Oden To Miss SEASON w/Microfracture!

[slinslin]

the better player AND the safer pick?! Yeah - that's why he was picked number two, because that makes a lot of sense.

You guys are making it out like Oden was the second coming of the Kandi-man. It's really weird.

That being said, I love Durant and think he's gonna be a star, but I thought a healthy Oden would have been a star as well, on both ends of the court, something that can't be said about KD.

Why couldn't it be said of Durant? He was a good defender in college. Blocking shots and a monster on the boards.

Oden was picked #1 because he is a center and 7' , simple. It's always the same because a lot of teams value size and position a lot.

 

[elindholm]

huh? Again, you don't watch college basketball so how exactly are you coming to these conclusions about what the kid was like or the head scratcher of "can't miss project that in their gut most people knew they should have passed on."

I read a lot.

Reports that Oden was looking disappointing were all over. He was disappointing in this tournament game, this workout, this camp, this scrimmage. His allegedly "dominant" numbers, give as proof positive of his destiny, never looked like much to me. I never said he would be a bust, but I always felt that declaring him the Next Big Thing was woefully premature.

When Durant started tearing it up in workouts, there was some speculation that the Blazers should go with him instead. I have no idea whether the Blazers ever considered it, but the point is, people could talk about it without getting laughed off the internet. Would anyone, ever, have considered passing on the likes of Duncan or O'Neal with the #1 pick? Absolutely not, no chance, no way, ever. So the fact that it was even possible that Oden might not go #1 -- behind someone equally unproven, I should point out -- was further evidence that the case in favor of him was not really all that strong.

And then, of course, he continued to stink it up after being drafted, because of his tonsils and whatever other injury and not being motivated and so forth. Pretty much all the signs were bad. The only thing keeping the Oden Dream afloat was the deeply held convictions, impervious to evidence, of those who had been pimping him for more than a year.

You don't have to watch games to know when you're being sold a bill of goods.

 

[azirish]

You can learn a lot by just watching. Oden's length and quickness do not make an impact unless you really see him in action. After the Finals, people criticized Horford for not being able to handle Oden despite Horford being one of the best low post defenders in NCAA; but you have to see the gameit to understand Hordord's problems (he was still the #3 pick).

Obviously college is not the NBA and some guys look great against college opponents, but I have not seen a college big with his size and physical skills in a very long time.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Why couldn't it be said of Durant? He was a good defender in college. Blocking shots and a monster on the boards.

a) blocking shots - Oden DOUBLED Durant's blocks per game, in fewer minutes. There's no comparison there. That's where the ginormous difference is on defense. Like I said, I think Durant's gonna be a stud as well and I was incredibly impressed with his rebounding, almost as much as the fluidity of his sterling offensive game.

Oden was picked #1 because he is a center and 7' , simple.

simple... except you left off that Oden is also incredibly athletic as well, unlike most 7 footers, not to mention that while playing the entire season recovering from a broken SHOOTING hand, and came to a pedestrian team and transformed them into a 31-1 monster, getting to the NCAA Finals. Oh yeah, and he averaged 15 ppg, 3.5 blocks and 10 boards.

 

[Mainstreet]

Portland could end up with another top 5 pick... If Oden can come back strong, I will not feel sorry for them.

This could almost be a replay of how the Spurs got David Robinson and Tim Duncan... at least very similar as I recall.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Anyone have a link to the Blazers boards???

 

[Cheesebeef]

I read a lot.

that sounds familiar to another poster,who is regularly taken to task (sometimes by you) for giving an opinion without actually watching something. but, I digress...

Reports that Oden was looking disappointing were all over. He was disappointing in this tournament game,

Uh, he had 19, 10, 1 in game 1 of the tourney... 14, 12, 2 in the second round (versus a horrendous game by Durant who was bounced at this point), a bad round three game in which he limited because of foul trouble with 9, 3, 1, a fourth round game of 17, 9, 1 (in 24 minutes), a final four game of 13, 9, 1 (in 20 minutes) and a championship game of 25, 12, 4. Basically, if you average that out, his numbers look pretty much the same as the regular season, with him being the ONLY guy stepping up when it counted most against FLA. You'd probably know this (and know that everyone doing the broadcasting thought he was getting unbelievably ticky-tack fouls called against him, limiting him through the tourney), but you don't watch college basketball.

...this workout, this camp, this scrimmage. His allegedly "dominant" numbers, give as proof positive of his destiny, never looked like much to me. I never said he would be a bust, but I always felt that declaring him the Next Big Thing was woefully premature.

When Durant started tearing it up in workouts, there was some speculation that the Blazers should go with him instead. I have no idea whether the Blazers ever considered it, but the point is, people could talk about it without getting laughed off the internet. Would anyone, ever, have considered passing on the likes of Duncan or O'Neal with the #1 pick?

come on Eric - you know why that is? It's because both of these guys are still FRESHMAN and we don't know exactly how they're going to keep growing, whereas Duncan and Shaq were seniors and juniors, respectively, which makes a HUGE difference as people had gotten three and four years of looking at them and knowing, point blank, locked down - WHAM. These guys were it. You're comparing different eras (neither of which you watched I'm assuming) and you're also not taking into consideration that Duncan didn't have ANYONE that season like Durant in that draft who blew people away. It's a credit to Durant that he's as highly touted as he is, but that shouldn't be used as evidence of "Oden being someone people thought should be passed on.

And then, of course, he continued to stink it up after being drafted, because of his tonsils and whatever other injury and not being motivated and so forth.

whatever other injury? you mean like one that leads to devastating surgery like Micro-fracture. Couldn't that pain in his knee have been the reason why he was playing so poorly? That would make sense, no?

You don't have to watch games to know when you're being sold a bill of goods.

okay other unnamed poster who you would rip for saying the same thing. Sheesh man, it's okay to just say, "maybe I mis-spoke as I don't really have all the information necessary to make this opinion."

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I read a lot.

Reports that Oden was looking disappointing were all over. He was disappointing in this tournament game, this workout, this camp, this scrimmage. His allegedly "dominant" numbers, give as proof positive of his destiny, never looked like much to me. I never said he would be a bust, but I always felt that declaring him the Next Big Thing was woefully premature.

When Durant started tearing it up in workouts, there was some speculation that the Blazers should go with him instead. I have no idea whether the Blazers ever considered it, but the point is, people could talk about it without getting laughed off the internet. Would anyone, ever, have considered passing on the likes of Duncan or O'Neal with the #1 pick? Absolutely not, no chance, no way, ever. So the fact that it was even possible that Oden might not go #1 -- behind someone equally unproven, I should point out -- was further evidence that the case in favor of him was not really all that strong.

And then, of course, he continued to stink it up after being drafted, because of his tonsils and whatever other injury and not being motivated and so forth. Pretty much all the signs were bad. The only thing keeping the Oden Dream afloat was the deeply held convictions, impervious to evidence, of those who had been pimping him for more than a year.

You don't have to watch games to know when you're being sold a bill of goods.

i'm sorry eric, your last comment may be the dumbest thing i've ever read on this board. those of us that watched him play know he was the real deal. you have no legs to stand on here. you READ about him. we WATCHED him. next.

 

[elindholm]

that sounds familiar to another poster,who is regularly taken to task (sometimes by you) for giving an opinion without actually watching something. but, I digress...

I don't know why you keep trying to damn me by association; it's beneath even your typically infantile level of discourse.

What's different about evaluating college prospects, as you seem reluctant to acknowledge, is that no one has seen them play! What they do in college doesn't mean any more than what Banks did in Las Vegas. It's a junior league with inferior competiton, especially when you're talking about a guy who played a grand total of one season.

Instead, we trust the analysis of scouts who have made it their profession to guess how someone is going to do, working with incomplete, often misleading information.

Why do you think agents are so tight about letting their top prospects work out? To avoid letting anyone get more information about their weaknesses, obviously. That's a completely different situation from making sight-unseen proclamations about the effectiveness of current NBA players with established track records -- which, needless to say, I don't do.

Uh, he had 19, 10, 1 in game 1 of the tourney... 14, 12, 2 in the second round (versus a horrendous game by Durant who was bounced at this point)...

Yes, and if you read the analyses, they say things like "Well he didn't really look that good, but [insert excuse here]." He looked sometimes good and sometimes great.

You'd probably know this (and know that everyone doing the broadcasting thought he was getting unbelievably ticky-tack fouls called against him, limiting him through the tourney)

Actually I knew that anyway, since it was widely reported. The officials wouldn't let him play, so went the story. Gee, and NBA officials are going to be more lenient?

come on Eric - you know why that is? It's because both of these guys are still FRESHMAN and we don't know exactly how they're going to keep growing

Thank you, yes, that's my point. The information is incomplete and no one really has any idea yet what kind of player Oden will be. Have you misunderstood my argument from the beginning, or are you just too fixated on disqualifying it because I don't watch college basketball?

whatever other injury? you mean like one that leads to devastating surgery like Micro-fracture. Couldn't that pain in his knee have been the reason why he was playing so poorly? That would make sense, no?

Sure, of course. Again, it's all "Well gee, we can't really see him at full strength because of [excuse], but he's going to be really awesome, trust us."

"maybe I mis-spoke as I don't really have all the information necessary to make this opinion."

But I didn't misspeak. I said that the information was very much incomplete, and I was right. Search on any of my posts about Oden and you'll see that I was consistent, including never saying that he would be a bust. Watching all 30-whatever games of his college career would have provided more information, but still not much.

No one knew much about Oden, period. All they knew was what they wanted to see in him, so they convinced themselves it was there.

 

[elindholm]

i'm sorry eric, your last comment may be the dumbest thing i've ever read on this board. those of us that watched him play know he was the real deal.

And how is that knowledge working out for you?

 

[F-Dog]

i'm sorry eric, your last comment may be the dumbest thing i've ever read on this board. those of us that watched him play know he was the real deal. you have no legs to stand on here. you READ about him. we WATCHED him. next.

Sure, but you watch the Suns, too, so Eric knows you're not perfect.




Anyway, Oden is the real deal. As a microfracture patient, I would compare him to Tim Duncan rather than Amare--Oden has (had?) the hops to dominate above the rim, but with his size, he doesn't need explosive jumping ability like Amare does.

It was bad enough that he was drafted by a team with Portland's talent and Paul Allen's money, but if he makes a full recovery and the Blazers get another top pick, the Western Conference is going to get ugly quick.



Here's hoping Oden recovers well, at least. He seems to be well-grounded given his age and history, and Blazers fans deserve some success for a change.

 

[elindholm]

Anyway, Oden is the real deal.

So says the man who awarded the Suns the 2007 championship back in, hmm, February was it?

 

[tobiazz]

Would anyone, ever, have considered passing on the likes of Duncan or O'Neal with the #1 pick?

Oden's freshman numbers were better than those of Duncan, so that adds a lot of legitimacy to him being taken first. I previously mentioned Oden's impressive freshman stats as compared to some NBA greats.

So the fact that it was even possible that Oden might not go #1 -- behind someone equally unproven, I should point out -- was further evidence that the case in favor of him was not really all that strong.

Kevin Durant was the NCAA Player of the Year. He was the most proven player in college. Would Olajuwon have been an illegitimate #1 pick if teams considered taking Jordan ahead of him?

Oden has the frame, athleticism, and production of an excellent player, but he will certainly not be an NBA-changing freak like Shaq was. Based on his appearance and injury history, I have to wonder if he has some sort of premature aging condition, natural or unnatural.

 

[F-Dog]

So says the man who awarded the Suns the 2007 championship back in, hmm, February was it?

That would have been awfully early to blame crooked officiating, don't you think?

You said yourself that the Suns surprised you in the Spurs series.

 

[elindholm]

You said yourself that the Suns surprised you in the Spurs series.

Yes, they did, and I would have been very eager to see the last three games of the series played on a level field. I wouldn't want to predict the outcome, but the Suns might have been able to pull it off. Of course, they'd still have to get by Utah and Cleveland, but the odds would have been in their favor. (They also could have done as I suggested, blown off Game 5 and bet the house on Game 6, which would have given them a better chance than the course they chose.)

But my point is that we seem to have different thresholds for declaring things done deals.

 

[elindholm]

Would Olajuwon have been an illegitimate #1 pick if teams considered taking Jordan ahead of him?

Even I know that Durant is no Jordan. But besides that, no, it wouldn't have made Olajuwon illegitimate at all. It just would have undermined claims that he was destined to become a megastar. I don't remember that there was as much pre-career hype over Olajuwon as there was about Robinson, Duncan, or O'Neal, but I could be wrong about that. Actually Olajuwon sort of needed Sampson to get out of his way before he could really blossom.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

This could almost be a replay of how the Spurs got David Robinson and Tim Duncan... at least very similar as I recall.

Was just going to post that, sucks for the Blazers, I remember just reading how all these guys voluntarily started camp early

http://mikebarrettsblog.blogspot.com/2007/08/theyre-back.html


Mike Barrett
Television play-by-play voice of the Trail Blazers on KGW-TV 8 and Comcast SportsNet.
Stream Courtside LIVE on Thursday's at 6:00pm on 750am KXL



They're Back posted: 8/27/2007 at 2:52 PM
PERMALINK | VIEW COMMENTS (17) | LEAVE COMMENT |

Most NBA teams will get set to welcome their players back in late September, or early October. For the Trail Blazers, it has happened slightly sooner than that. Teams can't require players to report until October, so this is totally voluntary.


With that in mind, you should know that today (Monday), at the practice facility, Greg Oden, Steve Blake, Brandon Roy, Jarrett Jack, LaMarcus Aldridge, Martell Webster, Channing Frye, Josh McRoberts, and James Jones, were going at it, five on five, like it was a mid-season practice. Travis Outlaw is expected to arrive by Wednesday. Milwaukee's Desmond Mason, who lives in Portland during the off-season, was playing as well, as were a couple of other players. That made it possible to have the five-on-five runs, with a sub or two. Darius Miles was there as well, but is still rehabbing, and didn't take part in the full-court runs.


"Not a bad run for August," joked Blazers assistant coach Dean Demopolous, as he stuck his head in the gym. "Actually, not a bad run anytime." Several coaches were there, and were allowed to work with the players on one-on-one drills, but are not allowed to coach during the full-court games.


We got a look at a healthy Oden, and to say he was impressive is an understatement. He about ripped the rim down with several dunks, and was swatting shots away at the defensive end. He was explosive around the rim, and showed his developing outside touch. Probably most impressive is the way this 19-year old controls the middle of the paint. His defense is here. The offense is right around the corner.


Frye, who had to guard Oden most of the day, sat next to me between one of the games, and said, "that kid is a monster, just a monster. He is so strong. He has no idea how strong he is. He doesn't even realize it. He was just throwing me around," said Frye, shaking his head. Keep in mind, Frye has been with the USA select team in Las Vegas, guarding the likes of Dwight Howard and Amare Stoudemire. Kevin Pritchard, who was also in Vegas, was just telling us on the radio last week how impressed he was with Frye's defense on the Dream Team's big men.


After the workout, I asked Oden how he feels. "Pretty good," he said. "I'm here to get in shape, and am going to hit the weights like crazy." So, in other words, he's only going to get stronger.


Also very impressive during the full-court games was Martell Webster, who has lost 15 pounds. He possibly had the dunk of the day, crossing over and throwing it down over Aldridge, who had designs on blocking the shot. "That kid has improved," said Aldridge. "He put that one right in my face, and I really didn't expect it." Webster was also dropping in three pointers with accuracy, as we've come to expect. Don't think he doesn't realize Jones and Outlaw are going to be battling him for minutes a the 3 position.


The guard play was solid on this first day, with Jarrett Jack hitting from all over the court. The acquisition of Blake has seemed to inspire Jarrett, as he looks to be in mid-season form. Today, Jack spent a lot of time playing in the same backcourt with Brandon Roy, and they were switching back and forth between the guard positions. Roy looks to be in great shape, by the way. Blake, who rolled his ankle last week, had a great shooting day, and ran the team like the veteran he is. Rookie Taurean Green, who closed with a strong summer league, was also solid.


Aldridge continues to show why many have predicted that he'll lead this Portland team in scoring this season. He was hitting inside and outside, and runs the floor so well for a guy his size. Frye, who's a better outside shooter than Aldridge, spent time dragging Oden out to the perimeter and was firing over him.


Almost as a disclaimer, I need to throw in the fact that this Trail Blazer team's playing rotation will be the league's youngest. One projected starting five for this team will average 21.8 years of age. So, in other words, I'm trying to somewhat check my enthusiasm. But, it's easy to get excited watching this crew work- even in the month of August.


Ace photographer Jeff Curtin was with me today at the practice facility and shot some great video of the full-court session. The link for the highlights of the scrimmage session is below. We also interviewed a few players. As soon as those are edited and put together, I'll give you the link to that. There are some photos I took as well. They aren't great, but I had just my regular little digital camera. All this stuff will also be posted on the "news" page on this website. Much more news, photos, and interviews to come this week. I'll be back at the workout, with more video and photos, on Wednesday. Tuesday, I'm going to help Bobby Gross out with his charity golf tournament.

 

[mribnik]

Are they performing the microfracture surgery on a weight-bearing part of the knee?

 

[F-Dog]

But my point is that we seem to have different thresholds for declaring things done deals.

I'm not sure how that applies here, since both of us are equally adamant in our assessments of Oden.

Now, if you're saying I'm usually wrong, or that I don't know what I'm talking about...

 

[elindholm]

I'm not sure how that applies here, since both of us are equally adamant in our assessments of Oden.

No we aren't. You're saying he's the real thing, and I'm saying it's too soon to tell. I'm explicitly not adamant in my assessment.

 

[F-Dog]

Even I know that Durant is no Jordan. But besides that, no, it wouldn't have made Olajuwon illegitimate at all. It just would have undermined claims that he was destined to become a megastar.

It might have undermined claims that Olajuwon would be the best player in the league, but I doubt many were making such claims.



Olajuwon peaked late (and Sampson fizzled early), but they made the NBA finals together.

 

[F-Dog]

I'm explicitly not adamant in my assessment.

Saying the Blazers should have passed on him seems fairly adamant to me.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

If you watched the championship game against Florida, it would be hard to argue that Oden won't be a star. With three top 10 prospects on the Florida roster, Oden looked like an man among boys and by far the best of the group. I wasn't a huge believer based on production for Oden, but when healthy, like in the championship game he can be a dominant force.

 

[elindholm]

Saying the Blazers should have passed on him seems fairly adamant to me.

It would be, had I said that. In fact I said,

"... a 'can't miss' project that, in their gut, most people knew they should have passed on."

I'll admit that I shouldn't have written "knew" there; "felt" would have been more accurate. What I meant was, the perceived gap between Oden and Durant shrunk dramatically in the weeks leading up to the draft. My failure to watch games isn't relevant here, because there were no games to watch. Oden was the frontrunner, but Durant mounted a furious late charge, enough to give lots of people pause. Bill Simmons was only one of many discussing how it was really the Sonics who had won the lottery, because while Portland "had" to take Oden, Seattle would be getting the better player.

The consensus I was reading -- for whatever it was worth, which I'll admit is not much -- is that Portland would take Oden because they were afraid not to, but not because they were really convinced by what they were getting. After all, how could they be? They'd seen very little of him at full strength, and what they'd seen had been underwhelming. But they had to go with the size and the dream, even though their hearts weren't in it.

I'm not claiming to know what Portland was actually thinking, and I apologize for suggesting that I did -- that was indeed a misspeak, to satisfy cheesebeef. But all the chatter seemed to indicate that Portland considered themselves between a rock and a hard place, and it was hard not to envy Seattle, who would have the decision made for them and probably wind up with the better player to boot.

 

[devilalum]

no they don't - we just need ATL to be in the lotto and that's ALL dependent on the Eastern conference.

You need to eat more fiber.