Joe Johnson...Up In Smoke

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by RugbyMuffin
B*LLSHIT! THIS IS IN ALL CAPS BECAUSE I AM YELLING. COPS CAN BE COMPLETE NAZI'S. WHEN A COP SAYS HE "SMELLED POT IN THE CAR" IT IS LIKE TELLING YOUR DATE AFTER YOU HAD SEX THAT YOU HAVE A MEETING TOMMORROW. IT IS A LIE THAT COPS USE AND GET AWAY WITH ALL THE TIME. IT IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST INJUSTICES IN THIS COUNTRY. EVERY TIME A COP GETS CAUGHT IN A LIE THEY SHOULD BE HUNG IN THE MIDDLE OF TOWN, OR IF YOU WANT TO BE MEAN YOU CAN JUST PUT THEM IN A CAGE WITH ME AND LET ME RIP THERE THROAT OUT WITH MY TEETH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


DOWN WITH CORRUPT COPS!

Whoa there....I don't think Ed would fully disagree with you, but searching his car because he (supposedly) smells marijuana is valid. It is technically illegal, and it does have a potent smell...

I have had many friends popped for possesion of various different amounts of marijuana, and many times they hadn't smoked any but the cop said he smelled it. In most instances the cop was correct.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by Brian in Mesa


Many criminals (guilty of far worse crimes) are caught on the road because of a broken-down vehicle, bad tags, traffic violation, etc.

Exactly, though I have seen many instances where cops were busting (friends and acquaintences) people for no reason at all. My girlfriend (who is black) and I always joke that in this country cops can pull you over for DWB (driving while black).

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by RugbyMuffin
Unless they got a dog with them. They are not going to smell it. Maybe the weed in Arizona just is better than around NYC. Or at least smells more.

Sorry dude but you are plain and simply a MORON!

If someone has been smoking pot in vehicle or a vehicle is full of people who had smoked pot at a party and they may have a few roaches in the ash tray you better bet that I have smelled it and would smell it. You saying otherwise is completely ludicrouse!

It is obvious you have no clue about Police Officers in general you just have a wild hair up your ass about them and thats a shame!

 

[Brian in Mesa]

I'm about as anti-drug as you can get and I still know what mary jane smells like (first experience: Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band concert, 1985, ASU Activity Center, I was probably the only one there who wasn't smoking it firsthand). Later, 7 years of living in an apartment brought back that familiar odor. And currently, my neighbor's garage reeks of it...

Cops definitely know what it smells like.

I understand where you're coming from, believing that a cop would make up some excuse for a search, but the fact that he did find some pot leads one to the assumption that he truly did smell an odor.

Heck, I bet Johnson, after asking you for some snacks to munch on, would tell you he had smoked some too.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

OK

Calm blue ocean. Calm Blue Ocean.

Yes, I am calm. That is a sensitive subject. I seriously have always tried to be a good person. But all that I stated is no joke. I got pulled over by a cop (19yrs old at at the time) Did I have weed on me ? Yes. Was I stoned?, hell no. Only crack addicts and drunks get behind the wheel of a car when they are not normal. Reason I got pulled over was it was 2pm and I was driving my stoned out drunk friend home. He looked like **** and the cop decided that was enough to search the car. He stopped me because he said he thought I didn't have my seat beat on. As I looked at the strap across my chest.
But I only had 1 stupid dime bag on me. The next thing I know the cops are planting about 5 oz. of weed and 2 glass pieces on me. Saying I had it hid in my crotch, and put it in between the cushions of the cop car. HOW THE HELL COULD I HIDE GLASS PIECES IN MY CROTCH, how could I have sat down, how did they not find them when I was patted down.
So now here I sit with a felony on my record. A person who had never been in trouble with law at all (not even a speeding ticket) before or since my conviction. My college dilploma for 4 years of working my @ss off is now worthless and I can't find a job which anyone. Luckly a friend of mine lets me work for him at $10.00.
Did I break the law. Yes. Am I a felon. F*ck no! And neither are a lot of other people in this country who get screwed by manditory minimum sentencing and dick head cops.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

http://packers.theinsiders.com/2/112320.html

Johnson faces charges
By Laura Veras Marran
Date: May 23, 2003

Packers defensive end Joe Johnson was charged with marijuana possession in Tift County, Georgia early Thursday, according to published reports.

Johnson reportedly stopped his car in a turning lane of US Highway 319. A Tift County Sheriff's deputy saw the stopped car with its hazard lights flashing and approached the car. Johnson exited the car and asked directions to Tallahassee, Fla.
The deputy smelled marijuana smoke and searched the vehicle, finding what is believed to be a misdemeanor amount of marijuana, the report said.

Johnson posted a $1,625 cash bond and was released from the Tift County Jail before noon Thursday, county officials said.

The 30-year-old defensive lineman signed with the Packers in 2002, but was hampered by injury. He is in the process of coming back from triceps surgery.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He was asking for trouble: Johnson reportedly stopped his car in a turning lane of US Highway 319. A Tift County Sheriff's deputy saw the stopped car with its hazard lights flashing and approached the car. That's gonna get a cop on you regardless of your color.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Originally posted by Shane H
Sorry dude but you are plain and simply a MORON!

If someone has been smoking pot in vehicle or a vehicle is full of people who had smoked pot at a party and they may have a few roaches in the ash tray you better bet that I have smelled it and would smell it. You saying otherwise is completely ludicrouse!

It is obvious you have no clue about Police Officers in general you just have a wild hair up your ass about them and thats a shame!

Look I have already said if he was smoking or high while driving than it is WRONG. And it is dangerous. I agree with what you are saying completely. You SMOKE pot anywhere and you can smell it a mile away.
What I said. IS if he just had it on him, and was not smoking in the car. YOu wouldn't be able to smell it unless it was some good fresh weed.
So I am with you on that. And I am trying to keep my moronic comments about this to a minimum. But man if the crap were to happen to you or a person close to you would understand.
Plus this is a football message board not a narchotic clinic. The best way to keep yourself out of trouble is to just not do it untill it is legalized. Which is my current position. I am just trying to educated my fellow Cardinals fans, and keep people from getting into the mess that I got MYSELF INTO. Regardless of who did what.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Originally posted by Brian in Mesa
http://packers.theinsiders.com/2/112320.html

Johnson faces charges
By Laura Veras Marran
Date: May 23, 2003

Packers defensive end Joe Johnson was charged with marijuana possession in Tift County, Georgia early Thursday, according to published reports.

Johnson reportedly stopped his car in a turning lane of US Highway 319. A Tift County Sheriff's deputy saw the stopped car with its hazard lights flashing and approached the car. Johnson exited the car and asked directions to Tallahassee, Fla.
The deputy smelled marijuana smoke and searched the vehicle, finding what is believed to be a misdemeanor amount of marijuana, the report said.

Johnson posted a $1,625 cash bond and was released from the Tift County Jail before noon Thursday, county officials said.

The 30-year-old defensive lineman signed with the Packers in 2002, but was hampered by injury. He is in the process of coming back from triceps surgery.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He was asking for trouble: Johnson reportedly stopped his car in a turning lane of US Highway 319. A Tift County Sheriff's deputy saw the stopped car with its hazard lights flashing and approached the car. That's gonna get a cop on you regardless of your color.

Damn right!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Good cop Bad cop

Originally posted by Shane H
Fiasco I have interacted with you for a few years now and quite frankly Im offended by this statement.

Just because I pull over a "black guy with out of state plates" in no way means that I am going to toss his ride PERIOD!

I have to have proper PC to conduct such a search and if you think I am going to risk my career and a civil rights law suit all because I want to say I SMELLED POT *WINK WINK* Even though I didnt then you are sorely mistaken!

To imply that EVERY cop would is offensive to us who do the job and make the city a safer place for people such as you! :roll:

Now Shane you are obviously a police officer. I do NOT hate cops. Only the corrupt ones. And if you are saying there are not corrupt cops. Well then your a lier.
Regardless you seem like a good cop. And that rocks. Cops are cool people, and I learn this through playing rugby with a lot of them. They are funny and have the BEST bar stories to tell.
We just need more cops like you in NJ. Were unfortunately a lot of racial profile goes down. I see you are from Vegas so I bet you got your hands full. Nobody is saying that being a cop is easy but if a person can't handle being a cop than HE SHOULD NOT BE ONE. You don't give power and a gun to people who can't handle it.

BY the way "Wild hair up your @ss?". Where did you get that one from, never heard it before.

And by the way since you seem like a good cop. Thanks!

Can we talk about football again ? I am tired of reliving bad moments!

 

[ChiCard]

Well first off I thought the story said he got out of the car and approached the officer? I can tell you I've done hundreds of court apearances in drug cases and many has been the time I've had to ask to excuse a defendant before he came into court because of the lingering smell of pot on his person and clothing. Anyone who says you can't smell it is mistaken. As for the search, the US Supreme Court has long held that the mobility of a vehicle puts it in a seperate and distinct catagory from buildings when it comes to the 4th Amendment. They've even abandonded the distinction between open, opaque, locked, taped or otherwise secured packages. Furthermore we don't even know if they cop asked to search and the guy said yes, which happens more often then you'd think. The smell alone would trigger PC for a chemical test because in the vast majority of State's DUI drugs is a different creature from DUI alcohol. There's no ".08 presumption" type test for dope. It's strict liability. If it's in your blood, you're guilty. No ifs' ands' or buts. As for the "out of state plates". Come on now Shane. We know that more often then not that plus a "lost motorist" will bring about "the officer's public care function" as the court's like to refer to it, as pc for a stop.

 

[Snakester]

If you don't want to get into trouble don't break the law. If you are stopped, be very polite and answer the cops questions and let him get on his way. The more of a hard time you give the cop the more likely he is going to give you a hard time and believe me he is gonna win. It's very hard to fight the law and win in anyway. The best thing you can do is if your gonna smoke pot or drink or whatever do it at home. I am one of those people that think that the police should not be able to search your car or your home or bug your phones or tell you to wear a seatbelt and so on. But big brother can do what ever he want's and 9 times out of 10 he is gonna get away with it. I am sorry to here that you (Rugby Muffin ) were set up like you were but it happens,there are bad cops out there and beyond filing out a complaint against the cop there isn't much else that can be done. The one good thing is that enough public complaints will get the cop fired over time. If he is abusing his power then he might have other people filing complaints about him as well. The thing is for every bad cop doing stuff like that there are probably ten doing there job fairly to the public.
As far as pot I think the players should know better. If your gonna make millions of dollars for only a short period of time in your life and staying clean is part of what you have to do to secure your future then you just have to be smart enough to do that.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Originally posted by ChiCard
... thought the story said he got out of the car and approached the officer?

I think this is a big part of the story that is easy to overlook.

If you get pulled over (or are sitting in your vehicle) and a cop pulls you over (or pulls up behind your car)...getting out of your vehicle and approaching the officer is going to make him suspicious. To him it raises a red flag. It says you are trying to get his attention away from your vehicle. The best thing to do is to remain seated in your vehicle and let the officer approach you.

 

[Shane]

Originally posted by ChiCard
As for the "out of state plates". Come on now Shane. We know that more often then not that plus a "lost motorist" will bring about "the officer's public care function" as the court's like to refer to it, as pc for a stop.

Chicard I agree with you to some extent I can say that I worked an all black very depressed neighborhood here in Las Vegas for 3 1/2 years. I can say that I have actually pulled over a white guy with out of state plates or in state for that matter who I see creeping through the ALL BLACK neighborhood at 2 am.

You are correct I am making that stop for this persons well being because many out of staters in Vegas can make one wrong turn on the freeway and end up in a part of town they shouldnt be in. So I do stop that person and direct them on how to get out of the neighborhood, but not before I engage in a line of questioning that helps me determine if the guy was legitimately lost or looking to bye dope. Which is well within my legal right as an officer.

During the questioning and while viewing the subjects actions if I start to develop suspicion or even actual PC that a crime is being committed I will pursue it any GOOD cop would.

But more often then not it was just a wrong turn and I dont toss the car and it ends up being a casual friendly converstaion where directions are given and nothing more. Everyone leaves happy!

But at the same token if I see a black guy in the neighborhood at 2 am with out of stae plates I will be less apt to stop him because there are many Cali people who have relocated here and havent changed registaration yet or people visiting home or family and since it is a black neighborhood it is not nearly as unusual.

Plain and simply a white guy down there at 2am is going to get stopped because he will get hurt, killed, or jacked.

If I were to see that same black guuy with out of state plates in an upscale neighborhood I also would not stop him. Because there are many prevalent black individuals in Vegas who live in wonderful neighborhoods as well so that to would not be out of the ordinary. So the for his safety stop wouldnt fly there either!

 

[Fiasco]

Originally posted by Shane H
Fiasco I have interacted with you for a few years now and quite frankly Im offended by this statement.

Just because I pull over a "black guy with out of state plates" in no way means that I am going to toss his ride PERIOD!

I have to have proper PC to conduct such a search and if you think I am going to risk my career and a civil rights law suit all because I want to say I SMELLED POT *WINK WINK* Even though I didnt then you are sorely mistaken!

To imply that EVERY cop would is offensive to us who do the job and make the city a safer place for people such as you! :roll:

Shane,

Of course not every cop is like this, please don't take my statement as an indictment against your character. Police officers are as susceptible to the same mistakes, racial bias and hubris that ordinary people are. From all of our interactions on these boards I have complete respect for you and I am sure that you are a fine police officer.

From my own personal experience (I have been pulled over many many times. My car is an absolute police officer magnet) I have been treated very differently depending upon who was in the car with me. Every single time I was with a black person(s) we were split up and temporarily cuffed or one of us was confined in the rear of the cruiser while the car was searched. This has never happened once when I was with other whites. Do I believe all police officers are like this? Absolutely not. But I will quote Joseph McNamara (former police chief of San Jose, CA)

<I>" I've come to believe that hundreds of thousands of law-enforcement officers commit felony perjury every year testifying about drug arrests." -Chief McNamara "</I>

The racial issue really isn't what concerned me and it sidetracked what my intent was. Here are my issues with this whole thing. It would be alot easier if I still had my college thesis on the War on Drugs (written prior to my every smoking pot mind you, I didn't try it until I was over 20) but I digress...

The majority of the population either smokes marijuana or has tried it in the past. The war on drugs is an unjust war on the majority of the population. It is a huge waste of resources at every level of society. The rate of incarceration has increased sixfold since Nixon first declared the "War on Drugs" in 1971.

One needs only look back in history to the twenties and early thirties and the miserable failure that was prohibition. We are a market economy. If the demand for a product exists, someone will step in and fill that demand. Prohibition failed to curb demand for alcohol and had even less of an effect on supply. The prohibition policy effectively stripped the government of oversight of the industry. The policy made alcohol lucrative, and was ultimately responsible for the vast increase of power weilded by organized crime during the period.

Marijuana should be classified and handled like alcohol. Marijuana is less costly to grow and process then tobacco. Exorbitant taxes could be levied on each pack (upwards of $40 a pack over production costs), yet the price of a pack of Marijuana cigarettes would still be cheaper then current market value. Individuals should also be able to possess a restricted amount of plants for personal use if they choose. This effectively removes the profit margin for the street dealer selling marijuana.

Control of narcotics and the burden of dealing with addicts should be removed from criminal/correctional branches of government and given to the healthcare system where it belongs.

My final pet peeve with the War on Drugs is anti-drug education, particularly the commercials. Most are just thinly veiled ********.

It has been over 30 years since the war ond drugs was declared by Nixon. Isn't it about damn time we try something else?

 

[Fiasco]

(And Fiasco - until the laws are changed - possession is a crime.)

Then the vast majority of the population are criminals. So you really want to see every single one of them caught and convicted?

Just because an act is on the books as a crime doesn't make it right.

 

[red desert]

Originally posted by Ed B
I don't disagree with you, but the fact that they found weed makes it pretty hard to accuse the officer of making up the fact that he smelled weed!

Not hard at all, happens all the time.

 

[ChiCard]

Originally posted by Shane H
Chicard I agree with you to some extent I can say that I worked an all black very depressed neighborhood here in Las Vegas for 3 1/2 years. I can say that I have actually pulled over a white guy with out of state plates or in state for that matter who I see creeping through the ALL BLACK neighborhood at 2 am.

You are correct I am making that stop for this persons well being because many out of staters in Vegas can make one wrong turn on the freeway and end up in a part of town they shouldnt be in. So I do stop that person and direct them on how to get out of the neighborhood, but not before I engage in a line of questioning that helps me determine if the guy was legitimately lost or looking to bye dope. Which is well within my legal right as an officer.

During the questioning and while viewing the subjects actions if I start to develop suspicion or even actual PC that a crime is being committed I will pursue it any GOOD cop would.

But more often then not it was just a wrong turn and I dont toss the car and it ends up being a casual friendly converstaion where directions are given and nothing more. Everyone leaves happy!

But at the same token if I see a black guy in the neighborhood at 2 am with out of stae plates I will be less apt to stop him because there are many Cali people who have relocated here and havent changed registaration yet or people visiting home or family and since it is a black neighborhood it is not nearly as unusual.

Plain and simply a white guy down there at 2am is going to get stopped because he will get hurt, killed, or jacked.

If I were to see that same black guuy with out of state plates in an upscale neighborhood I also would not stop him. Because there are many prevalent black individuals in Vegas who live in wonderful neighborhoods as well so that to would not be out of the ordinary. So the for his safety stop wouldnt fly there either!

Fair enough.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by Fiasco
Shane,

Of course not every cop is like this, please don't take my statement as an indictment against your character. Police officers are as susceptible to the same mistakes, racial bias and hubris that ordinary people are. From all of our interactions on these boards I have complete respect for you and I am sure that you are a fine police officer.

From my own personal experience (I have been pulled over many many times. My car is an absolute police officer magnet) I have been treated very differently depending upon who was in the car with me. Every single time I was with a black person(s) we were split up and temporarily cuffed or one of us was confined in the rear of the cruiser while the car was searched. This has never happened once when I was with other whites. Do I believe all police officers are like this? Absolutely not. But I will quote Joseph McNamara (former police chief of San Jose, CA)

<I>" I've come to believe that hundreds of thousands of law-enforcement officers commit felony perjury every year testifying about drug arrests." -Chief McNamara "</I>

The racial issue really isn't what concerned me and it sidetracked what my intent was. Here are my issues with this whole thing. It would be alot easier if I still had my college thesis on the War on Drugs (written prior to my every smoking pot mind you, I didn't try it until I was over 20) but I digress...

The majority of the population either smokes marijuana or has tried it in the past. The war on drugs is an unjust war on the majority of the population. It is a huge waste of resources at every level of society. The rate of incarceration has increased sixfold since Nixon first declared the "War on Drugs" in 1971.

One needs only look back in history to the twenties and early thirties and the miserable failure that was prohibition. We are a market economy. If the demand for a product exists, someone will step in and fill that demand. Prohibition failed to curb demand for alcohol and had even less of an effect on supply. The prohibition policy effectively stripped the government of oversight of the industry. The policy made alcohol lucrative, and was ultimately responsible for the vast increase of power weilded by organized crime during the period.

Marijuana should be classified and handled like alcohol. Marijuana is less costly to grow and process then tobacco. Exorbitant taxes could be levied on each pack (upwards of $40 a pack over production costs), yet the price of a pack of Marijuana cigarettes would still be cheaper then current market value. Individuals should also be able to possess a restricted amount of plants for personal use if they choose. This effectively removes the profit margin for the street dealer selling marijuana.

Control of narcotics and the burden of dealing with addicts should be removed from criminal/correctional branches of government and given to the healthcare system where it belongs.

My final pet peeve with the War on Drugs is anti-drug education, particularly the commercials. Most are just thinly veiled ********.

It has been over 30 years since the war ond drugs was declared by Nixon. Isn't it about damn time we try something else?

I thought Nixon started the "War on Crime" not the "War on Drugs"? I thought the official War on Drugs was started by Reagan....

The "War on Drugs" is a farce, and I totally agree with you. It is also inherrently racially biased. The clearest example of this is the "crack/cocaine ratio". During the Reagan admin., legislation was enacted to put away crack dealers and users, and basically 100 grams of cocaine was equal to 1 gram of crack as far as sentencing goes. Well most crack users are minorities, while most cocaine users are white. Cocaine is much more potent than crack

 

[justAndy]

some thoughts.

1. The "war on drugs" and the high incarceration rate in the USA is very useful to corporations who have a pool of cheap (virtually free) labor to draw from
2. It's a fact of life that upper income folks who get busted and can afford good lawyers get more chances than the poor.
3. I have a friend from highschool days that becam a cop. His take on weed: "smoke up all you want in your house - if i catch you with it in your car or out on the street I'll have to arrest you - for being STUPID!".

 

[Ed B]

Rugby, this certainly seems to have touched a nerve, but I have to say (as Brian did) that if you are going to argue that marijuana doesn't have enough of an odor for a cop to have realistically smelled it from the window (especially if Johnson had been smoking it and it was on his breath), you are in denial.

I've lived in apartments where i could smell people smoking weed 2 floors down. And you know that to be the case. It is a very distinct smell.

I still don't think it should be illegal but I don't think the police officer acted improperly here.

Let's face the reality that in the middle of the night police are ALWAYS more suspicious and ANY ONE OF US who gets pulled over at 3 AM is going to have our vehicle searched. The natural assumption is that anyone driving at that hour is drinking, drugging, or somehow up to no good.

 

[ajcardfan]

There's one problem with Government sanctioned drug sales, as I see it.

Once a profit is made by the Government in the form of taxes, or from direct sales, inevitably, the goal will become to protect that revenue and/or, increase it. The money will be made not off of casual users, but the addicts. Much like alcohol companies count on alcoholics to maintain their profits. Thus, reducing drug addiction rates will be given lip service only. Much like the alcohol companies do today ofr alcoholism. This will increase addiction rates, and I know that almost everyone who has had experience, directly or indirectly, with addiction knows how catastrophic it can be to the addicts and their families. We have too many screwed up families and kids already. Is it worth that to put drug cartels and street gangs out of business? Maybe. But you're only shifting the negative consequences, not eliminating or reducing them.

In the short term, it would be hell on our health care system as well. My insurance just went up 25% in one year. We'd need to change that system before we could even think about legalizing. I don't think there's a chance use rates would do anything but increase, bringing all the health problems associated with use.

JMO.

 

[CardinalChris]

Originally posted by Brian in Mesa
People endangering the lives of themselves and others on the road has nothing to do with my morality.

I do take a strong stance against drunk driving (or driving under the influence of other drugs), always have. IMO, if you drive under the influence, especially with all of the awareness these days, you are a loser. That doesn't mean a person cannot change, etc, but for that choice they were most definitely a loser.

I was in SADD in high school, have had friends killed in alcohol-related crashes, and have been hit head on by an extreme-dui-driver myself (he also had his 7-yr-old in his car...he was charged with 4 felonies), so this is a big issue with me.

If you want to drink or get high...do it at home or get a ride home. It really is not too much to ask.

Here here.. my friend's mom picks us up in van (we are 28 and mom gets us at the club!!!). And I am ALWAYS up for a 2:30 phone call from a friend or even aquantance to get a ride. In my younger days I felt invincible, as I think most youths do, but it just isn't freaking worth it..... and you'd be amazed how easy it is NOT to drive like that. People are willing to help!!

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
There's one problem with Government sanctioned drug sales, as I see it.

Once a profit is made by the Government in the form of taxes, or from direct sales, inevitably, the goal will become to protect that revenue and/or, increase it. The money will be made not off of casual users, but the addicts. Much like alcohol companies count on alcoholics to maintain their profits. Thus, reducing drug addiction rates will be given lip service only. Much like the alcohol companies do today ofr alcoholism. This will increase addiction rates, and I know that almost everyone who has had experience, directly or indirectly, with addiction knows how catastrophic it can be to the addicts and their families. We have too many screwed up families and kids already. Is it worth that to put drug cartels and street gangs out of business? Maybe. But you're only shifting the negative consequences, not eliminating or reducing them.

In the short term, it would be hell on our health care system as well. My insurance just went up 25% in one year. We'd need to change that system before we could even think about legalizing. I don't think there's a chance use rates would do anything but increase, bringing all the health problems associated with use.

JMO.

But looking at the Dutch experience, hard drug usuage has dropped, while soft drug usuage has increased a little when drug laws were relaxed.

I for one believe marijuana alone should be made legal. Drugs such as cocaine, ectasy, heroin, LSD (and mushrooms), Speed, and PCP really screw people up pretty badly when one isn't being responsible. Marijuana is less harmful than alcohol, and from everything I've learned, it isn't even arguable.

 

[CardinalChris]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
There's one problem with Government sanctioned drug sales, as I see it.
In the short term, it would be hell on our health care system as well. My insurance just went up 25% in one year. We'd need to change that system before we could even think about legalizing. I don't think there's a chance use rates would do anything but increase, bringing all the health problems associated with use.

JMO.

Health care is in trouble because of liability. We live in a society where if something goes wrong, you sue somebody because SOMEBODY is responsible and that person has to pay you. Blame may be the thing that destroys our good will to each other.

As for the wacky tobacci....... I doubt use would rise... people who smoke weed do it now. It is very previlent in our society. Legalizing it will not create a huge influx of new smokers. alcohol is our biggest problem. It kills more people than ANYTHING else, and is socially acceptable. With the costs of prison and the high use of marijuana... imagine between law enforcement and prison costs what it costs the goverment to fight marijuana use. Yet it is taboo. It doesn't mke much sense to me.

 

[Fiasco]

Let's face the reality that in the middle of the night police are ALWAYS more suspicious and ANY ONE OF US who gets pulled over at 3 AM is going to have our vehicle searched. The natural assumption is that anyone driving at that hour is drinking, drugging, or somehow up to no good.

I've been pulled over many times late at night and have never had my car searched.