Insight Bowl

Renz

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Renz said:
With all of their bluster about ASU being an elite program, the university and their fans are consistently satisfied with mediocrity.
I rest my case...

http://www.azstarnet.com/dailystar/sports/108515

Arizona State probably will realize about $125,000 in revenue from Tuesday's Insight Bowl. Even though the game is played in Phoenix, the Sun Devils expect to spend $130,000 for meals and lodging. Curiously, ASU is spending about $105,000 on rings and awards for a season in which it went 6-5. Awards for what?

No wonder the athletic department is always broke. :D
 

sundevilscott

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Renz said:
I rest my case...

http://www.azstarnet.com/dailystar/sports/108515

Arizona State probably will realize about $125,000 in revenue from Tuesday's Insight Bowl. Even though the game is played in Phoenix, the Sun Devils expect to spend $130,000 for meals and lodging. Curiously, ASU is spending about $105,000 on rings and awards for a season in which it went 6-5. Awards for what?

No wonder the athletic department is always broke. :D

What is Arizona's excuse for the state of their football program?
 

Brian in Mesa

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Renz said:

First, we finished the season 7-5 (last I checked Bowl games counted. :thumbup: )

Second, azstarnet.com - What do they know about football? :D

BTW: Way to take things out of context. Just above that it points out how much even the sorry Wildcats will get in postseason revenue because of bowl revenue sharing in the Pac-10.

From the article: Even though the Wildcats are sitting out the bowl season for the seventh consecutive season, they expect to receive about $1.4 million from the league's bowl-sharing revenue pool.


Here's a recent article on ASU and the Insight Bowl:

Insight ‘trip’ will be moneymaker for ASU
By Dan Zeiger, Tribune
December 21, 2005


After Arizona State’s win against archrival Arizona, Dirk Koetter held up the Territorial Cup — which had a small Insight Bowl patch affixed to it — and said his team was going to its own little Disneyland.

"We’re spending Christmas in downtown Phoenix!" the Sun Devils coach yelled at his postgame press conference. "Have you ever been there during that time of year? It’s beautiful!"

Though dollars and cents were likely the last thing triggering his euphoria at the moment, Koetter could have added the ASU athletic department will save a bunch of money on the Sun Devils’ bowl "trip."

With ASU’s game against Rutgers on Tuesday night a few miles down the road at Chase Field, the school will spend substantially less on lodging and transportation. There will also be no unsold tickets to eat.

As a result, Amy Schramm, associate athletic director for business affairs, is projecting that ASU will keep about $137,000 of the $750,000 Insight payout after expenses. That is a fiscal achievement, considering many schools actually lose money on a bowl game.

"We try to make sure it’s a good experience for the players," Schramm said. "That’s the main thing we want to do. But if we are able to be fiscally conservative and still provide that good time, we try to do that.

"And we’ve been able to do it in the bowls we’ve been in recently because we operate on a tight budget overall annually."

For Koetter, the main benefits of the Insight Bowl trip are in the exposure for the program and the 15 extra days of practice. The bottom line? That’s for the worrywarts in the accounting department.

"I leave that up to (director of football operations) Tom Kleinlein and the administrators," Koetter said. "But obviously, I’m happy that we can have (a surplus). The funds can help any program in our department that has a need for them."

After losing money on the 1999 and 2000 Aloha Bowls — a deficit on a postseason trip to Hawaii is pretty much unavoidable — ASU managed to turn a surplus from the 2002 Holiday and 2004 Sun bowls. That money went into the athletic department’s general budget.

Schramm said the Insight Bowl revenue will provide a cushion to help balance the athletics budget, which is $37.4 million for fiscal year 2005.

"It will be nice to have that money available in case something comes up, like a shortfall in revenue or an unexpected expense," Schramm said.

Unless a school is fortunate to play in a big-money Bowl Championship Series game, postseason profits can be hard to come by. A 2000 study by USA Today revealed at least 18 schools came home from their bowl games with a deficit, some exceeding $300,000.

BYU’s trip to the 1999 Motor City Bowl in Detroit was painful on the field (a 21-3 loss against Marshall) and the wallet (a $250,000 shortfall).

"Everybody wants to talk about the big money the bowls pay out," then-Brigham Young athletic director Val Hale said in 2000. "But if you do not sell all of your tickets and have to travel a long way, that money is eaten up very quickly."

Typically, bowl travel expenses for a school easily exceed six figures. ASU has budgeted $81,300 in plane fares for this year’s Insight Bowl — most of that going toward player trips home for Christmas.

Meals and lodging — which cost $253,300 at the 2000 Aloha Bowl and $231,300 at last year’s Sun Bowl — are projected to cost $129,950 for the Insight Bowl, as ASU’s party will spend only two nights in a hotel.

With those savings, the Sun Devils can afford to splurge in other areas. Entertainment expenses are up this year, mainly because Koetter wants to provide the players with a variety of extra activities. For example, players took part in a paintball excursion earlier this week.

"Since they are staying home, you have to do some special things, or the guys will go stir crazy," Koetter said. "The nice thing about Phoenix is that there are a lot of restaurants and places we haven’t been to."

For schools in BCS conferences, individual bowl trip losses are more than offset by postseason disbursements from the league. Last year, the Pac-10 sent ASU and the other nine schools $1.5 million each.

Schools in non-BCS leagues do not enjoy such a windfall. Also, many of them are relegated to the 11 bowls that have the NCAA minimum payout of $750,000.

Southern California, meanwhile, will collect $15 million for the Pac-10 when it plays Texas for the national title in the Rose Bowl.

"We always want to be in a bowl," BYU’s Hale said in 2000. "But wearing my athletic director’s hat, balancing my budget, my job gets a little easier when we don’t. That’s the irony of the whole thing."

It would have been a challenge even for Schramm and her fellow number crunchers to squeeze a surplus from a minimum-payment bowl. Luckily for ASU, the $750,000 game that offered it an invitation was the one in town.

"In a budget of $37 million, $100,000 doesn’t sound like a very big deal," Schramm said. "But it’s good to have it there if we need it."
 

MaoTosiFanClub

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sundevilscott said:
Mao - Please give me a break. You are normally one of the most level headed UA fans I have seen but you know damn well that expectations are much higher for me. If you don't you are blind. This coming from fans who are happy with a coach that has lead a team to 4 D1 wins in 2 seasons. But he is Stoops and he can recruit, forget the fact that he has personally blown numerous games in the past 2 years. The guy has yet to prove that he can be a head coach.
Name one level-headed Arizona fan that is happy with the results of the Stoops' era. I'm pretty sure both Renz and I have said that we have been dissapointed so far with Stoops' two years in Tucson but for a multitude of reasons he will be the head coach next season. And Arizona and Stoops have nothing to do with the topic at hand, they're being used solely to prop up ASU's football program which in my opinion is both comical and a huge mistake.
Keep fooling yourself about expectations. My expectation is to be in a BCS game but if not to still be in a bowl game, not just to get to 5 or 6 wins.
Then why are we subjected to celebratory digital art applauding sqeaking out home victories over 3-8 and below average Big Least teams? I'm certainly not jumping up and down when Arizona beats ASU or Western Kentucky in basketball. I have noticed that on this board and others too that being better than Arizona in football blinds many (but not all) Sun Devil fans to the reality of their own football situation. You guys can set the bar that low if you want to, but that doesn't mean us Arizona fans won't laugh at such a mindset.
 
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sundevilscott

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MaoTosiFanClub said:
Name one level-headed Arizona fan that is happy with the results of the Stoops' era. I'm pretty sure both Renz and I have said that we have been dissapointed so far with Stoops' two years in Tucson but for a multitude of reasons he will be the head coach next season. And Arizona and Stoops have nothing to do with the topic at hand, they're being used solely to prop up ASU's football program which in my opinion is both comical and a huge mistake.

Then why are we subjected to celebratory digital art applauding squakong out home victories over 3-8 and below average Big Least teams? I'm certainly not jumping up and down when Arizona beats ASU or Western Kentucky in basketball. I have noticed that on this board and others too that being better than Arizona in football blinds many (but not all) Sun Devil fans to the reality of their own football situation. You guys can set the bar that low if you want to, but that doesn't mean us Arizona fans won't laugh at such a mindset.

lol, ok Mao. Unless you haven't looked around your fans are the kettle.

Maybe not you exactly but a huge number of your fanbase.
 

Arizona's Finest

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MaoTosiFanClub said:
Name one level-headed Arizona fan that is happy with the results of the Stoops' era. I'm pretty sure both Renz and I have said that we have been dissapointed so far with Stoops' two years in Tucson but for a multitude of reasons he will be the head coach next season. And Arizona and Stoops have nothing to do with the topic at hand, they're being used solely to prop up ASU's football program which in my opinion is both comical and a huge mistake.

Then why are we subjected to celebratory digital art applauding squakong out home victories over 3-8 and below average Big Least teams? I'm certainly not jumping up and down when Arizona beats ASU or Western Kentucky in basketball. I have noticed that on this board and others too that being better than Arizona in football blinds many (but not all) Sun Devil fans to the reality of their own football situation. You guys can set the bar that low if you want to, but that doesn't mean us Arizona fans won't laugh at such a mindset.


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Keep preaching the gospel Mao...

(and im sure one of the "non level headed" cat fans they are referring too)

You guys keep forgetting you have had a three year head start on your program being built. Not to mention taking over for a coach like Snyder takes alot less work that taking over for the abysmal Mackovic.

Hes exactly right. If we are in the Insight bowl in year 5 of Stoops tenure, i will NOT be extolling his virtues and that of the program. Even at a school whose football prgram has been dormant for so long, i expect more out of my hot shot coach. Face it, as Koetter even said in an article today "we are taking baby steps as a program" If you guys were as legit as a program as you think you are, kotter would have been fired after last year. You think Miami would put up with that kind of medicority? And really you guys have many of the same advantages that the "U' has besides the in state talent. But Ca. and Tx are on opposite sides of us and Stoops seems to be doing ok with those boundaries....We are just saying you should be less impressed with your selves and your coach. You are a football school, remember?

As for the game, man i love Hagan and Z. Miller. And i think jamar and robinson are going to be studs in the show. I would love for the Cards to get any of those guys in the next few years.

The defense was a joke and i hope Miller starts to get through to these guys in year two.

As for your QB, Carpenter is good but I AM a HUGE Sam Keller fan and I hope he tears it up next year (cept for the final game of course)

Watching this game makes you realize just how good Koetters passing system is. It might be one of the few thats a productive system AND turns out legit NFL prospects (unlike Texas Tech, Florida under Spurrier and Meyer, and others). NOW THAT is a recruiting tool you guys should be using. Scary to see what Shaw might do once he gets under center with all his physical talent.

BEARDOWN CATS!
 

sundevilscott

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AF I agree with Mao and yourself to a certain extent. What you are missing is that if your expectations were so high then there should have been an uproar for a second straight 3-8 season. Did you see any improvement in Stoops and the coaching staff? He still cost them a chance at the Utah game.
 

Arizona's Finest

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sundevilscott said:
AF I agree with Mao and yourself to a certain extent. What you are missing is that if your expectations were so high then there should have been an uproar for a second straight 3-8 season. Did you see any improvement in Stoops and the coaching staff? He still cost them a chance at the Utah game.

I do like what i have seen, despite the record. Contrastingly (is that word?) If Mackovic had had an eight win season his second year, i STILL would have been worried in the direction of the program. Do i think Stoops could/should have one more games. I dont know. we played a tough schedule, in that all the teams we played we playing well at the time (which in college football is the most important factor) but would i trade a couple wins for some of the signs he has shown me including

a) Playing agressive hard defense and flying to the ball (we are loess talented than you guys and show 10x the heart. And bad news, that talent gap is finally closing)

b) Getting the team up for big games (Played well against SC, killed UCLA, Beat the devils last year and might have again this year if not for some bad luck and poor special teams)

c) Recruiting (ridiculous how he bring in this talent to a 3 win team)

d) Garnering the support of the fan base (the opposite of Mackovic)

e) Bringing in top coaches who only leave after promotions to more established schools (Heupel and Spurrier)

f) Holding players accountable (BJ Vickers)

g) cool new unis and facility upgrades (dont underestimate the lure of these two thing)

h)the offense has shown improvement since last year. Defense is expected of Stoops. Showing progress on the side of the ball thats not your forte is even more impressive and not something all coaches can do (ahem....Koetter)

i) and most importantly the one thing i have not been able to say as a Cat fan.....establishing a QBOF after his freshman year. You guys can try to bring willie down but i have seen enought to know it is he, not Zach Miller, that should be nicknamed "The Truth"

Sure i would like more wins but i really believe that has more to do with the attitude and talent level Mackovic left rather than stoops ability. Win or lose we will have a better gauge of Stoops value after this year....

And oh yeah....i still love that sig and am quite flattered. And really its still true....but come next football season hopefully there will be two reasons why that quote no longer applies......
 

sundevilscott

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Arizona's Finest said:
And oh yeah....i still love that sig and am quite flattered. And really its still true....but come next football season hopefully there will be two reasons why that quote no longer applies......

I hope you know the qutoe was just a joke. I just found it funny as I am a Cardinal fan also.
 

AZBALLER

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"You guys can try to bring willie down but i have seen enought to know it is he, not Zach Miller, that should be nicknamed "The Truth""



Really? Wow, I've never ever heard that comment from a ua fan about their qb before:thud:

I'd give Willie and your perceived solid recruiting class props, if it wasn't for 14 year old kids that think Willie is a better player than Miller...Don't you wildcat fans cringe when you see stupid comments like that from cat fans???

If "The Truth" and Willie were able to declare for next year's draft, Miller would go on the first day, while Willie wouldn't be drafted...Enough said.
 

AZBALLER

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And yes, having a little common sense does help too...
 

AZBALLER

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Nope, just answering your question...If you don't want answers, don't ask questions.
 

Renz

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AZBALLER said:
Nope, just answering your question...If you don't want answers, don't ask questions.
"I'm not a moron" is an answer? Saying Zach Miller is a first day draft pick and that Willie Tuitama would go undrafted is an opinion. Nothing more, nothing less. Unless you are a scout or NFL personnel man, your opinion is no more valid than anyone else's on this board, regardless of what your mother might have told you.

How about trying to explain your posts for a change instead of blindly spewing your Sparky-love and resorting to juvenile name-calling?

Why don't you just run back to devils digest or whatever MB you crawled out of where no one asks you to back up your blind and uninformed devotion to SAU.
 

AZBALLER

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Renz said:
"I'm not a moron" is an answer? Saying Zach Miller is a first day draft pick and that Willie Tuitama would go undrafted is an opinion. Nothing more, nothing less. Unless you are a scout or NFL personnel man, your opinion is no more valid than anyone else's on this board, regardless of what your mother might have told you.

How about trying to explain your posts for a change instead of blindly spewing your Sparky-love and resorting to juvenile name-calling?

Why don't you just run back to devils digest or whatever MB you crawled out of where no one asks you to back up your blind and uninformed devotion to SAU.


Speaking of JUVENILE name-calling...Where did I call people names??? You're the one calling people names, because you don't agree with their opinions...Why don't you grow up?

So you don't like my opinions? I really don't care, and I won't resort to calling you names...

If you read my posts, I don't personally call anyone out...All I did was answer YOUR question RENZ, and I stand by my answer, as you could ask any scout, NFL personnel, etc, and they'd agree that Miller is a first day pick, while Tui is off the radar...That's not an OPINION, that's a FACT.

BTW, I didn't crawl out of some other message board, I've been here longer than you...I just don't have the time to waste arguing with au fans, as it seems you do have the time to argue with ASU fans.
 
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Renz

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AZBALLER said:
Speaking of JUVENILE name-calling...Where did I call people names??? You're the one calling people names, because you don't agree with their opinions...Why don't you grow up?

So you don't like my opinions? I really don't care, and I won't resort to calling you names...

If you read my posts, I don't personally call anyone out...All I did was answer YOUR question RENZ, and I stand by my answer, as you could ask any scout, NFL personnel, etc, and they'd agree that Miller is a first day pick, while Tui is off the radar...That's not an OPINION, that's a FACT.
If it's a fact, then back it up with some evidence. Do you have any? If not, then it is an opinion and an opinion only.

When I asked you how you knew that Tui wouldn't be drafted you said, "Because I'm not a moron". That statement implies that anyone who thinks differently about Miller and Tui must be "a moron". That is name calling.
 

AZBALLER

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Renz said:
When I asked you how you knew that Tui wouldn't be drafted you said, "Because I'm not a moron". That statement implies that anyone who thinks differently about Miller and Tui must be "a moron". That is name calling.

Get your facts strait...I didn't say Tui wouldn't be drafted, I said he wasn't a first day pick...Do you really disagree with that?


***I was wrong in my last post, I did say that Tui wouldn't be drafted at all, and looking back on that, I still stand by that position***
 
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Renz

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AZBALLER said:
Get your facts strait...I didn't say Tui wouldn't be drafted, I said he wasn't a first day pick...Do you really disagree with that?


***I was wrong in my last post, I did say that Tui wouldn't be drafted at all, and looking back on that, I still stand by that position***
It's cool. I apologize if I crossed the line in personally attacking you in any previous posts and for bringing your mother into the discussion.
 

AZBALLER

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Renz said:
If it's a fact, then back it up with some evidence. Do you have any? If not, then it is an opinion and an opinion only.

All draft picks are based on the opinion of the scouts and coaches...According to you there are no facts in recruiting or drafting...If that's the case, then what exactly are you arguing with me about? Do you want me to show you Carpenter's Qb rating? He finished the season as the #1 rated QB in the nation...Vince Young finished 3rd...Keller finished in the top 25...Where did Tui finish? If you want facts, then I'll give them to you...I just didn't think it was necessary to point out that Tui wouldn't be drafted, if he turned pro after his frosh year(if it was possible/legal).
 

AZBALLER

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Renz said:
It's cool. I apologize if I crossed the line in personally attacking you in any previous posts and for bringing your mother into the discussion.

I apologize to...Sometimes I get a little carried away in these college arguments...I respect UA, but I just don't like them
 

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