Mavericks @ Suns Tuesday Playoff game thread, R2, 5-10-2022 - Game 5

[nashman]

Final comments on Paul….
He had a bad game - by his standards - last night. I think that really not debatable and totally fine to call out.
But he’s the BEST leader on this team and his presence, on the court, is vital! I have no doubt that his presence, not his performance, contributed to the win last night.
At 37, I find it miraculous that he’s held up as well as he has! And I pray that he get his championship - which he GREATLY deserves, this season!!

I’d call it a subpar game not bad, other were scoring well so he did his job and facilitated that. You can tell he is tired but still hit a nice 3 in a key moment late. And he is smart enough not to force a bunch of bad tired shots instead feeds his teammates. Clearly not his best game but not a BAD game, games 3-4 were bad…

 

[Mainstreet]

Final comments on Paul….
He had a bad game - by his standards - last night. I think that’s really not debatable and totally fine to call out.
But he’s the BEST leader on this team and his presence, on the court, is vital! I have no doubt that his presence, not his performance, contributed to the win last night.
At 37, I find it miraculous that he’s held up as well as he has! And I pray that he get his championship - which he GREATLY deserves, this season!!

So do you still want to start Shamet?

 

[Covert Rain]

Yeah do you find it strange that I remember Powell in every game at the start, but don't remember seeing him on the floor at all the last 3 quarters? In every single game? What an odd way to use a "starter."

I didn't see this until now. The Suns were +18 when him on the floor. Not to mention he made Luka work his ass off on some of those missed shots.

 

[82CardsGrad]

As for Book. At only 25 yrs old, he’s proven to be an alltime Sun great! He’s got a Max deal and will get another one day!
He is well on his way to becoming one of the games true stars. And he still has some maturing to do. That’s a knit…. As the majority of the time, he conducts himself in ways well beyond his age! He’ll get there!

 

[Cheesebeef]

I’d call it a subpar game not bad, other were scoring well so he did his job and facilitated that. You can tell he is tired but still hit a nice 3 in a key moment late. And he is smart enough not to force a bunch of bad tired shots instead feeds his teammates. Clearly not his best game but not a BAD game, games 3-4 were bad…

games 3 and 4 weren’t just bad… they were all time awful games.

But I think last night was still Bad. He just looks exhausted from the jump.

 

[82CardsGrad]

So do you still want to start Shamet?

Uh… no. Never did though…

 

[Mainstreet]

I’d call it a subpar game not bad, other were scoring well so he did his job and facilitated that. You can tell he is tired but still hit a nice 3 in a key moment late. And he is smart enough not to force a bunch of bad tired shots instead feeds his teammates. Clearly not his best game but not a BAD game, games 3-4 were bad…

I guess I will use the football analogy again.

If a team sells out their defense to limit the opponent's run game to 60 yards but the offense passes for 600 yards and they lose, is that a win by the defense?

 

[Finito]

So do you still want to start Shamet?

Nobody wants to start Shamet but it’s very clear Paul isn’t right.

 

[Finito]

I guess I will use the football analogy again.

If a team sells out their defense to limit the opponent's run game to 60 yards but the offense passes for 600 yards and they lose, is that a win by the defense?

You keep going back to football. Basket is a sport where 1 player can bend the defense to do whatever they want. The whole take what the defense gives you thing doesn’t work for basketball.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I get Monty was late sitting Payne… of course, that has nothing to do with why we’re now entering a Game 6 however…
But how bout we just trust the NBA Coach of The Year, his staff and James Jones when it comes to the rotation? I mean, I wouldn’t mind seeing Holiday as well, wherever Monty believes it makes most sense.

I'm usually the first person to defend the coach (any sport). I'm well aware that, in addition to knowing the game better than we do, our Coach has far more intimate knowledge of the players than any of us do. But in this case, I've watched Monty do this in the past. And he has, on at least two occasions, admitted to the press that he completely forgot about one of his bench players and regretted not using him in hindsight.

So, knowing he locks in on his main guys and loses sight of his bench, I can't help but get concerned when I see clear needs that could perhaps be solved by using on of his deep bench guys. I think he's a great coach but they all have weak areas and no coach can do it all. I think he needs to put an assistant in charge of reminding him about options beyond the starting 5 and the first 2 or 3 off the bench for those situations and matchups that warrant it.

 

[Mainstreet]

The Suns won in spite of CP3 last night. It’s ok to admit that. It’s just the truth.

Getting pretty close to starting Shamet in this comment.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think he’s hurt. There’s got to be something going on with him.

His shooting looked okay though I hitch is why my mind has a tough time grasping that.

I think this mavs team had become a very good defensive team down the back end of the season as well. So while doncic isn’t great defensively he’s still 6’8. Bullock and Finney-smith are top, tall, long, athletic defenders, and Brunson is a tough defender. I think they’re denying Paul his spot like we saw in New Orleans (kidd openly admits he stole defensive alignment/strategy from New Orleans series) and they’re doing an excellent job of rotating a defender in front of our centers as they roll. Our centers have to catch under control and just drop the bunny over Brunson instead of running him over.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Don’t get me wrong… Even in a performance last night, CP3’s presence has value. Mentally… Emotionally…. There’s tangible value to him being on the court, even when he’s essentially a zero performance wise.

And he still has gravity. He’s occupying a defender. He just has to find the right guy and right now he’s struggling there.

 

[Mainstreet]

Nobody wants to start Shamet but it’s very clear Paul isn’t right.

So who do you suggest starting?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

So what? Two bad passes? BENCH HIM! Michael Jordan I'm sure once or twice made a couple bad passes in a game before too.

I think he was pointing that out to evidence the poor play wasn’t just because he was tired from this game.

 

[Mainstreet]

You keep going back to football. Basket is a sport where 1 player can bend the defense to do whatever they want. The whole take what the defense gives you thing doesn’t work for basketball.

This part of the game translates.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Getting pretty close to starting Shamet in this comment.

Nope.. not at all buddy.

 

[Dback Jon]

The Suns won in spite of CP3 last night. It’s ok to admit that. It’s just the truth.

Kinda like its ok to Admit that Monty has been slow to react and make changes, but finally did some last night.

 

[Covert Rain]

games 3 and 4 weren’t just bad… they were all time awful games.

But I think last night was still Bad. He just looks exhausted from the jump.

This is what I was alluding to in my question post. Two series in a row two teams have made it a mission to just beat the hell out of him and tire him out. It's worked in 5/12 games. He looks beat-up and exhausted to me. More so than I have ever seen him. To me it's taking its toll on him over the course of two series.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I think he needs to put an assistant in charge of reminding him about options beyond the starting 5 and the first 2 or 3 off the bench for those situations and matchups that warrant it.

I assume he’s got that in place already…. I assume every coach/team does…
But, I could be wrong.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

You keep going back to football. Basket is a sport where 1 player can bend the defense to do whatever they want. The whole take what the defense gives you thing doesn’t work for basketball.

That’s not entirely true. Not every player in the nba can bend defenses to do what they want. In fact most teams don’t have a single player that can do that. I don’t even think Booker can do that. Paul can when playing peak Paul ball, but even then defenses can be designed to stifle him but then they’ll have to sacrifice something else, and that’s what it means to take what they give you - leverage where they weaken themselves.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm usually the first person to defend the coach (any sport). I'm well aware that, in addition to knowing the game better than we do, our Coach has far more intimate knowledge of the players than any of us do. But in this case, I've watched Monty do this in the past. And he has, on at least two occasions, admitted to the press that he completely forgot about one of his bench players and regretted not using him in hindsight.

So, knowing he locks in on his main guys and loses sight of his bench, I can't help but get concerned when I see clear needs that could perhaps be solved by using on of his deep bench guys. I think he's a great coach but they all have weak areas and no coach can do it all. I think he needs to put an assistant in charge of reminding him about options beyond the starting 5 and the first 2 or 3 off the bench for those situations and matchups that warrant it.

Willie Green used to be really good at offering Monty suggestions. I'm not sure how it's being handled now.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Should be interesting to see how Payne is handled now. Does he see the court now that he got a game to sit and watch. Maybe calm down? Or is his confidence now shot?

 

[Bufalay]

Should be interesting to see how Payne is handled now. Does he see the court now that he got a game to sit and watch. Maybe calm down? Or is his confidence now shot?

I would assume he's tough. He somehow went from playing in China to playing awesome under-control basketball in the west finals. That's a sign that he's resilient and confident. He might also be hurt.

 

[Mainstreet]

Should be interesting to see how Payne is handled now. Does he see the court now that he got a game to sit and watch. Maybe calm down? Or is his confidence now shot?

I don't see how it can't help. Payne needs to see the bigger picture and that is running the team.

He needs to be more selective with his shots and figure out what he used to do best... getting to the basket.