Mike Budenholzer - Officially Suns new Head Coach - NOW FIRED on 4/14/2025

[Superbone]

I am going to be majorly disappointing if James Jones is still the GM of this team after all of this.

Be careful what you wish for. What if Isiah Thomas takes his place?

 

[Germz249]

3 in 3 years.. not a good look.

 

[1982baskets]

Vogel was a way better coach. Consistent boring style, but more effective. Team played defense and we utilized Nurk/Grayson much better around KD/Booker. Beal is always going to be a guy that we will regret paying so much to get. Even the big 3 they had a much better record with Vogel.

Aside from blowing it all up, which you can't really see Matt doing, since he's promised championships, the best move was to add some defenders to the group we had with Vogel. We were outmatched with athleticism and defense vs the Wolves last year. We needed to add some more rotational level players, kept some faith in Grayson/Nurk and kept at it. The West is wide open. Nuggets are worse. Lakers traded Anthony Davis, lost size. Dallas traded Luka and lost Kyrie to an ACL. Clippers lost Paul George to free agency.

Only OKC got better, Houston is still too young to win a title. We should have had more sense and seen we weren't that far off in the West. We were a near 50 win team last year without any health from Beal/KD/Booker together. Vogel got Nurk/Allen to play like core players. We needed to address his needs and buy in that he could build a champion like he did with the Lakers. Instead we scapegoated him, because he's an easy target and the Wolves beat us with their size and athleticism in a playoff series.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Good lord… if true, the out and out laziness of this front office will be laid bare for all to see.

GO FIND THE NEXT KENNY ATKINSON/STEVE KERR/JJ REDDICK/MARK DAIGNULT… not another ******* retread.

Ish knows just enough about basketball to make him very dangerous as thinking he knows enough to be a GM. (spoiler alert - he doesn't)

 

[Phrazbit]

Seriously though, if Jones is brought back in any way, shape, or form, I'm out on Ishbia.

Even with all of the foolishness up to now, I would be willing to give Ishbia a mulligan for being an "over enthusiastic" owner of a new toy. But keeping that idiot as GM or anything similar would indicate that he is beyond hope as an owner (not that he still might prove so anyway).

I think it would just be an indicator that Jones has had very little to do with what’s taken place the last 2 1/2 years.

 

[95pro]

KD and Book racking up their body count, I mean coaches count.

 

[95pro]

I think it would just be an indicator that Jones has had very little to do with what’s taken place the last 2 1/2 years.

A real drastic change in the way things were ran.
Before Ish, there were slow and steady moves, players had a bit of tenure with us.
Ish comes, bam, change of people and players, now we are gutted in only 2.5 years.

I could convince myself that JJ is the scapegoat for a lot of what has happened. For sure i dont think JJ pushed the KD trade through.

 

[Phrazbit]

A real drastic change in the way things were ran.
Before Ish, there were slow and steady moves, players had a bit of tenure with us.
Ish comes, bam, change of people and players, now we are gutted in only 2.5 years.

I could convince myself that JJ is the scapegoat for a lot of what has happened. For sure i dont think JJ pushed the KD trade through.

I think Ishbia has dictated pretty much every move since he got here, he has not been shy at all about gloating over them… up until their undeniable failure.

 

[Chaplin]

I think it would just be an indicator that Jones has had very little to do with what’s taken place the last 2 1/2 years.

I wish we could stop giving him a pass. Every bad thing that happens, why is James Jones assumed to not be involved?

 

[elindholm]

Its just amazing how many bad coaches are out there. Even the ones with championship rings are bad. Since leaving the Golden State Warriors, Kevin Durant has played for four coaches who have been fired: Steve Nash, Monty Williams, Frank Vogel, and Mike Budenholzer. Additionally Kenny Atkinson who was Durant's coach in Brooklyn, was also fired after Durant and Kyrie Irving joined the team.

So a bad coach is one who can't get along with Durant?

 

[Phrazbit]

I wish we could stop giving him a pass. Every bad thing that happens, why is James Jones assumed to not be involved?

He’s made mistakes, but the utter ruination of this franchise last couple years I think is unquestionably on Ishbia.

And I think he might stay because if you are Matt Ishbia, why hire a GM? You’re not letting them make any real decisions..

 

[95pro]

He’s made mistakes, but the utter ruination of this franchise last couple years I think is unquestionably on Ishbia.

And I think he might stay because if you are Matt Ishbia, why hire a GM? You’re not letting them make any real decisions..

They both made mistakes, but just the rate of transactions and turnover is night and day between JJ and Ishbia.

 

[Phrazbit]

They both made mistakes, but just the rate of transactions and turnover is night and day between JJ and Ishbia.

Ishbia has shown zero patience and no regard for risk. Bad combo.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Ishbia has shown zero patience and no regard for risk. Bad combo.

He acts like he's building a team on NBA 2K with 0 foresight. He's obsessed with names, rather than building an actual team.

 

[Absolute Zero]

So a bad coach is one who can't get along with Durant?

I was being sarcastic. There are good coaches there.

 

[elindholm]

I was being sarcastic. There are good coaches there.

My bad. I'm on this forum so rarely now that I've lost track of people's tone.

 

[Hoop Head]

I think Ishbia has dictated pretty much every move since he got here, he has not been shy at all about gloating over them… up until their undeniable failure.

Billionaires owners love taking credit for the good and shifting the blame for the bad. We have no way of knowing who did what for the Suns but James Jones got a pass for bad drafts, bad free agent moves, and poor trades under Sarver and those continued under Ishbia. He is a constant here and even though the teams talent budget has increased drastically we've seen those mistakes repeated. Every signing from last summer was moved or let go. I have to believe JJ was excited at the prospect of turning picks into a veteran also since he's been regularly disengaged regarding the draft. The player issues have also persisted here despite his initial hiring being to quell those.

 

[leclerc]

I heard JJ is hired until end of June...

 

[AzStevenCal]

Billionaires owners love taking credit for the good and shifting the blame for the bad. We have no way of knowing who did what for the Suns but James Jones got a pass for bad drafts, bad free agent moves, and poor trades under Sarver and those continued under Ishbia. He is a constant here and even though the teams talent budget has increased drastically we've seen those mistakes repeated. Every signing from last summer was moved or let go. I have to believe JJ was excited at the prospect of turning picks into a veteran also since he's been regularly disengaged regarding the draft. The player issues have also persisted here despite his initial hiring being to quell those.

I don't blame Jones. I don't excuse Jones. From where I sit I have no idea who is making the calls. But since they occurred on JJ's watch, he should be the fall guy. Firing him is a necessary step IMO but I'm unconvinced that his firing will fix our front office.

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't blame Jones. I don't excuse Jones. From where I sit I have no idea who is making the calls. But since they occurred on JJ's watch, he should be the fall guy. Firing him is a necessary step IMO but I'm unconvinced that his firing will fix our front office.

Retaining him certainly won't help. Firing won't fix it, you're right. It depends on who is hired and what sort of leeway he has. If we could get a Danny Ainge type of guy who has the ability to work free of meddling then the sky is the limit.

 

[Covert Rain]

Vogel was a way better coach. Consistent boring style, but more effective. Team played defense and we utilized Nurk/Grayson much better around KD/Booker. Beal is always going to be a guy that we will regret paying so much to get. Even the big 3 they had a much better record with Vogel.

Aside from blowing it all up, which you can't really see Matt doing, since he's promised championships, the best move was to add some defenders to the group we had with Vogel. We were outmatched with athleticism and defense vs the Wolves last year. We needed to add some more rotational level players, kept some faith in Grayson/Nurk and kept at it. The West is wide open. Nuggets are worse. Lakers traded Anthony Davis, lost size. Dallas traded Luka and lost Kyrie to an ACL. Clippers lost Paul George to free agency.

Only OKC got better, Houston is still too young to win a title. We should have had more sense and seen we weren't that far off in the West. We were a near 50 win team last year without any health from Beal/KD/Booker together. Vogel got Nurk/Allen to play like core players. We needed to address his needs and buy in that he could build a champion like he did with the Lakers. Instead we scapegoated him, because he's an easy target and the Wolves beat us with their size and athleticism in a playoff series.

I will buy more effective but not way better. He was awful too. He reminded much of Pringles who had zero ability to make in game adjustments. When things went south it seemed you were not coming back from that on his teams. He was a better defensive coach but that is about it IMO. Also, this was never a Bud team. We didn't have his type of players. We didn't have centers that could shoot the 3 after Nurk was gone (not that he was great). He didn't build this roster. I am not saying he didn't under perform as a coach. I am saying as long as this team wasn't built for his type of team? He was doomed.

 

[Raindog]

I wish we could stop giving him a pass. Every bad thing that happens, why is James Jones assumed to not be involved?

I guarantee Ishbia is not involved in the FA signings that have failed or all the failed personnel decisions to fill out the roster around the "big three."

Those fumbles have all been on Jones. And we know this because they were the same kind of roster misfires that we had before Ishbia was even the owner.

 

[Raindog]

Billionaires owners love taking credit for the good and shifting the blame for the bad. We have no way of knowing who did what for the Suns but James Jones got a pass for bad drafts, bad free agent moves, and poor trades under Sarver and those continued under Ishbia. He is a constant here and even though the teams talent budget has increased drastically we've seen those mistakes repeated. Every signing from last summer was moved or let go. I have to believe JJ was excited at the prospect of turning picks into a veteran also since he's been regularly disengaged regarding the draft. The player issues have also persisted here despite his initial hiring being to quell those.

+1000

 

[gimpy]

I guarantee Ishbia is not involved in the FA signings that have failed or all the failed personnel decisions to fill out the roster around the "big three."

Those fumbles have all been on Jones. And we know this because they were the same kind of roster misfires that we had before Ishbia was even the owner.

How can you guarantee ishbia is not involved in these FA signings?

 

[BirdGangThing]

I guarantee Ishbia is not involved in the FA signings that have failed or all the failed personnel decisions to fill out the roster around the "big three."

Those fumbles have all been on Jones. And we know this because they were the same kind of roster misfires that we had before Ishbia was even the owner.

jj woulda been fired with bud