Isabella vs Metcalf talk - Stop it

jf-08

chohan
Administrator
Super Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
27,857
Reaction score
23,640
Location
Eye in the Sky
Please stop it with the "We should have drafted Metcalf over Isabella" talk in every freaking thread.

Only one person prior to the draft voiced this, @LoyaltyisaCurse , and even he doesn't whine about this all the time.

It gets old to read every thread and this comes up.

Yes, hindsight is 20/20 and we probably should have drafted DK, as would have every other team in the league. But one of the main reasons that DK is doing is doing well is because Russ has been mentoring him to become great. We don't have anyone that would have done that. (Fitz is amazing and my all-time favorite, but when has he taken a WR and made them better by direct tutelage?)

Just stop.
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,247
Reaction score
11,852
Please stop it with the "We should have drafted Metcalf over Isabella" talk in every freaking thread.

Only one person prior to the draft voiced this, @LoyaltyisaCurse , and even he doesn't whine about this all the time.

It gets old to read every thread and this comes up.

Yes, hindsight is 20/20 and we probably should have drafted DK, as would have every other team in the league. But one of the main reasons that DK is doing is doing well is because Russ has been mentoring him to become great. We don't have anyone that would have done that. (Fitz is amazing and my all-time favorite, but when has he taken a WR and made them better by direct tutelage?)

Just stop.

For the record. I did too. Once I saw the commercials with Fitzgerald hyping DK, I wanted him.

Not that it matters...
 

juza76

ASFN Icon
Joined
Sep 5, 2009
Posts
13,792
Reaction score
9,603
Location
milan-italy
What we can say, 2nd round wax too early for Isabella, at this point we can say also seventh round would have been to early, but it's too easy to say right now
About Metcalf there is no reason for regrets, all the nfl teams decided to no taking him with the first 60 picks
 

SoonerLou

ASFN Addict
Joined
Sep 15, 2019
Posts
8,146
Reaction score
12,249
Location
St Louis, MO
I've been guilty of this, but just had to let it go cause its not worth stress.

The thing that's helped me is that I really do think Andy is good guy. So I feel kind of bad getting upset with him.

Kirk has obviously shown more through 2 years, but the light seems to have on in the 3rd year for him.

Maybe the same from Andy? Andy gets open just has to work on being complete.
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,247
Reaction score
11,852
Isabella is this year's whipping boy. A few years ago it was Rob Housler. Chad Williams 2017. Josh Rosen 2018.

:deadhorse::deadhorse2:

Coach is creeping up behind Isabella.
 

juza76

ASFN Icon
Joined
Sep 5, 2009
Posts
13,792
Reaction score
9,603
Location
milan-italy
To be clear..... Am I allowed to continue talking about how much I loved Kyler pre-announcement and then pre-draft? :Dold
:deadhorse2:

#HidesBehindHisDesk

:newcards:

Dr Jones, I thought I was the first here:cool:
The sooners guy, PA cards fan, me, DVontel but not sure
Krangthebrain came just a bit later
 

DevonCardsFan

Registered User
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
5,819
Reaction score
802
Location
Your Mamas
I was very against the pick as well, another example of Kiem getting cute and thinking he knows more than everyone.

Some little fragile guy compared to a beast, Metcalf was falling and was the value pick. I will admit I wanted Harry and Pat's grabbed him and he isn't doing to awesome
 

dscher

ASFN Icon
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Posts
13,261
Reaction score
8,311
Location
Mesa, AZ
Give the kid one more full year and move on if these struggles persist. He is still extremely raw and frustrating as all heck. But, his ability as a decoy will still play a small but possibly important role this year me thinks.
 

TaylorSwift

Hall of Famer
Joined
Sep 20, 2019
Posts
1,406
Reaction score
1,240
Location
Phoenix
My think is that its a reflection of a scouting department that doesnt know how to do their job.

Its clear Isabella has no football instincts, dont you pay people to figure that out before spending a high professional draft pick on a guy?
 

Praxis

Hall of Famer
Joined
Mar 11, 2015
Posts
1,391
Reaction score
871
I said pick DK as soon as we traded Rosen. Isabella was a huge reach and it was obvious at the time. DK is as fast anyone and physically dominant. People said he didn't know how to run routes but Isabella relied on his speed to get open, too.
 

jmt

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Nov 24, 2002
Posts
3,240
Reaction score
820
Location
Reston, VA
“It is what it is”. That was pretty bad losing the first down but at least we know when Andy is in the game! All I can say is good luck if your strength is as a decoy.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

Not So Skeptical
Joined
Aug 26, 2012
Posts
10,143
Reaction score
6,582
Metcalf is salt in the wound. The real crime is wasting a 2nd round pick on a guy who looks as if he doesn’t belong in the league.
Not sure I would quite go as far as doesn't belong in the league. KM throws a pass about a foot shorter in the back of the end zone and AI would have had a nice TD catch. Of course he made the mistake of going backwards when he already had the first down, but he still ran a perfect route right at the sticks and made the catch. Just made a mental error with running backwards.
 

Cbus cardsfan

Back to Back ASFN FFL Champion
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
21,463
Reaction score
7,632
I wanted Terry McLaurin.

Actually I wanted AJ Brown the most. Can’t believe he fell to round 2. Go up and get him.
 
OP
OP
jf-08

jf-08

chohan
Administrator
Super Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
27,857
Reaction score
23,640
Location
Eye in the Sky
Creating a thread bringing it up isn't going to make people talk about it less
Talk about it here in this thread is fine but many, many posters (including myself) are sick and tired of what seems like every thread getting sidetracked by a few posters who constantly regurgitate the same old rhetoric.
 

GimmedaBall

Hall of Famer
Joined
Dec 2, 2013
Posts
1,626
Reaction score
1,110
I think the jury is still out on AI.

Isabella’s stats so far:
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/_/id/3914328/andy-isabella

(1)You can’t get the numbers if you don’t get the targets. He getting about 3 targets per game. With so few targets, the missed connections are amplified.

(2) You can’t get in sync with the QB unless you are getting the practice reps. If Isabella is defined by the coaches as the guy who is going to be a deep-threat with 3 targets per game and a decoy the rest of the time he is on the field—how many reps is he getting with KM? Only so many times KM can sling it, only so many times Isabella can run the deep route. Witness the two early deep balls in the SeaTurkey game that were big misses. Who made the bad decision—was it Isabella not running the correct route or was it KM not putting the ball on target OR was it on both. KM and Kirk appear to be in better sync—but they played together for a year in college. Also, Isabella is returning kicks—how much of his practice time and game prep is spent on that assignment.

An experienced QB can more quickly mesh with a newbie WR. That’s one of the reasons RW is connecting with Metcalf. Look at all of the out-of-sync misses between KM and Fitz—there you have a HOF WR trying to mesh with a newbie QB.

(3) You can’t perform if the coaching staff doesn’t use you to your best advantage. Think of the abuse of Reddick for four years before the coaches put him in his college position.

(4) He can’t track the ball. Really? How did he put up the college numbers that he did if he can’t track the ball—a receiver expects the ball to delivered somewhere in his wingspan—how do you track the ball when it is several yards off the route? Witness the KM missed TD to Fitz—one of the few times I’ve ever seen Fitz give the ‘What the ????’ to the QB. Check out Isabella’s draft preview tape—he’s doing a good job of tracking and adjusting to the ball.

(5) QB and WR mismatch. We got a smurf QB attempting to throw to his mirror image smurf WR. Isabella might have a future working out of the slot—but only if the QB can see him behind the OL/DL scrum. Ditto on the deep balls—is KM able to spot him going down field when the D is bearing down? If it is OK for our QB to be a smurf—not fair to then rag on a WR who is also a smurf. Find something else to rag on the smurf WR who is trying to catch balls from the smurf QB. By contrast, Josh Allen and John Brown are doing a good job of getting in sync. There, you got a huge QB throwing to a smurf WR.

(6) No player is the label(s) laid on him and repeated by fans trying to understood the player. For example, Isabella was labeled as catching the ball with his body, not extending the hands. That was supposedly the rationale that kept him off the field. I don’t know if this is true or not—he’s making plenty of catches extending his hands in his pre-draft highlights. That kind of negative label becomes part of the burden the player has to overcome before acceptance by fans. Those type of tags can stick around for a career.

(7) Is he fulfilling the role for which he was drafted? You can argue whether he went too high but that is judgment only if you know what he was drafted to do. Nothing wrong with being a decoy who stretches the field for the rest of the offensive weapons. Need to look at game tape and see what goes on when he is a decoy. Teams know he can put up a quick 6 on a single play. Is he drawing double coverage off Hopkins? Is he opening up the middle of the field for Fitz? The TE’s? Is there one less DB trailing him on run plays. He needs credit for that especially if this is what SK drafted him to do.

(8) A player is not the most obvious mistake that he makes—AI is catching grief because he caught a ball that had the first down distance but he tried to make a move and came off that first down. It was painful since it stopped the Cards. But what player has not made a similar mistake. KM missed a 1-yard pass that cost the Cards possession—why not rag on that mistake? With so few targets per game, that mistake is like a flashing neon like. A 3-target WR is in the same judgement category as a three attempt FG kicker.

As to DK Metcalf—what can you say. Live and learn. Here’s his career stats:
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/_/id/4047650/dk-metcalf

Look at teams that passed him over–he fell to the bottom of the second with 63 other players taken before him. (Of course Cards are happy with that first pick) Look at the stats for some of the WR taken before him—now there are some GM who are slapping themselves upside their head.

Marquis Brown (#25) - Baltimore
Career to date: 73 Rec /963 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/marquise-brown-brownma18

N’Keal Harry (#32) Pats
Career to Date: 31 Rec / 277 yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/nkeal-harry-harrynk01

Deebo Samuel (# 36) Whiners
Career to Date: 73 Rec /987 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/deebo-samuel-samuede01

A. J. Brown (#51) Bengals
Career to Date: 79 Rec /1407 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/aj-brown-brownaj01

Mecole Hartman (#56) Chiefs
Career to Date: 48 Rec / 885 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/mecole-hardman-hardmme01

J.J. Arcega-Whiteside (#57) Eagles
Career to Date: 12 Rec / 214 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/jj-arcegawhiteside-arcegjj01

Parris Campbell (#59) Colts
Career to Date: 24 Rec / 198 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/parris-campbell-campbpa01

Andy Isabella (#62) Cards
Career to Date: 20 Rec / 343 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/andy-isabella-isabean01

D. K. Metcalf (# 64) SeaTurkeys
Career to Date: 94 Rec / 1580 Yards
https://www.footballdb.com/players/dk-metcalf-metcadk01

At the time I did this survey, Isabella had more receiving yards than Harry, Arcega-Whiteside, and Campbell who were all taken before him. Wonder if the fans of the Pats, Eagles, and Colts are ragging on their team/GM for passing on AI. LOL.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
11,172
Reaction score
12,108
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Is this a site rule, or...?

I mean, I don't interact much in gameday threads since I'm not able to watch them at home, but this seems like a very strange rule if it really is one. It's very much a factor in Keim's terrible drafting.

Only one person prior to the draft voiced this, @LoyaltyisaCurse , and even he doesn't whine about this all the time.
I did mention wanting Deebo Samuel or DK Metcalf before the draft... so. And I definitely wanted him when we acquired that pick, although I wasn't here to say it that day.
 
Top