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[overseascardfan]

Maybe PHX can still get Jackson if PHI takes Smith. If Jackson is gone maybe use pick in a package to get a star player.

 

[Bodha]

He's also on about the same level as a shooter.

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Bender: FG 35.4% / Three 27.7% / Free throw 36.7% / 2.4 RPG
Laurie: FG 54.5% / Three 42.3% / Free throw 84.3%/ 7.2 RPG


They arent in the same dimension as shooters. They arent in the same dimension in anything.

How long will it take Bender to have that bottom stat line? 3-5 years? Over that 3-5 years Laurie will also be growing. Maybe at a slower pace than Bender, but when you start off 10 miles ahead of somebody else in a race, odds are you are going to win most of the time.

 

[Mainstreet]

Maybe PHX can still get Jackson if PHI takes Smith. If Jackson is gone maybe use pick in a package to get a star player.

The ACL injury to Smith would raise concerns for me with an early pick but I'm not the 76ers.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The ACL injury to Smith would raise concerns for me with an early pick but I'm not the 76ers.

Its their MO.

They drafted Embiid and Noel, and even Simmons got injured as a rookie. To me it looks like they kind of like sitting their rooks for a year. [touch of sarcasm there].

 

[Finito]

You must be registered for see images attach

Bender: FG 35.4% / Three 27.7% / Free throw 36.7% / 2.4 RPG
Laurie: FG 54.5% / Three 42.3% / Free throw 84.3%/ 7.2 RPG


They arent in the same dimension as shooters. They arent in the same dimension in anything.

How long will it take Bender to have that bottom stat line? 3-5 years? Over that 3-5 years Laurie will also be growing. Maybe at a slower pace than Bender, but when you start off 10 miles ahead of somebody else in a race, odds are you are going to win most of the time.

Yea we get it LM can shoot it but what else can he do? Can he defend? Nope. Can he rebound? Nope. Can he create? Nope.

I'm sorry if your a 7 footer and call you bring to the table is shooting no thanks. Because more so than other positions on defense you can't get away from banging in the paint.

LM is not a tough kid.

Benders upside is 10x that of LM

 

[Mainstreet]

Its their MO.

They drafted Embiid and Noel, and even Simmons got injured as a rookie. To me it looks like they kind of like sitting their rooks for a year. [touch of sarcasm there].

Well taken.

If they like to chase those things around, let them.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Its their MO.

They drafted Embiid and Noel, and even Simmons got injured as a rookie. To me it looks like they kind of like sitting their rooks for a year. [touch of sarcasm there].

Most of what you're looking at historically was hinkie. Colangeli in the house now.

Shockingly the vast majority of mocks I'm seeing have Tatum as #3 to sixers as most refined offensive weapon. But I still have a time seeing the colangeli failing to identify the most talented player. Their track record was pretty good with draft talent identification.

 

[Bodha]

Yea we get it LM can shoot it but what else can he do? Can he defend? Nope. Can he rebound? Nope. Can he create? Nope.

I'm sorry if your a 7 footer and call you bring to the table is shooting no thanks. Because more so than other positions on defense you can't get away from banging in the paint.

LM is not a tough kid.

Benders upside is 10x that of LM

If LM is just a Channing Frye then so be it, Channing was a key in the Cavs championship offense. A big who can spread the floor.


Also I heard all these same "He has crazy upside!" arguments with Len. I hate upside. Upside is worthless to me. Nkemdiche has upside.

You know what I like? Stats. Game tape. Ink on paper. Numbers. Tangible production.

Upside is fantasy land.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yea we get it LM can shoot it but what else can he do? Can he defend? Nope. Can he rebound? Nope. Can he create? Nope.

I'm sorry if your a 7 footer and call you bring to the table is shooting no thanks. Because more so than other positions on defense you can't get away from banging in the paint.

LM is not a tough kid.

Benders upside is 10x that of LM

Markenaan can put the ball on the floor and has a nice (albeit not dominant) post game in addition to his shooting chops. Also, while he might not be a big assist guy, he's not a ball stopper. He's also not a horrid rebounder as you suggest.

Mind you, I have great hope for bender, but markenaan looks like he will be a nice skilled big.

 

[AzStevenCal]

What makes Markannen better than Kaminsky or Zeller? He's just another tall stiff who can shoot. If he isn't playing defense when he's playing against inferior competition then what makes you think he'll turn it on in the pro's? He's one dimensional and it's highly unlikely he's better than Bender in a few years. As stated Bender is actually younger, is a better defender, and has much better footwork. He's also on about the same level as a shooter. Markannen will be a stretch 4, stretch 5 similar to Kaminsky, Hawes, Zeller, and best case scenario Kelly Olynyk while Bender has shown in his very limited time that he should be able to play SF, PF, or C, and not just as a stretch player, but because he was the speed and vertasility to play offnesively and defensively inside, outside, and on the wing.

Each to their own but get back to me in a decade or two when Lauri is being talked about as a HOFer. And he is the most multi-skilled big man that I've ever seen that is also called one dimensional. Maybe I'm biased but I'm not blind, if he fails it certainly won't be because he's one dimensional.

Lauri struggles in the pick and roll, isn't always sure when to switch in the American game, is too easily blocked from behind when shooting down low and will never be a great rim defender. BUT, he's a solid positional defender, rebounds his space well, handles the ball well, can score at all 3 levels and is an exceptional passer in addition to doing all the little things a team needs in order to succeed.

 

[Finito]

If LM is just a Channing Frye then so be it, Channing was a key in the Cavs championship offense. A big who can spread the floor.


Also I heard all these same "He has crazy upside!" arguments with Len. I hate upside. Upside is worthless to me. Nkemdiche has upside.

You know what I like? Stats. Game tape. Ink on paper. Numbers. Tangible production.

Upside is fantasy land.

Noooobody made the case for Len like they do Bender. Most hated the Len pick but the draft was super weak that year. Just stop that they don't even compare.

Upside is not fantasy land it's reality. This is the NBA in 2017 not 1993 it's the age of the one and done all these guys are drafted on upside. There was a time when Kevin Garnet, Kobe Bryant, Amare, Dirk, Kawai, Greek Freak and tons of others were drafted just being super raw and on the potential of upside. If you looking for a finished product in this day and age your the one living in a fantasy land.

You bring up Robert Nkemdiche but forget the Cardinals took a flyer on Calias Campbell who was very raw and drafted on what his upside could be and it did take him a few years to develop.

 

[pokerface]

Noooobody made the case for Len like they do Bender. Most hated the Len pick but the draft was super weak that year. Just stop that they don't even compare.

I wanted the Len pick based on upside but after three full seasons and a lousy offseason I gave up on him. This last season he was dead man walking as far as I was concerned.

 

[sunsfan88]

76ers celebrate Hinkie after they get the #3 pick due to his trade with the Kings

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[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Each to their own but get back to me in a decade or two when Lauri is being talked about as a HOFer. And he is the most multi-skilled big man that I've ever seen that is also called one dimensional. Maybe I'm biased but I'm not blind, if he fails it certainly won't be because he's one dimensional.

Lauri struggles in the pick and roll, isn't always sure when to switch in the American game, is too easily blocked from behind when shooting down low and will never be a great rim defender. BUT, he's a solid positional defender, rebounds his space well, handles the ball well, can score at all 3 levels and is an exceptional passer in addition to doing all the little things a team needs in order to succeed.

Agree with all this. But I think his average athleticism keeps him from being a HOF. It's the difference between he and dirk imo.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Agree with all this. But I think his average athleticism keeps him from being a HOF. It's the difference between he and dirk imo.

I'm convinced that his tail-off in shooting was solely due to tired legs. If the first half Lauri is the real deal, he's going to be a great player in the NBA. If he's what we saw the second half of the season, maybe he's not much better than Channing Frye. But personally, I'd take the chance.

I really believe Lauri will compare very well with Dirk in almost every area except for that one small thing that made Dirk a legend. Nowitzki could get his shot off against any defense, we have no idea whether Lauri can live up to that part of the legend.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'm convinced that his tail-off in shooting was solely due to tired legs. If the first half Lauri is the real deal, he's going to be a great player in the NBA. If he's what we saw the second half of the season, maybe he's not much better than Channing Frye. But personally, I'd take the chance.

I really believe Lauri will compare very well with Dirk in almost every area except for that one small thing that made Dirk a legend. Nowitzki could get his shot off against any defense, we have no idea whether Lauri can live up to that part of the legend.

Dirk had a pull up jumper off the dribble and a fadeaway. Haven't seen either of those from Lauri. Also I reiterate I think dirk was a better athlete

 

[Bodha]

Noooobody made the case for Len like they do Bender. Most hated the Len pick but the draft was super weak that year. Just stop that they don't even compare.

Upside is not fantasy land it's reality. This is the NBA in 2017 not 1993 it's the age of the one and done all these guys are drafted on upside. There was a time when Kevin Garnet, Kobe Bryant, Amare, Dirk, Kawai, Greek Freak and tons of others were drafted just being super raw and on the potential of upside. If you looking for a finished product in this day and age your the one living in a fantasy land.

You bring up Robert Nkemdiche but forget the Cardinals took a flyer on Calias Campbell who was very raw and drafted on what his upside could be and it did take him a few years to develop.

Did you just compare Bender to all-time dominant HS and college players? Yeah, they had upside. You know what else they had?

Domination. Stats. Game film. Accolades. Awards. Mr.Basketballs.

At what point has Bender ever dominated? Like I said he was a 2 ppg backup in the Euroleague......

 

[AzStevenCal]

Dirk had a pull up jumper off the dribble and a fadeaway. Haven't seen either of those from Lauri. Also I reiterate I think dirk was a better athlete

I left it alone because I really don't see much of a difference in them athletically. But yeah, Dirk's ability to take and make that fadeaway separates him from most players. Defending it is almost as challenging as trying to stop Kareem's sky hook.

 

[Bodha]

Make it happen man.


Laurie can be taught D. You cant teach a 7 footer to shoot the lights out. Youre born with it.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Make it happen man.


Laurie can be taught D. You cant teach a 7 footer to shoot the lights out. Youre born with it.

As much as I'm on your side (yeesh) in support of Lauri I think you have this completely backward. Shooting is a skill that can be learned through refinement and repetition. Defense is predicated on a number of factors including athleticism, learning nuances, learning skills, film preparation, desire, but at the end of the day the single largest factor in being a great defender is going to be natural athleticism. If you're slow or can't jump the ceiling of your defense is always going to be quite low.

 

[Finito]

Defense is pretty much toughness and effort dude. If he ain't shown a willingness to mix it up by now he ain't gonna show it when the guys get bigger and stronger.

I don't know where you get this shooters are born argument no they are not shooters are made through practice and practice and more practice ask anybody that's played basketball.

The argument was "upside" none of those guys were even close to being finished products that's how they compare. Come on now your better than that.

There is a reason a "such skilled" 7 footer is being talked about in the 8-12 range of the draft and not the sure fire #1 spot because he has several holes and question marks

 

[Bodha]

As much as I'm on your side (yeesh) in support of Lauri I think you have this completely backward. Shooting is a skill that can be learned through refinement and repetition. Defense is predicated on a number of factors including athleticism, learning nuances, learning skills, film preparation, desire, but at the end of the day the single largest factor in being a great defender is going to be natural athleticism. If you're slow or can't jump the ceiling of your defense is always going to be quite low.

Shaq disagrees.

Every NBA player disagrees. They all shoot 1000 shots in practice. If you could actually continually improve your shot, then every player would be Steph. Theres a very low ceiling on how much you can improve your shot.

shooting in basketball, shots in hockey, accuracy is football, batting average in baseball are all talents. They can be improved, but there is most definitely levels to it. Nobody is equal.

D is mostly effort.

 

[JCSunsfan]

As much as I'm on your side (yeesh) in support of Lauri I think you have this completely backward. Shooting is a skill that can be learned through refinement and repetition. Defense is predicated on a number of factors including athleticism, learning nuances, learning skills, film preparation, desire, but at the end of the day the single largest factor in being a great defender is going to be natural athleticism. If you're slow or can't jump the ceiling of your defense is always going to be quite low.

Rarely does a player develop defense if he doesn't have it coming in. Quality defensive intensity can be refined but not manufactured. I don't think shooting can be taught much either. Either you have that kind of muscle memory or you don't.

 

[Finito]

Shaq disagrees.

Every NBA player disagrees. They all shoot 1000 shots in practice. If you could actually continually improve your shot, then every player would be Steph. Theres a very low ceiling on how much you can improve your shot.

shooting in basketball, shots in hockey, accuracy is football, batting average in baseball are all talents. They can be improved, but there is most definitely levels to it. Nobody is equal.

D is mostly effort.

Yes because we all know Shaq is the authority on shooting. That's the single last guy you should of brought up to help your argument.

Ask Ray Allen what his routine is

 

[Bodha]

Yes because we all know Shaq is the authority on shooting. That's the single last guy you should of brought up to help your argument.

Ask Ray Allen what his routine is

How so? You said someone can learn shooting. Shaq was in the NBA for 19 years. Probably took 1 million shots in that time frame between games and practice. Had world class coaches every day in practice. Why'd he never develop a shot?