Knicks Suns post mortem thread

[Phrazbit]

JR Smith is scum. Not "ha ha he beat us" scum, but an actual disgusting human being. He not only should have been ejected from the game for an absurdly dangerous foul, but he should have been sent to prison years ago.

That is all.

 

[95pro]

That was a douche move on Dragic for sure. Oh, did any of you see earlier in the first half where he took a swipe at someone's face, I don't recall the details but was thinking this guy is still a dick.
I ain't mad at him for making a good shot though.

 

[Absolute Zero]

JR Smith is scum. Not "ha ha he beat us" scum, but an actual disgusting human being. He not only should have been ejected from the game for an absurdly dangerous foul, but he should have been sent to prison years ago.

That is all.

Dude, you really need some serious counseling.

 

[Errntknght]

This is the closest thing to a game thread... an all time low in interest level. Or did everyone skip watching, guessing that the Knicks, minus Anthony and Felton, would beat us on our floor on the second night of a back-to-back?

I haven't watched the game yet but looking at the box score I can't help but think that Gentry blew this one - PJ only played 11 minutes and Kidd beat us almost single handed. Or maybe we should look on the bright side... he might be doing a subtle tank job.

 

[Phrazbit]

Dude, you really need some serious counseling.

I am not saying he should be in prison because he is a dirty player. He should be in prison because he killed someone. After racking up countless speeding tickets he got a passenger killed by blowing through a stop sign. If any average citizen got someone killed after racking up a ton of traffic violations they would get charged with vehicular man-slaughter and spend 10-15 years in prison. Smith gets a couple weeks in jail and community service. And did he learn his lesson? Nope. Since then he has had his license suspended 3 times for various violations.

Scum.

 

[AfroSuns]

Dude, you really need some serious counseling.

I am with with Phrazbit on this, that JR foul was intentional. The result may have been worse than he intend, but he was trying to dislodge Dragic enough for him to miss. It was a poopy move.

I haven't watched the game yet but looking at the box score I can't help but think that Gentry blew this one - PJ only played 11 minutes and Kidd beat us almost single handed.

Maybe you should watch the game.
It'd be stupid for any coach or player to agree to tanking unless their contract is guaranteed. Why would they do that; Intentionally destroy their own resume in an effort to assist the organization to replace them?

Kid was definitely the surprise of the night and he was hitting his shot pretty easy, but he is not the reason the Suns lost, you can blame the turnovers and crappy on offense in the second quarter for that. Dudley was the only one that played well.
Having to go with Telfair for the remainder of the game after Dragic's fall didnt really bode well for them down the stretch. He was oversized on defense irrespective of who he is guarding and his teammates trying to help out opened up other players.

The Suns are just a bunch of role players and i am not surprised we lost.

 

[Phrazbit]

That was a douche move on Dragic for sure. Oh, did any of you see earlier in the first half where he took a swipe at someone's face, I don't recall the details but was thinking this guy is still a dick.
I ain't mad at him for making a good shot though.

Yeah, it was Dudley who he went after earlier. The foul on Dragic was about as dangerous as they come, and not surprisingly it knocked Goran out of the game. He should have been tossed for it. Shoulder checking a guy in mid air and not even putting his hands up to go for the ball. Its a joke that he was allowed to stay in the game.

 

[sunsfan88]

This is the closest thing to a game thread... an all time low in interest level. Or did everyone skip watching, guessing that the Knicks, minus Anthony and Felton, would beat us on our floor on the second night of a back-to-back?

I haven't watched the game yet but looking at the box score I can't help but think that Gentry blew this one - PJ only played 11 minutes and Kidd beat us almost single handed. Or maybe we should look on the bright side... he might be doing a subtle tank job.

There's no doubt that Gentry is an absolute joke of a HC. He kept Brown who was playing awful in the game instead of Tucker.

I know the tendencies of the Suns players better than Gentry. If Beasley and Brown don't start hitting shots and playing well in the 1st QTR/early 2nd QTR then they won't catch fire later. Their not those kind of players who can get off a shooting slump within the game.

And with the game tied, Gentry's play for us to win the game was for Telfair to dribble the ball around and then end up turning it over. It was so bad my 6 year old brother who knows nothing about basketball started laughing.

Dudley was hot and instead of letting Dudley come off a screen to attempt a 3 or something, he elected to go with Telfair dribbling it around.

I can't wait til he's gone. Anyone else can do just about the job he's doing, maybe even better.

 

[Phrazbit]

There's no doubt that Gentry is an absolute joke of a HC. He kept Brown who was playing awful in the game instead of Tucker.

I know the tendencies of the Suns players better than Gentry. If Beasley and Brown don't start hitting shots and playing well in the 1st QTR/early 2nd QTR then they won't catch fire later. Their not those kind of players who can get off a shooting slump within the game.

And with the game tied, Gentry's play for us to win the game was for Telfair to dribble the ball around and then end up turning it over. It was so bad my 6 year old brother who knows nothing about basketball started laughing.

Dudley was hot and instead of letting Dudley come off a screen to attempt a 3 or something, he elected to go with Telfair dribbling it around.

I can't wait til he's gone. Anyone else can do just about the job he's doing, maybe even better.

The play was supposed to go to Dudley coming off a Gortat screen, but Telfair screwed it up... but if your dumb enough to think the drawn up play was for Telfair to turn the ball over then... whatever.

 

[Absolute Zero]

I am not saying he should be in prison because he is a dirty player. He should be in prison because he killed someone. After racking up countless speeding tickets he got a passenger killed by blowing through a stop sign. If any average citizen got someone killed after racking up a ton of traffic violations they would get charged with vehicular man-slaughter and spend 10-15 years in prison. Smith gets a couple weeks in jail and community service. And did he learn his lesson? Nope. Since then he has had his license suspended 3 times for various violations.

Scum.

You are big on leveling devastating personal attacks on players, not just this one. I, for one, come to this board to read about basketball, not your insults against the players. I really wonder what is going on inside of you that finds it necessary to attack these guys out of the blue.

 

[Phrazbit]

You are big on leveling devastating personal attacks on players, not just this one. I, for one, come to this board to read about basketball, not your insults against the players. I really wonder what is going on inside of you that finds it necessary to attack these guys out of the blue.

lol, the guy injured our best player... and in recent history has literally killed someone. If that person is above reproach in your eyes then... wonderful. But I feel differently.

Rot in hell JR Smith.

 

[Mainstreet]

This is the closest thing to a game thread... an all time low in interest level. Or did everyone skip watching, guessing that the Knicks, minus Anthony and Felton, would beat us on our floor on the second night of a back-to-back?

This is exactly what I thought... the Suns would lay down and roll ever even against the depleted Knicks. I did force myself to watch part of the game. There was only one player out there giving his all and that was Jared Dudley. The effort from the rest of the team was not there.

Also what kind of layup attempt was that by Dragic when Smith got called for the technical? I would not have called Smith for a foul, much less a flagrant foul. Sure Smith slightly brushed Dragic with his hand down by his side, but it was Dragic's fault for being off balance. It looked liked Dragic was sitting down in mid-air before he reached the rim... I can't believe it. I can't ever remember a player doing such a sitting motion while going for a breakaway layup. This is why Dragic took such a tumble, because he was off balance.

I must admit I am very disgruntled by the Suns lack of effort of late. They deserved to lose last night. Perhaps the team has quit on Gentry. It is looking more and more like it from my perspective. One thing I just don't get, the players are collecting handsome salaries not to play hard. Watching Dudley giving it his all amid apathy by the other players just doesn't cut it.

 

[AfroSuns]

Also what kind of layup attempt was that by Dragic when Smith got called for the technical? I would not have called Smith for a foul, much less a flagrant foul. Sure Smith slightly brushed Dragic with his hand down by his side, but it was Dragic's fault for being off balance. It looked liked Dragic was sitting down in mid-air before he reached the rim... I can't believe it. I can't ever remember a player doing such a sitting motion while going for a breakaway layup. This is why Dragic took such a tumble, because he was off balance.
.

Hm?? You made it sound like Dragic would have fell on his side had JR not brushed him. Even if JR's hand were tied to his side don't mean it wasn't intentional.

 

[Superbone]

Also what kind of layup attempt was that by Dragic when Smith got called for the technical? I would not have called Smith for a foul, much less a flagrant foul. Sure Smith slightly brushed Dragic with his hand down by his side, but it was Dragic's fault for being off balance. It looked liked Dragic was sitting down in mid-air before he reached the rim... I can't believe it. I can't ever remember a player doing such a sitting motion while going for a breakaway layup. This is why Dragic took such a tumble, because he was off balance.

What the heck are you talking about?! Smith knocked Dragic off-balance.

 

[Mainstreet]

Hm?? You made it sound like Dragic would have fell on his side had JR not brushed him. Even if JR's hand were tied to his side don't mean it wasn't intentional.

I don't know how Dragic would have come down if Smith had not brushed him. Dragic certainly did not have his legs underneath him in a normal position when he was going to the rim. It's not like Smith came underneath him and took his legs out. From my perspective, it looked like Dragic was almost sitting down in mid-air (almost like in a chair). His rear was behind his knees in an almost level plane. Why Dragic would float to the rim in this awkward position is hard for me to understand when the slightest contact would take him down hard. I did not consider the slight brush by Smith even worthy of a foul if Dragic had not crashed to the floor because he was off balance.

 

[Mainstreet]

What the heck are you talking about?! Smith knocked Dragic off-balance.

A butterfly could have knocked Dragic off balance the way he had his body positioned floating to the rim.

 

[elindholm]

Smith bumped Dragic enough for it to be a foul, but Dragic was going very fast and was out of control. As Eddie Johnson was saying, the foul didn't look intentional, but you can't be sure what's going on in a player's mind, and Smith certainly had surer ways of avoiding contact if his main concern had been to avoid a collision.

 

[Superbone]

A butterfly could have knocked Dragic off balance the way he had his body positioned floating to the rim.

That's not far from the truth for anybody. If you play basketball, you know that once you're airborne, the slightest push can knock you off-kilter.

 

[Mainstreet]

That's not far from the truth for anybody. If you play basketball, you know that once you're airborne, the slightest push can knock you off-kilter.

This is true.

However, I guess what bothered me about Dragic is that he chose to put his body in that position for no apparent reason. Maybe he did not know Smith was behind him or would challenge, but this would be purely a guess on my part.

 

[Phrazbit]

Smith put a shoulder into Dragic side as Dragic was in mid air, and you see a lot of guys go in the way Dragic did when they are on their own for a layup. And IMO it was absolutely intentional by Smith. The way he lowers his left arm shows he knew exactly where Dragic was and if he was trying to avoid contact he turned his upper body the exact opposite way the he should have to do so. It was a very dangerous bush-league move. Just look at the angle Smith took, he was in no position to make a play on the ball, if that was him attempting to avoid contact then he is very uncoordinated for an NBA athlete.

 

[Errntknght]

I haven't gotten to Dragic play yet, but in the second quarter JR gave Duds a vicious headshot that was clearly not a play on ball - Dudley was extending it out in front going for a layup. A very solid Flagrant 1 if the refs had been paying attention. Jared rolled with the punch and didn't react when he got up so the announcers didn't catch it and give it a replay. (That is to say EJ didn't catch it, the other dipstick doesn't catch anything.)

Overall the refs are giving the Knicks the homecourt advantage - well, not the homecourt advantage they get in MSG. They are getting away with a hipcheck on almost every pick - the Suns doing some of those too, sans calls, I must admit. Its becoming almost the league standard pick, sad to say.

Most of the Suns problems are their own doing. Lots of awful passes, Duds with two of them even though he's generally playing very well. Some of the typical poor shot selection by Brown - if he were JR Smith they would still go in. Gentry has Scola guarding Copeland whose getting hot from behind the arc, thanks to Alvin.

I have to say that the refs have been better this year about letting the teams play without letting things get out of hand. Thats always been a killer for the Suns in the past but they're standing up to it pretty well this year. This game is not a particularly good example, however.

 

[Mainstreet]

In an article written by Bob Young at azcentral dated 12-27-12, here is the Suns take on the foul committed by Smith against Dragic.

One thing Dragic and Gentry agreed on is that Smith wasn’t intentionally trying to undercut Dragic. Smith was charged with a flagrant foul, penalty 1 on the play.

“I don’t think it was a dirty play at all,” Gentry said.

Dragic watched a replay on video and reached the same conclusion.

“I saw it,” he said. “I mean, it was not intentional. I think he bumped me with his shoulder in my leg, and I just (lost) control and fall awkwardly.

“In the end, it could be worse. I could hit my head on the floor or something like that. It’s OK now.”

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/sun...gic-out-vs-indiana-pacers.html?nclick_check=1

 

[AfroSuns]

^^^^
Are they supposed to say otherwise when there is no clear proof? It is fairly possible that what they are telling the press is not what they think.

 

[95pro]

i have no doubt that was indeed intentional. smith just keeps running and running knowing that he bump dragic, just look at his foot steps as he nears dragic. i mean why keep running if you not going to put your hands up and make a play on the ball.

of course they are saying what they should be saying. anything else is blasphemy by the nba bible and subject to fines.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

^^^^
Are they supposed to say otherwise when there is no clear proof? It is fairly possible that what they are telling the press is not what they think.

Just because it was pretty well disguised doesn't mean it wasn't intentional. When you watch the video above you pretty clearly see him lean his shoulder into Dragic rather than just simply running by him or turning the other direction away from Dragic.

P.S.: I'm not disagreeing with your post, but to some of the others saying it wasn't intentional.