NY Power Struggle Results

[Harry]

When the Giants leadership decided to sit Eli Manning, breaking his starting streak, they failed to check with owner, John Mara. It was a major factor in the those guys losing their jobs. I’m also hearing Shurmur was asked specifically about Maniing in his interview and indicated he supported Manning starting. So does that impact their draft? I’m also led to believe GM Gentlemen was asked the same question. Keep in mind before he left to become the Panther’s GM he was a long time personnel expert in the Giants’ administrative group. He and Manning were close. He was also a Mara favorite. So I’m thinking there’s a good chance the Giants use this draft to enhance Manning’s chance to succeed. There’s no O-lineman worthy of the second pick, but there is a potentially great runner. I think they take Barkley.

 

[POISON]

When the Giants leadership decided to sit Eli Manning, breaking his starting streak, they failed to check with owner, John Mara. It was a major factor in the those guys losing their jobs. I’m also hearing Shurmur was asked specifically about Maniing in his interview and indicated he supported Manning starting. So does that impact their draft? I’m also led to believe GM Gentlemen was asked the same question. Keep in mind before he left to become the Panther’s GM he was a long time personnel expert in the Giants’ administrative group. He and Manning were close. He was also a Mara favorite. So I’m thinking there’s a good chance the Giants use this draft to enhance Manning’s chance to succeed. There’s no O-lineman worthy of the second pick, but there is a potentially great runner. I think they take Barkley.

Might leave 1 more qb avaliable for us to draft!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

When the Giants leadership decided to sit Eli Manning, breaking his starting streak, they failed to check with owner, John Mara. It was a major factor in the those guys losing their jobs. I’m also hearing Shurmur was asked specifically about Maniing in his interview and indicated he supported Manning starting. So does that impact their draft? I’m also led to believe GM Gentlemen was asked the same question. Keep in mind before he left to become the Panther’s GM he was a long time personnel expert in the Giants’ administrative group. He and Manning were close. He was also a Mara favorite. So I’m thinking there’s a good chance the Giants use this draft to enhance Manning’s chance to succeed. There’s no O-lineman worthy of the second pick, but there is a potentially great runner. I think they take Barkley.

......you are selling me on this line of thinking, not sure I am on board, but it is not too out of the box. Good thoughts.

 

[Mitch]

Harry, back in November, I heard from my cousin who is close friends with the Mara family and plays golf with them at the Westchester Country Club that the Maras unanimously agree that Eli is done. I think in part they used the backlash of Eli's benching to get rid of Ben McAdoo---who didn't command the respect of the locker room, but, ironically, was the one who was closest to Eli.

There is no way the Giants are going to pass on a QB at #2 unless they surprise everyone and release Eli and sign Kirk Cousins or one of the Minnesota QBs to a long-term deal.

This poor season was like the Colts' poor season when Peyton was on the couch in a neck brace eating chicken parm. The Giants get to draft their successor to Eli. It will be either Sam Darnold or Josh Allen.

 

[az jam]

Agree with you Mitch, Giants may never pick this low (#2) and have to use it to get qb to take Eli's place.

 

[GimmedaBall]

Harry, back in November, I heard from my cousin who is close friends with the Mara family and plays golf with them at the Westchester Country Club that the Maras unanimously agree that Eli is done. I think in part they used the backlash of Eli's benching to get rid of Ben McAdoo---who didn't command the respect of the locker room, but, ironically, was the one who was closest to Eli.

There is no way the Giants are going to pass on a QB at #2 unless they surprise everyone and release Eli and sign Kirk Cousins or one of the Minnesota QBs to a long-term deal.

This poor season was like the Colts' poor season when Peyton was on the couch in a neck brace eating chicken parm. The Giants get to draft their successor to Eli. It will be either Sam Darnold or Josh Allen.

Agree.

If the Giants keep Manning at QB, they need to take advantage of their high draft pick in a QB-rich draft to get their QBOTF. If they go RB Barkley or OL---they may have a winning season with an aging Manning---and then have to wait a year or two to 'earn' a high draft pick. An average team will get them an average draft pick in the 1st round---see the Cards draft the last few years.

If the Giants sign Cousins (or other QB) and release/trade Manning, then Barkley would make a good pick.

 

[Buckybird]

Ignoring the QB position at #2 & relying on an aging QB who’s so close to retirement would be sooooo Cardinalesque! Unless they truly don’t like any of those QBs. How’s that worked out for us? Lol

Imo it would be foolish to ignore the QB needs, especially at #2 when the QB position trumps any other in the NFL draft!

 

[JeffGollin]

Slightly OT -

I've noticed lately that Giant fans in central NJ are showing Cardinal fans more respect. (It's not as if they were wise-assed or anything - they just ignored us). My inexact gauge of Cardinal respect are the comments made when wearing Cardinal gear at the local Food Mart - Giant fans would look past me as though I was a pane of glass. (This may not seem like a big deal -except that I had to put up,with "being invisible" for more than 6 decades).

But I've gotten an unusually high number of friendly thumbs-ups from Giant fans during the past 2 - 3 months.

Proof positive, perhaps, that - when you hold the Big Blue to zero points - their fans will respect you.

 

[Solar7]

I agree with both @Mitch and @az jam - it would be madness for the Giants not to accept this gift. Their easiest route to long term success is to draft an elite prospect this high - because a healthy Odell is going to propel them to more wins than they had this year for a while.

 

[oaken1]

wasting your time Harry... I tried to explain this a few weeks back,... but all these guys are spending someone elses money in the draft...doesnt occur to anybody that NYG also has pick 34 in the draft... they could draft Barkley at 2 then be expecting to get Lamar Jackson or Mason Rudolph in the second round.
most are also discounting that they just drafted Davis Webb last year

also,...maybe they wanted shurmer for the same reason so many Cards fans wanted shurmer... because he looks like he can make legit players out of young QB's....ie...Davis Webb

without a line and a running game they will just ruin a rookie QB anyway...so many are freaked out at the idea that if we dont put a rookie in the best possible situation to succeed our guy will bust... but the gints are a dumpster fire..their line is worse than ours and they dont have a David Johnson. Which is likely why they didnt put Webb on the field when they benched Eli.

side note... Daniel J has Quentin Nelson listed as his #2 player in the draft...so it wouldnt be completely out of left field for them to draft a lineman at 2....it would blow a lot of minds, but its possible.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Anyone who thinks they skip taking a QB is drinking drano.

And if they DO skip it, the Giants are doing the same thing.

 

[oaken1]

Anyone who thinks they skip taking a QB is drinking drano.

And if they DO skip it, the Giants are doing the same thing.

snorting. It's the new upgraded Tide Pod Challenge.

 

[Frank The Fixer]

Davis Webb isn't stopping the Giants from taking a quarterback. Barkley might but as others have said hard to see them passing up a potential FQB

 

[oaken1]

Davis Webb isn't stopping the Giants from taking a quarterback. Barkley might but as others have said hard to see them passing up a potential FQB

if you are correct...we should call and offer them a fourth round pick for him.

several of the giants players say Webb has "IT"..and "he is gonna be really good in this league"

Folks forget, he was in that mix at TT with Patrick Mahomes(1st rounder) and Baker Mayfield(likely first rounder)

and while at cal he broke several of Aaron Rodgers passing records....sitting for one year behind Eli Manning couldnt have hurt the guy at all...just need to coach the giant out of him a bit.

 

[Frank The Fixer]

if you are correct...we should call and offer them a fourth round pick for him.

several of the giants players say Webb has "IT"..and "he is gonna be really good in this league"

Folks forget, he was in that mix at TT with Patrick Mahomes(1st rounder) and Baker Mayfield(likely first rounder)

and while at cal he broke several of Aaron Rodgers passing records....sitting for one year behind Eli Manning couldnt have hurt the guy at all...just need to coach the giant out of him a bit.

They need to find a veteran/bridge and draft a rookie to develop.
We probably have different opinions on Webb. I wouldn't want to see the Cardinals trade a 4th round pick on a guy who's most likely going to be third on the depth chart .

 

[oaken1]

They need to find a veteran/bridge and draft a rookie to develop.
We probably have different opinions on Webb. I wouldn't want to see the Cardinals trade a 4th round pick on a guy who's most likely going to be third on the depth chart .

so,...what?? Your thinking they are just going to dump Eli Manning?

or are you saying the Redbirds need a vet and a rookie? If thats the case, I agree... but adding Webb couldnt hurt...we have been old long enough.
worst case scenario, as you say...he remains third string calibre... best case, we have a guy we can trade for a first rounder if he develops...and our rookie pans out

 

[Frank The Fixer]

so,...what?? Your thinking they are just going to dump Eli Manning?

or are you saying the Redbirds need a vet and a rookie? If thats the case, I agree... but adding Webb couldnt hurt...we have been old long enough.
worst case scenario, as you say...he remains third string calibre... best case, we have a guy we can trade for a first rounder if he develops...and our rookie pans out

I would imagine they'll keep Manning. I think they'll draft a quarterback at 2 and let the rookie compete/develop with Webb as the backup.
It certainly could hurt. There's a strong possibility we're going to be giving up draft picks to move up in the first round so can they really afford to give up a 4th for a guy who's probably your 3rd qb?
Webb is not a bridge.

 

[cardncubfan]

I can see the Giants trading the pick. To the Cards. The draft is so unpredictable it just could happen. Not likely but I also wouldn't be surprised. Everything you read about prior changes on draft day.

 

[Frank The Fixer]

I can see the Giants trading the pick. To the Cards. The draft is so unpredictable it just could happen. Not likely but I also wouldn't be surprised. Everything you read about prior changes on draft day.

It hasn't been discussed so far but I can certainly see the Giants trading out of that spot for multiple picks. I guess it's going to depend on how good they feel about Webb going forward

 

[oaken1]

I would imagine they'll keep Manning. I think they'll draft a quarterback at 2 and let the rookie compete/develop with Webb as the backup.
It certainly could hurt. There's a strong possibility we're going to be giving up draft picks to move up in the first round so can they really afford to give up a 4th for a guy who's probably your 3rd qb?
Webb is not a bridge.

of course Webb is not a bridge... he is a rookie...err,...WAS a rookie in 2017

 

[HGC]

of course Webb is not a bridge... he is a rookie...err,...WAS a rookie in 2017

So why give up draft capital for him when it’s pretty obvious they’ll be drafting a quarterback and signing a veteran. A fourth round pick could fill a major need.

 

[oaken1]

It hasn't been discussed so far but I can certainly see the Giants trading out of that spot for multiple picks. I guess it's going to depend on how good they feel about Webb going forward

the second pick in the draft is usually hand in hand with the second pick in the other rounds too. which means the giants likely have pick 34...
many speculate that guys like mason rudolph or lamar jackson will still be on the board at 34....also, a guy like Josh Allen may be there...he was considered a second rounder before the senior bowl.... lots of guys move up and down this time of year but generally speaking, they revert back to where they were at the end of the season when draft day comes... because most folks go back to the tape... there are always exceptions... but generally speaking..
Josh allen specifically will likely stay in the first round... specifically because he accepted coaching very well at the senior bowl and the results showed in the game with improved footwork and accuracy.... now,...if he shows up at the combine and is right back to his old bad habits.... then he will slip back into the second round.

 

[GimmedaBall]

Slightly OT -

I've noticed lately that Giant fans in central NJ are showing Cardinal fans more respect. (It's not as if they were wise-assed or anything - they just ignored us). My inexact gauge of Cardinal respect are the comments made when wearing Cardinal gear at the local Food Mart - Giant fans would look past me as though I was a pane of glass. (This may not seem like a big deal -except that I had to put up,with "being invisible" for more than 6 decades).

But I've gotten an unusually high number of friendly thumbs-ups from Giant fans during the past 2 - 3 months.

Proof positive, perhaps, that - when you hold the Big Blue to zero points - their fans will respect you.

More likely empathy for a fan of an equally doomed franchise.

 

[oaken1]

So why give up draft capital for him when it’s pretty obvious they’ll be drafting a quarterback and signing a veteran. A fourth round pick could fill a major need.

its called "hedging your bets"... one young QB prospect is good...two young QB prospects is better... Davis Webb has lots of talent,...and if for some reason the giants dont think they can bring that talent out, then maybe we can.

If the draft played out that way, hell...I would draft Baker Mayfield at 15, then draft Lamar Jackson at 47.... followed by a center and a WR in the third round.

Davis Webb taking the starting job was why Mayfield transferred to oklahoma... then webb transferred because he lost the job to mahomes.... both mayfield and webb lost the starting job because they were injured mind you, not due to how they played. The coaching staff at TT basically saw them as three QB's who were equal in what they could do on the field...and the results proved that out.

so why is everyone cool with mahomes being a 1st rounder, and cool with mayfield being a 1st rounder... but for some reason think Webb is trash? In a single season at cal webb broke like five of aaron rodgers passing records... the dude has talent...
I just think if the giants aint gonna use him for whatever reason, it couldnt hurt for the redbirds to give it a shot.

Having two young guys on the roster dramatically increases our chances that one of them becomes the franchise signal caller we need.

two young guys... then a guy like Josh McCown or (god forbid) Sam Bradford to mentor the youngsters as they grow.

 

[Frank The Fixer]

its called "hedging your bets"... one young QB prospect is good...two young QB prospects is better... Davis Webb has lots of talent,...and if for some reason the giants dont think they can bring that talent out, then maybe we can.

If the draft played out that way, hell...I would draft Baker Mayfield at 15, then draft Lamar Jackson at 47.... followed by a center and a WR in the third round.

Davis Webb taking the starting job was why Mayfield transferred to oklahoma... then webb transferred because he lost the job to mahomes.... both mayfield and webb lost the starting job because they were injured mind you, not due to how they played. The coaching staff at TT basically saw them as three QB's who were equal in what they could do on the field...and the results proved that out.

so why is everyone cool with mahomes being a 1st rounder, and cool with mayfield being a 1st rounder... but for some reason think Webb is trash? In a single season at cal webb broke like five of aaron rodgers passing records... the dude has talent...
I just think if the giants aint gonna use him for whatever reason, it couldnt hurt for the redbirds to give it a shot.

Having two young guys on the roster dramatically increases our chances that one of them becomes the franchise signal caller we need.

two young guys... then a guy like Josh McCown or (god forbid) Sam Bradford to mentor the youngsters as they grow.

Its pretty clear that Mayfield and Mahomes developed into better prospects.