've learned what he likes, and I have a lot more to learn.
"I know he doesn't like shots late in games, but he always tells me he doesn't want to take away what I do. If it's there, you have to take it, but the questionable shots that I shoot, and I know sometimes they're bad shots, those are the ones he has a huge problem with, and those are probably the ones I shouldn't be taking."
Continued...................
