Kingsbury adapting offensive verbiage to match Oklahoma's offense

[BigRedRage]

It wasn’t garbage time. OU had that game within about 10 points with a lot of time left. They just got out to a miserable start, mostly because the OU defense gave up a TD in each of the first 4 possessions.

I guess. being down 21-0 and then 31-10, life becomes easier for the offense that is losing. it is natural, normal and common. they did get within 11 points in the third quarter catching up while down by 21 to start.

and even then, his completion rate was 50%. This game did nothing for my confidence in him playing vs NFL defenses outside of his ability to run against them.

I am optimistic that he will be good for us but his tough games in college (tiny sample size) do not scream that he will be dominant at the next level.

Alabamas QB though? That dude was a stud in that game.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I guess. being down 21-0 and then 31-10, life becomes easier for the offense that is losing. it is natural, normal and common. they did get within 11 points in the third quarter catching up while down by 21 to start.

and even then, his completion rate was 50%. This game did nothing for my confidence in him playing vs NFL defenses.

My point isn’t that it should help in that regard, but it shouldn’t really be used as a knock on him like some suggest. It was by far the best defense he played all year and while he wasn’t great he wasn’t bad either. He ultimately had a pretty decent game against Alabama.

 

[slanidrac16]

I guess. being down 21-0 and then 31-10, life becomes easier for the offense that is losing. it is natural, normal and common. they did get within 11 points in the third quarter catching up while down by 21 to start.

and even then, his completion rate was 50%. This game did nothing for my confidence in him playing vs NFL defenses outside of his ability to run against them.

I am optimistic that he will be good for us but his tough games in college (tiny sample size) do not scream that he will be dominant at the next level.

Alabamas QB though? That dude was a stud in that game.

So if had lead a comeback and beat Alabama all your doubts would be put to rest?

 

[BigRedRage]

My point isn’t that it should help in that regard, but it shouldn’t really be used as a knock on him like some suggest. It was by far the best defense he played all year and while he wasn’t great he wasn’t bad either. He ultimately had a pretty decent game against Alabama.

He did have a decent game, I simply took issue with "he hung up a ton of points on them" when he was WAY behind before it really happened.

 

[BigRedRage]

So if had lead a comeback and beat Alabama all your doubts would be put to rest?

No, I would still have doubts because he only played a single season against mostly marginal talent defensively.

It's funny, everyone puts all this stock into Murray syndrome crap but even someone who wants murray to be good but has reservations is immediately pounced on if my comments do not swing from the balls of the great one.

I was simply commenting on the quoted below:

Murray still dropped a ton of points on Alabama's vaunted defense, even with probably 20 players that will be drafted over the 3-4 years.

Which is a bit of a weighted take considering that he was down 21 before he even did anything and even by the end of the first half, they were still down by 21. It's a lot easier to move the ball when you are down by 3 possessions, I dont care who you are playing.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

He did have a decent game, I simply took issue with "he hung up a ton of points on them" when he was WAY behind before it really happened.

I do think you are overemphasizing them being way behind. That big deficit all happened in like the first quarter and it is uncommon for good college teams to let up that early in a game. I could see an argument for the last OU drive of the game because the game was over at that point, but up until that point it was either too early or too close to expect the defense to let up. I think it was largely a product of OU adjusting to what they saw the first couple possessions.

 

[Krangodnzr]

yeah okay

Did you watch the game? I literally pulled it up and I am watching it right now. You don't play press man when you aren't trying to stop your opponent, which is what the Crimson Tide was still doing when they had a 28 point lead. They weren't playing prevent and were still coming after Murray hard.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I do think you are overemphasizing them being way behind. That big deficit all happened in like the first quarter and it is uncommon for good college teams to let up that early in a game. I could see an argument for the last OU drive of the game because the game was over at that point, but up until that point it was either too early or too close to expect the defense to let up. I think it was largely a product of OU adjusting to what they saw the first couple possessions.

Yep. And Kyler's throwing windows were much, much smaller. Some of his best game tape is in his worst loss, because you 1) get to see how he deals with that situation 2) you see a lot of nifty, tight window throws.

 

[BigRedRage]

I do think you are overemphasizing them being way behind. That big deficit all happened in like the first quarter and it is uncommon for good college teams to let up that early in a game. I could see an argument for the last OU drive of the game because the game was over at that point, but up until that point it was either too early or too close to expect the defense to let up. I think it was largely a product of OU adjusting to what they saw the first couple possessions.

Except they only scored 10 points in the first half. then ten points in the third quarter. It really wasnt a "close game"

 

[BigRedRage]

Did you watch the game? I literally pulled it up and I am watching it right now. You don't play press man when you aren't trying to stop your opponent, which is what the Crimson Tide was still doing when they had a 28 point lead. They weren't playing prevent and were still coming after Murray hard.

the playcall means the coach was not letting up, doesnt mean the player was totally focused.

 

[ARZCardinals]

KK looks very good coaching the QB's in the videos....he wants timing to the T.
They'll be a world better than last year on O.

 

[devilalum]

So now NFL defenses can pop on film of OU and guess the plays?

This doesn’t make any sense. If true all of OKs opponents after the first game could have done the same thing.


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[Krangodnzr]

the playcall means the coach was not letting up, doesnt mean the player was totally focused.

They looked pretty damn focused to me. Nick Saban pulls guys who don't play hard.

 

[Krangodnzr]

This doesn’t make any sense. If true all of OKs opponents after the first game could have done the same thing.


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The Air Raid is predicated on fewer plays, better execution. It's basically running a small number of plays that have a few variations that puts pressure on defenders to be in the right position. Not super complicated.

 

[kerouac9]

The proliferation of Air Raid offenses has also hurt the Big 12 defenses, which seemingly haven't had an answer.

Murray still dropped a ton of points on Alabama's vaunted defense, even with probably 20 players that will be drafted over the 3-4 years.

I mean, TCU doesn't seem to have a hard time fielding a solid defense.

Did you watch the game? I literally pulled it up and I am watching it right now. You don't play press man when you aren't trying to stop your opponent, which is what the Crimson Tide was still doing when they had a 28 point lead. They weren't playing prevent and were still coming after Murray hard.

I think that 'Bama put in a lot of their subs midway through the 3rd quarter, which is why those guys looked good still, but didn't look like a machine made to embarrass ordinary college offenses.

KK looks very good coaching the QB's in the videos....he wants timing to the T.
They'll be a world better than last year on O.

Well, all we have to be is not historically bad, and we'll be better on offense next year.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I think it’s hilarious that people who point out concerns about Murray are automatically haters and compared to Hitler.

Let me ask the Murray lovers, do you see ANY flaws, or potential flaws in his game? Or is he the perfect Qb?Because you sure do attack those that do.

Cue dvontel for an irrelevant Haskins comment.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I think it’s hilarious that people who point out concerns about Murray are automatically haters and compared to Hitler.

Let me ask the Murray lovers, do you see ANY flaws, or potential flaws in his game? Or is he the perfect Qb?Because you sure do attack those that do.

Cue dvontel for an irrelevant Haskins comment.

Talk about hyperbole...

Us "Murray lovers" don't generally have any issue with you pointing out potential flaws, but when you use any perceived flaw as basis to suggest he is going to fail we are going to call you out on it.

Furthermore if you are going to use something that really isn't a flaw to begin with to try and prove he will be a bust than you will likely start being seen as a "hater".

There are clearly some question marks with Murray. Small sample size, played a lot of poor defenses, didn't test at the combine and the question of whether or not his hieght will be a detriment. Those are all question marks for Murray or reasons to be skeptikal of him, but I don't see how any of those are legitimate "flaws". When I think of flaws I think of things like poor mechanics, inaccuracy, poor stats, poor numbers at the combine, injury history, etc.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

isnt that the game they were being blown out and all the points came in garbage time?

BigRedRage, I don't really try to spin that game too much.

139.0 QBR, and about 450 yards of total offense isn't horrible, but it's also impossible to argue that AL's defense, up 28-0, did not let down at least some. Murray definitely could have played better.

I do like to point out that Marquise Brown, the OU WR drafted in the 1st round, was about 40% for that game.

Brown was the one guy who would have put some fear into the AL sideline, and we desperately needed that. I don't think OU wins the game with Brown at 100%, but it might have been closer than than the final 11 point margin.

But Murray looked a little shaky out of the gate, and missed some throws that he normally makes. For Kyler Murray, all-world QB, it was a bad game. There's just no way around that.

But it wasn't bad enough to shake my faith in him. It wasn't a four INT meltdown. If you're saying that, based on that one game, he won't make it in the NFL, okay, great. We'll agree to disagree.

I'd like to ask you to give him credit for two things vs. AL though please BigRedRage. That he didn't turn the ball over, and he didn't quit. He kept trying to lead his team back, and his teammates seemed to respond.

 

[JeffGollin]

Re-read the heading of this thread and then read its final 2 pages.

What you see are a bunch of people "re-negotiating the Civil War.

Two "Also's":

1. I liked Chip Kelly and was disappointed he didn't succeed.

2. Most college coaches (at least the way they're portrayed publicly) are said to be a tight-knit fraternity who keep the phone and text lines buzzing.

 

[BigRedRage]

But it wasn't bad enough to shake my faith in him. It wasn't a four INT meltdown. If you're saying that, based on that one game, he won't make it in the NFL, okay, great. We'll agree to disagree.

I'd like to ask you to give him credit for two things vs. AL though please BigRedRage. That he didn't turn the ball over, and he didn't quit. He kept trying to lead his team back, and his teammates seemed to respond.

again, I only took issue with a statement like "Well, he hung up all those points on Alabama!!!"

I do not think it was overall a bad game for him or that it says anything about how he will do in the nfl. I only take issue with claims that he "hung up mad points on them"

 

[Cardinal]

BigRedRage, I don't really try to spin that game too much.

139.0 QBR, and about 450 yards of total offense isn't horrible, but it's also impossible to argue that AL's defense, up 28-0, did not let down at least some. Murray definitely could have played better.

I do like to point out that Marquise Brown, the OU WR drafted in the 1st round, was about 40% for that game.

Brown was the one guy who would have put some fear into the AL sideline, and we desperately needed that. I don't think OU wins the game with Brown at 100%, but it might have been closer than than the final 11 point margin.

But Murray looked a little shaky out of the gate, and missed some throws that he normally makes. For Kyler Murray, all-world QB, it was a bad game. There's just no way around that.

But it wasn't bad enough to shake my faith in him. It wasn't a four INT meltdown. If you're saying that, based on that one game, he won't make it in the NFL, okay, great. We'll agree to disagree.

I'd like to ask you to give him credit for two things vs. AL though please BigRedRage. That he didn't turn the ball over, and he didn't quit. He kept trying to lead his team back, and his teammates seemed to respond.

I think OU’s offense would’ve fared better if Brown didn’t suit up. He was clearly injured and he held the offense back trying to play through it.

If he was ruled out, they could’ve game planned around his absence. Instead, they had to adjust mid-game after seeing that Brown wasn’t himself. Think he had two big drops before he was pulled.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I think OU’s offense would’ve fared better if Brown didn’t suit up. He was clearly injured and he held the offense back trying to play through it.

If he was ruled out, they could’ve game planned around his absence. Instead, they had to adjust mid-game after seeing that Brown wasn’t himself. Think he had two big drops before he was pulled.

I don't think it would have changed the eventual outcome Cardinal, because I think Tua and company could have scored 80 on OU if they'd really wanted to.

But just between you and I, I think you're correct.

 

[blindseyed]

And so another thread that turns into "Murray is God' and "Murray will never succeed" yay

 

[Crimson Warrior]

again, I only took issue with a statement like "Well, he hung up all those points on Alabama!!!"

I do not think it was overall a bad game for him or that it says anything about how he will do in the nfl. I only take issue with claims that he "hung up mad points on them"

Ah, I see. I'm afraid I would agree with you.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Talk about hyperbole...

Us "Murray lovers" don't generally have any issue with you pointing out potential flaws, but when you use any perceived flaw as basis to suggest he is going to fail we are going to call you out on it.

Furthermore if you are going to use something that really isn't a flaw to begin with to try and prove he will be a bust than you will likely start being seen as a "hater".

There are clearly some question marks with Murray. Small sample size, played a lot of poor defenses, didn't test at the combine and the question of whether or not his hieght will be a detriment. Those are all question marks for Murray or reasons to be skeptikal of him, but I don't see how any of those are legitimate "flaws". When I think of flaws I think of things like poor mechanics, inaccuracy, poor stats, poor numbers at the combine, injury history, etc.

Well, I’ve never said that Murray will be a failure. I’ve got serious questions about him being successful though.

Those concerns are size, ability to read NFL defenses, motivation, ability to process information, and relying on athletic ability.

My concern are more with Kingsbury than Murray. He’s proven to be a losing coach after replacing a coach at the same school who never had a losing record in 10 years prior to KK taking over.