Not overly concerned about Navarre

[Reddog]

Am I crazy for not being overly concerned about Navarre? He was strong in the pocket, threw the ball with velocity and seemed totally cool under pressure. His mobility was less of an issue than I thought it would be. In fact on that odd, low scramble dump to Fits on 3rd down I think he could have ran for the first.

He threw very inaccurately but has a history of smarts, resiliency and passing accuracy so I expect that with practice with the first unit, film analysis of his play and more game experience he will develop into a legitimate NFL QB. I have far more optimism after his four pick game than I had after any of Josh's wins. He may not be our starter next year (I assume a FA will) but he will at least provide some confidence as a #2 and may just develop into a future starter.

 

[Russ Smith]

Am I crazy for not being overly concerned about Navarre? He was strong in the pocket, threw the ball with velocity and seemed totally cool under pressure. His mobility was less of an issue than I thought it would be. In fact on that odd, low scramble dump to Fits on 3rd down I think he could have ran for the first.

He threw very inaccurately but has a history of smarts, resiliency and passing accuracy so I expect that with practice with the first unit, film analysis of his play and more game experience he will develop into a legitimate NFL QB. I have far more optimism after his four pick game than I had after any of Josh's wins. He may not be our starter next year (I assume a FA will) but he will at least provide some confidence as a #2 and may just develop into a future starter.

Didn't see it but he does NOT have a history of accuracy, he never completed 60% in college despite playing behind a dominant OL, having a good running game, and having quality Wr's. He's not an accurate passer, read 3-4 scouting reports before the draft and most of them will mention lack of accuracy. That is what knocked him down to the 7th round. I'm amazed he only got sacked once, that's good to see, but the accuracy part is to be expected. With more reps he'll get better but he's not an accurate passer and never has been.

 

[D-Dogg]

I agree with you Reddog...

I was impressed when looking at a rookie QB in his first start who was unfazed by the blitz whilst running an offense with a 4th string RB.

When the Lions came out in the second half and dropped into some serious zone coverages, and abandoned the blitz, Navarre looked just like every other straight from the college QB out there, misreading coverages and throwing bad balls. It obviously hurt him, and he will recover. He's smart, he's got good zip and one thing I thought he would get killed on was not an issue...mobility. He "feels" the pocket, and stands in to make the throw. His low delivery at times needs work...that ish is a problem.

He's got a lot of upside. A marginal starter with potential to be really good but a probable OUTSTANDING backup QB.

 

[conraddobler]

Didn't see it but he does NOT have a history of accuracy, he never completed 60% in college despite playing behind a dominant OL, having a good running game, and having quality Wr's. He's not an accurate passer, read 3-4 scouting reports before the draft and most of them will mention lack of accuracy. That is what knocked him down to the 7th round. I'm amazed he only got sacked once, that's good to see, but the accuracy part is to be expected. With more reps he'll get better but he's not an accurate passer and never has been.

Reminds me of Dave Brown but that's probably because he's taller than our other QB's and slow.

His delivery is weird kinda half sidearm or something.

Explains the batted ball problem.

Watching him I love his game and his attitude... Accuracy well he needs a lot more of it.

 

[Mrh182]

Am I crazy for not being overly concerned about Navarre? He was strong in the pocket, threw the ball with velocity and seemed totally cool under pressure. His mobility was less of an issue than I thought it would be.

I agree with you here 100%. The post-game show stressed many times that they think it was more of an issue of timing then anything else. I have a feeling that after a few games, he'll show true potential as a QB.

 

[Southpaw]

Reminds me of Dave Brown but that's probably because he's taller than our other QB's and slow.

His delivery is weird kinda half sidearm or something.

Explains the batted ball problem.

Watching him I love his game and his attitude... Accuracy well he needs a lot more of it.

I thought I was seeing something real weird when I saw his delivery. That thing is FUNKY.

Slow release, immobile and sidearm delivery does not make the great QB. Bizarre haircut too.

 

[CaptTurbo]

There was a HUGE difference between Navarre's throws yesterday and his throws in preseason.

In preseason he was throwing like Favre. 60-70 miles an hour.

Now like King and mcCown he is doing that STUPID loft to fitz up for grabs. And lets face it, Moss will grab that pass 80% 19% it will fal incomplete and 1% INT.

Fitzgeral will catch it 5% of the time. Incomplete 90% of the time and intercepted 5 % of the time.

Fitz is no Moss.

 

[Russ Smith]

Reminds me of Dave Brown but that's probably because he's taller than our other QB's and slow.

His delivery is weird kinda half sidearm or something.

Explains the batted ball problem.

Watching him I love his game and his attitude... Accuracy well he needs a lot more of it.

Kent Graham to me, another big guy who got a ton of passes batted down. Basides throwing 3/4 he has a kind of slow delivery that DL's can time. So they bat down a lot of passes.

 

[jmr667]

Best part of Navarre's game was the way he handled the blitz in the first quarter or two. Maybe Josh will take some lessons from him about identifying when/where the blitz is coming from and making the hot read. Even though a couple of Navarre's passes were batted down at least he we throwing toward the typical hot route and quick enough to avoid getting sacked by the blitz.

 

[john h]

Am I crazy for not being overly concerned about Navarre? He was strong in the pocket, threw the ball with velocity and seemed totally cool under pressure. His mobility was less of an issue than I thought it would be. In fact on that odd, low scramble dump to Fits on 3rd down I think he could have ran for the first.

He threw very inaccurately but has a history of smarts, resiliency and passing accuracy so I expect that with practice with the first unit, film analysis of his play and more game experience he will develop into a legitimate NFL QB. I have far more optimism after his four pick game than I had after any of Josh's wins. He may not be our starter next year (I assume a FA will) but he will at least provide some confidence as a #2 and may just develop into a future starter.

Of our three QB's he looks the best to me. He had pocket presence and did not seem to panic as much as the other two. He audiable out of several situations and appeared to have some confidence in his face. I am not saying he is going to be the man but I would start him for the remainder of the season. He also can take some hits and get back up. Our play calling left a lot to be desired.

 

[john h]

Reminds me of Dave Brown but that's probably because he's taller than our other QB's and slow.

His delivery is weird kinda half sidearm or something.

Explains the batted ball problem.

Watching him I love his game and his attitude... Accuracy well he needs a lot more of it.

It appeared he had a fast delivery which may account for him not being sacked many times. I have given up on the other two but still have some hope for Navarre. Of course, who else at QB can I have hope for. He is a longshot but we are at a point we clearly need a longshot to come in for us. Does anyone besides me think our coaching staff sucks? Our defensive coordinator seems decent but from what I am seeing I do not like any of the others. Do these guys have any credentials to speak of? I know nothing abut their history. I am just guessing they are "yes" men as that is a requirement to coach under DG. P.S. What happened to Damien Anderson? I thought we signed him?

 

[john h]

There was a HUGE difference between Navarre's throws yesterday and his throws in preseason.

In preseason he was throwing like Favre. 60-70 miles an hour.

Now like King and mcCown he is doing that STUPID loft to fitz up for grabs. And lets face it, Moss will grab that pass 80% 19% it will fal incomplete and 1% INT.

Fitzgeral will catch it 5% of the time. Incomplete 90% of the time and intercepted 5 % of the time.

Fitz is no Moss.

On deep routes Fits is not able to get behind anyone. Looks to me like you have to loft the ball and hope he outjumps the defender. Fitz looks like he is better suited for the intermediat routes and crossing patterns where he can block out the defender with his big body. I got to believe our receivers are all really p------- off with the lack of any QB being able to get them the ball. Of course both Fitz and Bolden are dropping some passes now. Bolden dropped a 1st down pass right in his arms yesterday when he was wide open. That does not help the QB's cause. You can never talk about QB problems without bringing up the lack of a running game. It is double hard for any of our QB's to succeed when the oposition knows you cannot run a lick. RB or QB which will it be as our #1 pick in the draft? With Green I have no clue as to what he would do. I have never seen a team more in need of a RB and QB than we are. We tend to lay all our problems on the offensive line. Certainly they are part of the problem but the QB,RB and play calling have a lot to do with how an offensive line performs. When a team knows you lack a running game they frequently bring more rushers than you can cover. When you have basically rookie QB's they cannot read defenses very well and either do not audiable out or audialbe into a wrong scheme. Foot ball is clearly a team game and if one part is broke the other parts do not function well.

 

[Reddog]

It maybe the Cardinal Kool-aid in my blood but that one INT where he seemed to be trying to throw it out of bounds I am confident he never makes that mistake again. I never had that feeling with Josh, Jake or King. As to the accuracy issue. He was accurate enough to set UM passing records but I do not know his INT or completion percentages.

 

[CaptTurbo]

It maybe the Cardinal Kool-aid in my blood but that one INT where he seemed to be trying to throw it out of bounds I am confident he never makes that mistake again. I never had that feeling with Josh, Jake or King. As to the accuracy issue. He was accurate enough to set UM passing records but I do not know his INT or completion percentages.

1 or 2 other INT's went off hands or helmets I think.

 

[john h]

Best part of Navarre's game was the way he handled the blitz in the first quarter or two. Maybe Josh will take some lessons from him about identifying when/where the blitz is coming from and making the hot read. Even though a couple of Navarre's passes were batted down at least he we throwing toward the typical hot route and quick enough to avoid getting sacked by the blitz.

Seemed like he did not drop as far back as McCown and definitely not as far as King. He stood in and recoginzed a pocket when it formed and I thought delivered a rapid though not accurate pass. He did side step well to avoid some sacks. Bad results yesterday but I saw enough to want to see him some more. This guy has been with the scout team all year and has little experience working with our starting receivers so I look for him to improve vastly next week. My bigger worry is not being able to run the ball. Croom did not look very good. I thought our best looking runner was Ab------- who is big enough to move a pile. I liked what I heard from one of the announcers about some coaches not going for high priced free agents but stocking their team with second tier decent players who do not wreck your CAP and when placed in the right situations turn out to be good. They noted that only a few years ago Bertrand Berry could hardly find a job. A team needs to do their homework closely in the FA market and if you are perceptive you can often find a jewell who is being overlooked. I surely hope this team has ever FA QB who will be available lined up on a blackboard and evaluating them so they can be fast out of the gate to get one or possible even two. Good teams normally have two QB's who can play on any given day and one in training. I would think this is the worst team DG has ever had to deal with and he did not have a clue about our players when he signed on. Has he ever had a really bad team and turned it around on his own? That is a lot different than comming in with a fairly decent team and just adding a QB or one or two players and comming up with a contender. Airizona is the pit of the NFL and coaches come and go here. Good players stay until their contracts are up and then they are out. This is going to take a genius to turn us around. Players want come here just to play in a new stadium. We are going to have to become a competent team with the possibilty of making the playoffs to attract the type people we need in FA or in coaching. Why did DG come here? I truly suspect he did not have that many offers if any. Owners generally know a lot about coaches we do not and they do talk to each other.

 

[JeffGollin]

Of our three QB's he looks the best to me. He had pocket presence and did not seem to panic as much as the other two. He audiable out of several situations and appeared to have some confidence in his face.
That's how I saw it.

The 3/4 delivery is a problem (but not one you mess with now. Wait til the season is over).

He eyeballed his receiver on one pick and then failed to drill the ball. The combination of slow ball and DB's reading his eyes sort of nailed that one.

He threw into coverage more than a couple of times.

All of these things can be corrected if the kid's coachable (and there's no reason to think he isn't). Things like poise, pocket presence seeing the field etc. are the kinds of things that many young QB's need time to develop. Navarre seems to have that already.

I agree that, of the three options we have (unless you want Bolding to take a shot at playing single wing tailback), Navarre gives us the best chance of winning.

 

[khilari]

Lets have him start for rest of the season and see his progress before we make our decision. I think next season we should sign a FA QB and release KING. Have FA QB, Navarre, and McCown battle it out.

 

[Reddog]

Lets have him start for rest of the season and see his progress before we make our decision. I think next season we should sign a FA QB and release KING. Have FA QB, Navarre, and McCown battle it out.

That sounds good in theory but you still need to sign McCown to get him back and I am note sure he will want to sign for the type of $$ we will be willing to offer.

 

[TRW]

Navarre is out with his broken finger.

May have contributed to some of his errant throws in the second half.

 

[CaptTurbo]

May have contributed to some of his errant throws in the second half.

Man its amazing he was able to throw!

 

[pete]

That sounds good in theory but you still need to sign McCown to get him back and I am note sure he will want to sign for the type of $$ we will be willing to offer.

I may be wrong, but I can't see there being a lot of demand for McCown. I think he is definitely worth resigning. If anything, as a backup.

 

[vince56]

Isn't McCown an RFA? We own him.

 

[Russ Smith]

Man its amazing he was able to throw!

Depends which finger it was and how he holds the ball. Charlie Frye of Akron has played the entire season with a badly dislocated finger, it's come out of joints something like 15-20 times this season, they just put it back in tape it and let him play. It hurts him, but not unbearably because of the way he holds the ball.

Navarre probably holds it in such a way that this finger is taking too much pressure and he can't do it.

Does this mean King is the backup or Chris Lewis?

 

[vince56]

Does this mean King is the backup or Chris Lewis?

man, this season is truly over.

 

[D-Dogg]

Depends which finger it was and how he holds the ball. Charlie Frye of Akron has played the entire season with a badly dislocated finger, it's come out of joints something like 15-20 times this season, they just put it back in tape it and let him play. It hurts him, but not unbearably because of the way he holds the ball.

Navarre probably holds it in such a way that this finger is taking too much pressure and he can't do it.

Does this mean King is the backup or Chris Lewis?

it's his ring finger, I think. Which I think would really mess up his followthrough...especially if he has a snap to his normal motion...