Jim Fassel

[AZCB34]

Let me preface this by saying, I am not against the Cards pursuing and hiring Fassel. A caller into KDUS this afternoon mentioned that he felt hiring Fassel would actually further extend the Tobin era here...and that makes some sense.

I just wonder why everyone is so pumped for Fassel. I know about the Super Bowl and all and virtually any coach will look good to this organization record-wise.

I also know Fassel has always been good with QBs...however as ajcardfan points out, a HCs time is limited and the QB coach and OC will get a QB further than a HC generally speaking.

Fassel's record since he was hired in 1997:

1997 10-5-1
1998 8-8
1999 7-9
2000 12-4
2001 7-9
2002 10-6

If I recall properly, for 2001 and 2002 the players had to turn around seasons to "save" Fassel's job...which they apparently did.

Now the Giants appear to have given up on the guy. They have lost 5 straight...not nearly as badly as the Cards have been losing lately though.

I guess me question is, am I missing something here? Am I supposed to be more impressed with this guy than I am?

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

He's experienced and has had some success in the league. That's why he's an interesting prospect. He also knows how to run an offense, and got Kerry (KKK) Collins back from the grave. New York is a hard place to be a coach. He's been under a microscope since he got the job and never really cracked under the pressure.

 

[Krangodnzr]

But look at the level of talent he has had.

It certainly wouldn't be considered top 10 in any given year.

The only players that I would want from the Giants at this moment in time:

Michael Strahan (though he is getting old)
Amani Toomer
Shaun Williams
William Peterson

The rest of his team is ok. Not exactly a great team, but they generally play everyone tough, and are well coached.

With Fassel, I would hope he could bring in Jim McNally, the best offensive line coach in the business. He has done more with less talent, than probably any coach in the entire NFL.

Another point, is that Fassel has a pretty good record identifying good assistant coaches. Fox, Johnnie Lynn, Jim McNally, etc. have been excellent hires.

And to address the continuation of the Tobin era: I would put credence in that idea IF he had spent more time here. The fact of the matter is that he was one and done. He left this team, and immediately improved the Giants.

 

[JeffGollin]

To me the Tobin era was characterized by (a) inertia and (b) a beige approach to both strategy and team energy.

While Fassell was part of it for a year or so, I view him as a different cat from Tobin. More intense, more creative, quicker to pull the trigger on a personnel change. (Also has "gunfighter eyes.")

Some extenuating circumstances surrounding Fassell in NYC:

1. Ernie Accorsi failed to keep 2 or 3 members of a very promising young offensive line from jumping to other clubs and also failed to replace them with like talent. This crippled an otherwise playoff-bound football team.

2. When Fox (their DC) left to become head coach of the Panteras, the Giant defense took a hit.

Think about it for a moment - How many disciples of any head coach - are clone of that coach? Few if any - they all bring their own unique personalities to the table (i.e. Jeff Fisher is not identical to Buddy even though he played and coached for him and employed the 46).

 

[jmr667]

Originally posted by AZCB34


Fassel's record since he was hired in 1997:

1997 10-5-1
1998 8-8
1999 7-9
2000 12-4
2001 7-9
2002 10-6

If I recall properly, for 2001 and 2002 the players had to turn around seasons to "save" Fassel's job...which they apparently did.

I guess me question is, am I missing something here? Am I supposed to be more impressed with this guy than I am?

Guess I've been a Cards fan for too long. I could care less what the circumstances between the coach and the players were or who had to save who's job if the Cards won that many games in a 6 year span.

Heck, even if after those six seasons the players refused to get off the team bus for a game and claimed the coach deserved a publicly administered atomic wedgie I'd still be happy.

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

Fassel also likes to throw down field. That's what got the Giants to the Super Bowl. Rememeber the playoff game against the Vikings? Collins was going deep every other play. It's also the reason they suck right now: Collins is making poor decisions.

 

[Red Air Force]

The Cardinals need to get someone firery who can instill some confidence among both the players and the fans. To me Fassel IS a retread in the Tobin mold. Hell he even has the trademark "clipboard clutch".

I want someone in here with a chip on their shoulder and something to prove.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by CaliforniaCard
The Cardinals need to get someone firery who can instill some confidence among both the players and the fans. To me Fassel IS a retread in the Tobin mold. Hell he even has the trademark "clipboard clutch".

I want someone in here with a chip on their shoulder and something to prove.

Why not hire Buddy Ryan again? He's fiery.

And I haven't seen anyone show how or why he is a "retread"...

Who are you pimpin' for head coach?

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by CaliforniaCard
The Cardinals need to get someone firery who can instill some confidence among both the players and the fans. To me Fassel IS a retread in the Tobin mold. Hell he even has the trademark "clipboard clutch".

I want someone in here with a chip on their shoulder and something to prove.

I am not sure I would go this far about the guy but I still fail to get pumped about him. I want a HC to come here that will make me excited...excited that a turnaround is right around the corner. Fassel just doesn't do that. I don't need Rah rah stuff but rather something...anything...that will make me believe that this organization is about to finally do something.

Like I said. I wouldn't be disappointed if they hire Fassel, but I also wouldn't be pumped for it.

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
Who are you pimpin' for head coach?

I know you didn't ask me but right now there just isn;t anyone that thrills me. The name guys likely will not come here and there isn't an up and coming guy that knocks my socks off.

I think this offseason is going to see ALOT of changes in the coaching ranks league wide. Maybe someone will pop up out of that group.

 

[Red Air Force]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
Why not hire Buddy Ryan again? He's fiery.

And I haven't seen anyone show how or why he is a "retread"...

Who are you pimpin' for head coach?

Maybe "firery" is the wrong word. Confidence and vision might be a better description of what I'd like to see.

I'm not really pimpin' anyone, but I would say Coughlin, and Smith are my two favorites so far. However, I did read up on Fassel and have to say that I'm actually pretty impressed, and think he would probably be a pretty good pick up if we did hire him.

Here's what I found -

Jim Fassel joined the Giants as a first-time NFL head coach on Jan. 15, 1997. Since then, he has become one of the most successful, respected and longest-tenured coaches in the league and in the long history of the Giants. Fassel has led the Giants to two NFC East championships, a conference title and an appearance in Super Bowl XXXV and a Wild card playoff berth, as well as a regular season record of 54-41-1.
Fassel will enter the 2003 season as one of just five coaches to remain with the same team for seven consecutive years. The others are Denver's Mike Shanahan, Tennessee's Jeff Fisher, Pittsburgh's Bill Cowher and Atlanta's Dan Reeves. Fassel and Reeves, his predecessor as the Giants head coach, have the longest stints with one team in the NFC.


The Giants coach has continually distinguished himself among his peers. Fifteen of the NFL's active head coaches have coached at least 80 games. Fassel is the only one of those 15 coaches that has never had a four-game losing streak. In addition, of those 15 coaches that have been at the helm for at least five full NFL seasons, only four - Fassel, Jeff Fisher, Jon Gruden and Marty Schottenheimer - have never had a double-digit loss season. Bill Belichick, Dom Capers, Bill Cowher, Tony Dungy, Mike Holmgren, Steve Mariucci, Bill Parcell, Dan Reeves, Mike Shanahan, Dick Vermeil and Dave Wannstedt all have had at least one, and most have had more.


Under Fassel, the Giants are 19-5 in regular-season December games, a .792 winning percentage that is the best in the NFL over that span.
Fassel is 31-14-1 in games against NFC East opponents, a .685 winning percentage in division games that is the third-highest among active coaches with more than 20 division games. Mike Martz and Mike Sherman (both 16-6, .727) have a higher winning percentage in division games (minimum 20 games).


Few teams have taken care of the football as well as the Giants have under Fassel. In his first six years on the sideline, the Giants turnover differential is +23, placing them third in the NFC and ninth in the NFL in that important category. In Fassel's 96 regular season games, the Giants have 155 giveaways. That's 1.61 a game, the fifth-lowest turnover-per-game ratio among all NFL head coaches who began their careers since 1970. Fassel trails only Steve Mariucci, Tom Coughlin, Barry Switzer and Wade Phillips.


The Giants have also been strong defensively under Fassel. From 1997-2002, the Giants had 267 sacks, the fifth-highest total in the NFL, behind New Orleans (309), St. Louis (281), Philadelphia (273) and Pittsburgh (272). During those same six seasons, the Giants allowed only 99.4 rushing yards per game, making them one of just seven teams with an average of less than 100 yards. The 99.4-yard figure was second in the NFC (Tampa Bay was first at 99.1) and seventh in the NFL.


The Giants seldom lose leads under Fassel. In the regular season, they are 31-5 when leading after three periods, 36-5 when leading at halftime and 32-9 when leading after the first period.

 

[jf-08]

Nice Work, Cali-Card

I think he is a very well respected coach and I wouldn't mind getting him here. However, I think there will be alot of competition for him.

 

[MadRob]

The fact is that how likely are the Cards to go out and get some kind of big name??? I think that the biggest name that they might possibly consider by far would be Fassel...


HOWEVER, from what I remember, he and the Bidwells didn't part in the greatest of terms... I don't know if he would come here if they were to ask, but I don't know if they will even consider asking him...

 

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by MadRob
HOWEVER, from what I remember, he and the Bidwells didn't part in the greatest of terms... I don't know if he would come here if they were to ask, but I don't know if they will even consider asking him...

Actually they parted on very good terms. It's one of the reasons his name keeps popping up.

 

[WizardOfAz]

Originally posted by MadRob
HOWEVER, from what I remember, he and the Bidwells didn't part in the greatest of terms...

What do you base this on??

 

[MadRob]

What do you base this on?? [/QUOTE]

It just seems like I remember him leaving a bit angry...

 

[football karma]

I was lucky enough to play golf with Jim Fassell when he was here. Had very nice things to say about Bidwill (granted, that was his employer at the time) – essentially saying that the nature of the contract they gave him was very generous and that they treated him in a first class manner. I got more than the politically correct answer –

He noted that he didn’t really know Vince Tobin prior to taking the job – but liked working for him as Tobin didn’t mess with the offense, gave Fassell lots of autonomy, etc.

Interestingly, we had also talked about being a head coach. He was emphatic that he would have to be very comfortable with the organization he would be head coach for. At the time (this was early in the season he was OC for the Cards) volunteered that he thought George Young and the Giants were top notch and would go to work for them in a heartbeat. He had been QB coach there (under Reeves I believe).

By year end, when his name was being rumored as a Giants head coach, I knew he would take the job in an instant.

Lastly, Fassel was a George Young guy – not Accorsi – so I wonder if his troubles in NY come from a disconnect between coach and GM.

 

[JeffGollin]

Lastly, Fassel was a George Young guy – not Accorsi – so I wonder if his troubles in NY come from a disconnect between coach and GM.
I don't know if there was a disconnect, and Accorsi certainly deserves credit for (a) loading up on quality CB's and (b) trading up to get Jeremy Shockey - but, as a great believer that successful teams build off a solid foundation of strong offensive and defensive lines, I feel Ernie left Jim high and dry by letting a few quality offensive linemen leave and then not replacing them with players of similar talent.

Much of the team's poor W & L record this year has been a direct reflection of a subpar O-line. In that sense, Accorsi has jeopardized Fassell's future with the Giants