Let’s Talk About Lamb
- Thread starter Harry
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I think we only trade down if guaranteed one of Lamb, Jeudy, or Ruggs. They will be gone by #15. Trading back a few spots won't return much. Makes more sense to stay put and choose between those three WRs. My guess is it will be Lamb at #8.
Solar7
Go Suns
Who'd have expected it? Haha.
TJ
Frank Kaminsky is my Hero.
Depends on if you think this team needs another WR1 alongside Hopkins or if you are ok with going down a notch or two in talent for a WR2 and trusting that Murray is good enough to make his WRs better and not worse.
If we are to believe that Murray can become a Top-5, MVP caliber QB, we shouldn't worry so much about surrounding him with so many receivers.
Solar7
Go Suns
More truth bombs.
Someone mentioned Aaron Rodgers' WRs either here or in another thread, and the fact of the matter is, guys like Rodgers, Brees, and Mahomes make the players around them just that much better. It's not like these guys are packed with 1st round picks at WR or TE. That's why you take a QB #1 overall - to raise the production of everyone else.
CardsSunsDbacks
Not So Skeptical
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Just because a QB is good enough to make his receivers better doesn't mean you shouldn't surround him with quality receivers. If Murray is capable of making a #3 guy look like a #2 than imagine what he could do with 2 number ones. Even Winston put up huge numbers with with his 2 #1 receivers last year. Imagine what that offense would have been with an actual top flight QB.
Tom Brady is actually a good example here. So for most of his career he has lead some good offenses with not so great WRs, but the one time the man had a two top end receivers (Moss and Welker) they had the best offense in the NFL and went undefeated all the way to the SB.
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TJ
Frank Kaminsky is my Hero.
Not really. Wes Welker never got above 700 yards with a QB not named Brady or Peyton Manning. And the Patriots were winning championships with coaching, talent and balance on both sides of the ball, not high octane offenses with garbage defense.
Again, are you willing to sacrifice the opportunity to bolster your 32nd ranked defense or beef up a mediocre offensive line, to add more high priced players into the WR room? IDC how good our offense is or could be. We're not winning more than six games next season with the lack of depth and talent on the other side of the ball.
Naturally, our offense is going to be better because of Hopkins and another year of Murray and Kliff. We're simply not going to contend for anything with the defensive talent at our disposal.
CardsSunsDbacks
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My point was the difference having two great WRs made on Brady and his offense. When all 3 were healthy together that was by far the best offense Brady was a part of and probably his best team despite losing in the SB. Even great QBs can be helped by having more than 1 great receiver and you can call Welker whatever you want, but less than great receivers don't have season with a 120+ catches and 1350+ yards in just 14 games, regardless who their QB is.
GatorAZ
feed hopkins
Hopkins prior to last season was arguably the best WR in the league. When was the last time a sub-200lb receiver without elite speed was arguably the top WR? Man Lamb is nice but y’all crazy.
CardsSunsDbacks
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Dude can put on a few pounds, but he is ultimately slightly taller and slightly faster than Hopkins. Both excel at catching contested passes, both have exceptional hands and both are very good route runners. He may not end up as good as DHop (too early to say for sure), but it won't be because of his physical tools if he isn't.
GatorAZ
feed hopkins
I think he put on a few pounds for the combine and it affected his times. I thought he looked around 190 last year and was surprised he measured at 198. That’s still 15+ lbs lighter than Hopkins weighed at the combine. And we can’t be sure about skill sets projecting to the next level when the production has come against really bad competition. I’ve always thought Lamb is a safe pick but not a high ceiling.
BigRedArk
ASFN Lifer
Cee Dee Lamb was significantly stronger in 2019 than he was in 2018. Harry already mentioned that but it's worth repeating. That increases the likelihood that he is motivated and wants it.
Harry also noted his YAC proclivity. Also worth repeating.
He's also an excellent Punt Returner and Kick Off Returner.
Harry also noted his YAC proclivity. Also worth repeating.
He's also an excellent Punt Returner and Kick Off Returner.
I think Samuel, Jones or Williams would be the best fits who would not have an excessive cost and would be field stretchers. Guys like Golladay, Schuster, Godwin, and Hilton would not be affordable unless Fitz hangs them up then you have $11 million to play with and let's face it, at that point any of those 4 would be better than Fitz who is no more than a possession receiver now. Could you imagine having Hopkins and Golladay on the field at the same time.
mjb21aztd
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Yea galloday is dope my bro had him on our lg money fantasy last yr puts up good numbers
Will be interesting to see what happens after fitz goes
The thing I hate most about highlight reels is when they show a wr 10 yards behind the closest guy.
The thing I liked about Lamb is his highlight reel showed numerous catches with great coverage both downfield but especially outside the numbers.
As things stand right now, Nuk is going to attract the #1 corner and double coverage. Somebody on this team is going to have to step up and take advantage of this. Can it be Kirk? Fitz will but it won’t be downfield as much.
Is that receiver currently on this team ? That’s the real question. If not we need to get one. Might not be Lamb in the first round but how about a big target like Claypool? Mims will be gone.
The thing I liked about Lamb is his highlight reel showed numerous catches with great coverage both downfield but especially outside the numbers.
As things stand right now, Nuk is going to attract the #1 corner and double coverage. Somebody on this team is going to have to step up and take advantage of this. Can it be Kirk? Fitz will but it won’t be downfield as much.
Is that receiver currently on this team ? That’s the real question. If not we need to get one. Might not be Lamb in the first round but how about a big target like Claypool? Mims will be gone.
TheCardFan
Things have changed.
2020 NFL DRAFT WR RANKINGS
https://www.rotoworld.com/article/rankings/2020-nfl-draft-wr-rankings
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https://www.rotoworld.com/article/rankings/2020-nfl-draft-wr-rankings
People forget Murray spreads the ball around, he doesnt just lock onto a WR, having your 3rd or 4th CB on Lamb, Kirk, Fitz Murray will eat them alive also, forcing the D Into Nickles and Dimes, Lbs couldnt cover Lamb and Kirk, which also takes a way up front pressure, by reducing the number of Dline and Lbers, up front forcing more DBs into the field. Add that with Murrays wheels and pocket presence and escape skills, having such dangerous wide outs will force defenses from bringing the house or paying dearly for it when they do.
One thing we will have to remember from last year. This offense will be even better between the 20 yard lines.
The big improvement will be Hopkins, Fitz and Arnold in the the red zone.
I think KK learned that last year as the season progressed. When we are inside the 10 yard line 4 wr sets just floods the area with less room to throw the ball.
The big improvement will be Hopkins, Fitz and Arnold in the the red zone.
I think KK learned that last year as the season progressed. When we are inside the 10 yard line 4 wr sets just floods the area with less room to throw the ball.
TJ
Frank Kaminsky is my Hero.
Conversely, can our 3rd and 4th CBs cover any WR? Do we have a LB who could successfully cover TEs? What about a D-Lineman who could plug the hole and be a run stopper?
No one can say "yes" to any of those questions with any degree of confidence.
We now have an elite WR, and the only real argument about WR today is who's the 4th best, and we drafted three of them last season. If you trust Kliff's ability to coach and Murray's ability to throw the football, you should trust that the team doesn't need load the WR room while depriving the obvious weaknesses on the team.
TJ
Frank Kaminsky is my Hero.
Full disclosure: I think Dan Arnold is going to have a bigger impact on this offense than people think. I'm his biggest fan.
TJ: Dan Arnold::K9:Jim Dray
Jetstream Green
Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Provided Peterson plays well enough into his thirties and the team has not intention of trading him, Okudah still makes a lot of sense. Provided Larry Legend has a great year for his age and enjoys his current situation inching towards some of Rice's hallmark records and decides to come back, a Lamb or Jeudy still makes sense... the draft is about putting pieces in place which then reach maturation when your other players are no longer there
Too logical! I always looked at the draft for the year after. Whatever you get out of the 2020 draft in 2020 is a bonus. What is this pick going to add to your team in 2 years?
When you take this approach nobody should really be upset no matter who we select. There is not one player in this draft that is going to put a team in the Super Bowl. That is reserved for superstar free agents on teams that are 1 or 2 players away.
Solar7
Go Suns
With your logic, you shouldn't want a WR then, because you should be focused on what our 3 WRs drafted last year are going to contribute as 2nd year players.
Campbell was signed for TE coverage, Phillip's to help stuff the run. The Cards run the spread they are not facing 4 Wrs consistently, your argument makes no sense, they dont need 3 or 4 cbs, but the Cards opponents will. Cards run half their plays with 4 Wrs, Andy Isabella wasnt physical enough, Keesean stayed inactive as the season ended and Butler would have been cut in camp if not placed on IR. It shows Keim cant draft, take the homerun easy choice Lamb.
- They ran 376 plays with three receivers on the field. They ran 326 with four receivers.
- Their most common personnel was “11” personnel, with one back, one tight end and three receivers. They ran 346 plays that way.
- They ran “10” personnel 317 times, their next most common personnel grouping on offense. The other nine plays with four wideouts were with no running back and a tight end with the four receivers.
