It's OK if you think it's Shaq...

[Budden]

but just don't tell anybody about it.

Shaquille O'neal was not the problem. Not only that, but I can tell you this as well: Shawn Marion was not, nor is he, the answer.

If you are wondering why the Suns lost 3 of the 4 games that they lost this post season, you should know that it had nothing to do with Shaq's problems. And the Suns' problems could absolutely not have been solved by Shawn Marion. They couldn't have even been solved by Grant Hill - although he might have helped enough to make the Spurs series more competitive.

The Suns problem was that the team didn't have Steve Nash.

The Suns lost 3 games to the Spurs in which they led for the majority of the game. However, in crunch time, they didn't pull through. Do you think the Suns traded for Shaq for the impact he could provide in the last 6 minutes of the game? I know you don't. And do you think that Shawn Marion would have helped - against the Spurs, of all teams - in the last 6 minutes of the game? I sure as heck hope you don't.

The truth is, Nash wasn't Nash. And because of that, the Suns weren't the Suns. I know that a ton of Suns fans expected the team to win 60+ games, but who was going to help the team do that? Raja Bell? Boris Diaw? Amare is fantastic, but he's a power forward/center. If you want to win, you need to have a perimeter player who can create baskets in crunch time, when the defense buckles down - and more importantly, when the defense sags in and clogs up the lane a little more than usual - because they will be the only players that have enough court freedom to make the important play. You send it into Amare, or Tim Duncan, and you're going to need someone on the perimeter to get the ball on the kick-out, after the double team comes, and make a play. Nash used to do that so consistently. Shawn Marion did not. But in the 5 playoff games this season, he didn't do that.

When the team needed a play - be it in the last moments of the fourth quarter, or to quell a mini-run by the other team in the 1st quarter, or anytime in between - Nash used to make that play. Time and again. And this post-season, he simply didn't. I don't blame Nash for being human. But for the people who think it had anything to do with the Shaq trade, perhaps you'd be better suited sharing your opinion on a Yahoo! Sports board.

 

[cly2tw]

Nash of today can not be like Nash of two or 3 years ago, with respect to his on-court impact, not due to his getting older or not shooting as well for some physical reason. The league has adjusted to Suns style and Nash'. Yet, the Suns have not. To aggreviate the issue, in most crucial moments of the game, they went back to the "traditional" Nash system to close out, which played right into the enemy's strength in case of Spurs or NO. Simple as that.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

Nash aged before our eyes in the last 3 months.

 

[btimsah]

but just don't tell anybody about it.

Shaquille O'neal was not the problem. Not only that, but I can tell you this as well: Shawn Marion was not, nor is he, the answer.

If you are wondering why the Suns lost 3 of the 4 games that they lost this post season, you should know that it had nothing to do with Shaq's problems. And the Suns' problems could absolutely not have been solved by Shawn Marion. They couldn't have even been solved by Grant Hill - although he might have helped enough to make the Spurs series more competitive.

The Suns problem was that the team didn't have Steve Nash.

The Suns lost 3 games to the Spurs in which they led for the majority of the game. However, in crunch time, they didn't pull through. Do you think the Suns traded for Shaq for the impact he could provide in the last 6 minutes of the game? I know you don't. And do you think that Shawn Marion would have helped - against the Spurs, of all teams - in the last 6 minutes of the game? I sure as heck hope you don't.

The truth is, Nash wasn't Nash. And because of that, the Suns weren't the Suns. I know that a ton of Suns fans expected the team to win 60+ games, but who was going to help the team do that? Raja Bell? Boris Diaw? Amare is fantastic, but he's a power forward/center. If you want to win, you need to have a perimeter player who can create baskets in crunch time, when the defense buckles down - and more importantly, when the defense sags in and clogs up the lane a little more than usual - because they will be the only players that have enough court freedom to make the important play. You send it into Amare, or Tim Duncan, and you're going to need someone on the perimeter to get the ball on the kick-out, after the double team comes, and make a play. Nash used to do that so consistently. Shawn Marion did not. But in the 5 playoff games this season, he didn't do that.

When the team needed a play - be it in the last moments of the fourth quarter, or to quell a mini-run by the other team in the 1st quarter, or anytime in between - Nash used to make that play. Time and again. And this post-season, he simply didn't. I don't blame Nash for being human. But for the people who think it had anything to do with the Shaq trade, perhaps you'd be better suited sharing your opinion on a Yahoo! Sports board.

Sadly, I agree. Nash is by far my favorite NBA player. But the last couple of seasons he's gotten more and more inconsistent. Just doesn't seem to have that extra offensive gear anymore. An MVP point guard dominates the game. When is the last time he was able to get off a layup and make it? He used to do that almost at will. Sucks.

I guess that's why I'm enjoying CP3 so much. He's like my li'l replacement point guard to show everybody else how it's done. Score and assist!

 

[Budden]

Sadly, I agree. Nash is by far my favorite NBA player. But the last couple of seasons he's gotten more and more inconsistent. Just doesn't seem to have that extra offensive gear anymore. An MVP point guard dominates the game. When is the last time he was able to get off a layup and make it? He used to do that almost at will. Sucks.

I guess that's why I'm enjoying CP3 so much. He's like my li'l replacement point guard to show everybody else how it's done. Score and assist!

And just to be totally clear, I don't want people to think I'm ragging on Nash. Nash was still pretty awesome this season. He wasn't terrific in the playoffs, but he was better than 95% of the point guards in this league. People are going to say that so-and-so outplayed Nash on any given night, and they'll use that as evidence that Nash has fallen off, but the truth is that Nash is still called upon to carry as large a load as anybody else in the league.

Chris Paul is awesome. He does some things better than Nash ever did. But the short-sighted, idiotic idea that he is better than Nash was the previous 3 seasons (not this past one, but the 3 before that) almost makes me want to become a communist. I mean really: if people forget what the obvious this quickly, why should the majority be trusted to vote in an intelligent manner?

I watch the Hornets, and I can't think of one Phoenix Sun from 2004 onward that could make the plays that Peja Stojakavic makes. This year, Amare Stoudemire started creating plays for himself, but he didn't do that last season. And he certainly didn't do it the season before that, when he was injured the entire year. So, who on the Suns could create plays the way David West does now? Shawn Marion? Even Marion's biggest fan (Shawn Marion) couldn't imagine making some of the big-time plays that David West makes. And David West isn't even that good!

Fact is, Steve Nash was incredible in the 3 years that he was MVP of the league (yes, he was the most valuable player for 3 straight years). He made everyone around him look great, and when that wasn't enough, he made himself look even better. If you want to blame the fact that he didn't play up to the same level on Shaquille O'neal, then that's your prerogative. Democracy in the USA has to accept even the most ignorant morons who show up at the polls. I just hope that when Steve Kerr, Robert Sarver, and Mike D'Antoni get together to try to make this team a champion for next season, they don't indulge in the idiocy that pervades this board.

 

[Andrew]

Everytime I defend Shaq, I am belittled. People saying I am just sticking up for him because I am such a huge fan. It was the team, as a whole, that didn't get it done. They are certainly capable of it, but for whatever reason they didn't get it done this season.

 

[Shzm13]

I got so tired of hearing all those ignorant bastards saying that it was Shaqs fault that we didn't advance..

Shaq was far from being at fault. Blame Nash for not playing defense or knowing a way around Bowen.

Blame Barbosa for being so damn inconsistent.. (But no, he's still the "cute brazilian guy with the cool last name its cool to like)

Blame Boris for not being able to run the offense the first couple games and not being able to finish lay ups..

Blame Amare for choking and getting soft, when he should be attacking the hoop and getting to the damn line...

Blame Dantoni for not making a SINGLE adjustment in his gameplan going into, and during the series.

Blame Shaq for missing lay ups that shouldn't even be going to him in the first place...







I just hope our new coach KNOWS that Amare is our number one scoring option.

 

[SirStefan32]

Everytime I defend Shaq, I am belittled. People saying I am just sticking up for him because I am such a huge fan.

You are belittled because you are a Shaq fan, not a Suns fan. Lakers, Heat, and now Suns. Few of us were here when Penny was in Phoenix and we had a bunch of Penny fans. They dissapeared when Hardaway was finally gone. If Shaq got traded tomorrow, you'd be a fan of whatever team he was traded to.

As to the real point of this thread- Shaq is definitely not to blame. Suns have to figure out some set plays near the end of the game at least. Nash dribbling the ball around the court doesn't cut it.

 

[passenger]

he clogged the lane which effects Nash's game,he doesnt move well,he s not a good defender,duncan was superior in boards and blocks-gnobili and parker preferred him to be in front of them so they can shoot easily,he misses turnovers,free throws,he does intentional fouls out of frustration,he's not a good professional,he's lazy.

 

[OldDirtMcGirt]

Nash of today can not be like Nash of two or 3 years ago, with respect to his on-court impact, not due to his getting older or not shooting as well for some physical reason. The league has adjusted to Suns style and Nash'. Yet, the Suns have not. To aggreviate the issue, in most crucial moments of the game, they went back to the "traditional" Nash system to close out, which played right into the enemy's strength in case of Spurs or NO. Simple as that.

I do think that Nash is starting to break down a little physically. You could tell he just worn out in some of those Spurs games, and there's just no way any player could survive the beating that Antoni's system commands, let alone a small injury plagued guy like Nash.

 

[MiamiHeat]

I don't know how you don't put 2+2 together.

Shaq shows up, Nash's system is gone. Lane is clogged, no more running Amare at C, etc and etc. You would rather believe Nash magically aged in 3 months or somehow he sucks now instead of doing the 2+2 math and looking that the system changed once Shaq arrived. Nash is not compatible with Shaq in only 3 months.

but you can blame Nash if you want for not getting compatible with the new system so fast, but I would have more sympathy for him since it was that system that he ran for a few years and made him MVP 2x.

Fact is, Coaching change HAS to come because D'Antoni's system with Nash and Shaq do not mix.

 

[btimsah]

I don't know how you don't put 2+2 together.

Shaq shows up, Nash's system is gone. Lane is clogged, no more running Amare at C, etc and etc. You would rather believe Nash magically aged in 3 months or somehow he sucks now instead of doing the 2+2 math and looking that the system changed once Shaq arrived. Nash is not compatible with Shaq in only 3 months.

but you can blame Nash if you want for not getting compatible with the new system so fast, but I would have more sympathy for him since it was that system that he ran for a few years and made him MVP 2x.

Fact is, Coaching change HAS to come because D'Antoni's system with Nash and Shaq do not mix.

To clarify, I've been watching Nash slowly deteriorate the last 2 seasons. It's just more pronounced in the playoffs against a great defensive team. So, while he and others may believe "that just happened". I don't. His old aging back has been getting worse and worse and I think that has more affect than Shaq clogging the lane.

 

[passenger]

To clarify, I've been watching Nash slowly deteriorate the last 2 seasons. It's just more pronounced in the playoffs against a great defensive team. So, while he and others may believe "that just happened". I don't. His old aging back has been getting worse and worse and I think that has more affect than Shaq clogging the lane.

and you ve been watching shaq's performance for 2 years too?he looked solid,consistent to you?what the heck did he do in play off s since leaving lakers?

 

[Bufalay]

Everytime I defend Shaq, I am belittled. People saying I am just sticking up for him because I am such a huge fan. It was the team, as a whole, that didn't get it done. They are certainly capable of it, but for whatever reason they didn't get it done this season.

Dude Shaq sucks. Seriously, he's overpaid, slow, can't make freethrows, can't make layups, can't guard anyone. Just because the Suns would've sucked without Shaq doesn't mean that he doesn't suck.

 

[BC867]

I do think that Nash is starting to break down a little physically. You could tell he just worn out in some of those Spurs games, and there's just no way any player could survive the beating that Antoni's system commands, let alone a small injury plagued guy like Nash.

I agree. Steve Nash was smothered by the Spurs defense. Yes Mike, I used the word defense.

It was up to Sarver and Kerr to successfully provide a backup Point Guard for Steve . . . and it was up to D'Antoni to do more than move Diaw back to (Point) Small Forward earlier than the last two games of the post-season.

We need a legit backup Center to share 48 minutes with Shaq (whether that player is already on the team or not). And I'd love to see a 3-Forward rotation of Amare and Diaw, with Hill off the bench.

With the backup Center available as 3rd Power Forward and Giricek regularly getting time as well during the long season.

 

[jagu]

Suns need a backup point guard with a brain to give Nash some rest. He could still be great but he can't play a lot.