Jurecki on FOX Sports Arizona-Cards like Lovie Smith and Nick Saban.

[Lomax to Green 84]

He mentioned that he go this info. from outside sources but I wonder what the heck that means. He seems to be pretty tight with alot of Cardinal people and maybe he is floating this out to see what reaction they will get. Jurecki mentioned that he doubted the Cards would be willing to pay the money necessary to pry a guy like Saban away from LSU and kind of implied that a guy like Lovie Smith seemed to be a good fit.

Jurecki talks alot and alot of his stuff is just internet smoke, but we have all discussed Lovie Smith in the past. He certainly fits what has been typical Cardinal hiring practice-previous defensive coordinator promoted to the head coach of the Cards. Happened with Buddy Ryan, Vince Tobin, and Dave McGinnis.

 

[SECTION 11]

I like Lovie Smith's defenses. He plays to their stregnths.
Taking an NFC West guy would be an advantage.

That would leave a big question mark at offensive coordinator.

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

IF we took Lovie, I bet the Rams take Mac.

 

[earthsci]

What I like about Lovie Smith is that he is the defensive coordinator for a team who's head coach is an offensive (in many ways) guy. A guy like Romeo Crennel is intriguing, but how much of New Englands defense is his and how much is Belichecks'?

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

Originally posted by earthsci
What I like about Lovie Smith is that he is the defensive coordinator for a team who's head coach is an offensive (in many ways) guy. A guy like Romeo Crennel is intriguing, but how much of New Englands defense is his and how much is Belichecks'?

Lovie would also have a good idea of how to stop the Rams offense!

 

[CT Card Fan]

Originally posted by Holian
He mentioned that he go this info. from outside sources but I wonder what the heck that means. He seems to be pretty tight with alot of Cardinal people and maybe he is floating this out to see what reaction they will get. Jurecki mentioned that he doubted the Cards would be willing to pay the money necessary to pry a guy like Saban away from LSU and kind of implied that a guy like Lovie Smith seemed to be a good fit.

Since the season isn't over yet, it probably could be conisdered tampering inf the Cards were to say this. If "outside sources" wink wink leak that information, then there's nothing against the Cards. That's my guess at least.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

At least Lovie has a defensive scheme and gets players that fit that scheme.But can we really have a head coach named Lovie?

 

[Pariah]

The problem is that we've had a string of DCs in here playing HC. Where has that gotten us? A one way ticket to palookaville, that's where.

We have too much young, promising talent on offense (Boldin, Johnson, Shipp, Anderson, maybe McCown?) to let it continue to die on the vine. Smith might make a great HC, but I'd rather see someone in here with a track record of developing good QBs into great QBs.

 

[seesred]

I hope this is what it looks like bull. We need someone in charge that has been there, that has the ability to put together a great coaching staff. I hate the idea of any so called one side of the ball coach coming up and training in Arizona for a head coaches job. I'm sorry I would hate the decision should it come to that of any and I mean any second line coach taking over next year. I would accept but not love a head coach of a major winning college program coming over. But toi tell you the truth look at all the big colleg coaches that have come up through the ranks, very, very few success stories.

GBR

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Originally posted by seesred
I hope this is what it looks like bull. We need someone in charge that has been there, that has the ability to put together a great coaching staff. I hate the idea of any so called one side of the ball coach coming up and training in Arizona for a head coaches job. I'm sorry I would hate the decision should it come to that of any and I mean any second line coach taking over next year. I would accept but not love a head coach of a major winning college program coming over. But toi tell you the truth look at all the big colleg coaches that have come up through the ranks, very, very few success stories.

GBR

You're right.Who knows what kind of staff a young HC could put together.I'm not saying they can't get a good staff but it's just a question that's out there.The good thing about Smith is that he has access to the young coaches in the Rams offensive system and could promote them if they have talent.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

There's also been little success w/ retreads turning around notoriously dismal franchises. Look at Sam Wyche in TB, Ditka in New Orleans, countless in Cincy. What finally turned around these teams? Intelligent defensive coordinators from outside the organization.

I think our best option is getting a smart, organized defensive-mided coach who knows the league well enough to hire solid offensive coaches from college or other NFL teams.

 

[seesred]

I agree I don';t want retreads as well. But guys like Jimmy Johnson and Coughlin are not retreads and they can put together a staff that will make them look good/ That's what we want. Sure A Smith can probably get great coaches from under , but they will all be unproven in the NFL at top spots. Erikson, and the bozo in Washington , it takes a different knowledge to win in the NFL. It takes time to aquire that knowledge, does anyone here want to train a new coach for the NFL. I don't.

GBR

 

[Tangodnzr]

Originally posted by seesred
I agree I don';t want retreads as well. But guys like Jimmy Johnson and Coughlin are not retreads and they can put together a staff that will make them look good/ That's what we want. GBR

HUH?????
They aren't "retreads" ?
I'd be interested to know what your definition of "retreads" is then.

...and I'd also be curious to know where they are going to glean these "staff members that will make them look good", from.

 

[seesred]

In my mind a retread is someone that keeps getting hired because of time working in the job and gets fired early because he really can't do the job. Joe Bugle would fit here. Head coach Cards, failed, went to Oakland became head coach failed again.

JJ has been a winner knows what it looks like in personal to get there, knows what it takes in training to get there, is not trying to win for the first time high respect from most players wanting to get there even if they don't like him.
If A guy like JJ ( I'm sure he would never come) came over here he would get his staff from his prior staffs and they would know what to expect from him from day one becuause he has already been there with them.
GBR

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Originally posted by Pariah
The problem is that we've had a string of DCs in here playing HC. Where has that gotten us? A one way ticket to palookaville, that's where.

We have too much young, promising talent on offense (Boldin, Johnson, Shipp, Anderson, maybe McCown?) to let it continue to die on the vine. Smith might make a great HC, but I'd rather see someone in here with a track record of developing good QBs into great QBs.

That's why I'm in favor of Sean Payton, but he's more suited for Offensive Coordinator than anything....

 

[jmt]

IMO - we need a proven NFL coach. Let's get someone in here who knows how to put a staff together and has some credibility. God forbid we hire a college coach and we have not been successful with coordinators. Fassel, Ditka, JJ, Green, Reeves, Marty, Kotite (no never mind), even Coughlin, who I hate, but please - someone with experience.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

The main reason why I'm concerned about the Cardinals attracting an already established high profiled NFL coach is the fact that most of them command absolute player-personnel control, and that is something that the Bidwills and Graves wouldnt be willing to sacrifice whatsoever......

 

[john h]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
The main reason why I'm concerned about the Cardinals attracting an already established high profiled NFL coach is the fact that most of them command absolute player-personnel control, and that is something that the Bidwills and Graves wouldnt be willing to sacrifice whatsoever......

King Louie you hit the problem dead on.

 

[jf-08]

I think that they can get a coach who has previous NFL experience at a reasonable cost. Someone who built a foundation for others to build on and take their team to the playoffs
...........................






















RICH KOTITE

***ducks from all of the thrown vegetables***

 

[kerouac9]

Originally posted by KingLouieLouie
The main reason why I'm concerned about the Cardinals attracting an already established high profiled NFL coach is the fact that most of them command absolute player-personnel control, and that is something that the Bidwills and Graves wouldnt be willing to sacrifice whatsoever......

I don't think that's true. Rich McKay has personnel control in Tampa over Gruden. Fassel doesn't have personnel control. Andy Reid has a GM, but they work pretty tightly together. Brian Billick has a GM that is quietly the front-runner for Executive of the Year. Mike Holmgren's Seahawks didn't really take off until he gave up the GM reins to Ferguson. Even Bill Belichek has a GM that takes care of a lot of the personnel issues.

I think to say that "high profile coaches all have total personnel control and demand it on entrance" is pretty much totally off-base. For the most part, the HC/GM combined experiment has failed. Only Mike Sherman has done a passable job of it, and the Packers are clearly a franchise on the decline.

 

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by kerouac9
I don't think that's true. Rich McKay has personnel control in Tampa over Gruden. Fassel doesn't have personnel control. Andy Reid has a GM, but they work pretty tightly together. Brian Billick has a GM that is quietly the front-runner for Executive of the Year. Mike Holmgren's Seahawks didn't really take off until he gave up the GM reins to Ferguson. Even Bill Belichek has a GM that takes care of a lot of the personnel issues.

I think to say that "high profile coaches all have total personnel control and demand it on entrance" is pretty much totally off-base. For the most part, the HC/GM combined experiment has failed. Only Mike Sherman has done a passable job of it, and the Packers are clearly a franchise on the decline.

Right on.

Jimmy Johnson as a $5M/yr coach? Sure.
Jimmy Johnson as a $8M/yr coach/gm? No way. It's a bad idea. Whether it's Holmgren, Patino, Riley, Johnson or anyone else, it's a bad idea only because it just doesn't work.

 

[ajcardfan]

Lovie Smith is my top choice.

I don't get the "proven" argument really. Guys like Gruden, Cowher, Lewis, Reid, Fisher, etc. were not "proven" head coaches who could put together a name staff. They were talented guys, who could get the job done.

 

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
Lovie Smith is my top choice.

I don't get the "proven" argument really. Guys like Gruden, Cowher, Lewis, Reid, Fisher, etc. were not "proven" head coaches who could put together a name staff. They were talented guys, who could get the job done.

I agree with this also.
Personally I like Romeo Crennel. One of the reasons is because he's been under I think the best coach in the NFL in Bill Belichick.

 

[pinnacle]

Romeo Crennel is at the top of my list right now..but my list only contains guys we could realistically get. They have about 1/2 of their starters injured on defense and the defensive roster is full of retreads that anyone could have added - and they are 4th in the NFL in terms of points given up.

I am assuming he learned something coaching under Bill Parcells and Billicheck. Al Saunders would be at the top - but I do not think he is leaving Kansas City and has been promised the head coaching job.

Lovie Smith is in the top 3...I just like Crennel more.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

I posed this old adage couple weeks ago...... Do the players make the coach or the coach make the players? Why I say this is that anyone could have won during Jimmie Johnson's tenure in
Dallas (the Herschel Walker trade was definitely a thing of genius), but look at what Johnson did in Miami?

Gruden went to Tampa Bay because he knew they were closer to a Superbowl title (with an up-and-coming team) opposed to a team that most of their 1st stringers are "getting up there in age" and would have to immediately go into a rebuilding mode... Also, Gruden probably had some power-struggles with Al Davis that were hidden behind-the-scenes, we never know......


Fassel probably demands more personnel control and that could be one of his problems in NY.....Again, the media obviously doesnt know or report every single detail of what happens behind closed-doors.... The Eagles have a very highly regarded and established GM, which would prevent Reid for questioning his decisions.....The other 2 you mentioned also have up-and-coming teams that any coach would salivate the opportunity to coach for them........

Here's the main issue with Graves....Would he hire a coach who soon become his future successor as GM? It's happened before...
Especially someone with a high ego, they wouldnt want to defer to someone who is as unproven as Graves is......

The Cardinals need to finally hire an offensive oriented coach especially if they're drafting a 1st round QB, with Boldin, Johnson, and Shipp already being the main weapons on offense.... Someone who can even elevate all of them to the next level....
No way would any of them want a tyrant like Coughlin, I just cant envision that......And no, I don't mean someone with "kid-gloves" like McGinnis does either, but someone who knows how to teach the Xs and Os more effectively and has had proven results with play-calling....

The "proven" debate.....The problem is here, all of us define "proven" differently..... A"proven" coach to me is someone who has been successful at every level, with any kind of team...
Whether it was the team with the best or worst talent, he always gets the most of his players..... An innovator probably in the sense that they aren't always willing to play with the percentages, willing to take risks..... I guess the reason why I bring-up certain names over and over again as candidates is that they have taken younger talent at certain positions and have molded/nutured them into All-Pros.....

If the coach doesnt get the power he desires, then he'll demand more money....

Jimmie Johnson has nothing to prove, why would he return back into the NFL? He would want to return back to a team that is just a year away from the Superbowl......

I rambled long enough for now!