Let's Take a Closer Look at the Steelers D

[LukesDad88]

Really. Did Dick Labeau assume room temperature over night?

You think Lebeau's running the same schemes today, with different personnel, as he was running in 05? Great. I hope your coaches think the same thing.

 

[SteelCityMom]

Thank you for bringing this up. Let me ask you this Steeler fans? If you had the EXACT same team and played in a dome would you have the same defensive rankings? Are you going to tell me cold weather and the worst turf in the NFL don't effect offensive peformances?

You won't have that advantage Sunday.

We got extremely lucky with how the playoffs played out because we are the opposite of you. We are not built for cold weather.

Have fun chasing us on the fast track.

IMO (though it may be biased) yes I do think they would have still played extremely well. The Steelers lost 2 home games and 2 away games, so they can play as well as they do on the road as they do at home.

And on the statement about them playing in inclement weather I'll say this again, they only played 5 games in bad weather (3 at home 2 away games) and won all of them. That means they played 11 games in good weather and won 7 of them. They lost 4 of them, but again, 2 of those games were at home. Their only 2 road losses came from the Eagles (week 3) and the Titans in week 16 (after they had the division wrapped up).

 

[Arizona's Finest]

You think Lebeau's running the same schemes today, with different personnel, as he was running in 05? Great. I hope your coaches think the same thing.

Scheme wise you are going to have much of the same weaknesses and strengths. Plus alot of the keyplayers (Farrior, Hampton, Polamlu) are still playing.

We all know comparing things year to year is an inexact science but that doesn't mean there are not relative things you can take away.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

IMO (though it may be biased) yes I do think they would have still played extremely well. The Steelers lost 2 home games and 2 away games, so they can play as well as they do on the road as they do at home.

And on the statement about them playing in inclement weather I'll say this again, they only played 5 games in bad weather (3 at home 2 away games) and won all of them. That means they played 11 games in good weather and won 7 of them. They lost 4 of them, but again, 2 of those games were at home. Their only 2 road losses came from the Eagles (week 3) and the Titans in week 16 (after they had the division wrapped up).

Basically every game the Steelers played from November on is what I classify as tough weather that favors the defense. It wasn't snowing in Philly on Thanksgiving night but cold weather is going to effect a team thats not used to it and make them uncomfortable. That can be enough to decide the game.

I am not saying its the only reason you guys are ranked #1. Not at all. Every team has to play in different conditions and over a 16 game schedule it evens out.

But your kidding yourself if you don't think the cold weather hasn't favored the way your team is built the last couple months.

Again - its warm weather in Tampa. I like our chances. And its not even our offense running wild that is going to be the difference. Its that I think our stellar offense will score more points on your stellar defense then your mediocre offense on our resurgent (last 4 games) defense.

I honestly belive that. If we lose its because of a defensive turnover TD or ST's. But you can't really predict those things.

Your not going up against Joe Flacco (or even Phil Rivers) in the cold this week. Its Kurt Warner in warm weather. BIG difference.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Without even going through the season (since what happened during the regular season only applies to the Steelers, and not the Cardinals), let's take a look at who your passing juggernaut faced in these miraculous playoffs.

Atlanta Pass Defense Ranking of #21. Well below average.
Carolina Pass Defense #16. Average.

Philadelphia was the only team with a good pass defense (#3), but statistically, there was still a 25 YPG difference from them to the Steelers. Statistically, they were closer to the #15 Bengals than they were to the #1 Steeler Defense. Toss in their coach's history of choking in the big game, and your offense doesn't seem nearly as intimidating does it?

Other then one year where our HC (and the refs) pulled your asses out of the fire (Neither Ben or the Defense played well in SB 05) you guys have been just as big of chokers as the Eagles. The Atlanta Braves of the NFL if you will.

Color me unimpressed in your big game history.

 

[LukesDad88]

Not that warm. Gametime temperature expected to be in the mid to high forties. Winds at 10MPH, Gusts up to 20. The wind conditions are closer to what Pittsburgh experiences on a weekly basis than what the Cards experience.

 

[SteelCityMom]

Basically every game the Steelers played from November on is what I classify as tough weather that favors the defense. It wasn't snowing in Philly on Thanksgiving night but cold weather is going to effect a team thats not used to it and make them uncomfortable. That can be enough to decide the game.

I am not saying its the only reason you guys are ranked #1. Not at all. Every team has to play in different conditions and over a 16 game schedule it evens out.

But your kidding yourself if you don't think the cold weather hasn't favored the way your team is built the last couple months.

Again - its warm weather in Tampa. I like our chances. And its not even our offense running wild that is going to be the difference. Its that I think our stellar offense will score more points on your stellar defense then your mediocre offense on our resurgent (last 4 games) defense.

I honestly belive that. If we lose its because of a defensive turnover TD or ST's. But you can't really predict those things.

Your not going up against Joe Flacco (or even Phil Rivers) in the cold this week. Its Kurt Warner in warm weather. BIG difference.

I can agree with you on those points, I know (and the team knows) it's not Flacco or Rivers they are going up against, and that will make a difference. I'm excited to see how they match up honestly.

Underestimating our offense is a bad thing though, while the defense has had to win games in bad weather, our offense has had to play in that same weather as well and win those games (sometimes in close finishes). The Steelers offense has been playing better in the playoffs than they have for almost any game this year, in the cold. They will have the same advantage of warm weather and fast turf as the Cardinals do.

Their offensive statistics were poor for the regular season, but keep in mind they played 5 games without Parker (and a couple where he was not 100%), Mendenhall put on IR in week 4, TE Heath Miller out for a few games, an OL that only had one starter on it from the previous year, and playing half of their season against top ranked defenses. They had to overcome a crapload of adversity this year and while the defense did it's part in keeping games close enough for the offense to pull off wins, they are playing at a different level right now. The Steelers offense against the Cards D will be a truly interesting matchup as well, though it is being overlooked by the media far too much.

 

[LukesDad88]

Other then one year where our HC (and the refs) pulled your asses out of the fire (Neither Ben or the Defense played well in SB 05) you guys have been just as big of chokers as the Eagles. The Atlanta Braves of the NFL if you will.

Color me unimpressed in your big game history.

Your HC? Your HC was as responsible for any offensive bad play in that game as any other person. And the refs? You can debate the TD. Some felt it crossed, others thought it didn't. Whatever. The crackback block called on Hasselback on the INT? It is in the rulebook. Stupid rule, if you ask me, but it is there. We got called for it earlier that season. Holding call? It was there. Egregious? No. However, the lineman had been warned earlier that he was walking a narrow line, and the next time he pushed it, they would call it.

As far as choking in the AFCCG we're 3-3 over the last six. Not as good as we'd like, but choking? That's alot better than 1-4. Plus, the news that's come out about the Patriots over the last two years has to make you look at that record in a new light.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

I can agree with you on those points, I know (and the team knows) it's not Flacco or Rivers they are going up against, and that will make a difference. I'm excited to see how they match up honestly.

Underestimating our offense is a bad thing though, while the defense has had to win games in bad weather, our offense has had to play in that same weather as well and win those games (sometimes in close finishes). The Steelers offense has been playing better in the playoffs than they have for almost any game this year, in the cold. They will have the same advantage of warm weather and fast turf as the Cardinals do.

Their offensive statistics were poor for the regular season, but keep in mind they played 5 games without Parker (and a couple where he was not 100%), Mendenhall put on IR in week 4, TE Heath Miller out for a few games, an OL that only had one starter on it from the previous year, and playing half of their season against top ranked defenses. They had to overcome a crapload of adversity this year and while the defense did it's part in keeping games close enough for the offense to pull off wins, they are playing at a different level right now. The Steelers offense against the Cards D will be a truly interesting matchup as well, though it is being overlooked by the media far too much.

That's fair. You want to know how I really see it?

What it comes down to is the Quarterback knowing their limitations. I feel Kurt (and he has struggled with this in previous seasons) knows what he can and can't do. And he is smart enough to play to his strengths. I think Rothelesberger thinks he can do EVERYTHING and some time tries to hard and forces things. I really don't think he has changed all that much over the last two season from my vantage point and can be forced into mistakes.

And our defense has shown a propensity to force teams (and QB's) into mistakes with our pressure and discguised coverages.

Among other things thats what I think will be the difference.

 

[LukesDad88]

This whole thing about the weather helps defenses thing goes both ways. If it helps defenses, then it hurts offense, and erego our offense is more potent than people suspect.

Again, the wind conditions during the SB are going to be much closer to what Ben's used to than what Kurt (Please close the dome, even though there's a 3MPH wind and it's 70 degrees) Warner is used to.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Your HC? Your HC was as responsible for any offensive bad play in that game as any other person. And the refs? You can debate the TD. Some felt it crossed, others thought it didn't. Whatever. The crackback block called on Hasselback on the INT? It is in the rulebook. Stupid rule, if you ask me, but it is there. We got called for it earlier that season. Holding call? It was there. Egregious? No. However, the lineman had been warned earlier that he was walking a narrow line, and the next time he pushed it, they would call it.

As far as choking in the AFCCG we're 3-3 over the last six. Not as good as we'd like, but choking? That's alot better than 1-4. Plus, the news that's come out about the Patriots over the last two years has to make you look at that record in a new light.

I don't agree with the penalty assessment. Hasselbeck tackled the defender plain and simple. That was as ridiculous a call as you'll ever see. Also there was a phantom holding call the play before thatmoved it from the 2 to the 12 and with as good as running as Seattle was I think they would have punched that in for a 17 -14 lead. Of course thats all conjecture but the game and penalties aren't played in a vacum.

But I could care less about any of that. I am not a Seahawk fan and that was just my unbias perspective on the game.

However I must take exception to the comment about Wisenhunt. Are you freaking kidding me? Your (his) QB was throwing up one of the ALL TIME stink bombs in the Super Bowl and he deftly called the pass for Randle El to give them that lead that eventually won the game. Everyone credits that offensive game plan for leading to Wiz becoming a HC and that SB win - except you I guess.

Not to mention Grimm had that oline run blocking at a level that they heven't show an ability to since then. That Willie Parker 75 yard run and Randle El pas were ALL you guys did that game. Face it - you got saved by the offensive staff and the refs. I am not the bias one on that.

 

[SteelCityMom]

I don't agree with the penalty assessment. Hasselbeck tackled the defender plain and simple. That was as ridiculous a call as you'll ever see. Also there was a phantom holding call the play before thatmoved it from the 2 to the 12 and with as good as running as Seattle was I think they would have punched that in for a 17 -14 lead. Of course thats all conjecture but the game and penalties aren't played in a vacum.

But I could care less about any of that. I am not a Seahawk fan and that was just my unbias perspective on the game.

However I must take exception to the comment about Wisenhunt. Are you freaking kidding me? Your (his) QB was throwing up one of the ALL TIME stink bombs in the Super Bowl and he deftly called the pass for Randle El to give them that lead that eventually won the game. Everyone credits that offensive game plan for leading to Wiz becoming a HC and that SB win - except you I guess.

Not to mention Grimm had that oline run blocking at a level that they heven't show an ability to since then. That Willie Parker 75 yard run and Randle El pas were ALL you guys did that game. Face it - you got saved by the offensive staff and the refs. I am not the bias one on that.

Yes I'll agree that the offense played poorly for the better part of the game, but they made big plays when they needed to and in the end that was all that mattered. Ravens did the same thing to the Titans in the playoffs this year.

I have very little sympathy for any team or fans crying ref after the Steelers/Chargers game in week 11 (the one that ended in the 11-10 score). After having a difference of 13 penalties for 115 yards for the Steelers to 2 penalties for 5 yards for the Chargers (the second penalty actually negating a last second takeaway and TD by Troy, said to be a mistake immediately after the game) and the Steelers STILL finding a way to win that game leaves me with a good deal of indifference over other teams and their fans crying over a couple supposed blown or ticky tacky calls. That game was the definition of a travesty in refereeing and the Steelers managed to overcome that and win the game.

I've heard all the arguments about SB XL and while I agree that the PI call and the holding call were somewhat ticky tacky, Seattle had plenty of chances to come back from those calls, but just didn't.

 

[SteelCityMom]

That's fair. You want to know how I really see it?

What it comes down to is the Quarterback knowing their limitations. I feel Kurt (and he has struggled with this in previous seasons) knows what he can and can't do. And he is smart enough to play to his strengths. I think Rothelesberger thinks he can do EVERYTHING and some time tries to hard and forces things. I really don't think he has changed all that much over the last two season from my vantage point and can be forced into mistakes.

And our defense has shown a propensity to force teams (and QB's) into mistakes with our pressure and discguised coverages.

Among other things thats what I think will be the difference.

This is true about Ben and Kurt, though I don't feel that the last two seasons Ben has struggled with making bad decisions. At times during this season, yes he has, but he's had to practically carry the offense by himself this entire year. There was no run game to speak of and the OL couldn't block their grandmothers for most of the season, I'm not surprised he had a few horrible games.

Last year though, there's no way you could say that he was easily forced into bad decisions. That season showed what he could accomplish with an OL that could properly run block making it easy to set up the PA pass. He had amazing stats last year.

Ben's faced a lot of good defenses this year, gotten a lot of different looks and has been playing very focused the past couple of games. Of course this year has made me nervous and bite my nails every time he drops back to pass, but he's redeemed himself a lot in the playoffs as far as I'm concerned.

Honestly I think the bigger surprise of the game will be the Cards D vs. the Steelers O. Both have struggled throughout the regular season, but are playing their best ball now in the playoffs. Everyone is selling one or the other short and just going on to focus on the juggernauts that are the Cards O and the Steelers D.

 

[LukesDad88]

Oops, I forgot. It wasn't Ben that converted a 3rd & 28 thhat led to a score.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Really? Playing the top 2 defenses in the league twice a year has nothing to do with their offensive stats?.

No, i think we could get 11 guys from here and stop those two offenses this past year. Nobody is saying the steelers don't have a good defense. Personally, i think the Ravens defense is better but Pittsburgh is the better overall team. To me, the Cards would have had an easier time with Baltimore because their offense is so bad and,like i said in an earlier post, the Cardinals will put up 20+ against anyone. The steelers also have the ability to put up points which is something the Ravens would struggle with, even against us same 11 .

 

[Duckjake]

Any defense that has as many veteran players as the Steelers will be tough.

The weather is a big factor as I've pointed out before the Cards are 8-2 at home the last 2 years against "eastern" teams and 1 and forever on the road. The NFC West Champ has never lost a home playoff game to an eastern or bad weather team but has had little success on the road with the Cards win in Carolina the only victory.

As for our opponents, the Cards non-division opponents were 98-61-1 which more than balances out the 6 division games. Counting the playoffs the record goes to 121-76-2. That the Cards managed to go 6-7 against that bunch is impressive.

 

[Trophytown]

Basically every game the Steelers played from November on is what I classify as tough weather that favors the defense. It wasn't snowing in Philly on Thanksgiving night but cold weather is going to effect a team thats not used to it and make them uncomfortable. That can be enough to decide the game.

I am not saying its the only reason you guys are ranked #1. Not at all. Every team has to play in different conditions and over a 16 game schedule it evens out.

But your kidding yourself if you don't think the cold weather hasn't favored the way your team is built the last couple months.

Again - its warm weather in Tampa. I like our chances. And its not even our offense running wild that is going to be the difference. Its that I think our stellar offense will score more points on your stellar defense then your mediocre offense on our resurgent (last 4 games) defense.

I honestly belive that. If we lose its because of a defensive turnover TD or ST's. But you can't really predict those things.

Your not going up against Joe Flacco (or even Phil Rivers) in the cold this week. Its Kurt Warner in warm weather. BIG difference.

But you are predicting what your offense will do ? Hmmm, how nice...

You guys are reaching/searching for any possible advantage now. From the weather to the fast track to bringing up results from history and the words of a Quarterback whose team got spanked several times this year.

 

[PJ1]

But you are predicting what your offense will do ? Hmmm, how nice...

You guys are reaching/searching for any possible advantage now. From the weather to the fast track to bringing up results from history and the words of a Quarterback whose team got spanked several times this year.

Keep hoping you get that team that got spanked during the year. You will be surprised who you get. As were the Falcons, Panthers and Eagles. Seems you guys took quite a beating against the Titans this year also. You are better now and I assure you so are The Cards.

 

[Duckjake]

But you are predicting what your offense will do ? Hmmm, how nice...

You guys are reaching/searching for any possible advantage now. From the weather to the fast track to bringing up results from history and the words of a Quarterback whose team got spanked several times this year.

As opposed to what? Results from the future?

 

[Trophytown]

As opposed to what? Results from the future?

Well just about everyone around here wants to hang their hat on last seasons regular season victory like it means something today. Last season has no bearing on what will happen tomorrow.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

But you are predicting what your offense will do ? Hmmm, how nice...

You guys are reaching/searching for any possible advantage now. From the weather to the fast track to bringing up results from history and the words of a Quarterback whose team got spanked several times this year.

Dude you crack me up. We are fans. We don't decide *****.

The players will get it done whether I think we are going to get blown out or we are going to blow them out.

Tell me I am reaching all you want but I am not interested in winning the debate before the game with azzclowns.

In this thread in particular I am talking to REAL Steeler fan from Pittsburgh who have attended games at Heinz and live and breath Steeler football in the Steel City.

Know your role.

 

[SECTION 11]

Trophytown is just, completely irrelevant.

 

[Duckjake]

Well just about everyone around here wants to hang their hat on last seasons regular season victory like it means something today. Last season has no bearing on what will happen tomorrow.

Yes it does. Teams don't completely change overnight in the NFL. Heck most of them play the same way for decades reflecting their ownership more than anything else. I haven't noticed much difference in the Bears style of football for instance in 40 years. You could almost watch film of the Steelers from 1994 and prepare fairly well for what you'll see today.

That's not so true for the Cards because they essentially had a change in ownership when Michael Bidwill took over. Otherwise the Cards played the same football for years. No run game, no D, great wide receivers and 5-11.

I'm sure both coaching staffs have reviewed film of that game.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Well just about everyone around here wants to hang their hat on last seasons regular season victory like it means something today. Last season has no bearing on what will happen tomorrow.

I'm sure if Pittsburgh won, it would somehow be relevant in your eyes .
In fact, te makeup of the starting units is probably very similar to last year's game. Your OL is probably a little worse off with the loss of Faneca. I'm going from memory but the rest of the offense is the same. Starks may play a bigger role.Not that that is necessarily a good thing for you guys. I think your defense is about the same except for Haggans. We're pretty much the same except Warner, who played, is in for Leinart and DRC is in for Green. Those are both upgrades on our part from last year's team. Especially the DRC over Green upgrade.

 

[SteelCityMom]

I'm sure if Pittsburgh won, it would somehow be relevant in your eyes .
In fact, te makeup of the starting units is probably very similar to last year's game. Your OL is probably a little worse off with the loss of Faneca. I'm going from memory but the rest of the offense is the same. Starks may play a bigger role.Not that that is necessarily a good thing for you guys. I think your defense is about the same except for Haggans. We're pretty much the same except Warner, who played, is in for Leinart and DRC is in for Green. Those are both upgrades on our part from last year's team. Especially the DRC over Green upgrade.

Yeah the OL is about the only thing that's really different this year. They lost Faneca and have had 2 veteran lineman out for most of the year (Simmons and Smith, Smith wasn't put onto IR until week 13 or 14 I believe, but was injured and hadn't played since week 4). Their RB situation was very different as well since getting rid of Haynes and picking up Mendenhall and Moore.

Defense has been pretty solid for quite a few years now, with the newest addition to starters being Woodley, who fits in very well to the system. That's their strength though is that most of them have been playing together so long that they know how to work well as a unit. Being relatively healthy for the whole season hasn't hurt either...that was a big issue last season.

The biggest complete upgrade to the Steelers though was actually ST's, with the best new addition being Keyaron Fox (watch for him, he's always capable of making a huge play). The return game hasn't been anything explosive throughout the regular season, but they went from being almost dead last in return coverage last year to being in the top 5 in all STs categories this year. It's been quite a refreshing turnaround for that unit.